Stay up-to-date on news and events from our Young Advocates' Standing Committee (YASC) with Keeping Tabs.

Stay up-to-date on news and events from our Young Advocates' Standing Committee (YASC) with Keeping Tabs.


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The Advocates’ Society<br />

FALL <strong>2023</strong>


05<br />

07<br />

10<br />

14<br />

16<br />

Chair Chat<br />

Chris Kinnear Hunter (he/him), Torys LLP<br />

Litigating and Parenting: Musings from a<br />

young advocate and a new-ish mom<br />

Lisa Delaney (she/her), Cox & Palmer<br />

Back to the future? The in-person v.<br />

remote work debate revisited<br />

Karlson Leung (he/him), Ontario Ministry of the Attorney General –<br />

Crown Law Office Civil, James Hardy (he/him), Thornton Grout Finnigan<br />

LLP, Celina Stoan (she/her), Rogers Partners LLP<br />

Lawyerly Media for Inspiration<br />

<strong>Keeping</strong> <strong>Tabs</strong> Team<br />

Interview with John McIntyre (he/him),<br />

McIntyre Szabo PC<br />

Compiled by Aly Háji (he/him), Lax O’Sullivan Lisus Gottlieb LLP<br />

Editor: Eric Blay, Barrister & Solicitor | eric.c.blay@gmail.com<br />

Deputy Editor: Julie Mouris, Conway Baxter Wilson LLP/s.r.l. | jmouris@conwaylitigation.ca<br />

<strong>Keeping</strong> <strong>Tabs</strong> Editorial Team: Katrina Crocker, Henein Hutchison Robitaille LLP, Lisa Delaney (she/her), Cox & Palmer, Aly Háji (he/him), Lax O’Sullivan Lisus<br />

Gottlieb LLP, Glynnis Hawe, Paliare Roland Rosenberg Rothstein LLP, Karlson Leung (he/him), Ministry of the Attorney General, Crown Law Office and Jean-Simon Schoenholz,<br />

Norton Rose Fulbright<br />

The Young Advocates’ Standing Committee (“YASC”) is a standing committee of The Advocates’ Society with a mandate to be a voice for young advocates (advocates<br />

who are ten years of call or fewer) within the Society and within the profession. We do this through networking/mentoring events, by publishing articles by and<br />

for young advocates, and by raising issues of concern to young advocates as we work with the Society’s Board of Directors. The opinions expressed by individual<br />

authors are their own and do not necessarily reflect the policies of The Advocates’ Society.<br />

2 3


(Click on the program to learn more)<br />

NOV 22<br />

Arbitration Advocacy<br />

(Alberta)<br />

NOV 22<br />

Changing the<br />

Conversation<br />

NOV 23<br />

Class Actions Bench &<br />

Bar Reception<br />


(Calgary, AB, Live<br />

Stream)<br />

(Toronto, ON, Live<br />

Stream)<br />

(Toronto, ON)<br />

NOV 23<br />

Thunder Bay Social<br />

(Thunder Bay, ON)<br />

NOV 28<br />

Symposium pour les<br />

femmes en litige<br />

(Montréal, QC)<br />

NOV 28<br />

The Art of<br />

Examination-in-Chief<br />

(Toronto, ON, Zoom)<br />

Chair Chat<br />

Chris Kinnear Hunter (he/him), Torys LLP<br />

“Autumn carries more gold in its pocket than all the other seasons combined.”<br />

– Jim Bishop<br />

NOV 29<br />

The Art of Examination-in-Chief<br />

- Skills<br />

Workshop<br />

(Toronto, ON, Zoom)<br />

DEC 01<br />

View From the B.C.<br />

Bench<br />

(Vancouver, BC, Live<br />

Online)<br />

DEC 04<br />

Fireside Chat with The<br />

Hon. Justice Richard<br />

Bernstein<br />

(Toronto, ON, Live<br />

Stream)<br />

NOV 29<br />

President’s Festive<br />

Reception<br />

(Toronto, ON)<br />

NOV 30<br />

How to Deliver<br />

Bad News<br />

(Via Zoom)<br />

I love the fall. Always have. Crimson leaves,<br />

pumpkin pie and, above all else, the return of<br />

NHL hockey. Does it get any better?<br />

The challenge, of course, is finding time to<br />

enjoy these things. After scheduling all things<br />

litigation for “the fall” throughout the summer,<br />

September hits like a ton of bricks. By the time<br />

one gets to October, we all seem to be running<br />

on fumes with no end in sight.<br />

I won’t pretend to have the answer to that<br />

one. I can, however, offer some momentary respite<br />

in the form of this, our fall edition of <strong>Keeping</strong><br />

<strong>Tabs</strong>, which features a thoughtful piece by<br />

Lisa Delaney on the challenges new parents<br />

face maintaining their practice along with some<br />

tips to achieve a bit of balance; a fantastic interview<br />

with John McIntyre on his advocacy for<br />

the 2SLGBTQ+ community and his exciting new<br />

health law boutique; and the latest in the never-ending<br />

‘working from home vs in-person’ debate,<br />

courtesy of Karlson Leung, James Hardy,<br />

and Celina Stoan. Our team has also put together<br />

a stellar lineup of media picks featuring their<br />

favourite podcasts, Ted Talks and films that you<br />

don’t want to miss.<br />

As always, my sincere thanks goes out to the<br />

<strong>Keeping</strong> <strong>Tabs</strong> editorial team for their work putting<br />

this edition together. Our lead editor, Eric<br />

Blay, would love to hear from you if you’d like to<br />

contribute a piece to a future edition.<br />




Litigating and Parenting:<br />

Musings from a young<br />

advocate and a new-ish mom<br />

Lisa Delaney (she/her), Cox & Palmer<br />

When I first started thinking about this piece,<br />

I considered offering some ‘tips’ for litigation<br />

practice post-children. But then I remembered<br />

how, as a parent, the last thing we want, or<br />

need, is more unsolicited advice. That is what<br />

the internet and your in-laws are for! Instead,<br />

I thought I would offer my musings about returning<br />

to practice after parental leave, and the<br />

things that I have found worked for me (or not)<br />

as I adjust to litigating and parenting.<br />

As a private practice litigator, the billable<br />

hour is always looming. However, I am grateful<br />

for how supportive my firm has been. The partners<br />

and staff at my firm have gone out of their<br />

way to ensure I have the resources that I need<br />

and that I am not under water with work. I recognize<br />

that not everyone is so lucky. But supportive<br />

firms exist — I can testify as such.<br />

Carving out time<br />

Before I had my son, I was militant about monitoring<br />

and responding to my e-mails no matter<br />

what time they landed in my inbox. However,<br />

since my parental leave, I made the decision<br />

to turn off the notifications on my phone from<br />

daycare pick-up until my son’s bedtime. It was<br />

hard at first, but it has become my new normal.<br />

We’re taught to be available all the time,<br />

but in my experience, very few things require<br />

an immediate response. Muting notifications<br />

during those few hours allows me to<br />

be fully present with my child and gives me<br />

some time to transition from my workday.<br />

Using technology<br />

If we can be grateful for one thing that the<br />

pandemic has brought us, it is flexible work ar-<br />

6 7

angements. People are much more accepting<br />

of virtual meetings and working from home<br />

than they have ever been. Taking advantage<br />

of these flexibilities has been a necessity<br />

when we inevitably come down with another<br />

daycare-related plague. Seriously — since my<br />

return to work this May, our household has<br />

had strep throat, pink eye, a cold, and the flu.<br />

In addition to flexible work arrangements, I<br />

have become an entirely electronic litigator. I<br />

take advantage of electronic files, e-discovery<br />

software, Zoom discovery examinations, and<br />

a virtual task list. This allows me to work from<br />

anywhere, anytime.<br />

Delegating<br />

As litigators, we struggle with relinquishing<br />

control and in my experience, parents may be<br />

the biggest culprits. We truly believe we can<br />

be everything to everyone all of the time. This<br />

fallacy not only drains us but makes us feel inadequate.<br />

I am still struggling with relinquishing<br />

control. That said, I have tried to rely more<br />

on my junior colleagues by letting them run<br />

with research or an appearance on my behalf.<br />

Not only is this kind of delegation integral to<br />

the private practice model, it is also a mental<br />

health necessity. Let’s all take a page out of<br />

the Frozen playbook and try letting go.<br />

Not having it together<br />

In addition to my toddler, I am pregnant with<br />

my second child, so I am exhausted most of<br />

the time. It often feels like I finish one job at<br />

work and then go home for my other, unpaid<br />

gig. While I am lucky to have a supportive firm<br />

and an incredible partner, I do not have it together<br />

all the time. I am also reconciling that<br />

I am not the same litigator I was before I had<br />

children. Not better, not worse — just different.<br />

Truthfully, I am not sure I am the same<br />

person. But I have learned that for me, being<br />

my best is okay, and if it isn’t for others, that<br />

is okay too.<br />

8 9

eturn to the office that offers fewer distractions, more social connections and a sense of community,<br />

and ease of collaboration and mentoring.<br />

For this issue of <strong>Keeping</strong> <strong>Tabs</strong>, we juxtapose both sides of this debate, championed by two of<br />

TAS’s very own young advocates.<br />

Karlson Leung James Hardy Celina Stoan<br />


Back to the future? The in-person v.<br />

remote work debate revisited<br />

Karlson Leung (he/him), Ontario Ministry of the Attorney General – Crown Law Office Civil<br />

James Hardy (he/him), Thornton Grout Finnigan LLP<br />

Celina Stoan (she/her), Rogers Partners LLP<br />

Work From Home Optimizes Productivity and Quality of Life<br />

Celina Stoan – Insurance Defence Litigator<br />

When the pandemic hit in March 2020, most<br />

firms sent their staff home to limit the spread<br />

of the virus. Eventually, most of us have begun<br />

to come back to the office. I have been fortunate<br />

enough to be allowed some flexibility in<br />

my “in-office” schedule. I say fortunate, because<br />

I am on the pro “work-from-home” side<br />

of this debate.<br />

Some people have told me they find themselves<br />

to be less productive when working from home. I,<br />

on the other hand, find that I am more productive.<br />

Like many lawyers, I am a social person, so when<br />

I am in the office, I often find myself popping into<br />

a colleague’s office to ask a question and suddenly<br />

it’s half an hour later and we’re discussing the<br />

best places to get Bahn Mi. On the flip side, when<br />

working from home, I often find myself working<br />

through lunch and well past any imaginary 5:00<br />

p.m. end time when I’m wrapped up in something.<br />

I also find that when I work from home, I’ll often<br />

log in on a Sunday to manage emails and get a<br />

head start on the week.<br />

For me, working from home offers many advantages<br />

which an office environment does not. I<br />

don’t have to prepare my lunch in the morning or<br />

purchase lunch out, I save half an hour a day by<br />

not commuting to work which generally results in<br />

an earlier start time and later end time, I am able<br />

to use my daily breaks to walk my dog, and I’m also<br />

able to work (most days) in comfortable clothes<br />

like jogging pants and a sweatshirt. I also find that<br />

working from home enables me to have more regular<br />

contact with my family – not distractions, but<br />

just a shoulder squeeze from my husband as he<br />

passes behind me to go to the kitchen or a nuzzle<br />

from my dog to show me his toy.<br />

That being said, I have maintained that in my<br />

practice, litigation events such as examinations,<br />

mediations, and court appearances should be<br />

done from the office to take advantage of ready<br />

access to colleagues to collaborate with and discuss<br />

thorny issues.<br />

Introduction by Karlson Leung, Crown Counsel<br />

With fall season back in full swing, this time of year brings many familiar perennial themes:<br />

pumpkin spice everything, back to school, and back to work after a restful summer vacation.<br />

Recent months have also seen many firms and employers either roll out new return-to-the-office<br />

policies or remote work arrangements. For many in the legal profession, this fall also brings<br />

back the debate between in-person and hybrid/work-from-home (WFH) arrangements.<br />

Last year, the Young Advocates’ Standing Committee (YASC) heard from a diverse range of<br />

perspectives and lived experiences on the benefits of different work environment arrangements<br />

and what the delivery of legal services should look like in the future. During the 2021-2022 term,<br />

YASC interviewed or surveyed more than 220 young advocates across Canada (those with 10<br />

years of call or less). A link to the full Report can be found here.<br />

With 2024 around the corner and members of the bar having experienced three years of pandemic-induced<br />

remote work, many young advocates have celebrated the new possibilities that<br />

remote work brings – more time with loved ones and pets, less commute time, more productivity,<br />

and more accommodations for personal circumstances – while others have been eager to<br />

10 11

Dedicated Office Space Enables<br />

Social Connection and Allows<br />

Separation of Work and Home Life<br />

James Hardy – Commercial Litigator<br />

I spent the first few years of my legal career<br />

like most of us did before 2020: five days a<br />

week in the office, with the occasional weekend<br />

appearance. I’m glad for the benefits that<br />

flexible working offers, but for me, working<br />

in the office is the best way to connect with<br />

colleagues, disconnect at home, and develop<br />

as a professional.<br />

Law is a tough but rewarding profession<br />

and success depends upon building a strong<br />

community of peers. That community is built<br />

on the small chance interactions that happen<br />

when you share a space. Your examination<br />

finishes early, so you grab lunch with a colleague<br />

and discuss your litigation strategy.<br />

You overhear colleagues discussing a case<br />

that you recently used in a factum, so you offer<br />

to share notes. Or you see a colleague repeatedly<br />

at their desk late at night and offer<br />

to cover for them. It is much harder to build<br />

a supportive community when all you have<br />

to go on is the colour of a Microsoft Teams<br />

status icon.<br />

The rise of working from home also means<br />

the rise of the home office. Young lawyers<br />

place enormous pressure on themselves to<br />

always be available, so when we work from<br />

home, the separation of our personal and<br />

professional lives gets blurred – and if expensive<br />

property markets mean our home<br />

office might be a kitchen table with a laptop<br />

on it, there is always a reminder of the work<br />

we still have to complete. There are mental<br />

health benefits to leaving the work at work,<br />

so that we can truly switch off when we get<br />

home.<br />

Hybrid arrangements offer many advantages,<br />

but you will still find me most mornings<br />

on my bike heading downtown.<br />

*The views expressed in this article are the personal views of Mr. Leung and should not be taken as the views of either the<br />

Attorney General of Ontario or the Government of Ontario.<br />

12 13

Your injured client<br />

needs more than<br />

a settlement.<br />


Lawyerly Media for Inspiration<br />

Compiled by the <strong>Keeping</strong> <strong>Tabs</strong> Team<br />

Robichaud’s “Of Counsel”<br />

Podcast: Ewa Krajewska:<br />

“Confidence in yourself and<br />

the materials”<br />

Guy Pratte’s “The Art of<br />

Persuasion” Podcast:<br />

Changing People’s Minds<br />

with David Goldbloom<br />

Paula Price’s “The Joyful Practice for<br />

Women Lawyers” Podcast:<br />

“What Perfectionism is Costing You”<br />

Stand for the best guaranteed<br />

return for your client.<br />

STRUCTURE IT EVERY TIME. 1.800.265.8381 | www.mckellar.com<br />

14<br />

Friends Who Argue<br />

“Parenting in Law”<br />

Amy Cuddy’s Ted Talk on<br />

“Your body language may<br />

shape who you are”<br />

Film: Just Mercy (2019)<br />


Q. Could you tell me about your health law practice? How does health law intersect with<br />

your advocacy in the 2SLGBTQ+ community?<br />

A. My practice involves essentially any kind of dispute or litigation matter in the healthcare sphere.<br />

It sounds super niche, but the reality is that I’m rarely doing the same thing every day. One day I’ll be<br />

defending a healthcare practitioner on a medical malpractice matter or regulatory complaint, and the<br />

next I’ll be dealing with a complex physician privilege issue or a mental health appeal.<br />

There is a huge intersection between my practice and my advocacy, because the 2SLGBTQ+ community<br />

has been (and continues to be) significantly marginalized, particularly when it comes to access<br />

to healthcare and health outcomes. As an out gay lawyer, I’ve always felt it is important to use my privilege<br />

to support my community. And I’m always looking for new ways to integrate it into my health law<br />

practice; for example, I recently advocated against anti-trans speech by regulated health professionals<br />

in the Peterson v. College of Psychologists of Ontario case 1 as well as representing trans and non-binary<br />

people fighting for OHIP coverage of gender-affirming care.<br />

1. Peterson v. College of Psychologists of Ontario, <strong>2023</strong> ONSC 4685 (Div Ct).<br />


Interview with John McIntyre<br />

(he/him), McIntyre Szabo PC<br />

Compiled by Aly Háji (he/him), Lax O’Sullivan Lisus<br />

Gottlieb LLP<br />

John McIntyre founded McIntyre Health Law in 2022 and then co-founded McIntyre Szabo PC in <strong>2023</strong><br />

with Jessica Szabo. Prior to establishing his own firm, John was a senior associate in the health law<br />

group at a major Canadian law firm and obtained his Master of Public Health from Johns Hopkins University.<br />

John routinely represents and advises clients in the health care sector. His practice focuses on<br />

professional regulation and discipline (including defending clients in College complaints and discipline<br />

matters), medical staff credentialing, mental health law (CCB/ORB), appellate advocacy, human rights<br />

applications, civil litigation (including medical malpractice lawsuits), as well as general legal, clinical, operational,<br />

policy and risk advice.<br />

Q. Is your advocacy in the 2SLGBTQ+ community what led you to start your own firm?<br />

A. Actually, it’s the other way around. Running my own firm has given me the freedom to build a practice<br />

that is meaningful to me. There is no one looking over my shoulder telling me what I should bill,<br />

which clients I can take on pro bono or what issues I can take a stance on. If I want to do it, I do it.<br />

My partner, Jessica Szabo, and I have two core values to our firm: (1) contribute to the betterment of<br />

the healthcare system; and (2) enjoy our careers. It’s that simple for us. And the 2SLGBTQ+ advocacy<br />

work hits on both of those values in spades for me.<br />

Q. I was inspired by your work on the Jordan Peterson judicial review at the Ontario Divisional<br />

Court; it was remarkable to see a small, relatively new firm compete with some real<br />

heavy hitters. How did you get involved?<br />

A. I’m not going to lie, it was pretty surreal to look around the courtroom to see so many senior counsel<br />

I’ve looked up to in my career. It was a turning point for me in the goals I set for myself and the firm,<br />

because, at the time, it was beyond my wildest dreams to think I would be at that table so soon after<br />

starting the firm. Now, I set no limits to how big or audacious those goals are. If it’s something I want to<br />

do, I’m going to try.<br />

When I heard about the case, I knew it was something I had to be involved in – it was at the perfect<br />

intersection of my professional regulation practice and 2SLGBTQ+ rights. I did extensive background<br />

research and workshopped my potential arguments, then started hitting the ground by reaching out to<br />

2SLGBTQ+ advocacy organizations, and the whole thing snowballed from there.<br />

16 17

Q. Do you have any advice for young advocates who want to go out on their own?<br />

A. It’s not as scary as it looks. And trust me, I know the fear. Years ago, I would look at young advocates<br />

who went out on their own with envy – I thought they walked on water. I never thought it could be me.<br />

Frankly, I never wanted it to be me – I was one of those people who said I’d never start my own firm. But<br />

it has by far been the best decision of my career and I can’t imagine ever going back.<br />

If you’re thinking about it – reach out to me or talk to other lawyers doing it (shameless plug - through<br />

the TAS mentorship portal). I have found the small firm bar to be tremendously open, kind and interested<br />

in lifting others up for success.<br />

Q. What advice would you give young advocates who want to be their authentic selves?<br />

A. Don’t listen to the explicit and implicit pressures to suppress who you are. Law has traditionally<br />

been a more conservative industry, but it is changing. You will be more successful in your career when<br />

you bring your whole self to your work, because your confidence will shoot through the roof, and your<br />

passion will be infectious.<br />

For me, being my authentic self in my practice includes not hiding parts of my life just because others<br />

may not accept it. For example, I’m an out gay polyamorous man in a long-term three-person relationship.<br />

Some have said I should check that part of my life at the door. But, in my experience, you connect<br />

most with your clients when you engage on a personal level and so I am open about both of my partners<br />

to my clients and colleagues, which makes it easier to show up as my authentic self.<br />

Q. Speaking of which, you’ve been very involved in TAS’s new mentorship portal. Why do<br />

you think mentorship is important for young advocates, particularly those from diverse<br />

and equity-seeking communities?<br />

A. I think the portal is such an important program, whether you’re at a big or a small firm, because it exposes<br />

you to mentors with different perspectives who don’t have a direct stake in your career. Funnily<br />

enough, our landlord for our firm office space is Megan Keenberg (of Keenberg & Co), who I initially met<br />

through an Advocates’ Society mentorship session and Megan has become instrumental as an ongoing<br />

mentor to me.<br />

Mentorship is essential for those from diverse and equity-seeking communities because there isn’t a<br />

level playing field. But it is equally important, in my view, to have mentorship from those in diverse and<br />

equity-seeking communities. Young advocates need to see themselves represented in senior parts of<br />

the bar and to see there is not one mold of what makes a good litigator.<br />

Q. What can more experienced lawyers do to support those young advocates as mentors?<br />

A. If you are also part of a diverse and equity-seeking community, don’t assume your experiences<br />

are the same. If you are not, do the work to build cultural competency so you can properly support<br />

your mentee. Be there to truly listen and hear your mentee to tailor your guidance to them, rather<br />

than just assuming what worked for you will work for them.<br />

Also, mentoring is more than just giving advice and guidance. For mentees in your firm, give<br />

them opportunities. Give them the chance to interact directly with clients. Give them challenging<br />

projects that will help them grow even if they aren’t quite ready. Let them be first chair. Be their<br />

champion behind closed doors in the firm. Your biggest success as a lawyer is not the cases you’ve<br />

won, but the positive impact you make on the next generation of lawyers.<br />

18 19

Toronto Big Mingle<br />

Wednesday, August 9, <strong>2023</strong> | The Advocates’ Society, Toronto, ON<br />

20 21


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