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12 saerTo gazeTi #22 (206), 9-15.V, 2012 w.<br />

gvesaubreba partia `Tavisufali<br />

saqarTvelos~ Tavmjdomare<br />

kaxa kukava:<br />

_ kaxa, ras ityviT, aSS<br />

kvlav saakaSvils uWers mxars?<br />

_ arsebobs politikuri TamaSis<br />

wesebi, maT Soris amerikuli,<br />

romelic Semdegs moiTxovs<br />

_ qveyanaSi, rogorc<br />

xelisufleba, ise opozicia<br />

nominalurad unda arsebobdes.<br />

aSS-sTvis mniSvnelovania sazogadoebriv<br />

azrze zegavlenas<br />

srulad flobdes, isini unda<br />

akontrolebdnen saqarTveloSi<br />

yvela moTamaSes _ xelisuflebas,<br />

opoziciasac, mediasac, eqspertebsac<br />

da arasamTavroboebsac.<br />

amitomac, isini am logikiT<br />

muSaoben. is, rom aSS `nac.<br />

moZraobis~ garda `qristiandemokratebTan~,<br />

`axal memarjveneebTan~,<br />

`qarTul ocnebas-<br />

Tan~ `respublikelebTan~ muSaobs,<br />

es erTgvari speqtaklia,<br />

partiebs eubnebian _ Tqvi, vi-<br />

Tom opozicia xar, viTom xelisufleba<br />

xar. am dros arc<br />

xelisuflebaa xelisufleba da<br />

arc opoziciaa opozicia. yvelam<br />

kargad viciT, rom saqarTvelos<br />

saakaSvili ki ara, aramed<br />

aSS-s saelCo marTavs, xolo<br />

miSa maT azrebs axmovanebs.<br />

meore mxriv, arc opozicia ar<br />

aris opozicia imitom, rom<br />

isini araferSi ar ewinaaRmdegebian<br />

xelisuflebis kurss.<br />

daakvirdiT NDI-s da `airais~_<br />

gamokiTxvebs. SemiZlia eqskluziurad<br />

giTxraT Semdegi _<br />

zustad vici, rom NDI-s gamokiTxvebis<br />

mixedviT Cvens partias<br />

14 procentiani reitingi<br />

hqonda, romelic ar gamocxadebula.<br />

Tumca, me vaiZuleb amis<br />

Sesaxeb gancxadeba gaakeTon,<br />

radgan zust informacias<br />

vflob amis Taobaze, mtkicebulebebi<br />

maqvs da NDI-s amis<br />

aRiareba mouwevs. savaraudod<br />

am monacemebs respublikuri institutic<br />

flobs. ratom aqveyneben<br />

isini sxva partiebis<br />

reitingebs da blokaven Cvens<br />

politikur organizacias? _<br />

imitom, rom maTTvis pro-amerikul<br />

partiebs Soris vis eqneba<br />

11 procenti da vis 31 procenti,<br />

meorexarisxovania. mTavaria<br />

`Tavisufali saqarTvelos~<br />

mimarT sazogadoebis simpaTiebis<br />

zrda ar moxdes. piradi<br />

kontaqtebidan vici, rom<br />

isini mTavar safrTxed swored<br />

`Tavisufal saqarTvelos~ aRiqvamen<br />

da ara romelime im<br />

opoziciur Zalas, romelic<br />

Tavidan bolomde aSS-s marionetuli<br />

mmarTvelobis mier<br />

damkvidrebul, e.w. liberalur<br />

faseulobebs iziarebs.<br />

_ kaxa, natoSi gawevrianeba<br />

da avRaneTSi Cveni jarebis<br />

gawveva axsene. Tu erT pro-amerikul<br />

Zalas meoreTi CavanacvlebT,<br />

romelic aseve warmatebiT<br />

gagvawevrianebs natoSi, av-<br />

RaneTSi amogvixocavs qarTvel<br />

jariskacebs, risTvis vibrZviT<br />

maSin?<br />

_ diax, es SekiTxva gvaqvs<br />

Cvenc, qarTul sazogadoebas _<br />

bolobolo unda vicodeT ra<br />

gvinda. Cveni sazogadoeba iciT<br />

vis hgavs? _ luarsab TaTqari-<br />

Zes `kacia-adamianidan~, romelmac<br />

Zalian Tu Sewuxdeba da<br />

ofli daasxams, SeiZleba Subli<br />

moiwmindos, an buzi Tu daajda<br />

xeli auqnios, magram konceptualurad,<br />

ra saxelmwifos<br />

Seneba gvinda, amaze fiqrisTvis<br />

qarTulma sazogadoebam jer<br />

ver moicala, roca SevardnaZem<br />

qarTveli sazogadoeba Zalian<br />

Seawuxa, xalxi quCaSi gamovida<br />

da igi gaagdes, magram arcerTi<br />

wuTiT ar gvifiqria, Tu<br />

ra gvindoda SevardnaZis Semdgom,<br />

amitomac miviReT saakaSvili.<br />

dResac, rodesac saakaSvili<br />

ukve Zalian Semawuxebelia,<br />

sazogadoeba drtvinavs, magram<br />

Zalian cota dros uTmobs imaze<br />

fiqrs, Tu ra iqneba saakaSvilis<br />

Semdgom. garwmunebT,<br />

rogorc SevardnaZis avtomaturma<br />

gadadgomam progresi ar<br />

moitana, aseve moxdeba saakaSvilis<br />

SemTxvevaSic. kargad unda<br />

davfiqrdeT, Tu gvinda iseTive<br />

damoukidebelni viyoT, rogorc<br />

safrangeTi, germania da<br />

sxvebi, unda vicodeT, rom es<br />

qveynebi amerikis koloniebi ar<br />

arian. am qveynebma TavianT ganviTarebas<br />

mxolod Zalian<br />

principuli, ukompromiso, xSirad<br />

sisxliani brZolis Sedegad<br />

miaRwies. Tu Cven gvinda<br />

aSS-s marTvis qveS myofi, axali<br />

tipis kolonia viyoT, sadac<br />

inglisuri saxelmwifo ena<br />

iqneba da aSS-s 51-e Stati viqnebiT,<br />

maSin ar unda gvqondes<br />

pretenzia, rom iseve vicxovrebT,<br />

rogorc germanelebi an<br />

frangebi. amerikuli koloniebi,<br />

Tanamedrove msoflioSi,<br />

esaa erayi, avRaneTi, afrikaSi<br />

uamravi damokidebuli reJimi,<br />

libia da a.S. amitom qarTulma<br />

sazogadoebam arCevani unda gaakeTos.<br />

es procesi 2012 wlis<br />

oqtomberSi ar mTavrdeba, magram<br />

iwyeba. `Tavisufali saqar-<br />

Tvelo~ qarTvel sazogadoebas<br />

swored evropul arCevans sTavazobs,<br />

raTa Tavisufali eri<br />

viyoT. arian pro-amerikuli<br />

partiebi, romlebic<br />

qarTvel xalxs eubnebian<br />

_ ar gvinda bevri<br />

fiqri, SevcvaloT<br />

saakaSvili, mis nacvlad<br />

moviyvanoT savle<br />

an pavle da sxva yvelaferi<br />

ucvlelad<br />

darCes. ra ufro misa-<br />

Rebi iqneba xalxisTvis,<br />

oqtomberSi gamoCndeba.<br />

_ anu Tu sworad<br />

gavige problema saakaSvilis<br />

Secvla ki ara qveynis<br />

amerkis koloniisgan gaTavisuflebaa?<br />

_ dRes Cven vcxovrobT 21-<br />

e saukuneSi, roca politikuri<br />

brZolis formebi Secvlilia.<br />

jer kidev me-19-e saukuneSi<br />

ilia werda, rom xmliT mosuli<br />

mteri saSiSi ar ariso. me-<br />

20 saukuneSi politikur<br />

brZolaSi spec. samsaxurebi da<br />

finansuri monopoliebi asrulebdnen<br />

gadamwyvet rols. ukve<br />

amanac dakarga aqtualoba.<br />

dRes mTavari ideologiaa _ interneti<br />

_ `Youtube~ da<br />

`Facebook~ bevrad ufro Zlier<br />

gavlenas axdens politikur<br />

procesze, vidre aSS-s yvela<br />

spec. samsaxuri erTad aRebuli.<br />

amitom Cveni mTavari amocana<br />

qarTuli sazogadoebis gamofxizlebaa,<br />

qarTuli sazogadoebrivi<br />

azris Seqmna _ ra<br />

gvsurs, rogori saxelmwifos<br />

Seqmna gvinda 21-e saukuneSi.<br />

rodesac 80-iani wlebis<br />

bolos gamsaxurdiam da kostavam<br />

erovnuli moZraoba daiwyes,<br />

isini saqarTvelos damoukideblobis,<br />

komunisturi<br />

reJimis Secvlis da ara gumbariZis<br />

gadayenebis moTxovniT<br />

gamodiodnen. warmogidgeniaT,<br />

raoden sasacilo iqneboda gamsaxurdias<br />

mTavar moTxovnad<br />

gumbariZis gadayeneba rom daeyenebina,<br />

es xom arafers Secvlida?!<br />

asea axlac, saakaSvilis<br />

gadadgoma qveynisTvis absoluturad<br />

arafers ar Secvlis.<br />

amiT, SeiZleba Sinagani<br />

boRma gavaneitralod da meti<br />

araferi. me aravisze naklebi<br />

siZulvili ar maqvs mis<br />

mimarT, elementarulad Cemi<br />

piradi bolo wlebis biografiidan<br />

gamomdinare, magram rogorc<br />

politikosma minda<br />

vTqva, rom es qveynisTvis arafers<br />

Secvlis. vimeoreb, Cven<br />

kaxa kukava:<br />

2006-Si vinc gvarbevda,<br />

2007 wels Cveni Tanamoazre gaxda,<br />

2007 wels vinc gvawiokebda,<br />

2008-Si Cveni TanamebrZoli<br />

gaxda. ra moxdeba 2012 wels da<br />

vin Semogvemateba 2011 wlidan?<br />

aSS-s marionetuli reJimis<br />

Secvla gvWirdeba. es ar aris<br />

Cemi axireba. politikuri sistema,<br />

romelic ase Zalian ar<br />

mogvwons saakaSvils ar Seuqmnia,<br />

aramed amas msoflios yvela<br />

kontinentze aSS hqmnis. is<br />

ekonomikuri siduxWire, rac<br />

saqarTveloSia, amis avtoria<br />

ara saakaSvili, aramed e.w. Tavisufali<br />

vaWrobis koncefcia,<br />

romelsac swored amerikuli<br />

institutebi qadageben. arc<br />

kulturuli faseulobebis ngreva<br />

da axalgazrdobis gadagvarebaa<br />

saakaSvilis mogonili,<br />

aramed es aris swored is, rasac<br />

aSS liberalur faseulobebs<br />

uwodebs da ase agresiulad<br />

nergavs mTels msoflio-<br />

Si. sxvaTaSoris, erTma Cemma<br />

megobarma amas liberaluri<br />

fundamentalizmi uwoda.<br />

_ ras unda niSnavdes `endi-ais~<br />

da `ai-rais~ kvlevis is<br />

Sedegebi, romlebsac es organizaciebi<br />

ulufa-ulufad awvdian<br />

sazogadoebas?<br />

_ rodesac NDI-m kvleva<br />

gamoaqveyna, romlis mixedviTac<br />

`nac. moZraoba~ eWvgareSe imarjvebs<br />

am arCevnebSi, ganacxades<br />

_ iciT, ra es ar aris amerikis<br />

mTavrobis pozicia, aramed<br />

luis navaroa cudi kacio. axla,<br />

roca `ai-raimac~ igive gamoaqveyna,<br />

eqspertebma gamoacxades<br />

_ arc `ai-rai~ gamoxatavs<br />

aSS-s mTavrobis poziciaso.<br />

aSS-Si sul ori partiaa _ demokratiuli<br />

da respublikuri.<br />

SeiZleba demokratiuli ar<br />

mogwondes da respublikuri<br />

ki, an piriqiT, magram roca<br />

arc demokratebi mogwons da<br />

arc respublikelebi da acxadeb,<br />

rom aSS Zalian mogwons,<br />

es saRi azrisgan Zalian daSorebuli,<br />

rogorc dasavleT-saqarTveloSi<br />

ityvian daCoCebulia.<br />

_ Cveni `respublikelebi~<br />

amerikidan bednierni dabrundnen,<br />

Tumca riTi _ erma ver gaigo.<br />

_`respublikelebis~ da<br />

qarTveli eris amocanebi erTmaneTisgan<br />

gansxvavdeba. amitom<br />

is, rom `respublikuri partia~<br />

raRac procesiT kmayofilia,<br />

isini amaSi gulwrfelni arian,<br />

ubralod maTi amocanebi ar em-<br />

Txveva qarTveli erisas. Tuki<br />

`respublikelebi~ parlamentSi<br />

xuTkacian fraqcias Seqmnian,<br />

es mTels maT biografiaSi ise-<br />

Tive miRweva iqneba, rogorc<br />

saqarTvelos fexburTis nakrebi<br />

msoflio Cempioni rom gaxdes.<br />

amitom, bunebrivia, isini<br />

im viTarebiT, rac axla iqmneba<br />

kmayofilni arian.<br />

amerikis mTavrobis gancxadebebi,<br />

maT Soris NDI-s kvlevebisac,<br />

ramdenjerme, winaswar<br />

gamogicxadeT. SemiZlia giTxraT,<br />

rogori iqneba, arCevnebis<br />

Semdeg meore adgilze gasuli<br />

politikuri Zalis gancxadeba<br />

_ Cven mogvpares gamarjveba,<br />

gagviyalbes xmebi, magram mTavaria<br />

mTeli msoflio Cven gvi-<br />

Wers mxars, vaCvenoT mTels<br />

msoflios civilizebulobis<br />

magaliTi da vemzadoT saprezidento<br />

arCevnebisTvis, sadac<br />

beWebze davdebT `nac. moZraobas~-o.<br />

CaiwereT es, sityvasityviT<br />

am gancxadebas moismenT<br />

arCevnebidan ramodenime<br />

dRis Semdeg.<br />

_ saakaSvili bolo dros<br />

araadekvaturia, Tumca aSS amaze<br />

ar reagirebs.<br />

_ saakaSvili aris kokainis<br />

momxmarebeli, es politikur,<br />

maT Soris amerikul wreebSi<br />

saidumlos ar warmoadgens. es<br />

informacia 2 wlis win amerikuli<br />

pirvelwyarosgan miviRe.<br />

me ar mjera, rom adamiani<br />

SeiZleba 2011 wlade ar iyos<br />

patrioti da 2011 wlis Semdgom<br />

gaxdes. es masobrivad xdeba<br />

qarTul politikaSi _ 2006<br />

wels vinc gvarbevda 2007<br />

wels Cveni Tanamoazre gaxda,<br />

2007-Si vinc gvarbevda 2008-<br />

Si Cveni Tanamoazre gaxda da<br />

a.S. es ar mjera. ar SeiZleba<br />

mogwondes 7 noemberi da aRgaSfoTos<br />

26-ma maisma.<br />

Tamar SveliZe

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