Modern Law Magazine Issue 70

Issue 70
ISSN 2976-9396
THE BUSINESS OF LAW
Leading Ladies:
Women Shaping
the Future of Law
P06 P10 P30
Women
At The
Top
with Vivienne Artz OBE
A
Balancing
Act
Amy Cousineau Massey
Celebrating
Women in Law
Aspirational Women in the
Legal Profession

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“In the future there will be no female
leaders, there will just be leaders.”
Sheryl Sandberg
Hello, and welcome to issue 70 of Modern
Law magazine. Amidst the recent celebration
of International Women’s Day and the buzz
surrounding the latest round of partner
promotions, we have chosen to focus on the
pivotal theme of “Women in Law” for this
issue.
In the following pages we explore the triumphs,
challenges, and aspirations that shape the
landscape for women in the legal profession.
Through compelling narratives and thoughtprovoking
discussions, we aim to shed light
on the significant progress made, while also
considering the work that remains to be done,
in fostering a truly equitable and inclusive
environment.
In our opening interview Vivienne Artz OBE
speaks to us about her new position as CEO of
The FTSE Women Leaders Review which aims
to improve the representation of women on
the Boards and Leadership of the FTSE 350 and
50 of the UK’s largest companies. She shares
with us her journey so far, her ambitions for
the future and what more needs to be done to
improve the numbers of women in leadership
positions across UK business.
We also speak to Amy Cousineau Massey, a
passionate voice on LinkedIn – and beyond –
about both her work as an employment lawyer
advising women on their rights and about her
own experiences as a woman in law.
Our third interview is with Ella Watts, founder
of Ladies of Law, who tells us why she
created a networking community focused
on empowering women, how she thinks law
firms can better address the work-life balance
for working parents and which firms have
impressed her with their gender diversity
initiatives.
Our regular contributors from our Editorial
Board give us their take on how we can get
more women on boards and in leadership
positions, offer some practical steps firms can
take to encourage women to return to law after
having children and look at how to create fair
opportunities for all.
We have a thought-provoking contribution
from Nusrat Qureishi, Head of Corporate &
Commercial Law at Stevensdrake Solicitors,
which outlines her experiences of being a
female solicitor from a diverse background.
She ponders on how much has changed and
whether prejudices still exist.
Our main features shine a spotlight on a
curated selection of inspiring women both from
law firms and the wider legal sector.
In our “Celebrating Women in Law” section
we hear from a range of determined and
resilient women who provide their insights
and reflections on the topic of women in
leadership.
Our “Soundbites” section celebrates some
female rising stars in the legal world, who have
often taken a non-traditional route into law,
with a variety of barriers to overcome. We hope
you are inspired by their stories.
The Wills and Probate Roundtable for this issue
focuses on the current challenges faced by
the legal sector and how technology might be
able to help while our Conveyancing Forum
discusses regulatory change and compliance,
the impact of cyber security threats and
changing expectations from clients in an
increasingly digitised market.
We also have contributions from Kamila
Kurkowska, founder and president of Women
in Law Foundation and Maria Victoria Yuste,
Director of Women in eDiscovery in our Legal
Tech Talk section.
We wrap up with our popular “10 minutes with”
feature, where Laura Cartwright from Bell
Lamb & Joynson shares her most memorable
achievement and what you might find her
doing when she retires!
Finally, an introduction! After working
closely with lawyers on marketing, PR and
communications for over ten years I am thrilled
to now be Acting Editor of Modern Law
magazine. Along with, my team at Consortium
– more than marketing we are very excited to
be involved and look forward to bringing you
diverse perspectives, insightful content and
helpful discussions. Enjoy Issue 70
Cara Flood is Acting Editor at
Modern Law Magazine and
Marketing & Account Manager at
Consortium – more than marketing
cara@consortiumbiz.co.uk
Editorial Contributors
Helen Lobozzo, Taylor Rose
Collette Allen, SmartSearch
Paul Sams, Dutton Gregory
Mark Holt, Frenkel Topping
Neville Dinshaw, Law Mergers & Acquisitions
Kathliya Harwood, Speech Processing Solutions
Dave Seager, Matrix Capital
ISSUE 70
ISSN 2976-9396
Editor
Cara Flood - Acting Editor
Project Manager & Events Sales
Kate McKittrick
Modern Law Magazine is published by Charlton Grant Ltd ©2023
All material is copyrighted both written and illustrated.
Reproduction in part or whole is strictly forbidden without
the written permission of the publisher. All images and
information is collated from extensive research and along
with advertisements is published in good faith. Although
the author and publisher have made every effort to ensure
that the information in this publication was correct at press
time, the author and publisher do not assume and hereby
disclaim any liability to any party for any loss, damage, or
disruption caused by errors or omissions, whether such
errors or omissions result from negligence, accident, or
any other cause.
3

CONTENTS
INTERVIEW
06 Women at the Top
Vivienne Artz OBE, CEO, FTSE Women Leaders Review
10 A Balancing Act
Amy Cousineau Massey, Employment Solicitor, Woodstock Legal Services
13 Ladies of Law
Ella Watts, Founder, Ladies of Law
EDITORIAL
BOARD
FEATURE
15 Mergers & Acquisitions
The importance of a diverse workforce
Neville Dinshaw, Managing Director, Law Mergers & Acquisitions
15 Matrix Capital
Women dominate the empathetic side of the law
Dave Seager, Consulting Advisor, Matrix Capital
17 Dutton Gregory
Welcome Back - why it’s important to focus on the return to work
after maternity or family-related leave
Paul Sams, Managing Partner of Dutton Gregory Solicitors
17 Frenkel Topping
Diversity & Inclusion are key when it comes to business success
Mark Holt, COO of Frenkel Topping Group
19 SmartSearch
Four key drivers of inclusivity
Collette Allen, COO, SmartSearch
19 Philips Dictation
10 reasons why gender diversity is so important
Kathliya Harwood, Marketing Manager, Philips Dictation
20 Taylor Rose MW
What Women Want: How can employers help women in the
workplace?
Helen Lobozzo, Partner & Head of Client Care at Taylor Rose MW
21 Breaking Bias
Nusrat Qureishi, Head of Corporate & Commercial Law, Stevensdrake
Solicitors
56 A Day in the Life of Lara Squires
Lara Squires, Director, Consortium - more than marketing
78 The Impact of Ai on Legal Operations
Chris Green, Co-Founder & CEO, Xapien
EDITORIAL BOARD CONTRIBUTORS
SpeechLive
4

CONTENTS
CELEBRATING
WOMEN
IN LAW
SOUNDBITES
FORUM
23 Celebrating Women in Law
A handpicked selection of inspiring women talk to us about the role and
importance of women in the legal profession, where progress has been made, and
the remaining challenges the sector has yet to overcome
54 Our Journey Into Law
Prepare to be inspired by rising stars of the legal world who offer us
a glimpse into their journeys so far. These resilient women have often
overcome adversity, prejudice, and personal challenges, shaping them into
powerful future leaders of tomorrow.
60 Business Development For Law Firms A Roundtable Discussion
A roundtable discussion considering how sales and business development
are viewed within today’s legal market
ROUNDTABLE
67 Wills and Probate Panel
Our experts consider the biggest challenges the industry currently face and
how technology may be able to help
LEGAL TECH
77 LegalTechTalk
Charlotte Johnstone from LegalTechTalk discusses the role of women in law
and where further change needs to happen
10 MINS WITH
81 10 Mins With... Laura Cartwright
Laura shares her most memorable achievement and what you might find her
doing when she retires
Disclaimer: Our publications contain advertising material submitted by third parties. Each individual advertiser is solely responsible for the content of its advertising material. We accept
no responsibility for the content of advertising material, including, without limitation, any error, omission or inaccuracy therein. We do not endorse, and are not responsible or liable for,
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5

INTERVIEWS
AT THE TOP
The FTSE Women Leaders Review is the UK’s business-led voluntary framework,
supported by Government to improve the representation of women on the Boards and
Leadership teams of the FTSE 350 and 50 of the UK’s largest private companies.
Newly appointed CEO Vivienne Artz OBE talks to Cara Flood about her career path so
far, why it’s so important to have women in senior positions in business and what she
hopes to achieve in her new role.
6

INTERVIEWS
Many congratulations on your appointment
Q Vivienne, I know that building on the amazing work
your predecessor Denise Wilson has done will be a
priority but what in particular is your main focus for the
role?
Over the last decade there has been near
Arevolutionary change in the representation of women
at the top of British business. The FTSE Women Leaders
Review has been at the vanguard of that change and
reaching 40% women on FTSE 350 Boards last year, three
years ahead of deadline, was a significant milestone.
The priority now is to replicate that success with women
across senior leadership positions. Whilst the number
of women in senior executive decision-making roles has
increased, the rate of improvement needs to step up
considerably. The appointment rate of women is still too
low with more than six out of ten leadership vacancies still
going to men. To reach our target of 40% representation
of women two levels below board (Executive Committee
and their direct reports) we will need to see a woman
appointed into every other senior leadership position.
Given the number of talented women and the value of
diversity of perspective, this is wholly achievable but it
requires commitment, focus and determination across
British business.
I understand that you would like to improve gender
Q balance in four key roles (Chair, Senior Independent
Director (SID), CEO and Finance Director) at companies.
Why is it important to target these roles in particular and
what do you think are the main barriers standing in the
way?
Yes, we have set a target of having at least one of
Athose four key decision-making roles held by a woman
by the end of 2025.
Tracking progress of women in these roles encourages
focus at the very top of organisations, enables women to
better progress, and ensures that the UK’s most powerful,
influential roles benefit from diversity of experience and
perspective.
We have seen excellent progress in the representation of
women in the SID role which has now reached near parity
at 47%. The SID role plays a key part in board governance
and is also critical in building the pipeline of potential
women Chairs as the SID is a key feeder for the Chair role.
The current stand-out disappointing statistic is the
number of women CEOs in the FTSE 350 today. The CEO
role was always going to be the last hill to conquer as
these are the biggest, highest-paid and most influential
roles in British business, and the turnover is low. Some
of the reasons for this include an ongoing reliance on
‘traditional’ career routes, narrowly drawn briefs, and bias
in the selection process.
However, in addition to encouraging increased numbers
of women in Finance Director & CIO positions and on
Executive Committees in the FTSE 100, we now have a
changing business context that requires broader life and
work skills to lead effectively, and this also lends itself to
the strong skillset of many women leaders.
Can you tell me about your career path – where it
Q started and how it’s led you to where you are
today?
I began my career reading Philosophy and Theology at
Auniversity but it became clear to me fairly quickly that
with these subjects, the most likely career options open
to me would be academia or the church, so I decided to
retrain as a lawyer. How things have changed – my
Philosophy and Theology degree is now key to my work in
data and ED&I (Equality, Diversity & Inclusion)!
When I started out in law, there were very few women
becoming partners at the top of City law firms, so I
moved to an in-house role in financial services taking a
role at Citibank. I spent seventeen amazing years at Citi
becoming a Managing Director in the General Counsel’s
Office.
I also became heavily involved in the Citi Women’s
Network and became President and CEO of Women In
Banking and Finance (WIBF). This was one of the most
interesting roles in my career as it gave me first-hand
experience of the CEO role including defining the strategy,
running the budget, understanding the membership and
growing the organisation.
I developed a specialism in data and data protection
which led me to being appointed as Chief Privacy Officer
at Thomson Reuters, Refinitiv and then London Stock
Exchange Group (LSEG). Throughout this time I continued
leading WIBF, and at Refinitiv in particular, I learned
what makes a truly great leader and saw the power of
combining responsibility, accountability and diversity.
Refinitiv really valued my WIBF role and saw this as
enhancing and empowering me in my day-to-day business
role.
When I left LSEG I started to build my plural career with
a combination of advisory and board roles and I am
now delighted to be leading the FTSE Women Leaders
Review. I have always been a passionate advocate for
gender balance and the FTSE Women Leaders Review has
demonstrated how change can be achieved with focus
and determination.
“THE CEO ROLE WAS
ALWAYS GOING TO BE THE
LAST HILL TO CONQUER”
Were there any particular hurdles you had to
Q overcome?
Working in the City I think I encountered the same
Ahurdles as many women – bias, harassment and not
being taken seriously. When I had children I almost had to
operate as though I didn’t have a family, which was very
typical of a time when it was difficult to bring your ‘whole
self’ to work.
I think it’s fair to say that the prejudice that women face
reared its head early on for me. When I was applying
for university one of my teachers encouraged me to
apply to Oxford, but the Dean (who was a man) told me
I should withdraw my application as he didn’t believe I
would be successful, and was concerned that this would
reflect badly on the school! I did not withdraw, and with
much encouragement from my father, I persisted and was
successful in getting a place at Oxford. So that Dean really
underestimated and mis-judged me!
But perhaps the most memorable manifestation of the
in-built bias that exists was borne out when I handed in
my resignation at a law firm to take on an exciting, new
role only to have the partner jump to the conclusion that I
was resigning because I was pregnant. Before he had even
thought about the possibility of a new role, he had made a
set of assumptions based on my gender.
7

INTERVIEWS
“I HAVE ALWAYS BEEN A
PASSIONATE ADVOCATE FOR
GENDER BALANCE”
What have been your proudest moments?
Q
My proudest moment was probably being presented
Athe OBE for services to Financial Services and Gender
Diversity by HRH Princess Anne. I always think of the OBE
as the WIBF’s award in recognition of the tremendous team
work that was achieved and the powerhouse of change
that was delivered. We redefined WIBF as a network
that connects, challenges and inspires members through
mentoring development, thought leadership, communities
and networking, jobs and awards.
Have you seen opportunities and the workplace
Q change for women in business over the course of
your career?
I have seen huge change. There is now an expectation
Athat the work environment needs to reflect wider
society and there is increased focus among all stakeholders
on the benefits of diversity in terms of governance,
performance and innovation. There has also been a
sea-change in the understanding of the importance of
harnessing the skills and capabilities of women in an
environment where talent is at a premium. Gender balance
in leadership is now a core business issue with investors and
shareholders viewing diversity as a business imperative that
is key to long-term success.
Gender pay gap reporting, increased flexible working and
improvements to parental leave have all helped too, but as
we know, there remains more to do to create a genderequal
workplace in which everyone can reach their full
potential.
What more can businesses do to improve gender
Q diversity?
We need to treat improving gender diversity like any
Aother business topic with a robust plan of action, hard
data and deliverables that are tracked and measured. It also
requires leadership from the top of the organisation.
From a cultural perspective, companies that are rolemodelling
positive behaviour and encouraging a mature
conversation on this topic have made great strides in
transforming the gender balance and capability of their
leadership.
Who is your role model and how does it feel to be
Q seen as a role model yourself?
Condoleezza Rice who came from a modest
Abackground, and was the first African-American woman
Secretary of State in the US. This was an extraordinary
achievement particularly as there were no role models for
her to look up to or follow - she was the first, and had to
galvanise the sponsorship of amazing men around her to
realise her potential and achieve the position which she did.
What is the most important thing an employer can
Q do to help women progress at work?
There is no one silver bullet, but when companies tackle
Athe issue of gender balance and the development of
women with a proactive plan of action, underpinned by
public targets that are tracked and measured, it is truly
transformational.
These targets then need to be reinforced by key practical
measures aimed at:
ensuring that women have maximum opportunities to
broaden and develop their skills and are part of the
organisation’s talent management programme
reviewing all recruitment processes and procedures and
setting clear diversity criteria for the long/short list for
any new appointment
creating a database of senior leaders who are committed
to mentoring and sponsoring women in their careers and
putting mentoring/sponsorship in place
reviewing parental leave policies to ensure that they are
fair, flexible and transparent and ideally introducing a
policy of equal parenting leave
empowering colleagues to work flexibly by reviewing
ways of working
creating diversity networks that enable colleagues to
share experience and support each other in their careers.
I understand that prior to working at Citi, you used
Q to be a solicitor – what specific challenges do you
think the legal profession faces with regards to gender
diversity?
The legal profession has had a strong female pipeline
Afor a long time, but the progress has been slow to
promote and retain women at partner level where the
representation of men and women is not balanced. The
partnership structure and its relative lack of flexibility has
certainly complicated this.
“WHEN PEOPLE
SEE WOMEN LEADING
BUSINESSES IT CHALLENGES
STEREOTYPES”
Being seen as a role model is very humbling and I am
always humbled by people who have followed me and
my career and hopefully learned from my journey and
experience.
8

INTERVIEWS
“HAVING NEGOTIATED WITH A TODDLER OR TEENAGER YOU CAN
NEGOTIATE WITH ANYONE!”
Retaining talent is a big issue for law firms, what
Q more do you think firms could do to encourage
women to stay in the profession, particularly after having
children or a career break?
It starts with a commitment from the very top of the
Apartnership to achieving gender balance. Some of the
key measures and policies that help drive progress include:
introducing progressive parental leave policies and ideally
a policy of equal parental leave which enables the sharing
of childcare
reviewing policies and procedures to create flexible ways
of working which enable women (and men) to balance
their caring responsibilities with their working life
creating a dedicated programme of support for ‘returner’
parents who have had a maternity or career break, to
ensure a positive transition back into the workplace
demonstrating a commitment to the progression of
women’s careers by providing development opportunities
in terms of stretching projects as well as coaching,
mentoring and sponsorship
I believe you have children yourself so must fully
Q understand the juggle of trying to create a work life
balance for you and your family! How have you managed
this and what impact has it had?
Even today this is a question that is asked of women but
Ararely asked of men! Juggling family life and a career
is a challenge and it takes determination, organisation and
the sharing of responsibilities at home for me to strike that
balance. My children are my greatest delight, and I feel that
having children has helped me to make tough decisions
and focus on priorities. I also think that having negotiated
with a toddler or teenager, you can probably negotiate with
anyone!
What are some of the benefits in having a gender
Q diverse workforce and leadership team?
It’s critical for the success of business and wider society!
AEmbracing diversity is not only the right thing to do
but it results in more diverse thinking, improved decisionmaking
and greater trust among colleagues, customers and
investors.
business sends a powerful signal about the importance
of gender balance in business and society as a whole.
When people see women leading businesses it challenges
stereotypes, creates role models and fosters aspiration and
self-belief - all key to building an inclusive and fair society.
What career advice would you give to yourself, if
Q you were just starting out in the business world
today?
I know it is a cliché but I firmly believe in the ethos
Aof ‘nothing ventured nothing gained’ and would
encourage everyone to be curious, ‘have a go’ and dream
big.
Also think about building broad foundations by broadening
out connections and experience. Careers are not always
linear and sometimes there can be value in making
a sideways move if it opens out new and interesting
opportunities.
And finally just for fun, is there a job you would have
Q done in a parallel universe – totally different to law
business/finance?
Oceanography and marine biology! We know relatively
Alittle about the seas and oceans on our planet, the
amazing creatures that inhabit those waters, and the
complex ecosystems. We share the planet together, and
our sustainable future depends on ensuring a symbiotic
relationship - and they are so fascinating and colourful!
There is an extensive body of research demonstrating
the positive impact of diversity in leadership on company
performance. The recent Blackrock study of the MSCI Index
which was undertaken between 2013 and 2022 showed
that companies with more gender-balanced workforces
outperform their least-balanced peers by as much as 2
percentage points a year and delivered a higher return on
assets.
This study covered 1,250 companies and is one of the
biggest surveys ever carried out. It also found that
companies where gender diversity in top and mid-level
management reflected the overall workforce tended to have
lower employee turnover and provide high returns.
Women represent over 50% of the population so increasing
the representation of women around the top table of
Vivienne Artz OBE,
CEO of FTSE Women Leaders Review
9

INTERVIEWS
A Balancing
Act
Amy Cousineau Massey is an award-winning employment
lawyer who practises at Woodstock legal services, a
consultancy based law firm. Originally from Canada, she
moved to the UK in 2007 and studied law at Bournemouth
University before securing a training contract and qualifying
into private practice in 2013. She frequently represents
women who have faced discrimination at work and also
aims to increase awareness around issues affecting women
in the law such as inequality, the gender pay gap, baby loss
awareness and more.
Can you tell me about your
Q journey so far? You have gained a
bit of a cult following on LinkedIn for
your open, honest and no-nonsense
posts that call out inequality, sexism
and discrimination.
I knew I wanted to be a lawyer
Afrom a young age. I had a strong
sense of injustice and wanted to fight
for things to be fair. One memory that
stands out is of a school assembly
when I was about 6 where boys were
all sitting on seats with their legs
crossed. I sat and did the same but
was told by the teacher to put my legs
on the floor and that ladies don’t cross
their legs! It felt very unfair – it was
more comfortable and the boys were
all doing it so why couldn’t I?
I completed a sociology degree which
sharpened my interest in how societies
function but went on to study law and
qualify into private practice which I
enjoyed, but it felt very pressurised.
When I returned after having my
son I found the juggle impossible. I
couldn’t see how I could make it work
and be the mother I wanted to be. It
was a stark realisation of the struggle
women face – before I felt I was neck
and neck with my male colleagues but
I definitely had to take a step back
to have children. It was then that I
decided to move to a consultancy
which provided me with a lot more
flexibility.
What are some of the themes
Q you see in your work as an
employment lawyer that affect
women in business?
Sadly so many employers are still
Agetting it wrong when it comes
to maternity leave. An issue I see a
lot is during a redundancy process
when a woman on maternity leave
has an automatic right to be given
a suitable alternative role if there
is one. However, lots of employers
don’t engage with the employee on
maternity leave and end up asking
them to come in and re-apply for jobs
or fill out scoring matrixes etc.
I also see a lot of seemingly innocuous
things like women on leave not being
invited to social events such as the
Christmas party. It can create a feeling
of being untethered to your employer
and excluded, especially for women
who are used to leading busy,
career-focused lives.
10

INTERVIEWS
“We need
to be focusing
on how we make
firms welcoming
to women and
encourage them
to stay”
We are seeing more working
Q from home, flexible working
hours and part-time hours available,
both in law firms and businesses in
general. What do you think of the
options that are available for working
parents?
What’s great is that these are
Anow permissible topics up for
discussion, but I see a lot of words and
not so many deeds.
I see the worst in my job so have a
slightly skewed view but there is so
much more that could be done.
It’s fantastic that employees can now
make requests for flexible working
straight away for example, the
employer has to engage and consider
the request but there are still lots of
ways an employer can validly reject
requests.
There is also a real stigma around
shared parental leave – in my view
men haven’t taken it up more because
it will mean a hit on their career.
There is still a feeling that they will be
penalised for making that choice.
Do you think the changes that
Q came into force on 6 April this
year (offering greater protection
until 18 months after the birth of a
child) go far enough in supporting
women in returning to work after
maternity leave?
It was an incredibly helpful
Achange, effectively extending
the “protected period” for women by
up to two years. It’s also offered to
those taking shared parental leave of
more than six weeks so hopefully will
encourage more people to take that
option up too.
There is always more that could be
done but the law is always catching up
– the sentiment is there and then the
law follows. So the law will always be a
step behind I think.
What are your views on maternity
Q pay? Do you agree that it’s the
start of the gender pay gap?
It absolutely feeds into the gender
Apay gap. Maternity pay is shocking,
it’s simply not enough. We should
be supporting families with children
as much as we can - we all need the
next generation and want them to be
well-balanced, contributing individuals.
Having children is not a lifestyle choice
(it is a choice but I mean in a macro
sense for society) and we need families
that function well as part of the fabric
of that society.
Moving on to looking at the
Q role of women in law firms
specifically, why should firms see
gender equality as important? What
are some of the benefits?
It’s stereotypical but male and
Afemale ways of looking at things
are different and I believe the more
approaches you have the better. We’ve
got a large female cohort coming
through into the profession and we
need to be focusing on how can we
make firms welcoming to women and
encourage them to stay.
Do you think issues like imposter
Q syndrome, lack of confidence,
fear of negotiation/self-promotion
still hold women back?
I do, unfortunately.
AMicro-aggressions are still
happening all too often which play
into these issues too.
I had a male opponent last year who I
was speaking to on the phone about
our clients. I was outlining my client’s
position and explaining that I thought
some of the solicitor’s evidence he was
planning to give at tribunal would not
go down very well and halfway through
he said aggressively “I don’t give a s***
what you think”. I just don’t think he
would have said that to a 10-year PQE
male solicitor in the same situation. It
felt very “get back in your box”. It’s sad
that these things are still what women
face on a regular basis.
Why do you think there aren’t
Q more women on leadership
boards at law firms?
I think it boils down to childcare
Aresponsibilities and the unavoidable
break in your career. Having a child also
fundamentally changes you as a person
- your priorities change and you can’t
plan ahead for all the for the needs of a
child which may change over time too.
On the whole, childcare still falls mainly
down to women.
History & tradition are also still a major
factor although there are more female
law school graduates than male now so
we might see that changing over time.
I hope so! There is good evidence that
gender-diverse boards outperform
those that are not gender diverse, so it
also makes good business sense.
What more do you think needs
Q to be done/changed in the legal
profession to give women equal
opportunities?
I think as a starting point we need
Asome open, transparent figures
from firms about women (or lack of)
at the top table.
I see a lot of virtue signalling around
female promotions – which should be
done on merit as well as adjusting for
time out and individual circumstances
such as raising a family. Show me
who owns your firm and who is at the
top table? How many equity partners
are female? I’d love to know those
numbers.
Have you seen any law firms
Q implementing truly successful
initiatives or programmes to support
women?
Well any consultancy model like
AI am part of is inherently levelling
the playing field – because
self-employment provides flexibility.
Clients don’t tend to care when work
is done as long as it gets done. Some
actually prefer to speak outside work
hours. It offers better rewards too.
There is an innovative top 200 firm
who have kept the traditional billing
target but spread across a week rather
than a day. So if lawyers want to work
over the weekend and then take time
off during the week – no questions are
asked. That’s great to see.
What advice would you give to
Q women at an early stage in their
legal careers?
Look ahead as much as you are
Aable to and choose a practice area
that will suit the lifestyle you want.
Some practice areas can convert into
consultant models for example, others
are more pressurised and time-driven.
Amy Cousineau Massey,
Woodstock Legal Services
11

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INTERVIEWS
LADIES
OF LAW
Ella Watts is the founder of Ladies of Law,
created in 2021 to support women at all
stages of their legal careers through a
range of events and projects.
Can you tell us more about Ladies of Law?
Q
Ladies of Law is a networking community focused on
empowering women in the legal profession. Our primary
goal was to cultivate a community where women could
support and uplift each other, irrespective of their
background or professional journey, and work towards
achieving their definitions of success.
We also strive to promote awareness within the industry
regarding the invaluable contributions women make, to
address existing disparities and foster a more equitable
environment.
What have you been most proud of - both with Ladies
Q of Law and personally, in your career?
I think it has to be the incredible, supportive community
we’ve fostered. We’ve seen first hand the impact of our
network, with members forging meaningful connections
leading to opportunities like work experience, job offers,
mentorship, and lasting friendships. In just over two years,
Ladies of Law has grown its following to over 25,000
individuals.
One of my proudest professional achievements is receiving
an award at the Next 100 Years Inspirational Women in Law
Awards in 2021.
Can you tell us about any law firms you think are
Q doing really well in terms of gender diversity?
Irwin Mitchell has really impressed me. They have recently
launched their ‘IM POWERED’ gender equality policy and
network, which reflects a proactive stance toward gender
inclusivity. Their promotion figures also back this up with
women comprising over 50% of partners.
Additionally, I want to commend all firms that have signed
up for the voluntary Women in Law Pledge initiated by the
Law Society.
What advice would you give to women at an early
Q stage in their legal careers?
I see a lot of rejections in such a competitive market. My
advice would be to remember the phrases that helped me
when things didn’t go my way: “What is meant for you,
won’t miss you” and “rejection is just redirection”.
What more do you think needs to be done/changed
Q in the legal profession to give women equal
opportunities?
Introducing more policies which empower and support
women to do their job and feel valued. I’ve seen firms
introducing policies such as Menopause, Mental Health and
Fertility/IVF Policies, which is amazing.
In an ideal world, the Women in Law Pledge by the Law
Society would be a mandatory Pledge, not a voluntary one.
This would force companies to commit to setting
gender-specific targets at leadership level and other
levels as appropriate, consider the different outcomes for
different groups of women and develop action plans to
achieve gender equality. As it stands, there are only 49
signatories to the pledge. We need more!
You recently hosted an event focusing on building
Q personal brands - why is this important for women?
I did – and it went so well! Personal branding is an
opportunity to market yourself and show the industry what
you’re capable of!
A successful personal brand is rooted in authenticity. It
helps build a genuine connection with your audience.
It also facilitates networking and relationship building
opportunities.
How can firms address the work-life balance
Q challenges working mothers typically face?
In my role as a Legal Recruiter, I see every day how firms
approach work-life balance differently. The key is flexibility.
The pandemic has shown how work can still be done
to a high standard from home but I’m seeing more and
more firms re-introducing policies for their staff to be
office-based full-time, which puts pressures on parents
and caregivers to find suitable and affordable childcare.
Parents and caregivers are then forced to lean on family
or decide between their children or their career, which
shouldn’t be a decision they have to make.
In my opinion, it would be wise for firms to find out
from the parents and caregivers themselves about the
challenges they typically face regarding work-life balance
and what measures could potentially be put in place to
further support them in their roles, to ensure they can
continue their legal careers if they wish to.
Ella Watts
Founder, Ladies of Law
13

24
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EDITORIAL
BOARD
Neville Dinshaw,
Managing Director, Law
Mergers & Acquisitions
Dave Seager,
Consulting Advisor,
Matrix Capital
Why it is important for
firms to have a diverse
workforce and how has
this changed over the
30 years of your career?
Over the years, I have witnessed many changes in the legal
sector, not least that of diversity, which has evolved from
a tokenistic notion to an indispensable cornerstone of
success. Over the past three decades, the significance of
fostering a diverse workforce within law firms has undergone
a profound metamorphosis, driven by societal shifts, legal
imperatives, and a growing recognition of its intrinsic value.
Today, it stands not merely as a moral obligation, but as a
strategic imperative for firms navigating the complexities of
a globalised world.
One of the foremost reasons for the increasing importance
of diversity lies in its correlation with enhanced performance
and innovation. Studies consistently show that diverse
teams outperform homogeneous ones, bringing a breadth
of perspectives, experiences, and ideas to the table. In
the competitive landscape of the legal profession, where
innovation and problem-solving are paramount, such
diversity becomes a catalyst for creativity and effective
decision-making.
The legal landscape itself has grown significantly over
the last 30 years, reflecting the diverse tapestry of the
society it serves. Legislation promoting equality and antidiscrimination
measures has reshaped the ethos of legal
practice, compelling firms to reflect the communities they
represent. Clients, too, demand greater diversity among
their legal advisors, recognising the value of nuanced
understanding and cultural competence.
Moreover, diversity fosters a culture of inclusivity and
belonging within law firms, essential for attracting and
retaining top talent. As millennials and Gen Z professionals
enter the workforce with heightened awareness of social
justice issues, they seek environments that prioritise
diversity and fairness. Failure to embrace diversity not
only risks alienating this talent pool, but also undermines
employee morale and engagement, ultimately impacting firm
performance
Embracing diversity isn’t just about ticking boxes; it’s about
fostering innovation, enhancing client service, and creating
inclusive cultures where every voice is valued. As the legal
profession continues to develop, diversity will remain a
guiding principle, shaping the trajectory of firms and the
delivery of justice in the years to come.
Women dominate
the empathetic side
of the law
As a firm working actively with private client lawyers, we were
interested to read in the SRA’s ‘Diversity in law firms’ workforce’
report in January, of the continuing growth of women in the
profession. Particularly, as it seems to tie in with our own
experience.
The proportion of women in law tipped into a majority in 2019,
(100 years after the law enabled women to enter the profession)
and has now increased to the point where it represents 53% of
those working in the profession. More significantly 62% of all
practising solicitors are women.
Given our specialisms, working with elder clients and those in
vulnerable circumstances, the lawyers we collaborate with in the
best interest of those clients, or those introduced by a referring
solicitor, will invariably be private client lawyers. Women
dominate here too, with 58% of private client lawyers being
women.
Within financial services we have a fabulous organisation, the
Society of Later Life Advisers (SOLLA), founded by a trailblazing
female barrister, Tish Hanifan. SOLLA’s ‘Later Life Adviser’
accreditation has become the gold standard, held by our MD,
and is an endorsement of skills to work with and advise, elderly
and vulnerable clients, their carers, and families.
Logically, financial planners who are SOLLA accredited have
sought to collaborate with like-minded legal professionals,
which has traditionally led us to Solicitors for the Elderly
accredited private client solicitors. Now, rebranded as the
Association of Lifetime Lawyers, we have again found that,
in our region, and when we attend their events, most lawyers
choosing to specialise, as we have, are women. Indeed, a quick
search on the ASL directory, within a 20-mile radius of our office
near Bridgnorth, reveals 32 specialist solicitors, and 25 of them
(a staggering 78%) are women.
Fortunately, we already have excellent working relationships
with many of these women and their firms, and have found
them to be caring, empathetic, and tuned in to identifying
clients who might be in vulnerable circumstances, but research
from the Legal Services Board (LSB), as recently as 2022 found
that not all lawyers are the same. In fact, the LSB paper labelled
much of the profession as cold and clinical. The SRA, as we
would expect, issued fresh guidance as a regulator and the Law
Society also produced an excellent paper on identifying and
supporting clients who might be in vulnerable circumstances.
If you are a solicitor or a firm seeking additional training or
support in developing your skills when it comes to identifying
and supporting clients who find themselves in vulnerable
circumstances, then we can certainly help. Bearing in mind
that the LSB in its 2022 paper suggested that any consumer
needing to approach a lawyer is probably vulnerable, we would
also recommend that you visit the Consumer Duty Alliance
website at www.consumerduty.org where you will find fabulous
resources.
Lastly, if you are working with later life or vulnerable clients and
their families, carers, or perhaps their attorneys, and do not yet
have a trusted financial planning partner, visit the SOLLA site to
find a new colleague with whom to collaborate.
15

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GROUP

EDITORIAL
BOARD
Welcome Back - why it’s important
to focus on the return to work after
maternity or family-related leave
When it comes to parenthood,
there is one thing I can say with full
certainty on behalf of myself, my
wife, friends and colleagues – life
is never the same. Whether it be
a mother or father, one half of a
couple or a single parent, when a
child is born, one parent usually
takes time away from their job to
look after them during their first few
months. After making sure the new
addition and family are on track,
attention turns to the return to work.
Very few parents can work the way
they did before they welcomed their
little human into the world. They
must get used to the effects of a
long list of changes including less
sleep, early morning wake ups, and
the occasional clothing disaster
caused by upset little stomachs.
Work will (and should) not be at
the top of their priority at this
time, but little ones do cost money.
The thought of returning to work
can be intimidating. I remember
when my wife returned to work
after having our children, she told
me of feelings of both trepidation
and excitement at the prospect of
conversations that didn’t centre
around CBeebies, nursery rhymes,
and pureed vegetables.
When she was on maternity leave,
there were no ‘Keep In Touch’ days
to keep her up to date with what
was going on at her firm. If someone
is away from a business for nine
months then an awful lot is likely
to have changed - new people join,
some may have left, and in our firm’s
case we have had some people on
maternity leave who returned to
a larger firm through merger. We
do, though, all need to do more to
recognise the passage back to work
after maternity or family-related
leave can be a tricky one.
At Dutton Gregory we are known for
our flexible working policy. From
hybrid working to flexible hours,
we listen, discuss and negotiate
what works for an individual’s
circumstances. Whether it is working
five days in four, four days in three,
or finishing at different times each
day due to childcare, the aim is to
give our staff the family time they
deserve, and keep them relaxed and
confident when giving their attention
to work.
Being a parent generally makes
people more responsible and
grounded. As an employer, I have
huge respect for that and, as a father
who saw the issues my wife endured
when she first went back to work
when our children were younger,
I saw how difficult it can be. I
therefore believe it is the duty of an
employer to make the return to work
as welcoming and easy as possible.
Paul Sams,
Managing Partner of Dutton Gregory
Solicitors
Diversity & Inclusion are key when
it comes to business success
The diversity conversation needs
to be had across the board in
professional services including legal
firms, and it needs to include all
under-represented communities
including women.
Not only do we have a duty to our
employees to create environments
where everyone can be themselves
and thrive but we also owe it to our
clients to see themselves reflected
from inside Frenkel Topping when
they choose us as their adviser.
As a business guided by the
principles of ConsumerDuty,
our effectiveness is increasingly
measured by our adaptability to
meet diverse needs.
At Frenkel Topping Ltd we are on a
journey with our EDI strategy. I’m
proud to say we have more female
consultants and women in
business-critical roles than ever
and we are working to create
an environment that supports
women, including appointing a
Diversity, Inclusion and Wellbeing
Director in Dame Robina Shah and
creating a Diversity Steerco which
has prompted the creation of a
Menopause Support Group but there
is still much more to do.
I was glad to see the recent guidance
from the Equality and Human
Rights Commission regarding
reasonable adjustments and a policy
on menopause. As soon as a topic
enters the realms of legislation
it forces it to the forefront of
17
boardroom conversations and I’m
wholly supportive of guidance for
businesses and working women on
menopause in the workplace. It’s a
topic that impacts half of society and
our workforces.
The topic of diversity and inclusion
is a complex one that should be
permanently on the agenda for
all businesses, with every major
business decision being viewed
through a diverse lens.
Mark Holt,
COO of Frenkel Topping Group

EDITORIAL
BOARD
According to recent figures, women hold 42% of board seats
at large UK firms, but only 10 are chief executives at FTSE 100
companies. It is clear that we need to do more across the board
to increase the number of women in senior positions.
With that in mind, here are four key learnings from my time at
SmartSearch:
1. Put inclusion at the forefront of your culture
Diverse representation at all levels of an organisation enhances
and improves decision making, while also driving growth.
However, this must be a conscious decision made at a leadership
level.
For example, at SmartSearch, our commitment to equality,
diversity, and inclusion ensures everyone can develop and
thrive, regardless of age, race, position, or gender. This has
resulted in us being recognised as an official ‘Great Place to
Work’.
This inclusive approach has been instrumental in my own
journey, allowing me to grow within the company from an
entry-level position to Chief Operating Officer, while seeing the
business grow year on year.
2. Promote from within
Looking at the talent within your organisation is key. It ensures
employees deeply understand the business and are motivated
to stay.
When I joined the company in 2013, it had only 12 employees,
with five being directors. It quickly became evident that this
was a fast-growing, successful business. I was determined
to contribute to its progress and under my direction, the
client services division grew significantly and now manages
6,000 global clients across the legal, insurance, accountancy,
investment, property and finance sectors.
SmartSearch’s commitment to internal promotion has been vital
in my career progression. The business has rewarded my hard
work, seeing me become the youngest and first female board
member at the company just five years after joining as a support
specialist.
3. Create opportunities
While the gender split across businesses may be improving,
organisations must remain proactive.
For example, our Smarter Futures programme identifies team
members with untapped potential and gives them the chance
to pitch, develop, and execute their own business projects.
SmartSearch also has a mentorship scheme which lasts for six
months when an employee first joins the business, providing
the opportunity to gain knowledge and learn new skills from an
established member of staff with more experience across the
organisation.
Initiatives like the Smarter Futures programme, alongside access
to strong role models through mentorship, have been crucial in
helping me and others turn our goals into reality.
4. Encourage flexibility and support
Collette Allen,
COO, SmartSearch
Four key drivers of
inclusivity
Implementing flexible working arrangements and enhancing
support initiatives are essential in supporting women in
business.
Businesses must actively remove barriers and support staff in
reaching their potential. By doing so at SmartSearch, our gender
balance currently stands at 4:3 males to females on our Board,
and a 50/50 gender split across all levels of the business. Of
course, we can always do more, but I am proud of the progress
we’re making.
Kathliya Harwood,
Marketing Manager,
Philips Dictation
10 reasons why gender
diversity is so important
Gender equality and inclusion in the workplace is an essential
catalyst for fostering thriving, sustainable, and innovative
organisations. Gender diversity within leadership not only
correlates with increased sales revenue but staff with an equal
gender balance are also more likely to experiment, be creative,
and share knowledge.
Embracing these principles unlocks the full potential of every
individual; by dismantling barriers and biases, promoting
equal opportunities, and cultivating a culture of respect and
inclusivity, organisations not only nurture happier and more
engaged employees but also enhance their reputation, attract
top talent, and drive business success.
Below are 10, out of many reasons, that companies and their
employees can and do benefit from a gender-diverse workforce:
Fairness and Equity: Gender equality ensures that all employees
have equal opportunities for advancement and recognition
based on merit, rather than gender.
Legal and Reputational Risks Mitigation: Failure to address
gender inequality can result in legal and reputational risks,
including lawsuits, negative media coverage, and damage to
brand image.
Enhanced Decision-Making: Different viewpoints lead to wellrounded
decision-making processes, considering various angles
and potential outcomes.
Global Reach: Diverse teams can better navigate international
markets and cultural nuances.
Financial Performance: Studies show diverse companies often
outperform their less diverse counterparts financially.
Reduced Gender Pay Gap: Gender equality initiatives that aim to
close the gender pay gap, ensure equal compensation for equal
work, which is crucial for financial stability and gender equity.
Enhanced Reputation: Companies committed to gender equality
are viewed more favourably by consumers, investors, and
potential employees, enhancing their brand reputation.
Economic Growth: Gender equality in the workplace contributes
to economic growth by maximising the potential of the entire
workforce, leading to higher productivity and innovation.
Talent Attraction and Retention: Companies that promote
gender equality attract top talent and experience higher
retention rates as employees feel valued and respected.
Innovation and Creativity: Gender-diverse teams bring different
perspectives and experiences, encouraging innovation and
creativity, which are essential for staying competitive.
In summary, gender equality in the workforce is indispensable
for advancing economic growth, driving financial performance,
and promoting innovation. Beyond its economic benefits, it
reflects a commitment to fairness, social responsibility, and
inclusivity. Embracing gender equality isn’t just the right thing
to do; it’s a strategic imperative for organisations looking to
thrive in today’s diverse and dynamic global marketplace.
19

EDITORIAL
BOARD
What Women Want:
How can employers help women
in the workplace?
Historically, law firms were largely male
dominated however, there are now many
talented female lawyers in the industry.
Many female lawyers I know and have
met are ambitious and extremely driven,
but responsibilities can alter and often
change may be desired when children
come along. Whilst parental leave can be
shared between males and females, the
most recent government Shared Parental
Leave Report indicates that leave is still
dominated by women, with three quarters
of mothers opting to work part time
enabling them to be the primary caregiver.
Many parents, especially women will
probably agree when I say that being a
working mother is no small undertaking.
There is no longer just a home to run
and work to carry out, throw into the
mix additions of school runs, assemblies,
celebrations and out of school clubs.
Speaking to friends and colleagues, a
common theme arises of the daily juggle of
a working mum. If most wrote a CV based
on the true tasks that are carried out day
to day, as well as their career skills, viewers
might be tempted to ask when we get time
to sleep or have “me” time!
So, what is it that women need from
employers? For working mums, it may be
alternative working hours, being able to
do those school pickups and being present
for those milestone occasions especially
at school. During the challenging Covid
era, hybrid flexible working emerged as a
valuable solution particularly for mothers,
easing their daily balancing act. The
trend of remote working continues to
thrive in various industries, including law,
Taylor Rose MW also offers a Consultancy
Programme giving lawyers the freedom to
work around other commitments which
has proven efficient to both clients and
professionals.
At Taylor Rose MW, we value the work
of women. Recently, Annemarie Pye
has been appointed our Chief Operating
Officer, at the helm of our operations
and Louisa Copsey, as Head of Corporate
Commercial and our Company Secretary.
We have also championed and supported
Keeley Lengthorn, Lawyer and Partner at
our Bexleyheath branch in her fight for
paid time off connected with baby loss,
something hugely important to women as
a whole, taking positive steps to make a
difference. In support of this, our internal
policies have already been updated to align
with this ethos.
Overall, Taylor Rose MW’s workforce
consists of a large proportion of women
(67%), reflected in our diversity report,
many of which are heads of departments
and deputy roles. It is important to us
that our workplace represents both male
and females in most of its departments
and especially in managerial positions. To
deliver the best service to the public, it’s
important for firms to have a diversity of
spokespeople inside their firm, this ensures
balanced views are being brought to the
table and considered as part of ongoing
improvement, creating environments
where ranks are closed can be detrimental
to firms excelling.
Helen Lobozzo,
Partner & Head of Client Care at
Taylor Rose MW
20

FEATURE
BREAKING
BIAS
“Diversity is being invited to the party;
inclusion is being asked to dance” Verna
Myers. “There are a lot of n*****s working
here” a client at the Royal Courts of Justice.
“Are you a secretary, you don’t look like a
solicitor?” a potential client.
Hearing Muslims described as “refugees” and
“terrorists” within a workplace setting.
These are just three experiences I have
encountered in my professional life.
MY STORY
I was born and bred in South London, my life has been
one of living in a community and city which is multicultural
and multiracial. But I have regularly left this diversity to
enter a workplace where the vast majority (if not all) of
my colleagues and all senior partners are white.
There is no question that I have had to work much harder
than my white counterparts to get where I am.
I am Muslim, a woman and am of south Asian heritage.
I have been impacted negatively being from a diverse
background and the barriers to entry, retention, and
advancement that hampered me still exist within the
profession I have chosen.
UNDER-REPRESENTATION AT ALL LEVELS
The representation of Black and Minority Ethnic
(BME) solicitors in the legal profession has seen some
improvement at entry level. However, progress at senior
levels remains slow and painstaking. The problem is
compounded by the fact that up-to-date data is not
available.
We do know that Black (African-Caribbean and African)
and Asian solicitors are underrepresented within medium
and larger firms. The Black Solicitors Network (BSN)
found that out of 756 magic circle partners, only five are
Black; revealing an inadequate level of career progression
amongst Black and Asian solicitors. i
This is an indication of bias and not necessarily an
indication of talent. White privilege is an absence of the
consequences of racism. It is not a coincidence that those
in the most senior positions in our profession happen to
be white. The Law Society’s Race for Inclusion ii research
found not feeling equally valued, respected and included
in the workplace is a reason why there are ethnicity stay
gaps and pay and progression gaps, especially in the
largest firms.
“LEAN IN” IF YOU CAN
In Sheryl Sandberg’s book women are told to “Lean In”
which is great if you are a woman who can actually get
into the room. I have never been invited to the room let
alone been invited to the table. This has not been due to
my lack of ability or expertise but due to my colour and
gender. Initiatives such as flexible work schedules and
parental leave policies are steps in the right direction, but
they need to be part of a broader strategy to foster an
inclusive culture. It's crucial for law firms to go beyond
token gestures and create environments where women
feel valued and supported throughout their careers.
I. Stephanie Boyce made history as the first female black
Law Society President in 2021. What is not so well known
is that Boyce stood four times for deputy vice-president at
the Law Society before being elected to the role in 2019 (a
precursor to holding the presidency of the organisation).
“My belief was that I was just as capable and qualified
and I have earned my right to be in this space,” she says.
“I absolutely believe that every door is open if you push
through and persevere.” iii Boyce was succeeded by Lubna
Shuja, who broke ground as the first Asian, first Muslim
and seventh female president.
Although it should not have taken almost 200 years to
have a person of colour in the role it seems ground has
been broken
But there is much more to be done. Before a problem
can be addressed, it must be known. We must encourage
individuals to stand up for themselves and report incidents
(there is considerable underreporting of sexism, sexual
harassment, racism and islamophobia in the workplace).
HOPES FOR THE FUTURE
Firms must consider how they can create a more
diverse workplace by broadening the reach of their
hiring practices and cultivating a more inclusive culture.
Achieving gender and race parity needs to be the aim
of the legal profession, so that we properly reflect the
society we represent – and the imbalance addressed.
Nusrat Qureishi,
Associate Director, Head of Corporate and Commercial
Law Department, Stevensdrake Solicitors
i i https://www.societyofasianlawyers.co.uk/2021/04/is-the-legal-professiontruly-diverse/
ii https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/topics/research/race-for-inclusion-theexperiences-of-black-asian-and-minority-ethnic-solicitors
iii https://www.fnlondon.com/articles/you-dont-look-like-a-solicitor-how-istephanie-boyce-overcame-prejudice-to-become-the-law-societys-first-blackpresident-20221021
21

Celebrating
Women
in Law
As part of this issue’s focus on Women In Law we shine a
spotlight on a handpicked selection of trailblazing, brilliant,
and aspirational women working in or around the legal
profession.
Over the following pages they delve into the significance
of gender diversity, the advantages of a varied workforce,
and the critical steps required to empower and uplift
women professionals in the legal field. Their perspectives
offer invaluable insights and a roadmap towards fostering
an equitable and inclusive environment that will shape the
profession in the years to come.

Jo Hodges
Sales & Marketing Director,
Redbrick Solutions
Sarah Murphy
General Manager of Clio EMEA,
the global leader in legal technology.
Kirsten Roberts
Director, Box Legal
Simonne Llewellyn
Deputy Managing Director,
Finders International
Charlotte Fogg
Director of Development,
Maria Fogg Family Law.
Angela Hesketh
Head of Market
Development UK, Pexa
Natalie Summers
Head of Conveyancing,
CJCH Solicitors
Donna Scully,
Director Carpenters Group
Andrea Fogg
Director and Office Manager,
Maria Fogg Family Law.
Elaine Pasini MCIM
Head of Communications
The Institute of Legal Finance
& Management
Rachel Di Clemente
Chief Executive,
Hudgell Solicitors
Julia Salasky
CEO at Legl
Helen Claydon
Founder, Director, and Chief
Legal Officer HAIG Legal Group
(Fidelis Legal Services, Simpler Law,
Northwood Banks & Co.)
Bri McCrory
CMO, BigHand
Natalie Foster
Chief Executive Officer at
Inspire Legal Group
Eve Dullabh
Co-Founder of Law Training Centre
and Access Law Clinic

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INTERVIEWS
An evolution of
leadership
What differences have you seen implemented in
the workplace for women since you started your
career?
Over recent years, there has been a noticeable shift within
legal workplaces towards promoting inclusive environments
that prioritise the well-being and development of
women. This change indicates that more businesses are
understanding the significance of having diverse teams
and treating their employees fairly to drive organisational
success and innovation.
One key aspect is the implementation of various strategies
aimed at promoting work-life balance for women.
Businesses are increasingly offering arrangements such as
flexible hours, compressed work weeks, and supportive
parental leave policies, to accommodate the diverse needs
and responsibilities of female employees. By providing
greater flexibility and support, organisations are enabling
women to better balance their professional and personal
commitments, ultimately enhancing their overall job
satisfaction and productivity.
Many businesses in law are also actively working to offer
women opportunities to develop into leadership roles.
This includes initiatives such as investing in leadership
development training and qualifications, and tailored
recruitment initiatives designed to identify and foster
female talent within the business. By actively supporting
and empowering women to take on leadership positions,
companies are not only promoting diversity but also
utilising the talents of their workforce to stimulate
innovation and achieve success.
There are numerous networking opportunities specifically
tailored to support women in their career development.
Networking committees such as Women in Residential
Property promote collaboration and knowledge sharing
through the coordination of frequent online and in
person gatherings covering topics from the personal to
the professional. These provide women with valuable
opportunities to connect with peers, mentors, and industry
leaders, expanding their professional networks and
opening doors to new opportunities.
Companies are increasingly acknowledging the significance
of pay equity and are actively working to identify and
address any discrepancies between male and female
employees. This includes conducting regular pay audits
to assess gender-base pay differentials and implementing
transparent salary structures. While there have been
noticeable improvements, the gender pay gap persists and
demands continued attention, as confirmed by The Law
Society who recently stated, ‘Our analysis of the national
gender pay gap service of some of the largest 50 UK law
firms for 2021/2022 showed the median pay gap was 28%.
Yet for most firms this did not include partner pay which
would have increased the overall gender pay gap further.’
During my career, I have seen significant improvements
towards gender equality and inclusivity in the legal
workplace. Many years ago, our (male) managing director
and I shared an office, and we had a potential new partner
(also male) coming in to meet with us. Upon entering our
office, the visitor assumed I was the MD’s secretary and
having thrust his coat at me asked for a cup of tea. (This
of course, would traditionally have been the set-up, not
just in law firms but in businesses all over the country.)
There has been a noticeable difference in the newer
generation coming through as traditional partners retire,
and whilst there is still progress to be made, the positive
changes signify a promising future where women are
valued, respected, and provided with equal opportunities
to succeed in their work.
Redbrick Solutions has always offered flexible working
for all parents both on a formal basis in terms of part time
contracted hours but also on a more informal basis for
those ad hoc events such as a school play or sports day.
We also ensure all employees are given equal access to
training and personal development opportunities, in a way
that suits their individual commitments.
Jo Hodges
Sales & Marketing Director,
Redbrick Solutions
There has also been a growing awareness and focus on
addressing the gender pay gap within legal workplaces.
25

INTERVIEWS
Boardroom
Diversity
The legal world is traditionally a very maledominated
profession, particularly with partners
and the judiciary remaining male-centric. How
can we ensure that women get a seat at the
leadership table?
Gender diversity is not just a topic of discussion but
a pressing issue in the legal and technology sectors.
Historically, women have been underrepresented,
particularly in leadership roles and technical positions.
This lack of diversity stifles innovation and deprives
these sectors of many perspectives, which is a significant
concern. As a mother of a young daughter, I am deeply
committed to setting an example that ambition and
potential know no boundaries.
One way the legal world can provide greater support for
women aiming for leadership roles is by investing time
(and money!) into implementing mentorship schemes
within the business. These schemes can play a crucial role
in supporting career advancement for women and ensure
they have someone to talk to who actually understands
what they are facing. Pairing junior team members with
more experienced mentors ensures women get the support
they need and may encourage them to push themselves
outside their comfort zone and look for new opportunities.
As part of this support, companies should also provide
training in skills needed to succeed in leadership roles -
such as negotiation skills, executive presence and strategic
thinking - these are essential skills to learn and develop.
Flexibility is also essential to foster in a company—it has
been a game-changer for many female and male leaders
in recent years. Offering more flexible work arrangements
and understanding that everyone’s circumstances are
unique can help support the work-life balance of parents
and carers in the workforce. It shows that you care about
your team and makes it easier to balance professional and
personal responsibilities without worrying that it will impact
their career development.
What steps does your company take to help
ensure women are given fair opportunities to
leadership positions?
In many major tech companies, women are in the minority.
According to recent data, companies like Amazon,
Facebook, Apple, Google, and Microsoft all have a female
staff proportion below 50%. These figures are even more
concerning regarding leadership positions—all falling
below 35%.
At Clio, our commitment to gender diversity is not just a
statement; it’s a reality. Our genuinely supportive culture
values diversity and empowers women in leadership roles.
It’s a source of great pride that, within our leadership
team in EMEA, we have already achieved a 50:50 gender
balance. This is not just a statistic but a testament to the
power of inclusivity and equal opportunities. We have
more than doubled our VP suite since 2020, with women
holding the majority at 60% of roles. This demonstrates
that gender diversity is not just a goal but a reality that can
be achieved with the right strategies and commitment.
I am incredibly proud to be in a position where I can drive
meaningful change. In my role, I want to continue building
an inclusive and diverse culture within our EMEA team as
we grow and move forward.
Sarah Murphy
General Manager of Clio EMEA,
the global leader in legal technology.
27

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INTERVIEWS
Equal
Opportunities
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
Controversially, I believe that the biggest hurdle can be one
of two things:
1. Ourselves. Lacking self-belief. I suffer from this, and I
know many of my peers do as well. We feel like imposters.
We, as a profession, are learning to recognise this and
make allowances.
2. Women. Often, our own gender forms a barrier to us
getting the recognition we deserve. We need each other
for support. Competitiveness can get in the way of this.
At Box Legal, we have a team that is mixed but
predominantly female. We are progressive and innovative.
Cheerleaders for each other when things go well and
understanding when times are tough. We are a team I
would have looked at 20 years ago hoping to be a part of
one day. It is vital as a gender and profession that we work
hard to be inclusive and supportive. We all deserve to be
part of that dream team.
What areas do you think still need progress?
There’s a selective ignorance to progression. If we look
back, changes are due to awareness. Socials and television
have raised the profile of menopause, HRT is free on the
NHS, we offer equal parental leave for children, flexible
working and help for mental health continues to improve.
We are learning to cut through boundaries that once
would have made us less ambitious. However, those same
mediums can help alienate. Feminism should not mean
forging an army against men. The Me-Too movement,
whilst prominent throughout the world, allowed sadly for a
significant amount of generalisation that many men in the
workplace were predators. This as we know is not the case.
It’s ironic that we ask for progression with one hand and
yet push it away with the other. To progress, we need to
collaborate with women and men. Yes, we want a seat at
the table and yes, we should have the opportunity to apply
– but not at the detriment of our colleagues - if they work
harder or are better at what they do than we are, male or
female.
At Box Legal, I work alongside three male colleagues.
Our roles are vastly different, we complement each other
through our strengths and weaknesses. I feel valued. I
am fortunate, but I have worked in companies where
this wasn’t the case–not always due to the men I worked
with. When writing this, I chatted to female peers about
their experiences. There seemed to be a recurring theme.
Men like to take an ‘I’m in charge role’ which seemed
to give carte blanche to altering copy for style reasons,
interrupting women in meetings and adding their name to
projects that they have simply read. However, a big issue
seems to be women placing men on a pedestal. There are
women who would only see a male surgeon, women who
are concerned when they hear a female pilot’s voice rather
than a male’s. This is disturbing but shows that the issues
are wider than a problem with gender bias. Achieving a
balance means educating both men and women.
People should receive the same opportunities. There
should be respect between all parties. How do we achieve
that? Being more inclusive, listening and valuing each
other as people, no matter what our gender.
Kirsten Roberts
Director, Box Legal
29

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INTERVIEWS
Flexibility and
transparency
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
One of the biggest hurdles is the struggle to balance career
progression with family responsibilities. The demands of
the legal profession often clash with the needs of family
life, making it challenging for women to advance their
careers while also fulfilling their roles at home. Law firms
and legal support services can help alleviate this challenge
by offering more flexible working arrangements, such as
part-time roles, remote work options, and flexible hours,
allowing women to better manage their professional and
personal commitments.
What areas do you think still need progress?
While progress has been made towards gender equality in
the legal profession, several areas still require significant
improvement. Firstly, the representation of women in
senior leadership roles remains disproportionately low.
Despite many women entering the legal field, there is a
noticeable drop-off when it comes to advancing to senior
positions such as partners, judges, or executives. This
disparity highlights the need for more robust policies and
initiatives that ensure women have equal opportunities for
career advancement. Mentorship programs, sponsorship
opportunities, and leadership training specifically tailored
for women can help bridge this gap by providing the
necessary support and guidance.
Additionally, there is a critical need for comprehensive
support systems for women returning from maternity
leave. Often, women face challenges reintegrating into the
workforce after an extended absence, which can hinder
their career progression. To address this, companies should
implement return-to-work programs that offer re-skilling
and upskilling opportunities, and flexible scheduling to
accommodate the transition period. These programs should
aim to help women regain their professional footing and
continue their career trajectory seamlessly.
What steps does your company take to help
ensure women are given fair opportunities for
leadership positions?
Our company is predominantly female, with 70% of our
staff being women. This strong female presence is a
testament to our commitment to fostering an inclusive
and supportive work environment. To ensure fairness and
equal opportunity for all employees, we have implemented
a transparent promotion process with clear criteria. This
process is designed to be open and understandable, so
everyone knows exactly what is required to advance within
the company. We believe that clarity in expectations
and criteria helps to eliminate biases and ensures that
promotions are based on merit and performance.
We also conduct regular reviews of our diversity metrics.
These are essential for us to stay accountable to our
diversity and inclusion goals. By regularly analysing our
workforce data, we can identify trends, monitor progress,
and pinpoint areas that may need improvement. This
ongoing evaluation allows us to make informed decisions
and necessary adjustments to our strategies, ensuring that
we continue to support and promote diversity within our
company.
We also host social and charity events throughout the
year. These events provide opportunities for staff, whether
they are in the office or working from home. From virtual
fundraisers and charity drives to in-person team-building
activities and community service projects, we encourage
our employees to participate and make a positive impact.
These events not only foster team spirit and camaraderie
but also allow our staff to contribute to causes they care
about, reinforcing our commitment to creating a wellrounded
and socially responsible workplace.
Simonne Llewellyn
Deputy Managing Director,
Finders International
Ensuring that flexible working arrangements are available
and utilised by all employees, regardless of gender, is
another crucial area for improvement. Flexible work options
such as remote work, part-time roles, and flexible hours
should not be viewed as special accommodations but
as standard practices that benefit the entire workforce.
Promoting a culture where flexible work is normalised
and encouraged for everyone can help reduce the stigma
often associated with it and make it easier for everyone to
balance their professional and personal lives.
31

INTERVIEWS
Keeping It In
The Family
The legal world is traditionally a very
male-dominated profession, particularly
with partners and the judiciary remaining
male-centric – how can we ensure that women
get a seat at the leadership table?
In the traditionally male-dominated legal field, Maria
Fogg Family Law shines brightly as a symbol of women’s
empowerment and inclusivity. Founded and guided by
women, this firm embodies more than just legal prowess;
it stands as a tribute to female leadership and tenacity.
Throughout its 12-year journey, Maria Fogg Family
Law has not only extended its influence across borders
and earned numerous prestigious awards but has also
remained unwavering in its dedication to assisting the most
vulnerable members of society. Through Legal Aid, the firm
ensures that justice and safety are accessible to those who
need them most.
Specialising in vital areas such as domestic abuse and
Child Protection, the team at Maria Fogg Family Law
exemplifies a mission fuelled by empathy and advocacy.
Their dedication extends beyond legal representation to
truly understanding and addressing the multifaceted needs
of their clients. From supporting survivors of domestic
abuse to assisting individuals with cognitive and physical
disabilities, addiction, and homelessness, the team is
committed to providing comprehensive support and
guidance to those who need it most.
The tragic passing of Maria Fogg in 2018 marked a pivotal
moment for the firm, but her legacy lives on through
the visionary leadership of her daughters, Andrea and
Charlotte. Taking on the mantle of leadership, they not
only preserved their mother’s legacy but propelled it to
new heights. Upholding the firm’s core values, Andrea and
Charlotte have introduced innovative initiatives that have
further amplified its impact. Rooted in a commitment to
person-centred care, they’ve introduced groundbreaking
support frameworks and fostered a nurturing environment
that encourages professional growth. By championing
flexible working arrangements, wellness programs, and a
supportive culture, they’ve created an environment that
empowers working mothers and caregivers allowing them
to flourish in an industry historically dominated by men.
Beyond their legal practice, Maria Fogg Family Law actively
gives back to the community through pro bono work,
volunteering, and educational outreach. Their dedication to
social impact underscores their commitment to inclusivity
and equality, as they strive to uplift vulnerable individuals
and families beyond the courtroom.
As we look to the future, the firm’s vision remains clear:
to empower future generations of women, both within
the firm and in the broader community. As a trailblazer
in women’s leadership, it exemplifies the transformative
power of inclusive leadership, not just within the legal
sphere but across society. Through their unwavering
dedication to principles of justice, empathy, and
innovation, Maria Fogg Family Law paves the way for
a future where women’s voices are not just heard but
celebrated.
Despite significant progress, the journey to true gender
equality in the legal profession is far from over. While
there may be more female solicitors statistically, the
underrepresentation of women in senior and partner roles
persists, particularly in larger firms. This underscores the
ongoing need for concerted efforts to dismantle barriers
and foster an environment where every woman can thrive
and claim her rightful seat at the leadership table.
At Maria Fogg Family Law, we are not just a law firm,
but we are a testament to the resilience and strength of
women. Through our pioneering efforts and unwavering
commitment to justice, we hope to inspire a future where
gender equality is not just a dream but a reality.
Charlotte Fogg
Director of Development, Maria Fogg Family Law.
Andrea Fogg
Director and Office Manager, Maria Fogg Family Law.
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INTERVIEWS
Creating an
inclusive culture
The legal world is traditionally a very maledominated
profession, particularly with partners
and the judiciary remaining male-centric – how
can we ensure that women get a seat at the
leadership table?
This gender imbalance was driven previously by a higher
proportion of male lawyers, with women traditionally
taking more supportive roles in the work environment,
particularly within conveyancing. However, over the past
30 years, the landscape has changed significantly. Many
more women are qualifying into law although their journey
to leadership roles often remains challenging.
Internal barriers, such as imposter syndrome, have been
significant hurdles for many women and something I have
struggled with throughout my career. Often, the absence
of female counterparts in senior roles leads to self-doubt
and a feeling of not belonging or being too pushy. This
psychological barrier can be as challenging as any external
barriers. To tackle this, it is crucial to foster environments
where women can see others like them succeeding.
Mentorship programs, coaching and supportive networks
can play a crucial role in building confidence and providing
guidance.
Externally, women can encounter organisational and
structural barriers whether that be biased promotion
practices, lack of flexible working arrangements, or a
culture that may not support diversity.
Visibility of successful women in leadership positions is
vital to provide both inspiration and a roadmap. The legal
profession has increasingly recognised the contributions
of dynamic, inspirational, and visionary women who have
demonstrated resilience and belief in their capabilities.
These role models are essential for illustrating the
opportunities available and the value women bring to the
table.
The shift towards equality and true recognition is
promising. However, it requires continuous effort and
commitment from all involved to create inclusive cultures
that support and celebrate diversity.
We’ve seen a lot of women leave a profession
in the law after having children – what can be
done to help and encourage those returning to
work after periods of maternity or family-related
leave?
It is important to promote the narrative that pursuing a
career and being a dedicated mother are not mutually
exclusive.
Establishing mentorship programs where returning mothers
can receive guidance and support from those who have
successfully navigated similar transitions can help alleviate
feelings of guilt and build confidence.
High-level legal positions often involve long hours and
travel, which can be daunting for mothers returning
to work. To make the transition more feasible an
understanding and support for flexible working
arrangements that allow women to manage their
professional responsibilities alongside family commitments
is necessary.
While the pandemic highlighted the potential for remote
work, in my view it is essential to maintain and expand
these practices. Offering remote or hybrid working options
can significantly reduce the strain on returning mothers.
These policies should be integrated into the organisation’s
long-term strategy rather than being seen as temporary
measures. Shifting the focus from hours worked to results
achieved can help mitigate the pressure to be physically
present in the office and recognise the productivity of
remote work. Employers can also provide resources and
support for mental health and well-being and encourage
open conversations about the challenges of balancing work
and family life.
In conclusion, it is essential to address both internal
and external barriers. By fostering an inclusive culture,
offering flexible working arrangements, and providing
robust support systems, we can help women balance their
professional ambitions with their family responsibilities,
ensuring that talented individuals remain in the profession
and continue to contribute to its success.
Angela Hesketh
Head of Market
Development UK, Pexa
Drawing from my own experience, I recognise that the
decision to return to work is incredibly difficult and the
levels of guilt and conflict that you carry with you adds an
additional burden.
35

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INTERVIEWS
Managing the juggle
a balance between personal and professional life
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
I believe one of the biggest hurdles that women in
law face is focused around the work-life balance of
juggling a successful career and having a family. Anyone
running a heavy caseload will know the long and often
inflexible hours put in to meeting billable targets as well
as networking and attending business development
opportunities. We want to give our clients our undivided
attention so they feel safe and guided by us as well as
giving the same to our families.
The demanding and high-pressure nature of legal work can
make it difficult to strike a balance between professional
and personal lives.
Women with families still want to be recognised for their
skills and potential and pursue leadership positions. Often
these women can be stereotyped negatively which can
limit promotion opportunities. For example, will someone
pregnant or returning from maternity leave be given the
same opportunities for advancement as a male colleague
who is not about to take up to a year off? Will maternity
leave or a career break be frowned upon compared to
a male counterpart who hasn’t had the time away. This
culture can deter women returning to legal practice after
maternity leave or applying for more senior position
because of caring responsibilities.
It is important that law firms implement flexible policies
that accommodate the needs for lawyers to have a
successful work-life balance.
Following a career break it is natural for a woman to lose
some belief in her professional abilities despite gaining
valuable learning experiences while away from work. It is
often preferred to have a transition period when returning
to work to build back up to speed to a fast-paced office
environment and rebuild connections, networks and
relationships. Not forgetting there is a small human relying
on you 24/7 outside the office whom is unlikely to let you
sleep all night! Any flexibility that can be given to ease a
woman back into her new everyday life will help to feel
valued.
Natalie Summers
Head of Conveyancing, CJCH Solicitors
37

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INTERVIEWS
Culture is Key
how fostering an inclusive and empathetic culture
has paid off at Carpenters
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women in law
face and how can law firms help women overcome it?
We can’t get away from the fact that women will leave the
workforce for extended periods of time to have children
and to care for them. Whilst some women want or have to
take on primary childcare responsibilities, this is changing
and, for me, is the game changer for helping women to
balance home and work better. We need a shift in both
culture and paternity support for men for this to happen
though.
We’ve seen a lot of women leave a profession in the
law after having children – what can be done to help
and encourage those returning to work after periods
of maternity or family-related leave?
Women need proper support and true flexibility to enable a
better work/life balance. I’d like to see more development
programmes and parental support and coaching, as well
as intervention from government with financial support to
pay for childcare.
We also need more dialogue and understanding around
what women need to do to take the next steps and an
acceptance that everyone is different, one size does not
fit all.
What innovations have you seen in your area of the
industry relating to women in law?
There has been so much positive change. I have noticed
a huge amount in the past ten years, particularly around
gender diversity and inclusivity.
The legal sector has had to look closely at talent attraction
and retention and develop strategies to ensure everyone
can really thrive within it.
Giving employees a voice, offering true flexibility and
career progression are key. Offering fair and competitive
salaries and benefits is now a given, as is offering both
personal and professional support in a much stronger way
than was historically expected.
Can you tell us about any gender-diversity initiatives
that your company has used successfully?
Our DEI team now has several key priorities linked to what
is important to our people and business and we continue
to create a culture and physical environment that prioritises
and fosters inclusion, respect, empathy and listening.
We have worked closely with our leaders and managers so
that they understand how the role that they play is key.
We now include DEI, well-being and career development in
manager role profiles as key responsibilities. To ensure that
we have equipped our managers with the right support
and skills, our people team delivers an ongoing series of
“lunch and learns” to support them with effectively and
progressively managing their people. They also provide
ongoing and bespoke 121 support and coaching to all our
managers.
What areas do you think still need progress?
We still need to change mindsets around the role that
women and men take in family and extended family life.
We also need to truly value feminine leadership qualities
and style, as well as diversifying and rethinking how our
Boards look. We must stay modern and relevant so that
the younger generation sees our sector as an attractive
destination of choice.
For true social mobility and fair representation, we must
promote apprenticeships as an equal and legitimate
alternative to university. We also need to work to improve
the quality of data and tracking of data to demonstrate
progress. Ultimately, we have to “walk- the-walk” and
acknowledge that “box ticking” alone is not going to
change anything.
Donna Scully,
Director Carpenters Group
Our Chairman John and I set out these values when we
started 30 years ago. I truly believe that this is one of
the big reasons we have been successful and have 50/50
gender equality top to bottom, virtually no gender pay gap
and why we attract such amazing women as a result.
39

There isn’t
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INTERVIEWS
Holding onto talent
is vital
The legal world is traditionally a very maledominated
profession, particularly with partners
and the judiciary remaining male-centric – how
can we ensure that women get a seat at the
leadership table?
I have been in the legal industry for over 30 years,
and I haven’t seen the landscape of female leadership
drastically evolve in all that time. The answer is convoluted
- essentially until big law welcomes, with no agenda,
women on the board. We need to look at the professional
services sector as a whole, including insurance and
banking, because collaborations and partnership referrals
won’t necessarily align until we are all on the same page.
New generations might implement genuine equality and
work on inclusive internal cultures for a fairer and diluted
demographic. For now, when it comes to partners and
decision makers in law, it’s still male-dominated, but that
doesn’t mean females aren’t calling the shots by choosing
their own career paths in law under a different guise.
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
Without internal support and a culture that breeds fairness
and equality, women will face hurdles in navigating a
true work/life balance. Although recruitment has twirled
180 degrees this last year from being a candidates’
market to that of the employer, keeping great staff relies
on actionable opportunities, including pay rises and
promotions. An employer might snap up a technically
brilliant lawyer, compliance officer, or marketer but what
makes them stay? Investing in our employees, proving by
precedent, that there is a flexible working environment,
open dialogue, support for menopause, carers’ support,
coupled with continued learning and development are
what women want in a safe, happy and busy workplace.
Good ethics are key for a compliant law firm, which
manages risk by investing in their people.
my third child was born (10 years later), I worked in a more
supportive private practice, however, because of growing
family to support, plus the challenges of working around
my partner’s role as an officer in the London Fire Brigade, I
felt that the only reasonable choice as a family was for me
to revert to a lesser role, which I found frustrating. I have
run various forums with professional indemnity insurers
recently and they put wellbeing high on the
list when managing risk. Claims arising due to overwork,
stress or fear of speaking out are increasing and
the insurance market is holding the law firm leaders
accountable when it’s time to renew. Holding onto talent
is vital, therefore having the right inclusive culture with
flexible work opportunities without the fear of reprisals
would encourage more women to continue in this industry.
What innovations have you seen in your area of
the industry relating to women in law?
There has been an obvious shift in women-led initiatives
when it comes to access to justice campaigns; I’m also
witnessing more trailblazing women in legal tech too. As an
SEO and data nerd myself, I am working on the effects of
GenAI versus researched source content in law firms.
Innovation for women in law is exciting, whether that’s
driving EDI policies and controls, or heading up R&D
programs, we are in the forefront.
Elaine Pasini MCIM
Head of Communications
The Institute of Legal Finance & Management
We’ve seen a lot of women leave a profession
in the law after having children – what can be
done to help and encourage those returning to
work after periods of maternity or family-related
leave?
When I had my first child, I worked inhouse and the
pressures of returning to work quickly were overwhelming.
I suffered from undiagnosed post-natal depression, whilst
juggling childcare and had zero support from HR. After
41

INTERVIEWS
A new era of
leadership
The legal world is traditionally a very
male-dominated profession, particularly
with partners and the judiciary remaining
male-centric – how can we ensure that women
get a seat at the leadership table?
I have spent over 25 years in law, largely in the personal
injury sector. The partners and judges I came across
then were predominantly male, but this has improved
dramatically and I have spent the last decade largely
surrounded by other women.
I never accepted that being a woman was a barrier to
progression, but I am conscious that I had a strong support
network around me and workaholic genes inherited from
my parents. I can say without hesitation that it was hard
graft, blood, sweat and tears that got me to where I am
today, and not natural talent!
It has taken me a long time to realise that not everyone is
wired the same. Being flexible to accommodate someone’s
needs is a small price to pay to get the right person. If you
don’t accept this, you may have a full table of full-time,
office-based colleagues, but they won’t be the ‘A team’.
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
I think women should learn to champion each other more.
I can recall many more instances of women not supporting
other women’s progression than that of men. Perhaps it is
a product of women having to fight harder over the years
to succeed and therefore being fearful of challenge and,
dare I say it, feeling a need to be ‘sharp elbowed’.
Women leaders today have the power to make things
better. Learn from the challenges you have faced and make
sure others don’t face the same battles. Some of the first
changes I made when I became CEO were to make working
hours available between 7am and 7pm, implementing
hybrid working and, more recently, extending enhanced
maternity, paternity and adoptive leave pay.
We’ve seen a lot of women leave a profession
in the law after having children – what can be
done to help and encourage those returning to
work after periods of maternity or family-related
leave?
I am a passionate advocate for maternity/adoption leave
reform. Having only been able to afford to take six weeks
off work after the birth of both of my children, I still find
it nonsensical that SMP provides 90% of earnings for 6
weeks only but then goes on to allow a basic award for
a further 33 weeks. This means that women who are the
bread winners or single parents simply cannot afford to
take longer than 6 weeks off and never get to benefit
from the extended basic award. There should be an option
to take say 12 weeks at 90%, forfeiting the remaining basic
award for the subsequent 27 weeks.
The increasing scope of free childcare is helpful, but not
adequate for full time working parents. Again, there could
be an option of enhanced free childcare for those returning
to work full -time.
Rachel Di Clemente
Chief Executive, Hudgell Solicitors
Nothing makes me prouder than seeing my female
colleagues progress, being able to share what I have learnt
with them and watching and learning from others. So, I
challenge all the women out there to be better sisters to
their female colleagues – embrace that there is room for
many more of us to succeed.
43

Legl doesn't just make
compliance a competitive
advantage. We also do
great webinars.
Find out more

INTERVIEWS
Dream Big:
how women can navigate the world
of venture capitalism
In the UK, 2% of venture funding goes to female founders.
Over the last five years there have been several initiatives
from the market to increase this proportion. However, as
the macro environment has changed, the largely male VC
community has reverted to what they know best: funding
male founders.
VC deal value for female-founded companies in % of total deal value for all founded
companies
10.00%
7.50%
5.00%
2.50%
0.00%
2010 2012 2014 2016 2018 2020 2022
Data source: https://pitchbook.com/news/reports/2023-european-all-infemale-founders-in-the-vc-ecosystem
At Legl, a SaaS product that enables law firms to manage
client inception, onboarding and compliance, we have
managed to raise one of the highest venture capital in the
legal-tech space by a female-led business ($25M).
Partly because we have happy customers: over 300 law
firms in the UK, including over 40 of the Top 200. Investors
respond to that - to a fast-growing product with a great
team.
And partly because, as a (sole) female founder, I’ve learned
how to navigate an ecosystem that largely rewards patternmatching;
when the patterns are young male founders, it
can be uphill.
My key learnings:
• Confidence: I have a strong confidence in my ability
to solve hard problems. I credit this with a strong
belief in first principles, and the ability of any person
to look at what we are trying to learn or do and work
out a solution.
business decisions that make me unpopular with
people I care about. It’s not for everyone.
• Thinking big: Part of the venture world is about
thinking beyond today and presenting big dreams.
Often in analyses of female founders it’s said that
women focus on the pragmatic rather than the big
dream.
• Being ok with failure: Risk-taking – which is inherent
to starting a business and trying to find a path for a
product that hasn’t yet existed – is hard. It means that
you could fail. In fact, the likelihood of failure is quite
high. To go for broke is to be prepared to land flat on
your face, in front of your network.
Although these are lessons I’ve learned by being an
entrepreneur, I think a lot is transferable. We can
spend a lot of time training people on unconscious
bias or working on diversity and inclusion programmes
to change the macro environment, but that’s a slow
roll – as the VC funding numbers indicate, sometimes
change is one step back before two steps forward.
But there is one variable that women can have some
control over – and that’s how they approach the
day-to-day: is it with confidence, with a willingness to
put one’s head above the parapet – and fail? It may
not be fair that the world we’re operating in typically
rewards the pattern it has seen before. But as we
individually break small boundaries, we give another
example to those who come after, that it can be done.
Julia Salasky
CEO at Legl
Julia Salasky is a lawyer and entrepreneur. She is the founder and CEO of Legl
(www.legl.com), automating regulatory compliance for law firms, payments,
onboarding and workflow automation with AI. Julia previously founded
CrowdJustice, the award-winning platform democratising access to the legal
system, and was a lawyer at Linklaters and the United Nations. She has also
been named the Financial Times Legal Innovator of the Year, a Marie Claire
Future Shaper, and recognised in the Lawyer’s Hot 100.
I sometimes see people, often women, who doubt
their own abilities when faced with a new challenge
– I think whether one is a founder or not, this can set
people back.
• Willingness to sacrifice other priorities: Founding a
business is hard. I’ve moved countries to fundraise
while seven months pregnant, taken two weeks
maternity leave, and have made plenty of hard
45

INTERVIEWS
Defying
Conventions
The legal world is traditionally a very
male-dominated profession, particularly with
partners and the judiciary remaining
male-centric – how can we ensure that women
get a seat at the leadership table?
There are proactive steps that can be taken by firms
such as implementing mentorship programs, creating
inclusive policies for promotions, providing leadership
training tailored to women’s needs, and actively promoting
diversity initiatives. It is surprising how many firms still
don’t have these simple things in place. Having strong role
models is also really important. I feel fortunate to be in a
position where I can actively encourage those starting out
and help them see what is possible. Sometimes having that
vision is all that is needed to give someone the confidence
to challenge bias and achieve exactly what they are
capable of.
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
One of the hurdles revolves around work-life balance,
especially when juggling family responsibilities and career
ambitions. I started my legal career as a single parent so
I know what a struggle it can be. Law firms can assist
by offering flexible work arrangements, promoting a
supportive and inclusive culture, providing childcare
support, and actively addressing unconscious biases in
the workplace. I think the biggest hurdle is the existing
perception both within the legal and other industries.
I have spent many hours at an event being effectively
ignored while other firms ‘pitch’ their services at my male
colleagues. Being a woman, they often don’t identify that
I am one of the firm owners and the decision maker that
they should actually be talking to. This is also the most
difficult thing to overcome, we need to be educating
everyone from an early age that women can and do hold
senior positions in any industry and should be treated as
equals.
development of all our staff which leads to more women
progressing into senior positions so that there is a fair
representation of both genders at a senior management
level.
What areas do you think still need progress?
Areas such as addressing unconscious bias in hiring
and promotion processes, closing the gender pay gap,
increasing representation of women in leadership roles,
and fostering a more inclusive and supportive workplace
culture overall. Small businesses can face challenges in
providing solutions for employees but most of these
changes just require a different mindset from those already
in leadership. One of the reasons myself and the other cofounders
of HAIG Legal Group work so well together is that
we share the same mindset in this respect.
What steps does your company take to help
ensure women are given fair opportunities for
leadership positions?
We implement a transparent and merit-based promotion
process and provide leadership development programs.
We actively seek out and nurture female talent which
means our management team has excellent female leaders,
ensuring the management team is a fair representation
of the male to female ratio across the whole firm. We also
carry out regular diversity and inclusion training across all
staff levels which I believe is really important to challenge
any unsuitable opinions or behaviours.
Helen Claydon
Founder, Director, and Chief Legal Officer HAIG
Legal Group (Fidelis Legal Services, Simpler Law,
Northwood Banks & Co.)
What innovations have you seen in your area of
the industry relating to women in law?
The adoption of technology to facilitate remote working
and flexible schedules, the implementation of diversity and
inclusion initiatives, and the development of mentorship
programs specifically tailored to women lawyers has been
really important. I am a big advocate for training and
47

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The day will be packed with insightful discussions from
leaders in legal finance, operations, resource management
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Norton Rose Fulbright
Clyde & Co
Herbert Smith Freehills
Don't miss the keynote speech
from Sunday Times best-selling
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Plus, there will be plenty of
networking opportunities in
between sessions and at
the afterparty!
Register Now
Wednesday 26th June
Etc. Venues
133 Houndsditch
London, UK

INTERVIEWS
Embrace
the difference
The legal world is traditionally a very
male-dominated profession, particularly
with partners and the judiciary remaining
male-centric – how can we ensure that
women get a seat at the leadership table?
I am a big advocate of the value a diverse team brings to a
business, and there is a huge amount of financial data that
supports this. I believe law firms need to think more like a
business. Law firms are run by lawyers, who are experts in
practicing law – not running a business. Start thinking like
a business, embrace diversity and the benefits it brings,
and better outcomes will follow.
Secondly, law firms need to review their processes for the
allocation of work across matters. With growing pressure
from clients for greater DEI across matters, we are seeing
firms giving this greater attention. But, they need to focus
not just on having a diverse team in place, but ensuring
the work types are also fair. Too often we see data from
law firms who think they are achieving their DEI goals,
however when analysed it shows that up to 80% of the
‘documentation’ related to the matter is conducted by
females, while males work on what is often considered
the ‘career enhancing and visible’ elements such as court
representation. So don’t accept high-level data if you really
want to see change.
In the wider legal sector, we also need to recognize the
value of having a diverse team. Women need to back
themselves, and see our unique gender traits/differences
as the positives they are. And our male colleagues need to
embrace it and enable that safe space to do so.
We are different – and different is good!
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
The legal sector, and law firms specifically, have created a
very successful industry steeped in history and traditions.
This can result in openness and pace being slow when it
comes to change.
Recognise the extra burden women carry as a female in a
family environment (mother, daughter, sister etc). Accept
and support the extra burden our bodies bring every
week/month with our menstrual cycle & hormones, these
fluctuations also bring great creativity, empathy and drive.
Embrace our different communication styles and thought
processes.
None of these elements make women less capable,
committed or valuable. In fact, when in a supportive
environment, they are the opposite – they are
superpowers. Talk to the women in your business about
these. Understand them and build a culture that has a
place for them.
We’ve seen a lot of women leave a profession
in the law after having children – what can be
done to help and encourage those returning to
work after periods of maternity or family-related
leave?
Focus on value not time!
Time spent working is not a measure of success but in legal
it is, and it is often the reason that sees female lawyers
leave. Target billable hours or/and set working hours, are
often unachievable for women when you are a parent.
This can translate to being viewed as ‘less committed’ or
‘distracted’.
The reality is that as a parent, you get new skills including
operating more efficiently and effectively, which ironically,
is what most legal clients want. Other industry trends, like
AI & client demands, will force a move in this way – so
firms should be proactive and use this as an opportunity to
xx create more suitable business models for working parents.
xx
Bri McCrory
CMO, BigHand
Many law firms differentiate themselves on their people
and culture. This provides a great opportunity to really
embrace DEI by creating a safe, progressive and supportive
culture for women.
49

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INTERVIEWS
Launching a Law Firm as
a Female Leader in 2020
AI, Accountability, and Strategic Vision
Launching a law firm is an enormous task but doing so as a
female leader in 2020 presented its own unique challenges
and opportunities. Embracing artificial intelligence (AI) was
integral to our strategy at Inspire Legal Group. Not only
did it streamline our operations and boost efficiency, but
it also positioned us at the forefront of legal innovation.
AI became a critical resource, transforming the way we
approached case management, client interactions, and
data analysis.
However, technology wasn’t the only aspect of our launch
that demanded attention. The regulatory landscape
had undergone significant changes, especially with the
Solicitors Regulation Authority (SRA) implementing new
accountability measures since 2019. These changes aimed
to enhance transparency and client protection, placing
greater responsibility on law firms to uphold ethical
standards and demonstrate compliance.
As a female leader, I understood the importance
of strategic vision in developing an AI-driven and
commercially viable firm. A law firm, at its core, is a
business that sells time and expertise. It is essential to
recognise this and adopt a business-oriented approach to
ensure sustainable growth and profitability. Unfortunately,
many law firm leaders, often overwhelmed by the demands
of compliance, lose sight of the bigger picture. The need
for a hero at the top, someone who can drive business
deals, build relationships, and steer the firm towards
success, cannot be overstated.
Developing a comprehensive strategy that balanced legal
excellence with business acumen became a cornerstone
of our approach. AI played a pivotal role in achieving this
balance. By automating routine tasks, AI freed up valuable
time for our team to focus on higher-value activities,
such as client engagement, legal research, and strategic
planning. This not only improved efficiency but also
allowed us to deliver better outcomes for our clients.
professionals who share your vision and values can alleviate
some of the burdens and provide valuable support.
Delegating tasks and empowering your team to take
ownership of their roles fosters a collaborative environment
and allows you to focus on strategic decision-making.
Additionally, embracing flexibility and leveraging
technology is crucial. Remote work has become more
prevalent, enabling female leaders to manage their
responsibilities effectively.
Self-care is another vital aspect of maintaining balance.
Prioritising personal well-being and setting boundaries is
essential for long-term success. Taking time off, engaging
in activities that bring joy, and seeking support when
needed are all important aspects of self-management.
Launching a law firm as a female leader in 2020 required
a multifaceted approach. Embracing AI and leveraging
technology were integral to our strategy, enabling us to
enhance efficiency and deliver superior legal services.
Balancing the demands of compliance, business
development, and personal life required exceptional selfmanagement
and resilience. By adopting a strategic vision,
building a strong support network, embracing flexibility,
and prioritising self-care, female leaders can successfully
navigate the challenges and achieve remarkable success in
the legal industry.
Inspire Legal Group is a testament to the power of female
leadership, demonstrating that with the right strategies
and a commitment to innovation, we can thrive and make
a significant impact in the legal world.
Natalie Foster
Chief Executive Officer at Inspire Legal Group
However, the journey of launching and leading a law firm
as a female entrepreneur is not without its challenges.
Balancing the demands of raising a family, running
a business, and maintaining a personal life requires
exceptional self-management and resilience. Female
leaders often face societal expectations and biases that
can add to the complexity of their roles. It is crucial to
recognize and address these challenges head-on.
In my experience, achieving a balance requires a few key
elements. Firstly, building a strong support network is
essential. Surrounding yourself with a team of talented
51

INTERVIEWS
Smashing the
stereotypes
What do you think is the biggest hurdle women
in law face and how can law firms help women
overcome it?
The biggest hurdle a woman in law faces today is the same
as it was over 100 years ago, when women were allowed
into the profession on an equal footing.
Even though significant progress has been made with just
over half of solicitors being women - which is a remarkable
improvement on days gone by - challenges persist as we
go up in seniority in law firms.
When it comes to positions of power, such as partners and
judiciary roles, still only one in three of these roles are filled
by a woman. The larger the firm, the worse the number.
When we look at the numbers on a foundational level,
seven out of ten law students are women. This is partly
due to the current flexibility of online education that was
lacking in the past. Despite these promising numbers, the
portrayal of women in law during their studies does not
reflect the equality needed in the modern profession.
This disparity is a byproduct of our still pervasive history,
where women were only ‘recently’ allowed to enter the
profession. Initially, they were expected to know their
place and be there only to provide support to the lawyers
when called upon. This is not as far back as you may think.
It was commonplace as recently as the early 2000s, as
many women who have been in the profession since then
will attest to. Many of us have taken it in our stride and
achieved success, but nevertheless it needs addressing to
ensure it remains a relic of the past.
The numbers show that things are changing. However, it
remains a foundational issue, especially when you view
the attrition in numbers of women from law school up to
leadership roles.
encountered during early career stages like trainee
positions or early court appearances, and this hinders their
progress to more senior levels. They are often expected
to conform to an outdated archetype of a lawyer that no
longer exists.
To help women overcome these hurdles, law firms need
to address stereotypes and systemic barriers that persist
to this day. Flexible working arrangements are a relevant
example.
The outdated belief that flexible work hinders the potential
for leadership roles is a symptom of poor management
practices.
While a fully remote model may not suit all firms, a hybrid
model can be highly effective. It allows women, particularly
those with caregiving responsibilities, to excel in leadership
roles without compromising their performance. This
approach benefits the entire team regardless of their
gender.
By consciously implementing hybrid working models and
challenging outdated stereotypes, law firms can create
a more inclusive environment that supports women’s
advancement in the legal profession.
It is no coincidence that firms and consultancy models that
support flexible working and investment in their talent are
the ones that are growing and filling their vacancies, while
those that do not stagnate.
Eve Dullabh
Co-Founder of Law Training Centre
and Access Law Clinic
Although women dominate the numbers in educational
stages, stereotypical perceptions often prevent meaningful
advancement in leadership roles.
Once finally in the profession, post studies, many
women continue to face stereotypes. These are typically

FEATURE
A day in the life of
Lara Squires
Lara Squires FCIM, business owner, wife and mum
of two gives us an insight into her usual working
day. Although Lara is keen to point out that no day is
the same for her. Except maybe for the dedication to
working out most mornings!
The alarm goes off at 6.15am and after downing my AG1
drink (highly recommend this for anyone wanting to look
after their gut health) I am on my way to Project Spartan
by 6.30am. This has been game-changing for me as I
have found a group who I love working out with. It’s the
best start to the day, and today my husband joins me.
Today is a rare day in the office so I am not as time
pressured as I usually am. I’m home by 8.10am and after
rallying the kids to get them out the door for school I just
have time for a quick shower and change to be in the
office by 8.45am.
“It’s hugely
valuable chatting
to your peers and
getting insight and
support”
Breakfast is usually in the form of a protein bar and coffee
when I get to work. My first meeting is with one of my
colleagues to run through our business development
targets. Then we have our weekly team catch-up. The
next meeting of the day is with fellow agency owners. We
discuss the use of AI in our agencies. It's hugely valuable
chatting to your peers and getting insight and support.
Back to work, I am prepping for an in-person seminar I am
hosting later in the week on networking and relationship
building. An hour or so later I have a quick call with a
supplier as we need to design and create a new exhibition
stand. Next up is another coaching call, followed by a
podcast interview. This is the first time I have had to
take ownership of hosting the podcast. I think it went ok.
I do love to chat, and our guest for this one was Helen
Vane who is an expert recruiter and works with us both
as a consultant and a co-founder of our other brand
Consortium – more than recruitment.
Finally, my last meeting of the day is an online chat with
a potential candidate for our marketing account manager
role. It's great to speak with potential candidates. Our
process of recruiting for account managers at Consortium
is always that they have an initial 15 minute chat with me.
It's important for me that I think we will get along. As a
small business this is vital.
It's now 4.30 and as it's been a hectic day I need to
decompress. I am lucky enough to own a horse so I
head off to see him. Two hours of horse and countryside
therapy complete I finally get home at 7pm. My family
has already had dinner so we have a catch up about how
everyone’s day has been and if anyone needs anything,
then it's feet up, dinner and bed.
Then repeat again tomorrow!
Lara Squires,
Director, Consortium - more than
marketing
It's only 11am and I am now running a webinar on how
to get more work from your existing client base. My
colleague Hannah shares the presenting and it was an
engaged session with 26 law firm owners or marketers
taking part. Then I am straight onto a coaching call.
We are in the process of revamping our website so I
have an online session with our web agency next. Lou,
my colleague, and I go through the designs and suggest
some tweaks and changes to key straplines. I now have
a little window to have some lunch - soup and a yoghurt
today.
53

SOUND BITES
OUR JOURNEY
INTO LAW
SOUNDBITES
Not making things easy for myself,
I had my first child at the end of my second year of
university. I finished my third year with a newborn baby
and achieved a 2:1. The LPC was next, a course I found
easy to fit around my new life. I found employment in
the legal sector, had my second child, and was told by
a previous employer, ‘Your hopes of getting a training
contract are very slim, you cannot put the extra hours in
because you have children’. The next day, I handed my
notice in. The firm I am at now, I joined as a paralegal and
was awarded a training contract on merit. I am now an
Associate Solicitor, always feeling supported as a lawyer
and a woman. My hope for the future is that my daughter
never gets told she cannot do something because she is
a mother.
Charlotte Moore
Associate solicitor at Thomas
Flavell & Sons Solicitors
I founded my company Aconveyancing in
2017 and in that time, we have become a
multi-award-winning property law firm. Aconveyancing
was born out of a vision to establish a law firm with integrity, and
to treat staff with respect whilst delivering a professional and
personal service.
The opportunity to help
people in having a career in law has always
been what attracts me to the field and is the
main reason why I hope to qualify into Family
Law.
Starting University in the Covid-19 pandemic
was quite isolating, however my family always
supported me by regularly phoning me and
being there for me with encouragement. I am the
first generation in my family to attend University
so to have this constant support from them has
always been extremely important
and motivating.
Daisy Dyer,
Trainee Solicitor for
Stephen Rimmer LLP
Personal achievements for me include being named Managing
Partner of the Year at the 2022 Modern Law Conveyancing
Awards and I have been shortlisted twice as Industry Champion
at the British Conveyancing Awards. Aconveyancing is proudly
accredited with the gold Investors in People standard, one of
only 21 law firms in the UK to hold the accolade. In 2024 I was
privileged to be named a Conveyancing Foundation ambassador.
In my role I am committed to exploring different ways to
support the health and wellbeing of colleagues across the
industry, promoting an ethos of professional collaboration and
understanding.
Natalie Moore,
Managing Director & Licensed Conveyancer
at Aconveyancing Limited
54

SOUND BITES
I started my law journey in 2015 as
an administration assistant, working my way up to
a Case Handler. I left the firm during the pandemic
in 2020, having started at a new firm. I began as a
legal assistant and was promoted to a Paralegal. I am
currently a fee earner and am undertaking my CPQ
Advanced examinations to qualify as a CILEX lawyer
with the hope of qualifying next year.
A struggle I have faced in my career is finding the time
to study for my CILEX examinations whilst working full
time, however my current firm is very supportive of my
studies.
I have received glowing reviews from my clients
during my work career and have developed extensive
knowledge with nine years experience in the
conveyancing field.
Lucy Bowater-Sivell,
Trainee CILEX Lawyer, Chester & Co
My career is best seen through
the prism of the best advice I was given as a
pupil: that you can do very well at the Bar if
you say yes. Can you do this case that’s out
of your comfort zone? Yes. I’ll read the book
and ask some silly questions (there are no
silly questions) of a barrister friend. Have you
got time for a call with a client on your busy
afternoon off? Yes. I might be walking to the
station or rocking a baby in one arm, but yes.
Will you outsource all possible chores, learn
to book longer holidays so you can afford to
give up the inevitable hours for work along
the way, and slowly learn there really are more
important things in life? YES.
Vivienne Sedgley,
Barrister at 4-5 Gray’s Inn Square
My journey into law began with a dream
in secondary school: At that time I was not sure
on the type of law I would pursue but I knew it would
involve making a difference by helping people.
After ensuring I got the grades for university, I completed my LLB,
then went straight to law school followed by an MA in Law with
business.
However, the real challenge came with securing a training
contract or even a paralegal role, facing countless rejections.
I persisted and eventually landed my first paralegal position. I
secured a training contract and later became a qualified lawyer.
After a couple of years, I achieved membership in the Law Society
Children Panel, leading to my current role as a Family solicitor and
director. Though the journey had its highs and lows, each struggle
has been worthwhile in reaching where I am today.
Olamide (Mimi) Olayemi,
Director at Duncan Lewis Solicitors Ltd.
I decided to retrain in law as a second
career after my daughter was born and somehow
managed to balance most of my CILEx qualification
studies with working full-time, being a mum and
keeping the homestead running! After sending out
speculative letters to every law firm in the area, I was
fortunate to get my foot in the door of a big regional
firm over 20 years ago, where I gained valuable
experience from the brilliant employment lawyers and
barristers I had the pleasure to work with. I worked my
way up in each firm that I moved to, rising through the
ranks from paralegal to partner. I am now proud to be
part of the progressive and client-centric Doyle Clayton
family, with wall-to-wall highly ranked heavy-weight
workplace specialists and the best clients.
My route into law was rather atypical.
I attended a poorly performing state school in
Doncaster but came top of my year for GCSE results.
I later graduated with a first-class Media, Culture &
Society degree from the University of Birmingham
and came top of my year for three consecutive years.
I spent the next ten years working within the charity
sector, mainly in governance and grant management
roles. When my charity career plateaued, I chose to
pivot into the legal profession, since it aligned with my
values of justice, equity and accountability.
I completed a law conversion course while working
part-time as a paralegal at a high street firm.
It took me three years of applying to Farrer & Co for a
training contract until I was successful. I qualified into
the firm’s employment team in 2022. I now work with
expert colleagues and interesting clients on a variety
of fascinating, and often high-profile matters.
Iman Kouchouk,
Solicitor at Farrer & Co
Karen Holden,
Partner at Doyle Clayton
55

SOUND BITES
I developed a passion for law in my late 20s and
didn’t think going back to university would suit me
at that stage in my life, with two young children. I
therefore started my CILEX route into law aged 30 and
commenced a paralegal role at the same time, gaining
valuable experience whilst studying. I liked the flexibility
that CILEX could offer around my family and that I
could study at my own pace. Aged 34, I joined Doyle
Clayton. I qualified as a Chartered Legal Executive and
over the next 10 years progressed with the firm to where
I am now, Partner and Head of Doyle Clayton’s Thames
Valley Office. 30 year old me would never have thought
that such a successful career was available to me, but
the accessibility and affordability of CILEX, together
with an abundance of support from Doyle Clayton,
made that possible.
Kate Kapp,
Partner, Doyle Clayton
I had previously worked in publishing and,
at the time I was looking for a job, I had no idea what
I wanted to do. All I knew was, after years of being a
stay-at-home mum, I needed to invest more in myself.
I had no legal qualifications or experience, but I took a
job at a national conveyancing firm, in an administrative
position. A manager suggested that I had the right
attributes to be a good conveyancer. I was fortunate
enough to be offered the opportunity to begin studies.
I decided to become a Licenced Conveyancer. I was
determined and, after a few years, I managed to pass
all the exams. I was offered a fantastic opportunity to
join the wonderful team at Heringtons Solicitors and I
graduated in December. I feel like I’m a good example
that it’s never too late to pivot your career.
Leanne Badrock,
Conveyancing Executive, Heringtons
I graduated in 2019 with a LLB law
degree but I was unable to fund the LPC course
having come from a low-income background and
being the first in my family to go to university. It wasn’t
until 2021 I came across the Solicitor Apprenticeship
Scheme which allowed me to work whilst finishing my
studies one day a week. This was perfect for me as I
could carry on working with a regular income whilst
studying. The course was also funded so I avoided
any further student debt. The course has been a
real challenge, especially whilst working with two
young children and having to juggle work, study, and
home life. The last three years have been a real test
of resilience and determination, but I am on track to
qualify as a Solicitor by the end of the year thanks to
the apprenticeship scheme.
Clare Welsby,
Paralegal, Barker Booth & Eastwood,
Blackpool
My journey into law began at school,
where I discovered my passion for the field after
hearing lawyers talk about their days and what
encouraged them to pursue law. As the first in my
family to attend university, I faced the challenge
of navigating a new area of study alone. During
my undergraduate years, I faced personal hurdles
alongside my academic pursuits. Coping with the loss
of my grandfather, supporting a family member on a
ventilator, and undergoing my own surgery tested my
resilience. Despite these challenges, I maintained a
strong academic record and secured a training contract
amidst post-surgery recovery. Now, at Wolferstans LLP,
my ambition is to leverage my experiences to ensure
my clients receive the justice they deserve in the field
of medical negligence. Additionally, I’m committed to
mentoring future lawyers and sharing insights gained
from my own journey to support them in navigating the
legal profession.
Ikra Ghani,
Solicitor at Wolferstans Solicitors
My career start was inauspicious –
with countless rejections for training contracts
and huge competition.
Undeterred, after graduating I became a paralegal,
eventually got a training contract, and my career took
off. I qualified as a Solicitor, specialising in Family Law,
in December 2019 and am now an Associate Solicitor
at a leading firm. I have become a member of the
Junior Solicitors Network Committee, a member of
the National Junior Lawyers Division and a Rising Star
finalist in the Asian Legal Awards 2023.
Understanding the difficulties of getting “my foot in
the door”, I invest significant time encouraging the
next generation of lawyers. I engage with schools and
universities, talking about the industry and my personal
career journey.
I am particularly committed to inspiring students from
minority ethnic groups, contributing to publications,
and promoting the need for wider ethnic minority
representation in the legal industry.
Nusrat Siddique,
Associate Solicitor at
Rayden Solicitors
56

SOUND BITES
I commenced employment as an
Office Junior at a law firm. Fast-forward another 16
years, a house purchase, a marriage, bereavements,
two children and life generally, I feared it too late for
me to ever progress to become what I had admired
in my colleagues for so long. Personal commitments
meant that time and associated costs of studying
was not available to me. Thanks to the Degree
Apprenticeship programme, I will shortly qualify as a
Solicitor of the Senior Courts of England & Wales. With
the help and support of my employers, I am able to
work and study simultaneously to progress my career
to obtain formal qualifications outside of a traditional
academic environment. This includes studying for and
obtaining an LLB Hons in Law and enrolment upon
SQE examinations, passing which will see me qualify
(at last!) and meet my aspirations which have been
many years in the making!
Joanne Barker,
Solicitor Apprentice, Barker Booth Eastwood,
Blackpool
I remember being homeless at 16
and using my legal knowledge to advocate for
my right to shelter. I knew then that I wanted to learn
more. Many of my sixth-form teachers doubted my
potential for law school as I struggled due to my
dyslexia. Fortunately, I gained acceptance into the
Pathways to Law programme. Securing a training
contract was very hard. I didn’t fit the traditional mould.
The day before receiving my current firm’s offer, a
partner (at another firm) abruptly ended the interview,
deeming me unready for the role and that interviewing
me was a waste of time. I wish people understood the
impact of their words, especially on young individuals.
This is why I created the Power of You initiative to
inspire young people in my community which has
resulted in me being awarded the British Red Cross
Young Humanitarian Award. We all have our unique
journey!
I am a Partner at Goodman
Ray Solicitors, specialising in international child
abduction, forced marriage, child marriage, female
genital mutilation and gender-based violence. I
graduated with a law degree at the University of
Greenwich University (2008) was called to the Bar by
the Honourable Society of Middle Temple (2009) and
was admitted as a solicitor in 2013. I was named by The
Law Society as a Legal Hero in 2023.
I conducted legal research on acid violence in Sri Lanka,
Cambodia and India as a Winston Churchill Travel
Fellow. As a Fulbright Scholar I conducted research at
Cornell Law School on child and forced marriage in the
USA.
I am a UN recognised expert of child, early and forced
marriages in the UK. I was part of the pro–bono legal
team who drafted the Marriage and Civil Partnership
(Minimum Age) Act 2022. I am also a Resolution
accredited Specialist in Child Abduction & Forced
Marriage and Honour-based Violence.
Shabina Begum,
Partner, Goodman Ray Solicitors
Rebecca Asaolu,
Trainee Solicitor at Dean Wilson
My journey into law has not been plain
sailing and therefore what I have learnt is
resilience and the art of being armed with a calm but
firm temperament and positive inner voice. My hopes
for the future are that all women in law be ready to
smash through the glass ceiling but also reflect on
their achievements and feel proud of any obstacles
they may have had to overcome. It has taken me a
long time to learn that when we recognise our selfworth,
nothing is impossible and that with passion,
perseverance, and a commitment to staying true to
yourself, you can pave your own way. My journey is
more than just personal achievements, it has been
about opening doors and leaving footprints but also
remembering the words of Marie Colvin that “Bravery
is not being afraid to be afraid”.
Growing up in a single-parent household,
I shouldered responsibilities beyond my years, forging
my path in law where I found a sense of belonging and
purpose. Despite facing major surgery, personal loss, and
the disruptive force of COVID-19, I remained undeterred.
Currently, as a paralegal apprentice at The Financial Conduct
Authority (FCA), I navigate life’s challenges. Actively
contributing to the Hertfordshire Junior Lawyers Division
committee and engaging with the internal Social Mobility
Network, I play a role in shaping the professional world.
My experience as a former speaking coach at Patch App
equipped me with valuable skills in nurturing connections
and fostering professional growth. My admission into the
CLLS Training Committee represents significant progress in
my career. Continuing my pursuit of qualification through
the apprenticeship route, particularly in securing a solicitor
apprenticeship, I am dedicated to championing diverse
backgrounds and meaningful change within the legal sphere.
Charlie Moore,
Paralegal Apprentice at
The Financial Conduct Authority
Monica Kapur,
Director at Isadore Goldman
57

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BEST PRACTICE
FOR FUNDING PROFESSIONAL
INDEMNITY INSURANCE
Now that the dust has settled on the Spring PII
renewal season, it looks like the new entries to the
sector are signalling an end to the ‘hard’ market.
For those firms that are still in the traditional
September renewal season, now is the crucial time
to start thinking about preparing for the proposal
forms. Your PII broker will be much better placed
than me to help with this, however, I thought I
would take this opportunity to offer some brief tips
for paying for the (hopefully lower) premiums!
Many firms will do a great job negotiating a
lower premium with their insurers and then pay
thousands more than they need to by paying on
a monthly basis. The ‘tick box’ option is often
tempting, as most Compliance Officers for Legal
Practices will want to put the whole arduous
process behind them.
However, with lending being unregulated, there
is no requirement for the funder to provide a
comparable APR. The reality is that the cost of this
funding is not dissimilar to a credit card with actual
APRs of 20% not a rarity.
By getting independent finance, not only will
you obtain a much more favourable interest rate,
but more flexible terms allow you to fund over
12 months rather than the standard 10. Deferring
the first payment and being able to fund over 18
months if you choose to lock into a longer policy
is also a significant benefit. So, if you are looking
to spread the cost, getting independent finance is
definitely the best way forward.
Don’t approach too many funders – Try to
avoid using finance brokers. They can be useful
if your financials aren’t as strong as desired, but
most law firms should be able to get finance
arranged by their bank or a direct funder. Finance
brokers will often approach multiple funders,
which results in more searches than necessary
potentially downgrading your credit rating and,
in turn, creating further difficulties down the road.
Provide clear and accurate information – Most
PII loans via Iceberg can be approved via a Fast-
Track service, requiring one simple application
form. Make sure it’s completed accurately and
is easy to read. If you do need to provide more
financial information, make sure it is correctly
formatted and labelled clearly. Even if we aren’t
using the Fast Track service you will usually
only have to provide your last signed accounts
and most recent management figures. You can
never provide an underwriter with too much
information, so if you provide forecasts then this
will hold you in good stead.
If you would like further information on Iceberg’s
PII or working capital funding options, then
please feel free to call me or one of the team.
Ethan French,
Account Manager, Iceberg Group
How do you go about doing this?
Get funds in place early – You don’t have to wait
to get your final figure before getting an approval
in place. The most common reason we hear for
firms not getting independent finance is because
they run out of time waiting to hear back from
their brokers. Instead, use last year’s figure and add
10%. It won’t harm your application if the figure
comes in lower. Credit underwriters like to see
firms using conservative figures. An Iceberg loan
approval lasts 90 days, meaning you can have the
funds approved and ready to go as early as June
for 1 October renewal.
59

FORUM
BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT
FOR LAW FIRMS
A ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION
Our newest section of the magazine focuses on the role of sales and
business development in the legal profession – both within law firms
and for suppliers to the sector. In this edition our panel discusses how
sales and BD are viewed by firms, whether networking and relationship
building is still key and the importance of client feedback.
Hannah Perryman,
Marketing & Account Manager,
Consortium more than
marketing
Simon Marshall,
Founder, TBD
Peter Batchelor,
Marketing Manager
the HAIG Legal Group
(Simpler Law, Fidelis Legal
Services, Northwood Banks
& Co.)
Chris Davidson,
Business Development
Director, MLT
60

FORUM
“law firms are starting to realise
that they need to be more
business-savvy to stay
competitive in today’s market”
Do you think BD/sales are undervalued in law
firms? Are they high enough on the agenda and
being discussed at management board level?
Chris: They are undervalued in general but many of our law
firm clients now discuss these topics at the highest levels and
invest in resources accordingly. This can include specialised
support, sales training for lawyers, and technology solutions for
client relationship management. However, the level of priority
given to these functions varies depending on the firm’s size,
culture, and leadership. There’s still room for improvement.
Simon: I think there needs to be greater clarity concerning
who is responsible for business development and sales, and
the worth attached to proactive and revenue-driven BD. There
also needs to be a new form of contract between the BD and
marketing team and the fee earners that they support: for too
long, people with BD-related job titles have spent too long on
marketing tasks and not enhancing client relationships or driving
income into the business.
The legal sector can still learn lessons from the accountancy
sector in this regard.
Peter: There is a perception issue with sales, businesses
development, marketing, and comms in the legal sector.
Although the industry has grown broader there is still a
perception among certain law firms that pushing for sales is
somehow improper. Meanwhile the public perceiving lawyers
as reliable and stable are often shocked to think that they have
been ‘sold to’.
Hannah: Yes, quite often they are undervalued. There is a
misconception that BD teams are always ‘out on a jolly’ as it can
look like they are forever out for coffees, drinks and networking.
However, this is something that the fee-earning lawyers do
not have the time, skills or inclination to do. There is strategic
planning and a lot more that goes on behind the scenes.
Is sales still viewed as a bit of a dirty word in law firms?
Has this changed over time?
Peter: Yes, this has changed over time. When I was at an
agency in the 80s working with solicitors we were told not to
use phrases like sales and advertising, even if that’s exactly
what we were doing. Now, working in-house this is very
different. Sales form part of our outreach. We believe sectors
of society are underrepresented when it comes to the services
we offer, therefore we must go out and find them. A hardworking
family who doesn’t realise they need private client
services are not going to come knocking.
Chris: I think it is, and I get why— because lawyers have
always been trained to focus on giving legal advice and
representing clients, not so much on selling legal services.
But law firms are starting to realise that they need to be more
business-savvy to stay competitive in today’s market. It’s
crucial for firms to help their lawyers understand not just how
to practice law, but also how to run a successful business.
Hannah: Yes, I believe it is still viewed as a dirty word and
something that many solicitors shy away from as they ‘didn’t
train and qualify to be a salesperson’. However, gone are the
days where everyone would use their family solicitor and work
would just arrive on your desk! There is a much greater need
to ‘sell’ your services to remain competitive. I have witnessed
more progressive firms embrace the idea of selling and create
specific sales-focused roles. They also invest in training and
academies to upskill their lawyers and support teams.
Simon: Yes, but new entrants to the market have a very
different attitude to sales, don’t play by the agreed set of rules
and don’t feel bound by any form of legacy approach.
This allows them to be successful, innovative disruptors, with
the challenger brands that have entered the market in recent
years growing aggressively. The marketing strategy of these
firms has often been forged by individuals with a strong sales
background.
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FORUM
“law firms are starting to realise that they
need to be more business-savvy to stay
competitive in today’s market”
Here too, though, there needs to be a marriage between the
sales and marketing team and lawyers, as clients rightly don’t
want to experience or perceive any form of bait-and-switch
approach. We’ve seen some businesses try this in the lower
end of the market and stall as a result, because the law is still a
business based on relationships.
What role does networking and building referrals
play in legal BD/sales?
Hannah: In a digital world there is still a lot of value in getting
out and meeting people face to face. Especially with legal
services where people tend to be loyal to people rather than
a brand. All law firms should be aware of key events and
networking groups in their local area. It takes time to build
referrals and make good connections at networking events, so
it is important to regularly attend the same events to raise your
personal profile. Keeping in touch with professional introducers
is also vital. It really does pay to be ‘top of mind’ so making sure
you have regular catch ups and coffee meetings will help.
Peter: It depends on your target market. If you want to reach
members of the public who rarely use legal services then you
must find ways to build new networks with them, and then in
turn have them refer you to those in their ‘network’. Everybody
can use legal services, in just the same way that people can
use a plumber or mechanic. The ‘oh I might know someone’
can prove very useful.
Simon: It plays a huge role, because all the legal advice that
lawyers provide is based on trust, and trust is best established
face-to-face, initially by networking.
Experience has shown that firms can do as much marcomms
as they like, but the volume of instructions only really takes off
when lawyers walk into the room and spend time with existing
and potential clients face to face.
Chris: Networking and referrals are a huge part of growing
your legal practice. Referrals are like gold—they often lead to
better-quality leads and higher conversion rates. Networking
opens doors to speaking opportunities and industry events
where you can show off your expertise and attract clients.
But I get it—networking isn’t everyone’s cup of tea. That’s
okay! You can try things like podcasts, video blogs, LinkedIn, or
e-bulletins to promote your practice. The key is finding what
works best for you and sticking with it. Consistency is key.
How has the evolution of technology changed
sales and relationship building? Are face to face
opportunities still important?
Simon: Technology has helped to formalise the networking
process. Tools such as LinkedIn Sales Navigator for
example, help lawyers to be much better informed.
For more transactional work, some clients may be happy to
conduct most meetings online; however, when it comes to
building deep, meaningful relationships with clients who are
going to spend hundreds of thousands, if not millions, in legal
services, a face-to-face element is vital.
Chris: While it’s great that digital platforms make it easier
to connect quickly, I still think there’s something special
about meeting face-to-face. Technology lets us have remote
meetings, which is convenient and saves on travel costs. But
for me, nothing beats that personal connection you get from
sitting down with someone and reading their body language.
Peter: It wasn’t that long ago that law firms might be shocked
at the idea of communicating via social media or contacting
clients by text. Technology has opened new, and exciting,
avenues in sales and relationship building. Automated e-mail
responses keep clients updated without taking additional
time. Where services are not required frequently the use of
regular e-newsletters keep clients engaged too.
Hannah: Technology has really helped reduce the time spent
on admin tasks. Using a CRM system, prompts, AI, sales
funnels and automated processes can really help people in a
BDM role to manage their contacts and get an understanding
of their pipeline and workload. It is also excellent for
producing reports to directors or partners.
What role does client feedback play in BD/sales
strategy?
Hannah: Client feedback can help you identify the points that
matter most to your clients. Law firms might believe that one
part of their service is the most important, for example, their
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FORUM
years of experience or an accreditation. However, it could be
something entirely different that made their client’s experience
special – such as free parking, or the response times from
staff.
Finding out what clients value most can help you to shape your
sales messages.
Peter: No one is perfect. It’s true. Every law firm will make
mistakes, and it’s how these mistakes are dealt with that’s
important. Without client feedback we are all working in
a vacuum. We can assume that because we get repeat
business and new clients, we are doing everything perfectly.
If we want to improve and serve our clients better, then honest
feedback is vital.
Simon: It is an essential element. Ideally, there should be a
feedback loop from clients to highlight any mismatch between
their needs and your services so that you can address this.
If this isn’t happening we end up with tactical and reactive
marketing.
Sophisticated clients expect and demand the chance
to provide feedback. They want to get the best possible
performance out of their law firms and having a forum where
they can provide feedback is critical to maintaining trust.
Over the last decade, marketing has ceded a lot of control to
other areas of the business. For example, pricing often falls
under the aegis of finance teams, despite being one of the
five Ps and therefore an essential part of marketing. Product
innovation is also often outsourced to other departments, even
though this should be driven by client need first and foremost.
Marketing needs to get its mojo back and use the feedback
provided to drive strategy.
Chris: It’s all about understanding what clients need, making
services better, and building trust. By listening to feedback you
can adjust your approach to make sure you’re meeting their
expectations and showing them that you are committed to their
satisfaction.
By incorporating client feedback into your strategy, you can
not only set yourselves apart from the competition but also
discover new opportunities for growth. It’s important to
embrace client feedback as part of your ongoing processes,
it will help you get better, strengthens relationships, and
foster success in the long run.
What pain points do you typically encounter when
trying to encourage lawyers to do more BD?
Simon: A general resistance among some lawyers to doing
BD in the first place!
We need to teach lawyers firstly how to communicate
effectively and network internally, before progressing to
external networking and establishing themselves as subjectmatter
experts and thought leaders.
The other main pain points are around pricing, confidence
and impostor syndrome. Can I justify this price, in this way?
How do I act when someone tells me that a competitor is
cheaper? How do I interpret people’s feedback when they tell
me their rejection is to do with price, knowing that often the
real reason is a lack of chemistry?
The answer is to ask whether, beyond price, there is anything
else you could have done differently to win the work. If the
answer is no, then assume that the issue was chemistry and
be honest with yourself in your assessment of whether you
brought enough emotional intelligence to the situation and
did the groundwork to establish a rapport.
Chris: Often, lawyers struggle to focus on BD because
they’re juggling heavy workloads and trying to meet billable
hour targets. On top of that, some lawyers won’t feel
confident in their BD skills because they haven’t had much
training or experience. It can be intimidating to put yourself
out there and risk rejection, especially when you’re used to
focusing on tasks that have more immediate payoffs.
It’s important to provide lawyers with the right support
and resources. Perhaps offering training sessions on BD
strategies or helping them better manage their time so they
can carve out space for BD activities.
“there is still a perception among
certain law firms that pushing
for sales is somehow improper”
65

FORUM
Creating a culture that values BD efforts and highlighting the
long-term benefits, like happier clients and career growth
opportunities, can also encourage lawyers to embrace BD.
Peter: Time. Solicitors have a lot to focus on, and while I
believe in the importance of BD and marketing it could be
competing with a bereaved client or a tight legal deadline.
In practice what this means is, I need to plan further ahead,
have everything in place, work with others to get the best
information I can, and then hitting the deadlines becomes a
lot easier.
Hannah: Lawyers not utilising LinkedIn! It is straightforward,
free and isn’t time consuming. If used well it can be a
fantastic way to generate work, build relationships, raise your
profile and pick up extra opportunities such as speaking at
events or obtaining press coverage.
Is there one thing you would recommend that
lawyers do to generate more leads?
Chris: Strengthen your online presence. Make sure your
website is easy to find on search engines, share helpful
blogs and articles, and connect with potential clients on
relevant social media platforms.
Peter: Demystifying and humanising the sector further. The
largest untapped market in the legal industry is those people
who either don’t believe they require legal services, or only
use them when absolutely necessary. By becoming more
approachable, transparent and easier to understand, the
industry could attract a wider and more sustainable client base.
Hannah: Re-market to your existing clients. Often someone
will need to use the services of a law firm more than once and
in a competitive market you need to stay top of mind. Existing
clients have already been through the “know-like-trust” journey
with you, yet so many firms do not make use of their biggest
asset – their client bank.
Simon: Pick an existing client that you like working for –
someone who pays your bills on time, respects your opinion
and refers you to others – and then focus on marketing to
them. Inevitably, more clients of a similar ilk will follow.
Phone your clients and offer them some off-the-clock time to
see if they have any issues you can help with, to discuss new
products and ideas, and to generally make them feel like you
care about them. You may not get paid for it, but you might win
the next deal without even having bid for it, because you have
ensured that you stand out from your competitors.

ROUNDTABLE
A Wills & Probate
Expert Panel
In this issue’s panel our experts from Ochresoft and
Estatesearch consider the biggest challenges the wills and
probate industry currently face and how developments in
technology might be able to help.
This issue’s opinions are from:
Marie Harrison-Stradling
Work-Flow Team Manager,
Ochresoft
Ben Furlong
Managing Director UK,
Estatesearch
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68

WILLS
& PROBATE
What are the biggest pressures currently faced by
the wills and probate industry?
Ben: After conveyancing, probate is the second
‘most complained about’ sector of law. As a society,
customers are developing an ‘Amazon’ mentality,
expecting everything on demand. Probate delays and
the increasing numbers of contentious cases inevitably
extend the process and create frustration.
However, lawyers should look at aspects of the process
they can control, seeking efficiencies to deliver better
client service.
Technology offers the chance to implement robust
processes and improve workflow, so firms can improve
client communication and reduce frustration. Tech also
provides an audit trail to demonstrate due diligence,
ultimately protecting both the firm and the client.
Marie: In the administration of estates, the issue
currently felt most widely and significantly is the
continued delay in obtaining the Grant of Probate. It has
been reported, based on the HM Courts and Tribunals
Service data for January, that the average time recorded
from the point of submission of application to issue of
grant is 13.8 weeks.
Those in the industry may now be very familiar with
the frustrations of these delays. However, from the
perspective of the lay client, this lengthy period spent
in a perceived limbo can be extremely stressful, both
emotionally and financially. Access to keenly needed
estate funds may be blocked, property sales can
be affected by uncertain transaction times and, of
course, families, who have lost a loved one, cannot find
closure. The probate practitioner must navigate their
client(s) through this turbulent process, manage the
expectations of external stakeholders and, concurrently,
deliver excellent legal advice and service – a probate
practitioner’s skill set must be varied and dynamic.
This is by no means the only issue. An increase in
contentious probate cases, stemming from challenges
to the validity of the will and claims under the
Inheritance (Provision for Family and Dependants)
Act 1975 have placed a heightened emphasis on
consideration capacity, family relationships and external
socio-economic factors. Relevant reviews need to be
conducted in depth, and results rigorously recorded for
the practitioner to fully protect their client(s) and their
firm.
The industry has also just seen an increase to
the Probate Registry application fee (despite the
aforementioned delays), having previously weathered
the suggestion of further changes to fees and
inheritance tax. These new issues and challenges in the
industry are creating an environment of uncertainty.
How has the proliferation of digital assets, such
as cryptocurrency, online accounts, and digital
content added complexity to estate planning and
administration?
Marie: Digital assets, in all their varied forms, have
certainly added a layer of complexity to wills and
estate planning as well as to the administration of
the estate. The ease of procurement and accessibility
of digital assets has meant it would be unusual for
a client not to have an element of digital identity or
value, which needs to be identified and considered as
part of their instruction. The review and completion
of a Memorandum of Digital Assets with the client(s),
therefore, now must be an intrinsic part of the will
drafting and estate planning process.
Ideally, clients should also be advised to maintain a
contemporary Memorandum, which could ultimately
be referred to as part of the estate administration
process.
Ben: Digital assets represent a rapidly evolving space
which is likely to become more complex as our
society’s reliance on the digital world continues to
grow.
Identification will continue to be a challenge. We can
search for online cryptocurrency accounts for example,
where they are centralized and registered. However,
cryptocurrency can also be stored offline simply on a
USB stick, with no physical paper trail. These so called
‘cold wallets’ are outside the banking system, and it is
simply not possible to identify these assets through a
digital search.
Taxation of financial digital assets opens up further
complexities. The jurisdiction where digital assets are
hosted influences which country’s tax rules apply.
However, is taxation based on where servers are
hosted or where the beneficiary resides? A flight to
Switzerland with a cold crypto wallet could change the
picture entirely. How does this relate to IHT?
The Law Society consultation on digital assets seeks to
help provide clarification. However, sentimental assets
such as online photos are not currently covered by the
definition, leaving rules of succession open to question.
The US, Germany and France have already set out
priorities for such assets and the UK could take note
for the future.
How can developments in technology or case
management be used to the advantage of wills and
estate professionals?
Marie: Legal software is in a prime position to assist
wills and estate professionals in navigating and
addressing the new challenges and risks emerging
across the industry. For example, we have noted the
recorded increase in the number of wills challenged on
grounds of validity.
69

WILLS
& PROBATE
At Ochresoft, our legal team is able to consider
this trend, monitoring the detail and outcomes of
recent case law, combined with the application of
contemporary practice knowledge. This analysis and
identification of the key elements and issues, which
pose the greatest risk to practitioners and their
clients, has led us to target and enhance areas of our
workflows that address these high-risk areas of the
instruction.
An example of this is the enhancement of our Wills
workflow to include the production of a contemporary
statement, documenting specific elements of the
instruction, which we are aware could later be raised in
a Larke v Nugus request. The practitioner is prompted
and assisted to record and review the relevant
information, which is efficiently transposed into
contemporaneous client and firm statements, which
can be stored with the will, should a request be made
in the future.
Practitioners can use software to their advantage,
benefiting from its accessibility and support which
enables them to respond comprehensively and
dynamically to industry change.
Ben: Technology offers greater speed and efficiency
so can help with the increasing volume of caseloads. It
means legal firms can handle more cases, increasing
revenue and profit, while staying on top of costs to
remain cost competitive.
If used correctly, technology supports more robust,
consistent processes and procedures, automating
and removing the chance of human error. Data and
information can be identified, sorted and managed
more accurately and efficiently, ensuring nothing
is missed and enabling better communication with
clients.
How can wills and probate lawyers work more
efficiently and effectively - are there ways they
can automate or speed up the search processes for
example?
Ben: Covid was a catalyst for change and many firms
adopted better working practices, which quickly
become habit. Advances in technology continue at an
incredible pace and legal firms who don’t take a regular
look at what is available will get left behind.
Estatesearch’s solutions are designed specifically to
be accessible and usable by legal professionals. It’s
also a two-way street. The more teams engage with
technology providers the more all parties learn about
one another’s processes and challenges, driving
technology improvements to deliver products and
services that better service the profession and their
clients.

THE IMPACT OF AI
ON LEGAL OPERATIONS
Chris Green, Co-Founder and CEO of Xapien
considers new developments in AI and how
the legal industry is adopting them.
AI FOR LAWYERS
The term AI encompasses a wide range of technologies.
Generative AI and Large Language Models like ChatGPT
have made headlines but there are many other types of AI
specialising in different areas.
At Xapien, for instance, we use around 20 unique
algorithms to automate background research on individuals
or companies, worldwide. Generative AI is the type of AI
Xapien uses to generate summaries of all the information
that the other AI models have researched and analysed.
This complex set of algorithms come together to produce
comprehensive research reports in hours, not minutes.
This enables lawyers to make informed business decisions
in hours, not days. It could be onboarding a new client or
supplier, developing a litigation strategy, or scoping an M&A
matter.
CLIENT PROTECTION IS KEY
There is appetite for AI in the profession. But lawyers
tend to be risk averse and their duty to their clients and
their SRA Code of Conduct comes first. For lawyers, their
biggest concern is protecting their clients.
AVOIDING RISKS
Choosing the right AI tool for your firm is crucial. It must be
reliable, consistent and protect client confidentiality.
We collaborate with law firms to ensure our technology
meets these criteria. It hinges on Xapien’s ability to take
two simple data inputs—like a name and a LinkedIn profile
or company URL—and generate detailed, context-rich
research reports about specific subjects. This means
lawyers don't have to share sensitive third-party data or
collect irrelevant information.
diligence on all new clients meaning their Compliance
Analysts spent time gathering data. Xapien provides a
consistently comprehensive approach to due diligence,
and analyst time is focused on developing strategies
around high risk clients. This drives major efficiencies
and enables the firm to better protect itself against bad
actors.
Our clients are continually testing and learning new
applications for our AI-powered, fully automated
background research reports. Xapien is used to produce
“taxi reports” in minutes, so fee-earners can get to know
their clients before they’ve even met them, and better
serve them when they do. For M&A Xapien streamlines
due diligence by providing a thorough open source
research report in minutes, not days - an essential
“ground clearing” exercise so practitioners can better
focus their human-led efforts.
A TWO-WAY STREET
AI is here to stay. Firms that don’t adopt AI will get
left behind. But there’s a real risk of AI-washing and
misinformation, which can erode trust when claims don’t
live up to expectations.
It’s important that we work closely with firms and
professional associations. The onus is on the technology
vendor to provide lawyers with trustworthy tools that
protect against data privacy breaches, preserve client
confidentiality, and provide accurate, consistent and
reliable answers to lawyer’s challenges. Ultimately we
need our clients to test and learn new applications for this
powerful new capability. We’re all learning together and if
there’s a new gap that AI can fill then we’re always keen
to hear more.
Every piece of information in a Xapien report is fully
sourced and hallucination-free, enabling lawyers to use
them in regulatory contexts where the stakes are high.
Finally, it’s about human-AI collaboration. AI can drive
major efficiencies in legal processes but you still need the
humans to make the decisions.
EARLY INNOVATORS
One major law firm has reduced their average client intake
time from two weeks to just a few hours using our platform.
As a regulated firm, they need comprehensive due
Chris Green,
Co-Founder & CEO, Xapien
71

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FORUM
Opportunities & Threats
in Conveyancing
A Forum Discussion
Welcome to this issue of Modern Law’s Conveyancing Panel! In this edition
our panel consider the current challenges facing the conveyancing industry,
how technology can be used to help combat these challenges and discusses
risk management issues the sector needs to be aware of.
This issue’s opinions are from:
Richard Hinton
Twenty Convey
Gregor Angus
Senior Business Development
Manager, Amiqus
73

FORUM
What are the main pressures you think are facing
the conveyancing industry right now?
Gregor: There are many competing challenges for
conveyancers. There’s the ever evolving compliance landscape,
new legislation to contend with (such as the Building Safety
Act) and across the whole legal sector, but particularly in
conveyancing, attracting and retaining talent is a challenge.
These all have a knock-on effect meaning conveyancers have
to do more, with less.
Richard: The challenges of recruiting and retaining staff is a real
issue for firms and it’s directly linked, at least in part, to another
pressure - the industry’s inability to price properly. If margins
are thin, then utilisation needs to be high, and firms can neither
recruit ahead of demand nor manage workloads.
The profession seems to be a magnet for every new risk foisted
on the sector. AML checks, property due diligence, SDLT
reform and the new Building Safety Act are just a few examples
of well-intentioned reforms that are left with the profession to
implement in practice and often underwrite with their PI.
A final thought is that the industry’s own shape and structure
creates a pressure all of its own. Reform and representation
are compromised when the industry is so fragmented and
polarised. There are nearly 4,500 active conveyancing firms but
no brand has a market share of more than 2.2% and the largest
10 conveyancers bought as many residential properties as the
smallest 2,700 firms in 2022 / 2023.
How have technological changes and digitization of
processes affected the conveyancing industry? And
how can they be harnessed to improve efficiency
and services?
Richard: Most elements of the industry have harnessed the
now routine benefits of automated case progression and slicker
comms between parties. Also, many of the ‘scope creep’
challenges around onboarding and enhanced searches are
being answered by tech solutions.
These new processes have led to an explosion of actionable
data both internally and externally, that is in turn enabling a
new generation of market insight tools and new collaborative
opportunities.
One of the more profound impacts has been the choice
presented to firms around their team composition. Better tech
seems to offer greater junior-to-senior staff ratios seen by some
as dumbing down the profession.
The next generation of tech innovation will hopefully focus
on industry standardisation or interoperability so that these
improvements can be captured across all parties - which will
turbocharge their impact on efficiency across transactions. This
of course can’t happen unless the industry, its Regulators and
the Government create an environment that promotes such
cooperation.
Gregor: There has undoubtedly been progress in the use of
technology, and improved process efficiency at a lot of firms,
but there is still a lot more that could be improved. Many firms
still rely on manual processes for things like AML checks,
meaning it’s a double whammy of higher risk, and lower
efficiency.
There has definitely been an advancement in the use of
practice management systems, integrations to reduce re-entry
of data etc but there are many opportunities such as Open
Banking technology which has multi-use potential eg for
Source of Funds purposes, and as a payment platform.
Obviously we are seeing the emergence of generative AI
at significant pace, and there will be opportunities that arise
through that once we work out the risk, regulation, ethics etc
involved, but there is an opportunity in the intervening period
to ensure data is ‘clean’, so that you can benefit from the use of
these tools at the appropriate time.
How have regulatory changes and compliance
affected the sector?
Richard: Compliance requirements have dramatically
increased costs and loaded additional tasks on all stakeholders.
In the same way, I’m not aware that any regulatory changes
have freed conveyancers from cost and reduced complexities.
Gregor: Regulatory and compliance changes seem to be a
constant theme. In our area of KYC and AML compliance, there
may well be further regulatory changes on the horizon again.
There is the imminent decision on the consultation from 2023
on ‘Reforming Anti-Money Laundering and Counter Terrorism
Financing Supervision’ for a start.
In addition, the UK Government is currently consulting again
on ‘Improving the effectiveness of the Money Laundering
Regulations’. With the UK Gov Digital Trust Framework, and
accreditation of providers already in place and mandatory
across other sectors like Right to Work and Right to Rent,
and the current consultation specifically mentioning the Trust
Framework, change is quite possibly coming down the line,
so this may be another regulatory change for the sector to
contend with in future.
74

FORUM
What impact have cyber security threats had on
conveyancing firms?
Gregor: They are a constant concern for conveyancers as they
are at the very forefront of transactional work, dealing with
significant sums of money, often working to tight timescales,
and under high pressure from the other side and their client to
‘get things done’.
I recommend a Risk Management approach, looking at the
threat as a whole. It is important to get specialist help and
advice, as this isn’t generally a specialist subject for most IT
support.
The threat should be considered from a people, process and
technology perspective as it’s no use having the best firewalls
in place on your software, if your staff can be duped into giving
out information over the phone.
Richard: They’ve had a profound impact. Professional
Indemnity insurers have been quick to recognise the potential
costs. Individual firms have experienced first-hand the
catastrophic impact of attacks, and all firms now have to temper
their enthusiasm for tech innovation with a concern for robust
defensive measures.
On the other side of the coin, tech companies with cyber
solutions have had a market created for them. This is almost
a free pass. The cyber threat may also end up galvanising
the industry to supply bolder, more comprehensive change
with the potential to revolutionise, in particular, the accepted
wisdom around funds handling and exchange. Cyber fraud
may prove the white knight for market reform!
Have clients’ expectations changed in terms of
service delivery, turnaround times, communication
and digital experiences?
Gregor: Yes - they now expect ‘same day’ onboarding,
responses etc - what I would call the Amazon effect - where
they are used to signing up and completing any necessary
information on their end very quickly, being notified regularly
of updates, and viewing things that are often very complex
(conveyancing!) as simply a repeatable process.
There are tools out there to help. Experiment with available
technology, as there are plenty of non-traditional legal service
providers emerging who are looking at ways to enter the
market, with client experience, communication and ‘digital first’
processes being some of their prime targets for differentiation
from traditional law firms.
Richard: Yes, they certainly have! In a very real sense, these
expectations have been fuelled by comparable experiences
in other service industries. Typically, these too have complex
interactions with a range of different players but crucially, levels
of technical and regulatory standardisation are high which
means that ‘user journeys’ are smooth and joined up. With
home moving, all too often it’s the lack of coordination between
different stakeholders that makes the client’s experience so
erratic.
Are there some key risk management issues
firms need to be aware of and how can these be
mitigated?
Gregor: Cyber security is a key risk management issue, and
particularly in conveyancing. The threat is ever-evolving, so
this should be on a firm’s risk register/radar at all times and
constantly reviewed with specialist advice.
Compliance generally is an area of risk, and having the right
people, processes, technology (where relevant) and advisors
in place is key. Again, constant review is essential as things can
change quickly.
Finally, there are plenty of alternative providers looking to enter
the market and take your clients. You may decide that you don’t
need to do anything drastic immediately but, again, you should
always have one eye on the competition, traditional and nontraditional.
Richard: I think in the main, on a transactional basis, these are
well-understood. Practice rules could and should address all
the major risks whilst legislative changes are comprehensively
trailed.
Away from the transaction itself, firms should view external
dependencies as business risks. The source of work is an
obvious one and firms that actively control their pipelines are,
I think, better grounded. A lack of market awareness is also
a risk. Too many firms manage their businesses with blinkers
on - unaware of their competitive positioning. This problem has
laid the ground for what we are doing as a solution provider
to the conveyancing industry - addressing the lack of market
orientation and gaps in competitive positioning through the
most comprehensive market data and improving our clients’
strategic agility. With Material Information, for example, being
a new force in the market, can firms absorb the implications for
their firms and plan accordingly? Otherwise, new technologies,
new datasets, logbooks, upfront information, reservation
agreements etc all have the potential to reward the nimble and
penalise the laggard.
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LEGAL
TECH TALK
Charlotte Johnstone
Senior Content Manager, LegalTechTalk
In 1919, the Sex Disqualification (Removal) Act allowed women to enter into the legal profession for
the first time. But, despite now celebrating more than 100 years of women being officially accepted
into the profession, the legal industry continues to be fraught with sexism, misogyny and genderdiscrimination.
It is a sad state of affairs that (notwithstanding gradual progress), in 2024 women in law continue to face
both institutional and individual barriers in achieving equitable representation and treatment. According
to the SRA, at the beginning of this year, 53% of those in law firms were women. But, while the majority
of solicitors are women, less than half of salaried partners are women, and women make up under a third
of equity partners. Even these statistics, which are underwhelming at best, don’t go as far as to show the
intersectional inequalities within the industry.
In this Q&A, Kamila Kurkowska, president and founder of the Women in Law Foundation, and Maria
Victoria Yuste, director of Women in eDiscovery (in London), discuss the key issues they see in the
industry, and propose possible solutions.
The importance of systemic changes, including transparent promotion criteria, inclusive hiring practices,
and mentorship programs, comes up as a key part of the conversation. Kurkowska highlights how,
although self-confidence is a significant step, it is often insufficient in a field where women are judged
more harshly than their male counterparts. While remote and flexible working options are of course a
positive step, Kurkowska also calls for a cultural shift in which the parental responsibilities of both male
and female lawyers are recognised, in a bid to promote true gender equality.
While Yuste too echoes the need for more robust measures to challenge entrenched gender biases,
she also argues for severe penalties to be introduced in instances of proven discrimination, as well as
substantial rewards for those firms that do genuinely promote gender equality. In
her own experience, she relays how remote work has been a game-changer,
but that it alone is not enough.
Overall, it is clear that progress has been made in areas such as
the gender pay gap, flexible working and gender-bias training.
But, initiatives like these alone will do no good if they are
unaccompanied by efforts to address unconscious bias and
ensure equitable access to leadership opportunities.
Both of their insights reveal a legal industry which, though it
may be in transition towards a more inclusive and supportive
environment, is still in dire need of improvement. I thank them
both for their time and insightful comments.
77

LEGAL
TECH TALK
Interview with
Kamila Kurkowska
Founder and President at the Women in Law Foundation
The legal world is traditionally a
very male-dominated profession,
particularly with partners and the
judiciary remaining male-centric – how
can we ensure that women get a seat
at the leadership table?
We need to implement policies
that promote gender equality, such
as transparent promotion criteria,
mentorship programs, and inclusive hiring
practices. Encouraging male allies to
support gender diversity and fostering a
culture that values diverse perspectives
are also crucial. What I see from the
perspective of a mentor of female
lawyers is the need to empower women
and for them to be more confident.
However, self-confidence alone is not
enough. Women are generally judged
much more harshly than men. Therefore,
they often try much harder, work more
and are better educated. However, this is
rarely reflected in the fact that they earn
more or hold higher positions.
What do you think is the biggest
hurdle women in law face and how can
law firms help women overcome it?
The biggest hurdle women in law face
is the lack of work-life balance, often
exacerbated by traditional firm structures.
Law firms can help by offering flexible
working hours, remote work options,
and comprehensive parental leave.
Creating a supportive environment where
women can voice their needs without
fear of stigma is essential. I am a staunch
supporter of the claim that equality
begins at home. If a woman who decides
to have a child does not have the support
of her partner or immediate family it is
very difficult for her to reconcile her role
as a mother and an active person. Of
course it is possible, but it often comes at
a very high cost, including the constant
remorse of not being a good enough
mother or not a good enough lawyer.
Should women decide to have
children, what can be done to help and
encourage those returning to work
after periods of maternity or familyrelated
leave?
To support women returning to work
after maternity leave, firms should
offer re-entry programs that include
skill refreshers, flexible scheduling, and
mentoring. Establishing a culture that
respects and values family commitments
will encourage women to return
confidently and continue advancing
their careers. Besides, let’s remember
that, after all, the child also has a second
parent. Let’s not just look at women from
the angle that they are or can become
mothers. Let’s look more universally, that
a male lawyer is also or can become a
parent, and assume that he has the same
responsibilities at home as a mother.
What innovations have you seen in
your area of the industry relating to
women in law?
In recent years, I’ve seen law firms
increasingly adopt flexible work
arrangements, implement comprehensive
diversity and inclusion training, and
launch initiatives like sponsorship
programs specifically for women. These
innovations help create a more equitable
and supportive environment for women
in law. However, let’s not kid ourselves.
The legal industry is not a pioneer
78

LEGAL
TECH TALK
in implementing innovation, diversity
and equality. However, the law firm I
work with has implemented a policy of
reimbursement for the in-vitro procedure,
for women and for men. Another law firm
gives partial reimbursement for the cost of
a nanny or daycare centre. There are many
ways to support parents at work. But the
most important factor, in my opinion, is
empathy, that is, an understanding of what
situation parents are in.
Have you seen much uptake in Shared
Parental Leave, almost ten years after it
was introduced?
Although the uptake of Shared Parental
Leave has been slow, there is a positive
trend towards greater acceptance. More
companies are promoting it and educating
employees about its benefits. This cultural
shift is crucial for achieving true gender
equality in both the workplace and at
home.
What differences have you seen
implemented in the workplace for
women since you started your career?
Since I began my career, I’ve observed
significant changes such as heightened
awareness of the gender pay gap, the
introduction of flexible working initiatives,
and comprehensive gender bias training.
These changes reflect a broader cultural
shift towards valuing diversity and creating
more inclusive workplaces. Additionally,
what I’m seeing in the legal industry is the
growing presence of Generation Z in the
market, which has completely different
requirements from an employer than
previous generations. For Gen Z work-live
balance is something absolutely crucial.
Law firm managing partners cannot
close their eyes and pretend that such a
phenomenon does not exist.
and promote a culture of inclusion are
necessary for sustained progress in
these areas. The legal industry is still
very hierarchical and closed to change. I
think that internal mentoring programs in
law firms would change a lot, as well as
inviting people in who are not lawyers but
know the legal industry very well.
Can you tell me about any genderdiversity
initiatives that your company
has used successfully?
Our Foundation successfully implemented
mentorship and sponsorship programs
that pair emerging female leaders
with senior mentors. This initiative
has significantly contributed to the
professional development of women,
helping them navigate career challenges
and advance to leadership positions.
What training programmes does your
workplace use to address things like
unconscious bias, confidence and
self-promotion skills, work-life balance
challenges etc?
We offer a range of training programs,
including unconscious bias workshops,
confidence and self-promotion skillbuilding
sessions, and strategies for
achieving work-life balance. These
programs are designed to empower
women, enhance their professional skills,
and foster a more inclusive workplace
culture.
What areas do you think still need
progress?
Despite progress, there is still a need to
address unconscious bias, enhance worklife
balance options, and ensure equitable
access to leadership opportunities.
Ongoing efforts to challenge stereotypes
79

LEGAL
TECH TALK
Interview with
Maria Victoria Yuste
Director of Women in eDiscovery (London)
The legal world is traditionally
a very male-dominated
profession, particularly with
partners and the judiciary
remaining male-centric – how
can we ensure that women
get a seat at the leadership
table?
We must adopt bold and
uncompromising measures that
directly challenge entrenched
biases. There are two aspects
to this, first, we need to punish
evidence of discrimination
severely, with no leniency. Any
proven instance of gender bias
should result in severe penalties,
such as substantial fines,
and immediate removal from
leadership roles. This hardline
stance will unequivocally signal
that discrimination is not just
unacceptable but careerending.
Second, rewarding
evidence of equality must
go beyond token gestures.
Firms that genuinely promote
gender equality should receive
substantial financial incentives,
preferential treatment from
clients, and widespread public
accolades. This approach will
force organizations to prioritize
equality not out of goodwill
but out of necessity for their
survival and success.
Should women decide
to have children, what can be
done to help and encourage
those returning to work
after periods of maternity or
family-related leave?
I’m a big advocate of remote
working. I’m privileged to have
a position where I can work
fully remotely at Conduent.
I can’t imagine how women
before COVID did it all; I can’t
get my head around it. It has
been a game-changer for me
in so many ways – I get to
enjoy my (now) 6-year-old
daughter. It has provided a level
of flexibility and balance that I
didn’t have when commuting to
an office. I can better manage
my time, which means more
quality moments with my
family and less stress overall.
I work with India and with the
US, so it allows me to create a
workspace that’s tailored
to my needs, making me more
productive and fulfilled.
What do you think is the
biggest hurdle women in law
face, and how can law firms
help women overcome it?
If only there were one!
Unfortunately, women in
law face unique challenges.
Balancing work-life
responsibilities, navigating
gender-related dynamics, and
confronting gender bias are
just a few of the difficulties
encountered along the way.
Since my days as a lawyer 20
years ago, I don’t think I can
say I have seen extraordinary
changes. When examining
leadership roles in firms,
I still see a similar lack of
representation of female
80
partners. I think law firms must
actively promote and support
women’s advancement into
leadership positions within the
firm. By having mentorship and
sponsorship programs tailored
to women, alongside training
programs and awareness
initiatives, they can help create
a more inclusive environment.
Lastly, by implementing
transparent and unbiased
promotion processes, they can
help ensure deserving women
have equal opportunities to rise
to leadership roles within the
firm.
Clients, too, have a powerful
role to play. By demanding
diversity within their legal
teams, clients can push law
firms toward meaningful
change. This external pressure
can be a catalyst for the internal
reforms needed to foster a
more inclusive environment.

10 MINS WITH
Minutes With...
Laura
Cartwright
Q
What
is your most memorable achievement
whilst working in your current role?
In my role as Head of Department at BLJ I encountered
a significant challenge when the team grew from 7 to 27
in just a few years. Conveyancing is fast-paced with tight
deadlines, and I led a team in implementing new policies
and procedures whilst managing a heavy caseload myself.
Through collaboration and excellent teamwork we have
achieved success not only in exceeding our initial goals but
winning several awards along the way which I am extremely
proud of.
Q
What
has been the most valuable piece of
advice you’ve ever been given?
One valuable piece of advice that always stands out from
very early on in my career was given to me by a Partner who
I worked with for 27 years before he retired. “You always
know more than the Clients!” It’s so true in all aspects of law
and I offer the same advice to new colleagues regularly to
give them the confidence they need when speaking to clients
on the phone, or responding to any queries they have. There
is no better experience than working on the front line and
you soon pick up the terminology and procedures, you just
don’t realise how much you know sometimes.
Q
What
has been the key positive or negative
impact of change in your area of the market?
The key positive impact of change in conveyancing has been
the adoption of digital technology which has led to increased
efficiency. It has streamlined document processing, reduced
paperwork (we are of course paperless!) and has accelerated
many transactions.
Negative impacts are of course risk of cybersecurity threats
with the increasing reliance on digital platforms and
electronic communication together with confusion over new
regulations over the last few years.
Q
If
you were not in your current position, what
would you like to be doing?
It’s very difficult to answer this question as its all I know – I
have worked at BLJ for 35 years this year predominantly
in a conveyancing capacity. Other areas of law that I have
practiced are Wills and Probate and I studied criminal law
at higher level too and obtained a distinction, so I did learn
something in that area along the way.
I do enjoy baking cakes and have always said that I would
love to open a little coffee shop somewhere so maybe that’s
something I could look at when I retire!
Q
What
three items would you put on display
in a museum of your life and why?
A photograph of my two children – Rachel and Nathan. They
are my greatest achievement not only because of the love
they bring but also because of the impact they have had in
shaping who I am as a person. No other achievement could
ever compare and they are a constant reminder of what truly
matters in life and they motivate me to be the best version of
myself each day.
Holiday pictures – they have captured significant moments
and milestones whether family holidays or special celebrations
and we often reminisce about the moments and memories we
have about these fun times.
A list of all of the people who have been kind to me
throughout my life to recognise and appreciate the qualities
they possess that I know have had an impact on my life – you
all know who you are!
Laura Cartwright,
Partner Bell Lamb & Joynson
81

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