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A Transcription of an Interview with Dr. Jeffrey K, Zeig, Ph.D., Director of the Milton H. Erickson Foundation, Phoenix, AZ For more information on Dr. Zeig and the Foundation, see: www.erickson-foundation.org Q: Could you maybe start by telling us a bit about Dr. Erickson, his life, his schooling, how he started working as a therapist? A: Dr. Erickson was born in a three-walled log cabin in Aurum, Nevada. The fourth wall of the cabin was the mountain; he went East in a covered wagon, which may have been a metaphor for his life, that is, doing things differently. And he then grew up on a farm in rural Wisconsin. His schooling was very simple—he had to walk a great distance to go to high school. Eventually he went to college. Erickson was the third of nine children born to his mother; she had eleven pregnancies, only nine surviving. I think only Erickson and one sister finished high school and went on to college. Erickson, of course, got his medical degree and then a master’s degree. Erickson developed polio when he was about 17; he was a good high school athlete and then spent about a year confined to his home where he hovered over death. Eventually he had to teach himself how to walk, and learn how to negotiate three-dimensional space again. As he recalled, he was very impressed by his family physician and said that when he grew up, he wanted to become a doctor. I don’t know why he wanted to work as a therapist but certainly it was his biological disposition to be a psychotherapist. Q: What is the Ericksonian approach to psychotherapy? How does it work and what would you define as its fundamental aspects? A: An Ericksonian approach to psychotherapy is one in which we conceive psychotherapy to be the problem: The problem is being in psychotherapy; the solution to the problem is getting the person out of psychotherapy, living life independently of psychotherapy as soon as possible. Ericksonian psychotherapy is basically a structural approach, and by that I mean that we don’t spend a lot of time analyzing the roots of the problem; we deal more with the present structure, helping people to live more effectively in the now and develop that effectiveness into their future. It’s a short-term psychotherapy, so the patients, for example, that I see in my practice I try to see as few times as possible. Bu, like an internal medicine doctor, I’m there for them over the course of a lifetime, and they can come back to me for sessions when they need to. One of the fundamental aspects of Ericksonian psychotherapy is eliciting resources: You take the position that patients have u n r e c o g n i z e d resources. For example, depressed patients have experience in their history about changing their mood; smokers know how to be comfortable without a ;cigarette; schizophrenic patients even know how to speak in a clear and cogent way, but somehow people are out of touch with the essential resources that they have. Part of the paradox of Ericksonian therapy, which is based in hypnosis, is that we work to stimulate into play previously dormant resources. The idea is to wake people up to their potentialities, not to put them to sleep, and a fundamental approach that’s used is one called, “utilization,” which is a philosophy that says that whatever exists in the greater therapy situation can be harnessed and utilized. Rather than analyzing, the approach is based in utilizing. It’s hard to find a simple example of this utilization approach but all of Erickson’s cases are based in this idea, so if the patient was small, Erickson would find a way of utilizing that. If the patient was intellectual, he’d find a way of utilizing that. If the patient was resistant, Erickson would find a way of utilizing that. I’d advise readers to look at any of Erickson’s cases. You would find that the fulcrum of change is utilization; it’s how Erickson helps the person utilize previously unrecognized potentialities, and from this vantage point there are no problems, just opportunities for utilization. Q: A substantial part of Ericksonian therapy involves form of clinical hypnosis and trance induction. Could you start by telling us a bit more of what a trance state is, how it is different from a waking state, and how hypnosis works? A: I could do that, but it would probably take an encyclopedia to be able to answer that question. Basically, we could think of trance as being a “state.” but I use that term in a very loose sense because we could describe intensity as being a state, or curiosity as being a state, or interest as being a state, or love as being a state, and we would know that love was different from curiosity, but it would be pretty hard to define what the difference was in clear, intellectual terms. Phenomenologically we would know the difference, so if I try to deconstruct trance into its phenomenological components, I would say it’s some combination of changing the focus of attention, changing the intensity of experience, experiencing dissociation, and responding to the implication of communication, all of which happen in a context that’s defined as hypnosis, either implicitly or explicitly. So for some people, if they just focus their attention internally, they say I’m in a trance. For others, if the intensity of relaxation increases they say I’m in a trance. Or if they don’t feel their body or the passage of the time in the way that they normally do; or if their arm starts moving in a dissociative way; or if memories suddenly happen in a dissociated way; then they say “I’m in a trance,” Or if people start to respond without realizing the cues that caused the response, they characterize that as being in a trance. So, for any given person I don’t know exactly what criteria that would indicate this person is in a trance, but when people in a situation defined as hypnosis experience some part of those components, they can be said to be in a trance… A trance is a physiological/contextual/psycho/ social combination of components, and when people access this state, they are more capable of accessing those previously dormant capacities that I was talking about before. Q: How does Erickson’s approach to hypnotherapy differ from that of other practitioners? How would you describe his interest in hypnotism and hypnotherapy, what did he think such methods achieved or made possible? Why? A: Well, in modern psychotherapy, there are many different approaches, some that are based in psychoanalysis, others that are based in a humanistic tradition, and others still that are based in a behavioral tradition, or in a cognitive behavior tradition. Erickson’s therapy was considered uncommon therapy. As a matter of fact, one of definitive books written about Erickson, written by Jay Haley, is called “Uncommon Therapy.” Erickson used hypnosis as the foundation of his work, but he didn’t necessarily use formal trance, so his was a therapy that was guided by hypnosis, if we think of hypnosis as a technique of impact and as a state in which people can more readily access resources. Erickson would take techniques from hypnosis and apply them. We call that “hypnotherapy without trance.” Erickson called it “naturalistic hypnosis.” The essence of the approach is that it is a brief, solution-focused approach— solution-focused meaning that it builds on strengths. We could consider hypnosis to be the mother of psychotherapy. Many great practitioners, for example Sigmund Freud, started with hypnosis, Joseph Wolpe in the behaviorist tradition, started with hypnosis, but many of these experts diverged from hypnosis and found other methods of eliciting change that were more suited to their personality. Erickson stayed with hypnosis and made that a mainstay. If you were to study the history of hypnosis, in the 18 th century you’d study about Mesmer, in the 19 th century you’d study about Braid and Charcot and Bernheim, but in the 20 th century you would study about Erickson; he really dominated the field of hypnosis. Q: An important part of Erickson’s practice seems to involve not just language or dialogue, but a very sophisticated use of language. In the “February Man,” Ernest Rossi writes that he was often surprised by the complex and sophisticated motivations behind each and every one of Erickson’s phrases. Could you talk a little bit about this aspect of his practice, and more specifically about his use of language games such as punning, metaphors, and analogies? A: Well, this gets in to the area of art. If you want to increase impact, one of the things that you use is precision. If you want to increase impact, one of the things that you use is discontinuity. If you want to increase impact, one of the things that you do is use unusual communication such as punning, metaphors, and analogies. Think about a poet, when a poet communicates something, for example Carl Sandburg wrote a very short poem: The fog comes/ on little cat feet. / It sits looking/ over harbor and city/ on silent haunches/ and then moves on. Now that’s unusual communication. Artists, poets, dramatists know that when you’re using a lot of precision, a lot of subtlety, when you’re using discontinuities and unusual forms of communication, it elicits a change in mood and perspective. If you just want a person to learn facts, then you can give them didactic information. But if you want to change their mood and perspective, you need to use techniques from art. And so I think that it’s easier to describe Erickson from the perspective of Art than it is to describe him from the perspective of psychotherapy, especially contemporary psychotherapy, much of contemporary psychotherapy is based on providing information. Q: Erickson and Rossi often speak of their approach as a two-level communication with the patient? What does this mean? How does this work? A: Well, really all communication is multiple-level, because there’s both a psychological aspect and a social aspect. The great linguist, Noam Chomsky, talked about the fact that there’s a surface structure and a deep structure. Gregory Bateson, the great anthropologist, talked about the fact that every communication has a report and a command. So, every communication has content but also there’s a message that frames the content and says what to do about it. You could say, “Hi!” and mean on the level of command, “Let’s spend some time together.” You could say, “Hi!” and on the level of command, mean, “Let’s just have a brief social encounter.” So, every communication is multiple level, and in hypnosis, we try to get the person to respond not to the indicative level, the social level, but to the injunctive level, or the psychological level, which is also essential in influence. If you want to have impact, then you increase the multi-level nature of the communication. Again, think about poetry. Poetry uses multilevel communication because it’s designed to influence mood and perspective, and in the same way, Erickson would use multi-level communication because he really wanted to have impact in changing mood and perspective. Q: One of the aspects of Erickson’s dialogues that we found to be of greatest interest to us were the breaks, departures, and other ruptures of sense or of trains of thought that he staged throughout his conversation with his patients. He seems to want to continually distract his patient, to direct their attentions to one thing, only to jar it away towards something else. Could you discuss this aspect of his technique a bit more? What was its purpose? What does it allow him to do with the patient? A: If you watch a movie, you know that the movie is based in discontinuity, and the discontinuities are a way of modulating tension, which then captures attention, which then has an effect on mood
So Erickson’s use of discontinuities, again, was similar to the poet’s, because poets would use these discontinuities in their composition, and certainly moviemakers and dramatists use this kind of discontinuity. When one normally thinks about hypnosis, one thinks of it as a gradual slide into a soporific state. When Erickson started an induction he often started by increasing the tension and then decrease the tension, and then introduce discontinuities, and then he would increase, and decrease, and increase and decrease the tension over the course of the induction, also during the utilization period of trance. That is exactly as the dramatist does. The purpose of destabilizaiton is to have impact because if you’re talking in a monotone and your communication is completely symmetrical, it’s not going to have as much impact as communication that contains discontintuities, especially when the impact that you want to have is to alter mood and perspective. Q: In conclusion, as you know, we are both artists, and thus are approaching this from a very different angle. In our previous conversations, you spoke of how you often looked to art and literature for inspiration in your practice. What do you think are some aspects of Ericksonian psychotherapy that could be of use to artists, and conversely, could you tell us a bit more about the type of things in the arts that have inspired you in your own practice? A: Well, ironically, it’s curious that you contact me to include aspects of Ericksonian therapy to inform the arts because the project that most interests me now is what psychotherapists can learn from commercial filmmakers, and…social psychologists, The ellipsis is there because I think therapists can learn more from filmmakers than they can from social psychologists. When we study the structure of impact, we can look at the way that, for example, a moviemaker stages a particular frame, or sets up a dramatic moment in a series of small steps, or foreshadows a future event earlier in the movie. Well, these were things that Erickson did. I think that Erickson, who was very well-read, took a lot of his models from literature, so that the kinds of techniques that Thomas Mann would use, where for example Mann would bring a character in against an emotional background. Then some fifty or a hundred pages later against the same emotional background, that character would reemerge suddenly. That was a way of setting up dramatic impact. A lot of my work is teaching therapists around the world, but when I try to explain to therapists the idea of being strategic and setting up a future event; and the idea of using multi-level communication; and the idea of using discontinuities, their eyes start to glaze over. But when I can appeal to their media literacy and I can show them a small section of a movie, and demonstrate to them how the moviemaker uses those same techniques to have impact, then, because of people’s media literacy, they can more easily understand Erickson. So I can show my students a segment of a movie, and then I can tell them of a case of Erickson’s and rather than looking at traditional psychology as the foundation or the lens through which to understand Erickson, looking at Erickson through the lens of the filmmaker makes it easier to understand and integrate Erickson’s techniques. So in my workshops I’ll have exercises where my students will practice, for example, setting up a future event, foreshadowing, or using discontinuities, and learning how to have better impact by taking models from art. Now, the project of using commercial filmmakers, really that’s only a metaphor, because I’m interested in poets and dramatists and visual artists of all persuasions, including architects, because these are people who work to subtly influence mood and perspective. But, commercial filmmakers, because their medium combines music and visual composition—they turn out to be very useful in the way that I train psychotherapists, because there work is so multi-dimensional, and I can illustrate so much about impact by looking at the structural aspects of film. The viewer of the film and the artist create a moment of interpersonal impact. The viewer is having a relationship with the movie. The movie is about interpersonal impact. I hope that when the cinematographer and editor and the costume designer and set designer, etc. get together, they are thinking with intent about having an impact. I try to deconstruct those techniques and try to help therapists understand how to improve their communication by using those techniques. For therapists, communication is an underused medium; therapists don’t use all of the potentialities that are inherent in the medium of communication. I try to get therapists to explore the outer edges of communication, and how to better use their medium to have constructive impact on their patients. Art is provides a model from which influence can be studied. The Day’s Colors By Marie de Brugerolle Blue Monday Orange Tuesday Black Wednesday Yellow Thursday Green Friday Red and White Saturday Gray Sunday Blue as an orange Red as a peony Emerald yellow Scarlet rose Salmon blue Venetian green Indigo brown Ink orange Italic yellow Petroleum carmine Charcoal gray, like a tomato Seeing everything double Seeing everything gold Seeing everything Naple’s yellow Blond smoke Where does the white go when the snow melts ? SURVIVOR: REAL HOUSEWIVES ALL-STARS By Erik Ajemian On an Island: say Martinque 5 weeks in a beautiful mansion, all the alcohol one can drink. One week, ‘on safari’, tents and provisions provided w/o instructions. 6 weeks total (+ Reunion Show) One rule: no hitting/ initiator of fight is kicked off island. Show is a competition, America votes via text message only (within continental United States) Winner receives $500,000 shopping spree THURSDAYS: 9pm NBC Must Watch T.V. ALL-STARS: 1) NeNe (Atlanta)� 2) Kim (Atlanta) 3) Contess De <strong>Les</strong>seps (New York) 4) Jill Zarin (New York) 5),6) The two Younger-ish Hot Blonds (Orange County)* 7) New York (I Love New York) ** * not the one that married the rich guy and changed her face ** Special Entry—not a orignal member of the Bravo Series spnsors t.b.d. Sculpture By Bob Wilhite Los Angeles Institute of Contemporary Art LA CA Stept 27-Oct 5 th 1977, duration 20 min The performance was given to ten or less people per night for one week. The audiences were seated in front of a rotating spiral disc where they heard the following hypnotic induction spoken in a soothing monotone. Would everyone please be seated if you have not already done so. Make yourself as comfortable as possible. It would be best if you sat up in your chair and placed both feet on the floor in front of you. Make yourself as relaxed as possible. Give attention to the disc rotating in front of you. Breathe deeply and relax. Watch the spiral and relax. Watch the spiral. Watch it very closely. Don’t take your eyes off the spiral even for a moment. Concentrate all your attention on it. Spinning round and round, round and round. Watch it carefully. Breathe deeply and relax. You are feeling warm and comfortable. Relax and think only of sleep. Breathe deeply, very deeply. Soon your eyes will become very tired. Your eyelids so very heavy. You will hardly be able to keep them open. You will have to shut your eyes. When you shut them you will be in deep sound restful sleep. A deep sound restful sleep. Breathe very deeply and relax. Do not take your eyes away from the spiral even for a moment. Strain your eyes just a little to see the spiral. Soon your eyes will become very tired. They are beginning to water. Your eyelids are heavy, very heavy. Keep watching the spiral. Watch it. Watch it. Your arms and legs feel relaxed. You are so tired, you want to go to sleep. Think only of sleep. You are going into relaxed and restful sleep. With every breath you take your eyes are more and more tired. So very tired, keep them open. You must shut your eyes. Do not resist it. You have to shut your eyes. Shut your eyes. Shut them… shut them…shut them right now. Breathe deeply, very deeply. With every breath you are falling deeper and deeper into sleep. So very tired. You cannot keep them open. You must shut your eyes. Do not resist it. You have to shut your eyes. Shut your eyes. Shut them…shut them…shut them right now. Breathe deeply, very deeply. With every breath you are falling deeper and deeper into sleep. A peaceful sleep.You are paying attention only to my voice. Nothing else seems to matter. Nothing will disturb you. Let yourself relax competely now. It is very pleasant to feel so relaxed, so relaxed. As though all your cares have gone away. As though nothing else matters at all. You are so listless now. Give way to this feeling. Let yourself go. Drifting deeper and deeper. Deeper with every breath you take. You are listening only to my voice. Nothing else matters. You noice a feeling of heaviness in your arms and legs. Your breathing is slow and easy… slow and easy. Give way to this drowsy listlessness. Let all of your muscles relax. Relax them completely. Do not mind if your head falls forward or to the side... it will be perfectly comfortable. You are giving my voice your complete attention. The art of memory is the art of attention and retention. You must pay attention in order to remember. People who do not pay attention do not remember. Relax, breathe deeply, and pay attention only to my voice…only to my voice. You have always been able to picture objects in your mind. From a simple description you have been able to see crystal clear images. Using your ability to concentrate and see objects in your mind, I am going to show you a piece of sculpture I have made. The sculpture is a saucer-shaped object with a white opaque glass bubble on the top. It is four feet in diameter and is hovering in one spot about two feet off the ground in the open area in front of you. As you look closer at the sculpture you notice that it is spinning and has a wonderful satin appearance. The spinning action is what keeps the object in the air. It is secure and stable as it gently bobs up and down in one spot…suspended on a cushion of air. The sculpture is totally silent except for a slight whir of the air as it spins. You can hear it if you listen closely. It is a pleasant experience seeing the object. The sculpture I;ve made for you. You cannot help smiling because the experience is so enjoyable. I will soon count from 1 to 10. When I reach 7 you will be wide awake and you will feel comfortable and relaxed… with a warm glow of health and well-being. You will remember having seen the saucer-shaped object I have shown you. It will be a clear memory. The actual object however will not be present in front of you because I have taken it away. I will now start counting from 1 to 10. When I reach 7 you will be wide awake and feeling fine…1…2…3…4…5…6…7…8…9…10 An auditory description of the new letteric alphabet. ( where learning to pronounce, without vowels, becomes the new sound for each new letter) or N dtry dscrptn f th nw lttrc lphbt (whr lrnng t prnnc, wtht vwls, bcms th nw snd fr ch nw lttr) By Jon Pestoni alpha / nhltn (hrd) beta / xhltn (hrd) gamma / hssng (whstlng btwn th tth lke snd f nke) delta/ rttlng n th thrt epsilon/ grwlng (lk dg bt t brk) eta/ grspng (hrs snd) md wth th wndpp by pffng p th blly theta/ sgh (md smltnsly by th wndppe, mth, nd, ns kappa/ snrng lamda/ grglng (wth th r vbrtng btw nth tng nd th plt) mu/ whmprng nu/ hccgh omicron/ cgh, clrng th thrt pi/ blch ro/ clckng th tng sigma/ frtng snd (wth th lps) tau/ crcklng ( s f mttng th nse f n t) upsilon/ spttng snd ( srt f p-ph-pty tgthr) phi/ kssng (nsly) psi/ whstlng ( smpl, nt mldc)
Page 1: Jas ...Les Lettres Tristes... Ajemi
Page 5: December, Twelve, Two Thousand and
Page 9: By Tan Lin B 1 2007 I read a story

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