Volume 23 - San Diego Union-Tribune

IN THE SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA
FOR THE COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO
F t l " D
CIeri( of the Superior Court
JAN 1 1 2013
PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF
CALIFORNIA,
VS.
PLAINTIFF,
NICHOLAS CARL AL I OTO, GARY
ALLEN CABELLO, RAJ KUMAR CHOPRA,
JORGE DOMINGUEZ, JEFFREY
STEVEN FLORES, YOLANDA SALCIDO
JOHN MERRILL WILSON,
A.Munoz
G RAN D J U R Y
CASE NO. SCD235445
DA NO. ADH258
GRAND JURY NO. 12-09
VOLUME 23
PAGES 3531 THROUGH 3668,
INCLUSIVE
DEFENDANTS.
REPORTER'S TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
DECEMBER 13, 2012
SAN DIEGO, CALIFORN I A
APPEARANCES:
FOR THE PLAINTIFF:
BONNIE DUMANIS
DISTRICT ATTORNEY
BY: LEON H. SCHORR
BY: FREDERI C G. LUDWIG, III
DI STRICT ATTORNEYS
TIFFANY SCOTT
CERT IFIED LEGAL INTERN
330 WEST BROADWAY
SAN DIEGO, CALIFORNIA 92 101
BETTY J. ASH E, CSR NO. 4844
OFFICIAL COURT REPORTER
SAN DIEGO SUPERIOR COURT

1
2
3
ALPHABETIC)1.L INDEX OF WIT~WSSES
VOLUJ:.JE 23 - DECEr,1BER 13, 2012
PEOPLE VS. ALIOTO, ET AL.
4
5
CASE NO.
SCD235445
6
GRAND JURY
PAGE
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
RANDALL STEWART DUNCAN
"XA~lINAT ION BY MR. SCHORR 3554
VINCENT GIA=r"lE
EXAMINATION BY HR. SCHORR 3531
EXAMINATION BY MR. SCHORR 3600
JAIME OR'l'l Z
EXAl'lINAT I ON BY HR. LUDWlG 3621
BRETT RHOADES
EXArHNA'I' ION BY MR. I,UDWIG 3646
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28

1
2
3
4
CHRONOLOGICAL INDEX OF lAIIrN2SS2S
VOLUME 23 - DECEMBER 13, 2012
PEOPLE VS. ALIOTO, ET AL.
CASE NO. SCD235445
5
6
GRAND JURY
PAGE
7
8
9
10
12
13
14
VINCENT GIAH1E
EXA"II NAT ION Pj (n fl.. :5 L.h 0 ..... " 3531
Rl\NDALL STEvllmT DUNCAN
EXAt4INATION BY t1R. SCHORR 3554
VINCENT GIAIME
EX,l\MINATION BY MR. SCHORR 3600
JAIME ORTIZ
EXAMINATION BY MR. I,UDI-HG 3621
BRETT RHOADES
EXAMINATION BY MR. LUDWIG 3646
15
16
17
18
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28

1
INDEX OF MARKED
2
VOL~ME 23 - DECEMBER 13, 2012
3
PEOPLE VS. ALIOTO, ET AL.
4
CASE NO. SCD235445
5
GRAND
JURY
PAGE
6
91
QUINONES
FORM 700 MOCKUP FROM HARRIS 2007
7
92
SANDOVAL
FORM 700 ("lOCKUP FROt·j HI,RRIS 2007
8
93
GANDARA
FORN 700 (,jOCKUP 2011
3644
9
94
LOPEZ FOR[v1 700 MOCKUP 2011
3644
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28

3531
1 SAN DIEGO, CALIFORNIA; THURSDAY, DECEMBER 13, 2012; 9:14 A.M.
2 * * *
3 PRO C E E DIN G S
4 * * *
5 MR. SCHORR: GOOD MORNING, SIR. IF YOU WOULDN'T MIND TAKING
6 YOUR SEAT AGAIN.
7 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: YOU ARE REMINDED THAT YOU ARE STILL
8 UNDER OATH.
9
THE WITNESS:
YES, THANK YOU.
10 MR. SCHORR: I APPRECIATE EVERYONE MAKING THE EXTRA EFFORT
11 TO GET HERE IN THE RAIN TODAY, AND WE DO HAVE A BUNCH OF STUFF TO
12 GO THROUGH, SO WE WILL JUST GET STARTED.
13
14 VINCENT GIAIME,
15 GRAND JURY WITNESS, HAVING BEEN PREVIOUSLY, WAS EXAMINED AND
16 TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS:
17
18
EXAMINATION
19
20 MR. GIAIME: FOR THE RECORD, VINCENT GIAIME, G-I-A-I-M-E.
21 BY MR. SCHORR:
22 Q. I BELIEVE WHERE WE LEFT OFF WAS AT 40490, WHICH WAS AN
23 EMAIL ON 8/18/2008 FROM PEARL QUINONES TO EVELYN GARCIA. WE
24 TALKED ABOUT NHLI, SUBJECT REGARDING INFO TO ALTA VISTA. "WILL
25 GET YOU THE ADDRESS. THE AMOUNT IS WHATEVER I NEED TO RAISE LIKE
26 MY CLASS IS DOING ABD WHATEVER ELSE I NEED TO DONATE."
27 DO YOU RECALL GOING OVER THIS EMAIL?
28 A. YES, SIR.

3532
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
Q. WAS THAT FOUND DURING THE COORSE OF THE SEARCH
\'IARRANT S?
A. YES, SIR.
Q. I'IOVING m,I TO ,lU;GUST 22, 2008, ON 6205, WHAT IS IT
~IE 'RE LOOKING AT HERE?
A. 'I'HIS IS DR. GANDARA'S WORK CALENDAR FRor~ THE SWEETWATER
ONION HIGH SCHOOL DIS~RICT.
Q. I'N LOOKING AT THE DATE OF THE 22ND. THAT INDICATES
2:00 TO 3:00 P.M., ED, HENRY AND JAINE, AND THEN FROM 6:30 TO
9: 00, THE PHILI PPINE CINEt1A SHOWCASE; I S THAT CORRECT?
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. AND t10VING ON TO 37398, vlllAT IS :::T l'iE'RE LOOKING ,ll,T
HERE?
A. THIS IS A TICKET STOB FOR THE PADRES. 'I'HIS WAS FOUND
15 Pl;RSUANT TO A SEARCH vlARRANT IN MR. SANDOVAL'S RESIDENCE AND
16 l'r' S MR. SANDOVAL DID NOT REPORT RECEIVING THIS TICKET.
17
18
19
20
21
Q. THE TICKE'!, INDICATES ON THERE -- IT HAS SO[vJE
HANDWRITING; IS THAT CORRECT?
A. THAT'S CORRECT. IT APPEARS IT SAYS -- LOOKS LIKE
IT'S FROM GAKDARA PER COX COl'1 AND IGS.
Q. AND THAT'S FOR A SOITE -- TICKET FOR A SUITE AT THE
22 GARDEN LEVEL?
23 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
24 Q. I'!OVING ON TO 18235, WE'RE LOOKING AT THE DATE OF
25 8/29/2008. I"iHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IN TERtcS OF THE
26 DOCUI'!EN'!, ITSELF?
27 A. THIS IS DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR FROI'! THE SWEETWATER
28 UNION HIGH SCHOOL DISTRICT.

3533
1
2
3
4
5
6
Q. NOTICING THERE'S TWO DIFfERENT MEETINGS, DAN HOt4 AT RED
LOBSTER AND JAIME, HENRY AND ED AT FRIDA'S; IS TH]I.T CORREC":'?
A. THA':"S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. MOVING TO 36435, APPEARS TO BE AN El'1AIL EXCHANGE WI':'H
MS. QUINONES AND IT INDICATES, "DEAR GARY," A'l' THE BOTTOM -- TO
GARY CABELLO A'l' ALTA VISTA GOING OVER THE NHLI; IS THAT CORRECT?
7
8
A.THA'l" S CORRECT.
THIS DRAFT LET'l'ER.
PEARL QUINONES HAD EMAILED HERSELF
9
10
11
12
Q. 36436. IT CONTINUES ON AND IT IN DI CATES, DURING PART
OF IT, "THEREFORE, I'M ASKING FOR YOUR FINANCIAL SUPPORT IN THE
AMOUNT OF $1,200," INDICATING, "ONE HALF OF THIS ANOUNT IS FOR
NHLI TO CONTINUE PROVIDING THE UNIQUE EXECUTIVE LEADSRSHIP
13
DEVELOPMENT TO L]I.TINAS.
]I.ND THE OTHER HALF IS FOR SPONSORING
14
15
PART OF MY SCHOLARSHIP. THANK YOU IN ADVANCE FOR HELPING LATINA
LEADERS CONTINUE TO GROW AS VITAL CONTRIBUTORS TO THEIR
16 COMMUNITIES AND OUR COUNTRY. THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONS IDER]I.TION. "
17 AND IT GIVES HER PHONE NUMBER AND INDICATES MS. QUINONES ]I.S 2008
18 NHLI FEI,LOW; IS THAT CORRECT?
19
20
21
A.
Q.
A.
THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
18236. IS THIS ANOTHER VIEW OF DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR?
THAT'S CORRECT.
22
Q.
FUR SEPTEIvJBER ll, 2008.
DOES IT INDICATE DINNER .HTH
23 BUNTON AT OCEANAIRE SEAFOOD?
24 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
25 Q. AND PURSUANT TO -- EXCUSE ME. HOW DO WE HAVE THESE
26 CALENDARS?
27 A. ''1E RECEIVED THESE FROM -- TEE SWEETWATER UNION HIGH
28 SCHOOL DISTRICT PROVIDED THE CALENDARS TO OUR OFFICE.

3534
1 Q. OKAY. 18237. WE'RE LOOKING AT THE DATE OF
2 SEPTE~mER 22, 2008. IS THIS, AG)UN, ONE OE' THE CALENDARS FOR
3 GANDARA'!
4
A.
THAT'S CORRECT.
5
Q. IT INDICATES ON 9/22/2008, "DINNER HENRY Al-lIGABLE"
6 IT'S CUT OFF, "AT ROtv:ESCO'S AT 6: 30"; IS TH.l\T CORRECT?
7 A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
S Q. ON 6311, AND LOOKING AT THE DATE OF SEPTEMBER 29TH,
9 DOES THAT ALSO INDICATE FOR DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR A tv:EETING WITH
10 HENRY AMIGABLE AT 3:30 P.M,?
11 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
12 Q. MOVING ON TO 40454, AND THIS APPEARS TO BE AN EM.l\IL
13 FROM PE:ARL QUINONES TO YOLANDA HERNANDEZ ENTITLED "IGESIAS DE
14 MEXICO DE NOCHE."
15 MOVING ON TO 40455, p.ND START AT THE BOTTOM GOING BACK UP.
16 SO STARTING AC' THE BOTTOH HALF, IT INDICATES FRet'l PEARL QUINONES
17 TO YOLANDA HE:RNANDEZ. "HI, YOLAND.lI. ~lHAT HAPPENE:D WITH THE
18 FUNDRAISER?" RESPONSE:, "THE HAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE~ THAT I HAVE
19 BEE:N ASKED" -- "THAT I HAVE BEEN ASK SAID THAT THEY WILL NOT
20 AC'TEND. THEY TOLD ME IE' YOU HAVE ENVELOPES IT WILL BE BETTER FOR
21 THE14." AND GOING ON -- CONTINUING ON IN SPANISH.
22 GRAND JUROR NO. 17: OH, GO AHEAD.
23 BY Jv:R. SCHORR:
24 Q. MOVING UP, RESPONSE, "YES, I KNOV1, BUT GOD FORBID, WHEN
25 THEY WANT S014ETHING FR014 YOU OR THEY NEED SOMETHING, THEY THINK
26 THAT ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS FEED YOU LIKE IF WE ARE STARVING. SO
27 THEN C.l\N YOU PLEASE: GIVE THEM ENVELOPES .l\ND NO ONE, JUAN COCINA
28 OR MR. PAUL, HAS GIVEN ME HONEY.

3535
1 I HEARD THAT GILBANE -- HENRY ~JAS TOLD NOT TO GIVE t'lE t~ONEY.
2 HE PROMISED t'lE A $20,000 FUNDRAISER LIKE ':HE ONE HE PUT TOGE':HER
3 FOR ARLIE AND THEN THREE DAYS BEFORE THE EVENT HE CALLED AND TOLD
4 ME HE WAS BROKE AND ALL THE PEOPLE HE KNEW WAS BROKE AND COULDN'T
5 HEL P ME. I DON'T REt1EMBER I F I TOLD YOU BEFORE, BUT I STILL
6 CAN'T BELIEVE HE DID THAT.
7 THEN I HEARD THAT ALL THE MONEY OUT THERE IS GOING TO
8 BERTHA'S CAMPAIGN BECAUSE THEY REALLY WANT JAIME OFF THE BOARD.
9 I ALSO HEARD THAT G. RODRIGUEZ viAS GETTING MONEY. I DON' '1' KNOW
10 ABOUT THAT BUT YOU KNOW HOW IT IS. AT THE LAST FUNDRAISER I
11 SPENT ALSO MORE" -- THREE OR FOUR DOLLAR SIGNS. "SO I KNOW HOltl
12 IT IS, BUT ALSO I\NDREA -- EVERY TIME I SEE HER SHE S.ZI.YS TO GIVE
13 HER AN ENVELOPE AND I NEVER RECEIVE ONE FRO!'l HER EITHER. BUT,
14 YES,!'lY DEAR, I I'IOULD APPRECIATE YOUR HELP, IIJHICH, BY THE WAY,"
15 AND IT CONTINUANCE ON.
16 !'lOVING ON TO 40456, 'l'HAT'S THE REST OF THAT EMAIL. SO BACK
17 AT 40454. I'M SORRY, 40455. HOW IS IT THAT ,"E'RE LOOKING AT
18 THIS EMAIL EXCHANGE BET\"IEEN MS. HERNANDEZ AND MS. QUINONES?
19
20
1',. THIS ~iAS OBTAINE) PURSUANT TO THE SEARCH II/ARRANTS.
Q. 55925. THIS APPEARS TO BE AN EMAIL FROM GARY CABELLO
21 TO LINDSEY ~1ARKS ON 9/28/2008. INDICATING, "LINDSEY, HERE IS
22 11HAT YOU WROTE. GARY, CAN YOU MAIL THE CHECK OF $500 TO MY HOUSE
23 AT 3706 CIEN"~GA DRIVE, BONITA, CALIFORNIA. THE NAME OF THE
24 ORGANIZATION IS t

3536
1 Q. 44568. AND IS THAT ANOTHER VERSION OF THAT SAME EMAIL
2 WHERE IT HAS A HANDWRITTEN -- WHERE IT INDICATES DONATION?
3
4
5
6
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
06311. WHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT?
AGAIN, THIS IS DR. GANDARA'S SCHOOL DISTRICT CALENDAR.
LOOKING AT OCTOBER 3RD, FROM 12:00 TO 1:30, DOES IT
7 INDICATE JOSE MIRELES AND GREG SANDOVAL?
8
A.
THAT'S CORRECT.
9
Q.
WHY
DON'T WE CONTINUE WITH 18238 TO FIRM THAT UP.
10 AGAIN, THAT'S FOR ANOTHER VERSION OF THE SAME CALENDAR FOR
11 OCTOBER 3RD, WHERE IT ALSO INDICATES JOSE MIRELES AT THE BUTCHER
12 SHOP; IS THAT CORRECT?
13
14
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
MOVING ON 37274, WHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT HERE?
15
A.
THIS IS MR.
SANDOVAL'S DAY PLANNER, HIS CALENDAR.
16
Q.
ON THAT DATE AT 7:00 P.M. FOR OCTOBER 9TH, DOES IT
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
INDICATE WITH HENRY?
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. AND MOVING ON TO APPROXIMATELY OCTOBER 30TH TIME FRAME,
2008, WE'RE LOOKING AT 44030. AND FOR OCTOBER 30TH WHAT IS IT
THAT WE'RE LOOK ON 44030?
A. I BELIEVE THAT'S ALSO -- THIS IS AN EXPENSE REPORT FROM
ALTA VISTA FINANCIAL FOR GARY CABELLO.
Q. DOES IT INDICATE FLEMING'S, SOUTHWESTERN COLLEGE IN THE
AMOUNT $1,111.52?
26
27
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
AND THE SAME DATE ON 37274, LOOKING AT OCTOBER 30TH FOR
28 GREG SANDOVAL'S CALENDAR. WHAT DOES THAT INDICATE?

3537
1 A. 12:00 P.M., FLEMING'S, AND THEN IT SAYS 7:00 P.M.
2 CABELLO AND DON AT FLENING' S . I ASSm·1E THAT'S AT THE SAME TIME
3 FRA:'1E.
4 Q. OKAY. SO IT LOOKS LlKE, IF 1'1'1 REA;:)ING IT CORRECTLY,
5 12: 00 P. t1. -- THE NEXT 12: 00 UP TO THE RIGHT SAYS WITH OR HAS A
6 SOMETHING SLASH NH.
7 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
8 Q. THE WRITING CONTINUES AND THERE'S A 7: 00 P .1'1. CP TO
9 THE RIGHT OF' THAT IS FLEMING'S AND THEN UNUER THAT IS CABELLO AND
10 DON. AN I REAUING THAT CORRECTLY?
11 A. YES, SIR.
12 Q. THAT'S THE SA:'1E DATE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WITH THAT ALTA
13 VISTA, F'LEtJfING'S, $1,100 DINNER; IS THAT CORRECT, SIR?
14 A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
15 Q. LOOKING AT -- FOR NOVEMBER 5TH, 2008, WE'RE LOOKING AT
16 37276. AND WHAT IS IT WE'RE LOOKING HERE?
17 A. AGAIN, THIS IS MR. SANDOVAL'S DAY PLANNER, CALENDAR FOR
18 THAT DATE, NOVEMBER 5TH, 2008, AND IT INDICATES 11:30 JAIME, FISH
19 MARKET -- AT THE FISH ~mRKET.
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
Q. WE'LL GO TO NOVEl·JEER 24, 2008. LOOKING AT 18242, IS
THIS ANOTHER CALENDAR?
A. F'OR SWEETWATER -- DR. G},NDhRA hT THE SWEETWATER UNION
HIGH SCHOOL DISTRICT CALENDi'.R.
Q. FOR THAT DATE ON 11/24/2008, DOES THAT INDICATE GARY
CABELLO AND MIKE 0., FRUIT BARR CAFFE?
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. MOVING ON TO 18243 AND THE DATE OF DECEMBER 3RD, 2008,
IS THIS DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR?

3538
1
2
3
A.
Q.
A.
THAT'S CORRECT.
INDICATING SGI DINNER AT CANDELA'S?
THAT'S CORRECT.
4
Q. AND LOOKING AT 37278, IS THIS AGAIN GREG SANDOVAL'S
5 CALENDAR?
6
7
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
FOR DECEMBER 3RD, IS THAT ALSO OR DOES THAT LIST
8 SEVILLE
9
10
11
12
13
A. SEVILLE DINNER.
Q. ON 57165, WITH MS. QUINONES'S CALENDAR FOR
DECPIBER 3RD, AND I'M LOOKING AT THE MI DOLE FOR DECEMBER 3RD,
~lS. QUINONES'S CALENDA?. I DON'T KNOW :;:F YOU CAN ~1AKE IT OUT.
A. LOOKS LIKE THE CSBA.
14
Q.
IT'S ON
HER PHONE CALENDAR?
15
A.
YES.
16 Q. FOR THE SORRY. I'LL MOVE ON TO 43750 FOR THE DATE
17 OF DECEMBER 3RD, 2008, AND THIS IS ALTA VISTA PAGINATION FOR --
18 IT SAYS CANDEL, BUT AN AMERICAN EXPRESS REPORT. IS THAT
19 CANDELA'S FOR THE AMOUNT OF $257?
20 A. TH.I\T' S CORRECT.
21 Q. NO. 43745 WITH THE SAME DATE OF DECEMBER 3RD, THE
22 EXPENSE REPORT FOR MR. CABELLO. DOES THAT INDICATE CALIFORNIA
23 SCHOOL BO.I\RD CONFERENCE AT CANDELA'S, 8257, AND THEN AT ?ED PEl',RL
24 KITCHEN FOR $309?
25 A. AND SO.68, YES, SIR.
26 Q. THANK YOU. WE'LL LOOK AT 57165. THESE ARE DIFFICULT
27 TO LOOK AT. WE'LL LOOK A'I' THE DECEMBER 4TH DATE. AGAIN, IS THIS
28 Jll:S. QUINONES'S PHONE CALEND1,R?

3 9
1
2
A.
Q.
YES, THAT'S CORRECT.
DOES IT INDICA'],E FOR DECEMBER 4TH, CSBA, AS WELL AS
3 ELVIRA?
4
IL
THAT'S CORRECT.
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
Q. DECEMBER 5TH FOR 37278, AGAIN MR. SANDOVAL'S CALENDAR.
DOES THAT INDICATE CABELLO?
A. THAT'S CORRECT.
Q. WHILE ,'IE' RE THERE, ,'IE' LL GO TO DECE~lBER 6TH. DOES THAT
INDICATE HENRY?
A. THA,[" S CORRECT.
Q. FOR DECEM3ER 6Til DATED, HENRY, DOES THAT COORDIKATE
12
13
~HTH
AKYTilING ELSE THAT YOU HAVE?
A. YES. IT'S AN EXPENSE REPORT THAT WAS SUBMITTED BY
14
15
16
. 7
MR. AMIGABLE FOR A DINNER AT BACI' S RESTAURANT WI'l'H SWEETWATER,
DR. GANDARA AND ,JENNIE, GREG SANDOVAL AND IMELDA, BERTHA LOPEZ
AND JUAN, AND HEKRY AND AKGELA AMIGABLE.
Q. MOVn;G TO 37278, THE DATE 0;;' DSCEIYlBER 16TH, IS TillS
8 MR. SAN DOVl',L 'S CALENDAR?
19
20
21
A.
Q.
A.
THAT'S CORRECT.
DOES THAT INDICATE NORMA HERNANDEZ A'!' 6: 00 P.JVl.?
IT INDICATES NOR~lA H.
22
Q.
THANK YOU.
AND l·l0VING ON TO 37278, DECEMBER 28TH, THE
23 SAME CALENDAR, ARE YOU ABLE TO 11AKE OUT' _"HAT THAT SAYS?
24 A. I BELIEVE AT 5: 15 P.M. AND THAT'S CHARGERS GA11E.
25 Q. OKAY. INDICATING 11519 FOR PRO AMERICA CREDIT CARD
26 SERVICES, ,JAIME ORTIZ, THE DATE 0;;' 12/31. THAT SAYS STUBHUB
27 RECEIPT IN TIlE AMOUNT OF $1,717?
28 A. AND $0.80, YES, SIR.

35~0
1 Q. THANK YOU. 57166, AND FOR MS. QUINONES'S PHONE
2 CALENDAR FOR DECEMBER 31ST. AND I DON' 'I' KNOW IF YOU CAN MAKE
3 THAT OUT.
4 A. IT'S PARTY GARY, TINA AND I BELIEVE THAT'S ROSARIO AND
5 PARKER.
6 Q. 41236, WHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT HERE?
7 p'" 'rHIS IS - ARE vl-2 FORt'1S FOR PEARL QUINmms FRot>l THE
8 SWEETWATER UNION HIGH SCHOOL DISTRICT AND IT'S THE W-2' S ['OR THE
9 YEAR 2008.
10
11
12
13
14
Q. INDICA'l'ING THAT SHE GOT PAID WAGE, TIPS OR OTHER
COMPENSATION IN SECTION 1 OF THE W-2. $10,4247
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. 11519, AGAIN, IS THIS MR. ORTIZ FOR JANUARY 4TH DATE --
MR. ORTIZ'S CREDIT CARD. AND WHAT ARE ~JE LOOKING AT?
15
.D;.
THIS IS FOR QUALCOMM PARK cm,CESSIONS, SAN DIEGO, E'OR A
16
17
18
19
20
21
COS'l' OF $51.
Q. ON 6415, LOOKING AT JANUARY 6TH, IS THIS ANOTHER
VERSION OF THE SWEETWATER UNION HIGH SCHOOL DISTRICT CA1JENDAR FOR
JESUS GANDAR-I',?
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. AND LISTING 4:00 TO 5:00 P.M. BERTHA L6PEZ?
22
A.
THAT'S CORRECT.
23
Q.
MID 57166, AGAIN JANUARY 9TH, MS.
QUINONES'S CALENDAR?
2~
25
26
27
28
A. YEAH, THAT INDICATES NECA DINNER.
Q. 37280 FOR JANUARY 11TH, I'I' INDICATES THIS IS GREG
SANDOVAL'S CALENDAR AGAIN. IS THAT AN INDICATION Of 1:15
CHARGERS AT HENRY'S?
A. THA';"S CORRECT, THAT'S JANUARY :1, 2009.

3541
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
Q. 37280 IS THE CALENDAR FOR THE DATE OF THE 21ST OF
JANUARY. CAN YOU ~ll'.KE OUT WHAT THAT SAYS FOR 6:00 P.M.?
A. 6:CO P.t~., BONNY, R}I.INWATER'S, AND I BELIEVE 'I'BAT'S
WITH GANDARA, JESUS. AND I'M MAKING THE ASSUMPTION THAT THAT
SAYS GANDARA. I'M SORRY. IT SAYS JESUS.
Q. OKAY. BUT YOU CAN CLEARLY MAKE OUT 6:0C P.M. BONNY AT
RAINW1'.TER' S?
8
9
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT.
AND YOUR ESTIMATION IS THAT IT SAYS JESUS; IS THAT
10 CORRECT?
11
12
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT.
WE'LL GO ON JUST A LITTLE BIT.
13
A.
YEAH,
IT JUST INDICATES RAINWATER S.D. WITH JESUS.
14
Q.
OKAY.
FOR JANUARY 21ST?
15
16
A.
Q.
TBi'.'!' 'S CORREC'I'.
MOVING ON TO 18246 FOR THE SAME DATE, JANUARY 21, 2009,
17 LOOKING A'r DR. Gl"NDARA' S CALENDAR, DOES THAT INDICATE MIKE NAJER.ZI,
18 AND GREG SA AND RAINWATER'S, 7:00 P.M.?
19 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
20 Q. 18247, LOOKING AT THE Di'.TE OF FEBRUARY 3RD, 2009. IS
21 TIiIS DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR AGAIN?
22
23
A.
Q.
'I'HAT' S CORRECT.
AND FOR 'I'HAT DATE YOU SEE A LUNCH WITH JAIME ORTIZ?
24
25
A. THAT'S CORRECT, AT 11:30, ONE HOUR 30 MINUTES.
Q. AT 11521, LOOKING .ZI,T JAniE ORTIZ'S CREDIT CARD
26
STATErJENT FOR THAT SAME [)i\Y, WE SEE FEBRUARY 3RD
LET'S DO THE
27
28
WHOLE FEBRUARY 3RD, PLEASE. LOUIE & MICKEY'S FOR $42?
A. YES, FOR THE AMOUNT OF $42.93.

3542
1
2
Q.
A.
57254, AME:>lDED FORM 700 5'~ON BER'I'HA LOPEZ?
THAT'S CORRECT.
3
Q.
FOR 4/2/2012 FOR THE YEAR OF 2009.
IF WE LOOK AT
4 FEBRUARY 6, 2009, IT tcARKS DOWN $60, CV CHAtcBER GALA; IS THAT
5 CORRECT?
6
7
8
THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. Ii/E'LL GO TO 57167. IT'S A FEBRUARY 6TH DATE.
SEE WHAT'S WRITTEN ON NS. QUINONES'S CALENDAR?
DO YOU
9
10
A.
Q.
CV CHAMBER.
18250 FOR MARCH 4TH, 2009, WE'RE LOOKING AT
11 DR. GAN DARA 's c.z\LEN DAR?
12 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
13 Q. FOR THE DATE OF NARCH 4TH, DOES IT INDICATE GARY
14 CABELLO, SOUTH BAY FISH & GRILL, AS "JELL AS BERTHA LOPEZ, SOUTH
IS
BAY FISH & GRILL?
16
17
A.
Q.
YES, SIR.
1'1' INDICATE:S GARY CABELLO FOR 5: 30 FOR 30 MINu'n;s AND
18 THEK BERTHA LOPEZ AT 6:00 FOR AN HOUR AND A HALF; IS THAT
19 CORRECT?
20
A.
THAT'S CORRECT,
SIR.
2I
Q.
18251, AND IF WE CAN GO TO NARCH 12TH, 2009, DOES THAT
22 INDICATE LUNCH, HENRY ANIGABLE?
23 A. IT'S HE)lRY, A-N-I-G-A, ~]EET HERE )\T :2, ONE HOUR AND
24 30 NINUTES.
25 Q. AND lilE'LL LOOK AT 646 -- 0646, E'OR THAT -- THE SANE
26 DAY.:::S THAT HSKRY ANIGABLE' S EXPSKSE REPORT FOR LUNCH ~lITH
27 DR. GANDARA OF SWSSTWATER, \~EEK ENDING 3/15, BUT THE DATE BEIKG
28 0)1 A 'fHURSDlIY FOR THE ANOUNT OF $46.257

3543
1 A. YES. IT'S HIS GILBANE EXPENSE REPORT FOR HENRY
2 AMIGABLE FOR THE ~IEEK ENDING OF 3/15. AND THIS WAS A THURSDAY OF
3 THAT WEEK FOR LUNCH WITH DR. GANDARA.
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
Q. IS THIS AN EXA:,lPLE OF l'mAT YOU DO IN TERMS OF -- WHEN
I':vI READING OUT THESE DIF'F'ERE:.JT DATES AND CALENDAR ENTRIES AND
EVERYTHI:.JG ELSE, WHAT IS YOUR UNDERSTA~D=NG OF THE SIGNIFICA:.JCE
OF THE DATES THAT WE'RE GOING OVER?
A. PRI~~RILY, I REVIEWED THE EXPENSE REPORTS FROM VARIOUS
VENDORS TO INCLUDE MR. AMIGABLE'S, SGI, ALSO FROM SEVILLE
CONSTRUCTION SERVICES, SCS, AND I WOULD CHECK VARIOUS CALENDARS
AND ANY OTHER DOCut>1ENTATION TO VERIFY THEIR ATTENDANCE OR LISTING
OF HAVING IT ON THEIR CALENDAR TO A'1"l'E:.JD OR PREPARING FOR THAT
TO EVEN f..jAKE THAT APPOI:.JTfJlENT.
Q. SO YOU WOULD CROSS-REFERENCE THE EXPENDITURES THAT WERE
15
LISTED OR THAT YOU HAD KNOWN ABOUT IN SOME "lAY ~IITH
THE
16
17
18
19
20
21
CALENDARS, THE PHONE CALENDARS, THE SCHOOL CALENDARS AS WELL AS
THE FORtVI 700' S, BOTH ORIGINAL AND AMENDED?
A. THAT'S CORRECT, AND ALSO EMAILS, IF THERE'S ANY EMAILS
OR ANYTHING ELSE, TO CONFIRM THEIR ATTENDANCE OR PUTTING IT ON
THEIR APPOINTMENT CALENDARS.
Q. LOOK AT 56004. IT'S AN EMAIL FROt'l 2009, CCB ELECTRONIC
22 DOCU~lENTS FRO"l GREG SANDOVAL TO GARY CA,BE:"LO, FOR INSTANCE,
23 IN::lICATING, "GARY, I'M SENDING YOU TH=S INF'ORMATIO:.J REGARDING ':'HE
24 SOUTHWESTERN COLLEGE CESAR CHAVEZ SCHOLARSHIP BREAKFAST EVENT.
25 I'M HOPING YOU CAN BE A VIP PLATINUM SPONSOR OF A $1,000, P:"EASE
2 6 LET ME K:.JOW. THANKS, GREG."
27 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
28 Q. 18251 FOR THE DATE OF l-lARCH 17, 2009, DOES THAT

3544
1 INDICATE A LUNCH, JAIME ORTIZ?
2 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
3 Q. IS THAT DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR?
4 A. YES, IT IS FROM THE SlQEETl1A'!'ER UNION HIGH SCHOOL
5 DISTRICT.
6 Q. 18045. IS THIS AN EMAIL THAT WAS FOUND PURSUANT TO
7 SEARCH WARRANTS? INDICATING IT HAS AN INVITE, PDF, ENTITLED
8 "BERTHA LOPEZ. GOOD AFTERNOON, ON BEHALF OF YURI CALDER()N,
9 PLEASE ACCEPT THIS INVITATION FOR A SPECIAL RECEPTION EVENT TO
10 RETIRE THE CAMPAIGN DEBT OF BERTHA LOPEZ, SI'IEE'I'WATER UNION HIGH
11 SCHOOL DISTR:CT. THIS VE,RY SPECIAL EVENT lULL BE HELD AT ~HE
12 HOt'JE OF YURI AND ELVIA CALDERON."
13 IS THAT PAR'!' OF THE EMAIL?
l4
15
16 AT?
A.
Q.
YES, SIR.
MOVING FORWARD TO 37437, WHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE LOOKING
17 A. AGAIN, THIS IS A T:CKET STUB FOR THE LOS ANGELES LAKERS
18 BASKETBALL GAME, AND IT viAS FOUND PURSUANT TO A SEARCH vlARRANT IN
19 MR. SANDOVAL'S RESIDENCE. IT'S ANNOTATED WITH HECTOR CASTILLO.
20 Q. AND DID YOU CROSS-REFERENCE THAT TO SEE WHETHER OR NOT
21 1'1' WAS ON HIS - MR. SANDOVAL' S FORM 700?
22
23
A.
Q.
I HAVE TO CHECK THE DA'::'E ON t1Y REPORT.
F YOU LOOK AT 8/4/2009 --
24
A.
YES, AND MR.
SANDOVAL DID NOT REPORT THIS IN HIS FORI1
25 700.
26
27
Q.
IL
37200, AND \~HAT IS IT THAT WE' RE LOOKING AT?
THIS IS, AGAIN, A TICKET STUB FOR THE PADRES VERSUS THE
28 LOS .n.NGELES DODGERS AT PE?CO Ln.RK. IT'S DATED APRIL 6, 2009.

3545
1 Q. WITH THAT DATE DID MR. SANDOVAL REPORT RECEIVING A
2 PADRES BASEBALL -- ONE PADRES BASEBALL TICKET IN THE AMOUNT OF
3 $52?
4 A. THAT'S CORRECT, BUT I BELIEVE DURING THE SEARCH WARRANT
5 TWO TICKET STUBS WERE FOUND AND SO MR. SANDOVAL UNDERREPORTED; HE
6 JUST REPORTED ONLY RECEIVING ONE TICKET VERSUS TWO.
7 Q. 06863 -- AND, ACTUALLY, DO YOU KNOW WHAT THIS IS THAT
8 WE'RE LOOKING AT?
9 A. YES. THIS IS DR. GANDARA'S RECEIPT THAT HE SUBMITTED
10 TO THE SCHOOL DISTRICT IN USE OF THE SCHOOL DISTRICT CREDIT CARD
11 FOR AN EXPENSE.
12
Q. IN TERMS OF THE SCHOOL DISTRICT CREDIT CARD, WAS
13
DR. GANDARA -- DO
YOU HAVE KNOWLEDGE WHETHER OR NOT HE WAS GIVEN
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
A SCHOOL DISTRICT CREDIT CARD?
A. YES, I BELIEVE HE WAS.
Q. AND DID YOU IN THE COURSE OF YOUR INVESTIGATING GO
THROUGH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT CREDIT CARD AND COMPARE IT WITH
CALENDARS FOR DR. GANDARA AS WELL AS THE BOARD MEMBERS?
A. YES, I DID.
Q. AS FAR AS YOUR UNDERSTANDING OF THE ALLOWABLE USAGE FOR
DR. GANDARA'S CREDIT CARD PER THE DISTRICT'S POLICY, WAS HE
ALLOWED TO TAKE BOARD MEMBERS AS WELL AS OTHER INDIVIDUALS FROM
THE DISTRICT OUT TO MEALS IF THEY WERE DISCUSSING SOME KINDS OF
24 BUSINESS?
25 A. THERE WAS NOTHING IN WRITING TO RESTRICT HIM FROM DOING
26 THAT. SO, IN ESSENCE, IN REVIEWING THE BOARD'S AUTHORIZATION OF
27 THE CREDIT CARD, THERE'S NOTHING THAT RESTRICTED HIM TO TAKE THE
28 BOARD MEMBERS OUT TO DINNERS OR LUNCHES OR THINGS OF THIS NATURE.

3546
1 Q. AND IN REVIE\'lING THE RECEIPTS, THE CPEDIT CARD
2 PEI1'lBURSEMENTS AND PECEIPTS, DID HE OFTEN DO THAT, TAKE HIS BOAPD
3 t'lEMBERS OUT TO DISCUSS THE AGENDAS OR BOAPD t'lEETINGS OR WHATEVEP
4 ELSE \'lAS NOTED ON THE CALENDAPS?
5 A. YES, SIP.
6 Q. AND IN TERt-1S OF OUR INVESTIGATION, DID YOU INCLUDE THAT
7 IN TERr--1S OF EXPENSES CHp.PGED AGAINST OP REPOPT1\BLE EXPENSES F'OP
8 THE BOARD MEMBERS?
9 A. NO, I DID NOT. PRIMAPILY, IT WAS BROUGHT TO OUR A
10 ATTENTION -- IT WAS AN ACCUSATION -- AN ALLEGATION MADE BY ONE OF'
11 THE BOp.RD t-1EMBERS. IT I~AS AN ABUSE OF' THE CREDIT CAPD, THE
12 SCHOOL DISTRICT CREDIT CAPO.
13 SO AS A RESULT OF THAT I TOOK A LOOK AT ALL THE PECEIPTS AND
14 ALSO THE EXPENDITURES F'ROM THE CPEDIT CAPD, F'POM THE COMPANY
15 ITSELF, TO MAKE A DETER~nNATION IF THEPE \'lAS ANY POTENTIAL F'PAUD
16 OR ABUSE OF' THAT CREDIT CARD AND I DID NOT F'IND ANYTHING T~~T
17 \'lOULD BE THAT WOULD CONTPADICT HIS AU'l'HOPIZATION AND USE OF
18 THAT CPEDIT CAPO BY THE SCHOOL BOAPD.
19 Q. THANK YOU. 56012, WHAT IS IT THM' WE'PE LOOKING AT
20 HEPE?
21 A. AGAIN, THIS IS AN Et-1AI::" FROM MR. GPO:G SANDOVAL TO GAPY
22 CABELLO.
23 Q. DOES IT INDICATE "GARY, HERE'S INFOPMATION PEGARDING
24 THIS EVENT. I WENT TO A MEETING THIS AFTEPNOON AND I DIDN'T SEE
25 YOUP COMPANY ON THE LIST. THANKS," REFEPPING TO THE MARIACHI
26 GALA INVITAT ION PDF?
27 A. YES, THE 2009 MARIACHI INVl1'ATION.
28 Q. LOOKING AT 39316, DOES THA'!' INDICATE JOE COTO,

3547
1 4/21/2009?
2 A. YES.
3 Q. AND 110VING ON TO 41478, AND, AGAIN, DOES IT INDICATE AN
4 APPOINTMENT, SUBJECT JOE COTO, FROM PEARL QUINONES, 4/21/2009?
5 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
6 Q. AND ON THE BOTTOM PART Of THAT DOES IT INDICATE SENDER
7 NAtJfE PEARL QUINONES, SENDER EMAIL PEARLQUINONES@COX.NET?
8 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
9 Q. 57254, IS THIS BERTHA LOPEZ'S Al-'IENDED 2009 FORM 700,
10 AMENDED ON 4/2/2012?
11
12
13
14
15
A.
Q.
DINNER?
A.
Q.
YES, SIR.
FOR APRIL 23RD, 2009, DOES IT INDICATE $75, C1-'IAA ]\~Wl\RDS
YES, THAT'S CORRECT.
FOR MAY 1ST, DOES THAT :::NDICATE A MARIACHI SCHOLARSHIP
16
17
18
FOUNDATION GALA DINNER IN THE l'.MOUNT OF $61. 62?
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. IF WE CAN LOOK AT 1246, THIS E;MAIL AT THE BOTTOM FROM
19
JEFF FLORES TO t·JR. JOHANN RUPARATNE,
"WONDER I'IHO IS TALKING SHIT f
20
THOUGH.
THE STAFF DOWN THERE, THEY PROBABLY THINK WE'RE GOING TO
21
GO AFTER S~IEETWATER.
HENRY IS HOSTING THE FIGHT TONIGHT AT HIS
22 ITALIAN PLACE FOR GREG AND ARLIE. I'M PAYING FOR ='1' TOO. I TOLD
23 HIM 'I'HEY ARE NOT MY CLIENTS. BUT HE SAID, 'YEAH, BUT THEY ARE
24 GOING TO HELP US ~lIl'H SOU'rH\~ESTERN' SO I SAID OKAY. viE WANT '1'0
25 KEEP GREG CLOSE."
26 AND THEN MOVING UP IN THE EMiHL, INDICATING, "WE SHOULD GO
27 DOWN. I'M SURE IT JAIME'S STUPID ASS, HE NEEDS TO KNOW HIS ROLE
28 AND STAY IN L:::NE BEFORE HE DIGS HIMSELF IN A HOLE HE CAN'T GET

3548
1 II OUT OF." AND THAT'S EMAIL BACK AND FORTH BETWEEN MR. FLORES AND
2·· t~R. RGPARATNE.
3 IL 'I'HA'r'S CORREC'l'.
4 Q. AN 0 AS IT RELATES TO THAT DATE, WERE YOG ABLE TO SEE
5 ,,,HETHER OR NOT THERE ,,,AS A DINNER THA'I' WAS AN EXPENDITGRE FOR
6 ~IR. AMIGABLE?
7 A. YES. MR. AMIGABLE CONFIRMED THE DINNER AND I'IATCHING
8 THE FIGHT AT THE RESTAURANT. HOWEVER, HE SAID HE HOSTED BOTH
9 GANDARA AND S,n.NDOVAL, BUT NOT ARL::E RICASA.
10 Q. SO MR. AMIGABLE INDICATED THAT ARLIE RICASA ,,,AS NO'!' IN
11 ATTENDANCE FOR THAT MEAL; IS THAT CORRECT?
12 A. THA'~" S CORRE:c'r.
13 Q. THANK YOU. 18256 FROI'l MARCH 5TH, 2009 -- MAY 5TH,
14 2009, DOES THAT INDICATE DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR, SGI/GlLBANE, THE
15 5TH Of' MAY, FRIDl\.· S?
16 A. THAT' S CORRECT, AT 5: 15, FOR nlo HOURS l\'ND 45 r'l:NUTES.
17 Q. 56028 AND 56029. THIS IS AN EMAIL l"ROM SI,NDOVAL TO
18 GARY CABELLO ON 5/20/2009, INDICATING, "FYI, IMELDl\ I'Il\NTED ME TO
19 SHARE THIS INFORMATION WITH YOU. SHE IS HOPING YOG CAN HELP,
20 THANKS." INDICATING THE INVITE FLYER ATTACHED. AND GOING BACK
21 TO 56028, IS TH.''.T A COPY OF THE FLYER FOR THE AUGUSTINIAN
22 SCHOLARSHIP FUND?
23 A. YES, SIR.
24 Q. AND GO TO 1292, IS THIS AN EMAIL FROM JEFF FLORE:S ON
25 5/20/2009 TO JOHN WILSON WITH CC TO HENRY .Zl.~EGAB;"E. "JOHN, JUST
26 WANT TO THANK YOU FOR TAKING THE TIME TO MEET I'ilTH HENRY AN;)
27 MYSELF YESTERDAY. IT ONLY TOOK FIVE YEARS, BUT I'M GLAD WE
28 FINALLY HAD A CHANCE TO t1EET. WE LOOK FORWARD TO RESPONDING TO

:1 THE RFP PROCESS AND WE ARE HERE TO HELP WITH YOUR PROGRAi'1 NEEDS,
2 PRO BONO, OF COURSE, IN THE INTERIM. I'N VERY HAPPY HENRY IS
3 PART OF OUR TEAM NOW IN SAN DIEGO AND WE WILL ASSIST YOU IN ANY
4 WAY WE CAN. WE KNOW YOU HAVE A LOT ON YOUR PLATE. AS DISCUSSED,
5 ATTACHED ARE A FEW RFP'S THAT OTHER DISTRICTS HAVE ISSUED
6 RECENTLY. SONE ARE K-12 DISTRICTS. HOWEVER, PM SCOPE IS USUALLY
7 SIi'1ILAR. LOOK FORWARD TO SSEING YOU SOON. REGARDS, JEFF."
8 HOW DO WS IIlWE T:-IIS E~1AIL?
9 A. AGAIN, THIS WAS OBTAINED PURSUANT TO A SEARCH WARRANT.
10 t1R. FLORES'S IS E-MAILING JOHN WILSON PRIOR IN DISCUSSIONS OF T:-IE
11 RFP T:-IAT WAS GOING TO BE GOING OUT ON PROPOSITION R, WHICH WAS A
12 BOND FUND FOR THE SOUTHWESTERN COi'1i'1UNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT.
13 Q. 56032. THIS IS Ei'1AIL AGAIN, GREG SANDOVAL TO GARY
14 5/28. IT INDICATES, "REi'1INDER AS WE SPOKE TODAY.
15 THANKS." WITH THE STILL ATTACHi'1SNT ABOUT THE INVITE FLYSR PER
16 IMELDA. IS THAT CORRECT?
17 A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
18 Q. MOVING ON TO 11574, ,,/HAT IS IT THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT
19 FOR JULY 10, 2009'1
20 A. THIS IS FRO~l THE NATIONAL YOUTH LEA;)ERSHIP emiFERENCE
21 AND IT'S AN ENROLLi'1ENT CONFIRi'1A'],ION FOR MS. NATALIE BAGAPORO AND
22 IT WAS BEING PAID FOR BY FLORES AND FROM SGr FOR A TOTAL
23 Ai'10UNT OF $1,779.
24 Q. WHO IS i'1S. NATALIE BAGAPORO?
25
26
27
28
A. SHE IS THE DAUGHTER OF ARLIE RICASA AND ED BAGAPORO.
Q. 11575. WHAT IS IT WE'RE LOOKING AT HERE?
A. THIS IS THE ACCOUNT PAYABLE VOUCHER FOR SGI COClCERNING
THIS NATIO"'AL YOUNG LEADERSHIP STATE CONFERENCE AN;) ITS

3550
1 SPONSORSHIP FOR NATALIE BAGAPORO AND IN THE AMOUNT LISTED ON THE
2 VOUCHER IS $1,800.
3 Q. OKAY. 37440. MOVING ON TO WHAT APPEARS TO BE A TICKET
4
5
6
7
WITH FOR IL DIVO INDICATING WITH HENRY, FACE VALUE $129 PLUS
THE $13 SERVICE CHARGE, APPROXIMATELY.
DO YOU RECALL WHERE THESE WERE FOUND?
A. AGAIN, THIS WAS OBTAINED PURSUANT TO A SEARCH WARRANT
8 AT MR. SANDOVAL'S RESIDENCE.
9 Q. 37439, FOR JULY 19, 2009. WHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE
10 LOOKING AT HERE?
11 A. AGAIN, THIS IS A TICKET RECEIPT FROM TICKETMASTER THAT
12 WAS OBTAINED PURSUANT TO A SEARCH WARRANT AT MR. SANDOVAL'S
13 RESIDENCE. AND THIS WAS A TICKET THAT WAS OR IS A RECEIPT THAT
14
WAS OBTAINED BY MR.
JAIME ORTIZ FOR THIS JOAN SEBASTIAN CONCERT.
15
16
Q. INDICATING PURCHASED BY JAIME ORTIZ ON THE ACTUAL
TICKET ITSELF?
17
18
A.
Q.
YES.
DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT THAT WAS REPORTED BY
19 MR. SANDOVAL, FOR INSTANCE, THE JULY 19, 2009, DATE?
20 A. NO, HE DOES NOT REPORT THAT.
21 Q. 57173, AND THAT'S FOR THE DATE OF JULY 20, 2009. IS
22 THAT MS. QUINONES'S PHONE CALENDAR?
23 A. YES, IT IS.
24 Q. INDICATING HENRY AT THE UNIVERSITY CLUB?
25
A.
I BELIEVE SO, UNIVERSITY WAS ABBREVIATED U-N-I-V CLUB.
26
Q.
THANK YOU.
41481 IS ANOTHER APPOINTMENT NOTATION ON
27 EMAIL THAT INDICATES HENRY AT THE, U-N-I-V.CLUB, PEARL QUINONES,
28 7/20/2009 AT 12:30 P.M.?

3551
1
2
3
A. YES, SIR.
Q. AT 39239. ANOTHER VERSION OF THE SAME DATE FOR PEARL
QUINONES AT THE UNIVERSITY CLUB?
4
5
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT.
16011, AND LOOKING AT A DATE OF 7/20/2009,
6 MR. AMIGABLE, UNIVERSITY CLUB RECEIPTS; IS THAT CORRECT?
7 A. YES. THIS IS THE INVOICE FROM THE UNIVERSITY CLUB SENT
8 TO MR. HENRY AMIGABLE AND ON THE 7/20/09 IT INDICATES AN
9 EXPENDITURE OF $82.21.
10 Q. NOTHING FOR THE DATE OF 7/19/2009 -- EXCUSE ME, NO
11 WE'RE CORRECT, ON 7/20/2009. I APOLOGIZE. WITHDRAW THE
12 QUESTION. WE WERE LOOKING AT 7/20/2009.
13
A. THERE WAS AN ASSOCIATED PARKING FEE OF $25 ON THAT DATE
14
ALSO.
15
16
17
18
19
20
Q. OKAY. MOVING ON TO 18263, AND WE'RE LOOKING AT
JULY 28, 2009.
A. THAT'S CORRECT.
Q. AND IT INDICATES GARY CABELLO AT FRIDA'S. WHAT IS THIS
WE'RE LOOKING AT?
A. THIS IS, AGAIN, DR. GANDARA'S SWEETWATER UNION HIGH
21
22
23
SCHOOL DISTRICT CALENDAR AND IT'S DATED 7/28/2009, 6P.
THAT'S 6:00 P.M., ONE HOUR AND 30 MINUTES.
Q. 56042 FOR AUGUST 7, 2009, AND AT THE BOTTOM IT
I ASSUME
24
INDICATES IT'S AN EMAIL EXCHANGE FROM GREG SANDOVAL TO GARY
25 CABELLO. "GARY, I FOUND YOUR EMAIL ADDRESS. HERE'S THE
26 INFORMATION ABOUT MY DAUGHTER'S EVENT. I HOPE YOU CAN HELP."
27 AND THEN MOVING ON TO AN EXCHANGE FROM GARY CABELLO TO PAM
28 NEWCOMB INDICATING, "HOW MUCH ARE THEY LOOKING FOR?" AND "I

3552
1 BELIEVE FOUR TICKETS TO THE EVENT, WHICH WOULD BE $400. GARY."
2 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
3 Q. t·jOVING ON TO AUGUST 26, 2009, LOOK AT 36417 liT THE
4 BOTTON -- FROlvJ THE BOTTot~ UP. IT'S AN EXCHANGE BETWEEN LINDA
5 RODRIGUEZ AND PEARL QUINONES. RODRIGUEZ INDICATING, "NO, WE
6 DON'T HAVE TICKETS. WE'RE SAVING OUR MONEY." AND THE RESPONSE
7 FRON t1S. QUINONES, "BUT DON'T THEY PROVIDE TICKETS FOR BOARD
8 t~EMBERS?" LINDA RODRIGUEZ RESPONDS, "NO, WE HAVE TO BUY THEN."
9 AND PEARL QUINONES RESPONDS, "THEN I WOULDN'T GO EITHER OR BE ON
10 A BOARD, BUT THAT'S JUST NE. ANYWAY, 1'1'1 GOING. DO YOU THINK A
11 WHITE SUIT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE AND DID YOU FIND YOUR DRESS?"
12 AND MS. RODRIGUEZ RESPONSE, "YES, A viHITE SUIT IS NICE. DO YOU
13 HAVE AN EBER1\LD GREEN SHIRT? I'M WEARING A DRESS I ALREADY HAD.
14 I COULDN'T FIND A THING." AND THEN IT KEEPS GOING WITH "I WAS
15 THINKING FOR THE AI,/ARDS DINNER OF WEARING A ~lHITE SUIT AND BLACK
16 TOP. " THAT'S ":'HE EXTENT OF THE RELEVANT PORTIO:.!. I GUESS I
17 SHOULD CONTINUE ON THAT "~lHEN YOU ARE LOOKING, YOU c.z'.N' T FIND A
18 THING BUT YOU I'HLL LOOK BF,AUTIFUL WITH \,/HATEVER."
19 t40VING ON TO 37435, AND ,qE'RE LOOKING AT SONE CHARGERS
20 TICKETS, WHERE WERE THESE CHARGERS ":'ICKETS FOUND, DO YOU KNOW?
21 A. AGAr:.!, THIS viAS FOUND AT MR. SANDOVAL'S RESIDENCE
22 PURSUANT TO A SEARCH WARRANT.
23 Q. DOES IT INDICATE HECTOR ROMERO ON THE TICKETS
24 THEMSELVES?
25 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
26 Q. 18875. IS THIS F'OR THE DATE OF' 9/11/2011, JOHN
27 WILSON'S FORB 700. DOES HE INDICATE RECEIVI:.!G DINNER AND DRINKS
28 IN THE At40UNT OF $150 FRON SEVILLE CONSTRUCTION SERVICES?

3553
1
A.
YES, SIR.
2
Q. 41484. I'M GOING TO TAKE A MINUTE FOR -- A SECOND. I
3 KNOW O;JR WITNESS Rll.S SCHEDULED '1'0 BE '{ERE 25 MINUTES AGO. I'LL
4 MAKE SOME CALLS.
5 W,{Y DON'T WE HAVE YOU STEP DOWN. YOU ARE REMINDED YOU ARE
6 STU:' ADi'lON:::SHED.
7 MR. SCHORR: ~1HY DON'T WE GO BlICK ON THE RECORD FOR p"
8 MOMENT. I DON'T BELIEVE THIS NEXT WITNESS IS ON YOUR WITNESS
9 LIST. IT'S A:J INDIVIDUAL BY THE NAt1E OF RANDY DUNCAN. I'M NOT
10 SURE IF HE IS ON THE :'IST OR NOT. THE REASON I'M SO --
11
GRAND JUROR NO. 13:
FRAZZLED?
12
MR. SCHORR: FRAZZLED. THI\NK YOU. IT'S 10:10 AND THE
13 WITNESS HAS INDICNl'ED HE HAS Sm1EWHERE; HE HAS TO BE AND HE MADE A
14 SPECIAL APPEARANCE TO COME AND BE WITH US. BUT I REARRANGED THE
15 SCHEDULE TO TRY TO GET HIM IN THIS MORNI"lG ON TIME. HE'S
16 INDICATED THAT HE HAS TO LEAVE. A:JD HE'S, AS I SAID, A VERY
17 INPORTANT WI'I'NESS FOR US.
18 GRI1.ND JUROR NO. 16: RANDY DU:JCAN?
19 MR. SCHORR: RANDY DUNCAN. IS HE ON - NO, HE'S NOT ON THE
20 LIST. WE'LL GET HIM ON AND GET THROUGH AS t1UCH AS WE CAN.
21 HOPEFULLY vIE' L," 3E ABLE '1'0 DO SO IUTH THE T H1E WE HAVE.
22 GRAND JUROR NO 2: I' N KI"lD OF CURIOUS, SINCE 98 PERCEN'r OF
23 VINCE'S TESTHIONY JUST GOES BY US, 1'1" S NOT HELPING WITH OUR
24 DEC:!:SIONS, Ii/HY DO WE HAVE TO LISTE"l TO IT?
25 MR. LUDWIG: BECAUSE IT HAS TO BE ON THE RECORD. IF DURING
26 PART OF, FOR INSTANCE, THE CLOSING, IF THERE'S A SUMMARY THAT IS
27 GIVEN TO YOU WHICH HELPS TO TIE IN DATES AND TINES AND CONFIRNS
28 THINGS THEN WE I L1. DO THAT WITH YOU. I ':':' GET BACK TO IT. I

3554
1 APPRECIATE IT.
2 I'LL HAVE YOU TAKE THE STAND, WHICH IS THE BLUE CHAIR. DO
3 YOU "IANT TO STAND NEXT TO IT FIRST AND OUR FORE PERSON WILL SWEAR
4 YOU IN.
5 GRAND JURY FORE PERSON : PLEASE: RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND.
6 DO YOU SOLEMNLY SWEAR THAT THE EVIDENCE YOU SHALL GIVE IN
7 THE MATTER NOI'I PENDING BEFORE TH I S GRAND JURY SHALL BE THE '!'RUTH,
8 TilE ,'1 HOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH, SO HELP YOU GOD?
9 THE WITNESS: YES, I DO.
10 GRlHW JURY FOREPERSON: TIIANK YOU.
11
12 RAND1\LL STEWART DUNCAN,
13 GRAND JURY '~ITNESS, HAVING BEEN DULY SWORN, WAS EXAMINED AND
14 TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS:
15
16 EXAMINATION
17 BY MR. SCHORR:
18 Q. GO AHEAD AND TAKE: A SEAT. SIR, IF YOU \>,iOULDN'T t1IND
19 STATING YOUR FULL NAME, SPELLING YOUR FIRST AND LAST NAiVIE FOR TilE
20 RECORD.
21 A. MY NAME IS RANDALL STEWART DUNCAN. MY FIRST NAME IS
22 SPELLED, R-A-N-D-A-L-L, LAST NAME IS DUNCAN, D-U-N-C-A-N.
23 Q. SIR, JUST TO KIND OF LET YOU KNOW THE SETUP TIIAT WE
24 HAVE IIERE, WE HAVE OUR GR1'.ND JURORS WIIO ARE SEATED ON YOUR LEFT
25 THROUGHOUT THE PANEL AS WELL AS IN THE AUDIENCE 1'.REA, THE
26 FOREPERSON THAT JUST S\>,iORE YOU IN AS ,,,ELL AS OUR SECRET.".RY AND
27 iVIYSELF AND CO-COUNSEL SEATED IN FRONT OF YOU AS WELL AS THE COURT
28 REPORTER.

3555
1 I APPRECIATE YOU COMING DOWN AND BEING ABLE TO SPEAK WITH US
2 TODAY. I KNOW THAT YOU HAVE SOME TIME CONSTRAINTS. WE'LL TRY TO
3 GET THROUGH THE TESTIMONY AS QUICKLY AS WE CAN BUT ALSO
4 CONCENTRATING ON THE IMPORTANT PARTS THAT YOU CAN SHARE WITH US.
5 IF YOU WOULDN'T MIND, SO THE GRAND JURY HAS A LITTLE BIT OF
6 BACKGROUND ON YOURSELF, IF YOU CAN TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT
7 YOUR EDUCATIONAL BACKGROUND AS WELL AS WORK EXPERIENCE THAT
8 ALLOWED YOU TO BE IN THE POSITION THAT YOU WERE IN RELATED TO
9 SWEETWATER AND THEN AS YOU SIT TODAY.
10 A. OKAY. I GRADUATED FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF SOUTHERN
11 CALIFORNIA IN 1981 WITH A DEGREE IN BUSINESS ADMINISTRATION WITH
12 AN EMPHASIS ON INTERNATIONAL FINANCE. FOUR DAYS AFTER I
13 GRADUATED I ACCEPTED A POSITION IN SAUDI ARABIA ON A 2,200-PERSON
14 PROGRAM MANAGEMENT PROGRAM PROJECT, CONSTRUCTION MANAGEMENT
15 SERVICES FOR THE ROYAL COMMISSION OF SAUDI ARABIA. IT WAS A
16 $40 BILLION PRE-PLANNED CITY CALLED YANBU AL SINAIYAH ON THE
17 COAST OF THE RED SEA, AND I WORKED IN SAUDI ARABIA IN VARIOUS
18 PROJECT CONTROLS, COST MANAGEMENT POSITIONS FOR FIVE AND A HALF
19 YEARS.
20 I WAS WITH PARSONS CORPORATION OUT OF -- BASED IN PASADENA.
21 I THEN CAME BACK TO THE UNITED STATES AND WORKED ON THE EXPANSION
22 OF THE JOHN WAYNE AIRPORT. I SERVED AS THE FINANCIAL MANAGER FOR
23 THAT JOINT VENTURE OF THREE FIRMS, HOLMES & NARVER, PARSONS AND
24 VAN DELL & ASSOCIATES IN THE LATE '80S. I SUBSEQUENTLY HAD MY
25 OWN BUSINESS IN -- VENTURED TO START OUT ON MY OWN. I WASN'T
26 SUCCESSFUL. I REACCEPTED A POSITION WITH PARSONS AND I WENT BACK
27 TO SAUDI ARABIA. AND WAS ON THE PERSIAN GULF SIDE WORKING ON A
28 GAS OIL SEPARATION PLANT -- MULTIPLE GAS OIL SEPARATION PLANT

3556
I PROJECTS. I lilORKED THERE FOR A YEAR ANC CA!VlE BACK.
2 I Ul.TIMAc'E;],Y E'OUNC !ViY WAY TO ACCEPTING A POSITION In'I'H
3 DANIEl., MANN, JOHNSON AND t4ENDENHAl.l., I'IHICH IS -- THE PARENT
4 COMPANY IS AE COM, WHICH IS AN INTERNATIONAL ARCHITECT,
5 ENGINEERING AND PROGRAM CONTRACTION MANAGEMENT FIRM. I ACCEPTED
6 A POSITION OUT AT CAl. STATE NORTHRIDGE. THIS WAS IN DECEMBER OF
7 1995, WHERE DM/J!JI WAS THE PROJECT AND CONSTRUCTION MANAGER FOR
8 THE REBUILDING OF CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE AFTER THE EAR'I'HQUAKE. I
9 SERV>:D THERE AS THE DEPUTY PROGRAM DIRECTOR AND PROGRAc,1 DIRECTOR
10 IN CHARGE OF I HA:l AS ?-1ANY AS 23 FUl.l.-TH·lE STAE'F', PROJECT
11 l1ANAGERS, SCHEDUl.ERS, ESTIMATORS, CONTRACT ADMINISTRATORS AND I
12 THINK I SAID INSPECTORS. SO T OVERSAW ''iHAT AT THE TIME WAS THE
13 LARGEST EDUCATION CONSTRUCTION PROJ>:CT WEST OF THE MISSISSIPPI.
14 WE WERE EITHER DE?-10LISHING, DESIGNING AND REPLACING OR REPAIRING
15 ALL 107 BUILDINGS THAT WERE IMPACTED BY THE EARTHQUAKE. I LED
16 THAT PROGRAlVi TO A SUCCESSFUL COMPLETION AN:l IN AN IG AU:lIT WITH
17 EXCEPTIONS LESS THAN A PERCENT OF DISALLOWANCES AND MOST OF THOSE
18 OCCURREC BEFORE I ARRIVED ON SITE. I SET UP THE GENERAl. l.EDGER
19 THERE AND SET UP THE WHOl.E PROGRAI'1 AS TO HOW THE EARTHQUAKE
20 REPAIRS WOULD BE PERFORMED.
21 THAT LED TO ME BEING IN A POSITION TO WH>:N PROP 39 WAS
22 CREATE:l BASED ON ASSEMBLY BIl.L 1908, AND THE LEGISLATION PASSE:l
23 IN NOVEMBER OF 2000. THE LOS ANGELES COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT
24 PASSEC THE FIRST PROP 39 BON:l MEASURE AT THAT TINE FOR $1. 245
25 BILL:ON. THE PRESICENT OF DN/JM, OWNED BY AE CO",I, ASKED ME TO GO
2 6 AFTER PROGRI\?-1 ?-1.I\NAGEMENT AT THE :'. A. COMMm:::::TY COLLEGE :lISTRICT
27 AND I C:::O.
28 WE WENT AFTER IT, ~lE cm1PETEO, AND vIE vlERE SELECTED AS THE

3557
1 PROGRAM MANAGER FOR LACCD. I WAS PLEASED TO NOTE THAT IN ENR,
2 THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF FACILITIES WAS QUOTED AS SAYING WE
3 SELECTED DM/JM BECAUSE OF THE EXPERIENCE OF THEIR PROGRAM
4 DIRECTOR. THEY DIDN'T MENTION ME BY NAME, BUT THEY WERE
5 REFERRING TO ME.
6 I THEN WAS THE PROGRAM DIRECTOR FOR THE FIRST PROP 39 BOND
7 MEASURE. THAT ENCOMPASSED NINE INDIVIDUAL COLLEGE CAMPUSES AND I
8 WAS INVOLVED IN THE SETUP OF THE 9TH DISTRICT CITIZENS -- THE
9 CITIZENS OVERSIGHT COMMITTEES AND ALL NINE CAMPUSES ALONG WITH
10 LEGAL COUNSEL ADMINISTERING THE BROWN ACT COMPLIANCE ISSUES FOR
11 ALL THOSE NINE CITIZEN OVERSIGHT COMMITTEES, AS WELL PARTICIPATED
12 IN THE DISTRICT CITIZENS OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE FOR THE ENTIRETY OF
13 THE DISTRICT.
14 I WAS THE PROGRAM DIRECTOR THERE FOR A YEAR AT WHICH TIME I
15 WAS HEADHUNTED BY HARRIS & ASSOCIATES WHO WAS LOOKING FOR SOMEONE
16 TO HEAD UP THEIR EDUCATION PM/CM GROUP. HARRIS HAD PREVIOUSLY
17 BEEN PREDOMINATELY A HORIZONTAL CONSTRUCTION MANAGEMENT FIRM WITH
18 MAJOR CALTRANS ROADWAY PROJECTS. AND THEY PREVIOUSLY HAD
19 PURCHASED A FIRM CALLED PROJECT MANAGEMENT ASSOCIATES, AND THEIR
20 PRESIDENT RESIGNED OR WAS PART OF THE BUYOUT TO DEPARTURE. THEY
21 ASKED ME TO HEAD UP THE EDUCATION GROUP BECAUSE OF MY EXPERIENCE
22 AT CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE, I GUESS BECAUSE I WAS SITTING ATOP THE
23 LARGEST PROP 39 BOND MEASURE AT THE TIME AS THE LEAD MANAGING
24 CONSULTANT.
25 AND THAT ULTIMATELY LED TO A YEAR LATER I STARTED WITH
26 HARRIS IN MAY OF 2002. AND IN MAY OF 2003 HARRIS WAS CLOSING THE
27 DEAL ON ACQUIRING A FIRM CALLED PACIFIC PROGRAM MANAGEMENT, PPM,
28 OUT OF SACRAMENTO, AND IT WAS IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT PROCUREMENT

3558
1 THAT APPARENTLY PACIFIC PROGRAM MANAGEMENT WAS SELECTED AS THE
2 PROGRAM MANAGER AT SWEETWATER. AND LITERALLY WITH THE SECRETARY
3 OF STATE SIGNING THE PAPERS TO CLOSE THAT ACQUISITION I WAS ASKED
4 BY THEN SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT, JEFF COOPER AND BOARD MEMBER OF
5 HARRIS & ASSOCIATES, TO COME DOWN TO SAN DIEGO BECAUSE HE WANTED
6 ME TO SEE TO IT THAT WE LAUNCHED OUR SERVICES AT SWEETWATER UNDER
7 MY GUIDANCE AND LEADERSHIP.
8 Q. THANK YOU. TELL US ABOUT THE PROJECTS AND YOUR
9 INVOLVEMENT WITH SWEETWATER, HOW IT WAS THAT YOU WERE INVOLVED IN
10 OVERSEEING THE PROP BB CONSTRUCTION.
11 A. I ARRIVED ON SITE, AND AS THE PROGRAM DIRECTOR I WAS
12 RESPONSIBLE FOR MANAGING EVERY ASPECT OF THE DELIVERY OF THE
13 PROP BB PROJECTS. WE PUT OUT A -- THERE WAS ONLY ONE ARCHITECT
14 THAT HAD DONE SOME DESIGN WORK AT ONE OF THE SCHOOLS AND THAT WAS
15 CHULA VISTA MIDDLE SCHOOL. AND THAT WORK WAS DONE BY A
16 PREDECESSOR CONSTRUCTION MANAGEMENT FIRM KNOWN AS
17 3D/INTERNATIONAL OR 3D/I. THAT HAS SUBSEQUENTLY BEEN ACQUIRED BY
18 PARSONS, BUT 3D/I'S WORK AT CHULA VISTA MIDDLE SCHOOL APPARENTLY
19 DID NOT MEET WITH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT'S EXPECTATIONS AND THEY
20 WERE LET GO. THAT'S WHY THEY PUT OUT A RFQ FOR CM SERVICES --
21 PROGRAM MANAGEMENT SERVICES.
22 SO I LOOKED AT THE BALLOT LANGUAGE, THE TOTAL -- WELL, THE
23 COST ESTIMATES THAT WERE PREPARED BY CUMMINGS UNDER CONTRACT TO
24 LPA, THE MASTER PLAN ARCHITECTURAL FIRM, AND BASICALLY LOOKED AT
25 TAILORING THE DESIGN OF ALL OF THE RENOVATIONS TO BE CONSISTENT
26 WITH THE BALLOT LANGUAGE. AND SO WE BASICALLY HAD PUT OUT A RFQ
27 FOR -- AS I FOUND FROM MY SUCCESS AT CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE WAS YOU
28 NEED CONSULTANTS -- ANY CONSULTANTS THAT YOU WILL EVER NEED YOU

3559
1 NEED THEM TO BE CLOSE TO HAVING THE ABILITY TO HIRE THEM. SO I
2 PUT OUT A RFQ FOR ARCHITECTURAL ENGINEERING SERVICES AND RFQ
3 FOR -- REQUEST FOR QUALIFICATIONS, AND WE CONDUCTED THE SCREENING
4 TO SELECT THE ARCHITECTS THAT THEIR -- EACH WOULD BE GIVEN ABOUT
5 FOUR SCHOOL SITES TO DESIGN THE REPAIRS TO. WE SELECTED FOUR
6 ARCHITECTURAL FIRMS.
7 I PUT OUT A RFQ FOR CONSTRUCTION MANAGEMENT SERVICES. I
8 FELT THAT -- I WANTED TO MAKE SURE HARRIS STAYED AS THE PROGRAM
9 MANAGER AND THAT IF WE WERE TO IMPLEMENT THE PROGRAM CONSISTENT
10 WITH THE MAGNITUDE OF RESOURCES THAT I FELT WERE GOING TO BE
11 NEEDED TO STAFF EACH PROJECT WITH A PLAYERS, THAT WE NEEDED TO
12 PUT A RFQ OUT FOR CONSTRUCTION MANAGEMENT. THAT GOES HAND IN
13 HAND WITH THE FACT THAT I WORKED WITH THEN CFO BARRY DRAGON AND
14 DIRECTOR OF FINANCIAL SERVICES DIANNE RUSSO AND WITH SOME
15 DISCUSSIONS WITH ED BRAND, THE SUPERINTENDENT, ABOUT THE FACT
16 THAT THEY HAD A FIVE BOND SALE PLAN. THAT WAS THEIR ORIGINAL
17 PLAN DELIVERY OF PROP BB WITH THE LAST BOND SALE IN 2015. NOW,
18 THIS IS 2003. I'M TALKING ABOUT THE 2003/2004 TIME FRAME.
19 I SAID WITH THE CONSTRUCTION ESCALATION THAT YOU ARE SEEING
20 RIGHT NOW COMBINED WITH THE FACT THAT THE ASSESSED VALUATION OF
21 THE DISTRICT IS LIKELY SUCH THAT YOU CAN SELL ALL THE BOND
22 DOLLARS TODAY, THAT I ENCOURAGED THEM TO SELL ALL THE BOND
23 DOLLARS SO WE COULD DELIVER THE HARD -- PUT MORE INTO HARD
24 CONSTRUCTION IN THE GROUND QUICKER.
25 MY SUGGESTIONS WERE I WANT TO SAY LISTENED TO, AND DIANNE
26 RUSSO AND BARRY DRAGON, ALONG WITH SUPPORT FROM KATY WRIGHT, THE
27 DIRECTOR OF FACILITIES, WITH ED BRAND, SUPERINTENDENT'S
28 CONCURRENCE, THAT THIS SEEMED LIKE A GOOD PLAN TO GO AHEAD AND

3560
1 SELL ALL THE BONDS NOW AND DELIVER THE CONSTRUCTION NOW. AND THE
2 MASTER PROGRAM SCHEDULE THAT I HAD PUT TOGETHER SHOWED US
3 FINISHING THE PROJECT 11 YEARS AHEAD OF SCHEDULE AND
4 TRANSITIONING $72 MILLION OF WHAT WOULD BE LOST ESCALATION INTO
5 HARD CONSTRUCTION.
6 I REMEMBER STATING TO THAT COMMITTEE THAT IF WE DON'T DO
7 THIS, THE MONIES THAT WE COULD RENOVATE AN ENTIRE FOOTBALL
8 STADIUM FOR OR A WHOLE WING OF CLASSROOM BUILDINGS, IN 2016 WE'LL
9 BE ABLE TO MODERNIZE THE SNACK SHACK AT THE FOOTBALL STADIUM.
10 THAT'S HOW MUCH WE'LL BE ABLE TO GET DONE TODAY IF WE DO IT
11 SOONER. THAT RECOMMENDATION WENT TO THE BOARD. THE BOARD
12 APPROVED IT AND THAT'S WHAT LED TO THE RFQ FOR THE FOUR CM FIRMS
13 THAT WAS EXPANDED TO FIVE. PUT OUT A RFQ FOR INSPECTION AND
14 MATERIALS TESTING AND PUT UNDER CONTRACT A -- I THINK THREE OR
15 FOUR, POSSIBLY FIVE FIRMS TO DEPLOY DSA CLASS 1 THROUGH 3
16 INSPECTORS.
17 THE REASON I DO THAT -- I DO THAT ON EVERY MAJOR PROGRAM I'M
18 A PART OF IS I THEN DEMAND FROM EACH CONSULTANT FIRM THAT THEY
19 DELIVER THEIR A PLAYERS. BECAUSE EVERY COMPANY HAS A, BAND C,
20 AND I WANT THE A'S, BECAUSE I WANT US TO DO THE BEST JOB FOR THE
21 CLIENTS. I ALSO BUILT IN IF ANYBODY DIDN'T DELIVER AN A TEAM TO
22 ONE OF THE SCHOOL SITES THAT I HAD PREAPPROVED AS PART OF THE
23 BOND LANGUAGE THAT ONE OF THE OTHER CM FIRMS WAS ALREADY THE
24 APPROVED ALTERNATE AND THAT THEY COULD TAKE IT WITHOUT -- I COULD
25 JUST GO NEGOTIATE WITH ONE OF THE OTHER FIRMS.
26 WE -- I WAS THERE ON SITE FULL TIME, LIVING OVER IN LITTLE
27 ITALY, WHEREAS MY HOME AT THE TIME WAS IN PASADENA, CALIFORNIA.
28 I COMMUTED HOME ON WEEKENDS, BUT I LIVED DOWN HERE FOR TWO --

3561
1 LITTLE OVER TWO YEARS, AT WHICH TIME, IN THE SUMMER OF 2005, I
2 TURNED IT OVER TO CHRISTOPHER DUNNE WHO WAS MY PROJECT CONTROLS
3 MANAGER. I ELEVATED HIM TO THE PROGRAM DIRECTOR FULL TIME ON
4 SITE AND I WENT BACK TO BEING THE REGIONAL -- LOS ANGELES
5 REGIONAL MANAGER AND HEAD OF EDUCATION OF PM/CM FOR HARRIS OUT OF
6 LOS ANGELES.
7 Q. I HAVE A QUESTION FROM A GRAND JUROR. I HAD INDICATED
8 TO YOU AT SOME POINT WE MIGHT HAVE QUESTIONS FROM GRAND JURORS.
9 IT WILL BE GRAND JUROR NO. 2 ASKED THE QUESTION, WHICH IS --
10 GRAND JURY SECRETARY: 262.
11 BY MR. SCHORR:
12 Q. -- 262. "WHO WERE THE MEMBERS ON THE SWEETWATER BOARD
13 WHEN THEY ACCEPTED YOUR PLAN FOR ACCELERATING THE PROP BB
14 SCHEDULE?"
15 A. THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN ARLIE RICASA, PEARL QUINONES, JIM
16 CARTMILL.
17
18
19
20
21
22
Q. GREG SANDOVAL?
A. GREG SANDOVAL, AND I
Q. EITHER GREG OR JAIME
A. RIGHT. YES. YES. I
BEEN WELL, I DON'T REMEMBER.
Q. IN TERMS OF ACHIEVING
WANT TO SAY BOB GRIEGO MAYBE.
MERCADO AT THE TIME?
BELIEVE IT WAS -- IT MUST HAVE
SORRY.
THE GOALS OF PROP BB AND
23 EVERYTHING THAT YOU TALKED ABOUT, WAS HARRIS SUCCESSFUL IN
24 ACCELERATING THE PROGRAM AND COMPLETING ON TIME OR AHEAD OF
25 SCHEDULE IN A SATISFACTORY WAY THE PROJECTS THAT YOU HAD SAID YOU
26 WERE GOING TO DO?
27 A. YES. WE DEVELOPED A PLAN THAT -- ALTHOUGH THE COST
28 ESTIMATE PREPARED BY CUMMINGS SAID EXCLUDES HAZARDOUS MATERIAL

3562
1 ABATEMENT, EXCLUDES ESCALATION -- IT HAD A BUNCH OF EXCLUSIONS.
2 ANYTIME YOU HAVE A BUNCH OF EXCLUSIONS IN THE DOCUMENTATION THAT
3 BECOMES THE FOUNDATION OF THE BOND MEASURE ITSELF, OBVIOUSLY YOU
4 ARE SHORT FUNDED FROM THE GET-GO.
5 THAT SAID, I CONVEYED TO THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR -- DIRECTOR
6 OF FACILITIES, THE FINANCE TEAM OF BARRY DRAGON AND DIANNE RUSSO
7 AND TO THE FACILITIES AND FINANCE SUBCOMMITTEE, WHICH WAS
8 COMPRISED OF TWO BOARD MEMBERS, THAT WHAT WE WOULD DO -- IT
9 DIDN'T MAKE SENSE TO GO AIR-CONDITION ALL THE BUILDINGS ON
10 CAMPUS, BECAUSE IF YOU WERE TO COME BACK AND NEED TO ABATE THE
11 ASBESTOS OR LEAD-BASED PAINT LATER, YOU'LL RIP OUT ALL THE DUCT
12 WORK YOU PUT IN. IF WE'RE GOING TO TOUCH A BUILDING, WE'RE GOING
13 TO GUT THE BUILDING. WE'LL DEMO IT DOWN TO THE STUDS. WE'LL
14 ABATE AND ERADICATE AND MITIGATE ALL HAZARDOUS MATERIALS, SO
15 THESE ARE HAZARDOUS MATERIAL FREE STRUCTURES, AND WE WILL BUILD
16 THEM OUT FROM THE INSIDE, PUT IN THE SMART CLASSROOMS, THE
17 TEACHING WALLS, THAT WAS UP TO THE STANDARD THAT THE DISTRICT
18 WANTED TO GO TO.
19 AND WE -- AND WE COLLECTIVELY DETERMINED -- AND IT WAS
20 CONSISTENT WITH MY RECOMMENDATION, WAS LET'S ESTABLISH PARODY
21 THROUGHOUT THE DISTRICT. SO IF WE TOUCH A CLASSROOM AT CHULA
22 VISTA HIGH SCHOOL, IF WE'RE MODERNIZING IT, IT WILL BE MODERNIZED
23 TO THE SAME STANDARDS AS ANY OF THE OTHER HIGH SCHOOLS, THUS
24 ACHIEVING PARODY. AND I SAID IF YOU -- YOU ARE CLIMBING OUT OF A
25 SITUATION WHERE THE COMMUNITY WASN'T HAPPY WHERE THE PROGRAM WAS
26 GOING. YOU WANT TO SHOW THE PARENTS THAT THERE ARE BEFORE AND
27 AFTER BOND DOLLARS. SO WE WILL GO INTO THESE BUILDINGS AND WE
28 WILL COMPLETELY MODERNIZE THEM.

3563
1 l"ND COINCID:::NTALLY, THOSE BACK TO SCHOOL NIGHTS ,~HEN P.Z\RENTS
2 ARE GOING TO THE SIX CLASSROm'lS AND THE BELL IS RUNG AND THEY GO
3 FRQ['1 AN AIR-CONDITIONED BOND DOLLAR TOUCHED 70-YEAR-OLD BUILDING,
4 MIND YOU, AND THEN THEY GO TO THE NEXT BUILDING' THAT IS CLEARLY
5 NOT TOUCHED BY BOND DOLLARS BUT -- BECAUSE THE OTHER THING WE
6 WERE ABLE TO DO WITH PROP 39, YOU ARE ALLONED TO PUT NEN
7 FURNITURE AND FIXTURES IN IT. SO IT LITERALLY WAS TRANSFORt1ED
8 INTO A NEW CLASSROOM.
9 I SAID THAT SETS THE STAGE VERY NICELY WHEN YOU WANT TO
10 DEMONSTRATE TO THE COMMUNITY THAT YOUR JOB IS NOT DONE. THAT
11 THERE'S A LONG RANGE FACILITIES MASTER PLAN AND THP.T THEY CAN SEE
12 NHERE THE BOND DOLLl'.RS NEN':'. NE DELIVERED THE PROJECT 11 YEARS
13 AEE;AD OF SCHEDULE. NE NERE LITERZl.LLY IN THE PROCESS OF NE NERE
H GOI::

3564
1 IF YOU LOOKED AT THE BROCHURES, THEY WERE HIGHLIGHTING THE BOARD
2
3
AND THE DISTRICT'S ACHIEVEI'lENTS OF THE DELIVERY OF PROP BB.
Q. WERE YOU AROUND OR ANYWHERE INVOLVED WITH PROP O?
4 YOU S'l'lLL WITH HARRIS AND DID YOU SEEK TO RESPOND TO THE RFP'S IN
5 ORDER TO POTENTIALLY GE'l' THE CONTRACT E'OR PROP O?
6 A, YES, BUT --
7
Q.
A~1 I JUlv]P:::NG AHEAD?
8
A.
I
JUST WANT TO BACK UP AND SAY THAT THE -- BECAUSE THE
9 DISTRICT KNEW I -- I POINTED OUT .I,LL THESE EXCLUSIONS, THE THINGS
10 THAT WEREN' 'I' FUNDED, AND WE NOW HAD ACTUAL COST OF \~HAT THINGS
11 WERE GOING TO COST. I DEVELOPED THE -- WORKING WITH LPA, WE
12 UPDATED \~HAT WAS THE l1ASTER PLAN AND CREATED THE LONG Rl\NC;E
13 FACILITIES l1ASTER PLAN. IT TOOK THEIR CUl1l1INGS ESTIl1ATES THAT
14 HAD THE EXCLUSIONS AND OVERLAID IT WITH ACTUALS AND REl10VED THE
15 EXCLUSIONS AND DEVELOPED A LONG RANGE FACILITIES MASTER PLAN FOR
16 A BILLION AND 89 l1ILLION DOLLAR l10DERNIZATION NEED. NOW, THAT
17 INCLUDED THE PROP BB, WHICH WAS ABOUT 3 -- WITH THE STATE l1ATCH,
18 ,'lAS ABOUT $336 l1ILLION. SO I IDENTIFIED THAT THERE'S ANOTHER 644
19 l1ILLION NEEDED TO FINISH :::'1' AND THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE THE ROUC;HLY
20 400 11 ILL ION OF 'I'HE NEW SCHOOL REQUIREl'lEN'I'S, WHICH :}lC~U,)ED
21 OLY",IP:::.'" HIGH SCHOOL AND ."'}lOTHER COMBINED HIGH SCHOOL, l"!IDDLE
22 SCHOOL.
23 BU'I' -- AND I REt-lEl-omER CONVEYING TO ED BRAND -- HE SAl'),
24 II Rl\NDY , YOU'RE IN CHULA VISTA. YOU'RE USING THE B :;JORD." HE
25 SAID, "THAT'S FOR YOU GUYS UP IN LOS ANGELES, THE BIG GUYS. THIS
26 B WORD IS}l'T GOING TO SIT WELL." AND I SAID, "WELL, ED, YOU GUYS
27 ASKED ME TO TELL YOU HOW MUCH IT WAS GOING TO COST TO MODER}lIZE
28 THE RES'l' OF THE BUILDINGS AND BUILD THE NEW STRUCTURES, THE

3565
1 MULTIPURPOSE CLASSROOMS AT EACH SCHOOL. AND THE NUMBER IS WHAT
2 THE NUMBER IS AND HOW YOU FUND IT IS A DIFFERENT STORY, n ~nIICH
3 LED TO THAT DOCm1ENT THAT I PREPARED. I CO-WROTE IT ACTUl,LLY
4 WITH LPA AND I PREPARED ALL OF nIE FINANCIAL COST PROJECTIONS AND
5 EVERY'I'HING ELSE AND 'I'HE FUNDING ELIGIBILITY. THAT DOCUMENT WAS
6 ACCEPTED BY T;'!E BOARD AI\D IN FEBRUARY OF 2000 -- FEBRUARY,
7 1'lARCH 2006, WHICH LED TO ':'HE ULTn'lA':'E PREPARATION -- ALTHOUGH I
8 WASN ''I' THERE THEN. I \~AS BACK WORKING IN LOS ANGELES, BUT THAT
9 LED TO THE PREPARATION OF T;'!E BALLOT -- TIE PROP 0 BALLOT tJfEASURE
10 FOR 644 MILLION. I BELIEVE THAT'S THE AMOUNT.
11 Q. WE STARTED ABOUT TEN MINUTES LATE THIS MORNING,
12 APPROXIMATELY. WE'RE NOW ABOUT TEN MINUTES LATE ON OUR MORNING
13 BREAK. I'M FINE TO PRESS THROUGH IT. IF WE NEED A BREAK WE CAN
14 TAKE ONE. BUT SO FAR I'M GOING TO KEEP PRESSING THROUGH.
15 GRAND JUROR NO. 16: IF HE HAS A TIME ISSUE, LET'S KEEP
16 GOING.
17 MR. SCHORR: OKAY. IF ANYONE NEEDS TO TAKE A BREAK, AND
18 SOMETItJfES \~E DO, JUST MAKE A SIGNAL AND WE'LL MAKE SURE TO DO SO.
19 Q. WE'LL KEEP GOIN(; IN TERr~S (W YOUR INVOLVEMEN'::, IF ':'HERE
20 ~iAS INVOLVE1JfENT, WITH PROP 0 11\ TERfV1S OF RESPONDIKG TO A RFP.
21 A. :::~; TER~1S OF" RESPONDING, THE RFQ, I BELIEVE IT WAS, CAME
22 OUT AF'::ER THE BALLOT MEASURE PASSED ON NOVEMBER 2006. At'iD THERE
23 WAS DISCUSSION AT THE BOARD MEETING IK, BELIEVE, DECEMBER AS TO
24 THE POSSIBILITY OF PUTTING OUT A RFQ. THERE WAS DISCUSSION,
25 WELL, DO WE NEED TO? WE ALREADY HAVE THIS TEA!;l IN PLACE AND THE
26 DISCUSSIONS LED TO, NO, I THINK WE SHOULD, AND SO THAT DECISION
27 WAS MADE FOR A RFQ 1'0 COME; OUT. AND I WAS -- AS THE LEAD PERSON
28 IN CHARGE OF EDUCATION PM/CM AT HARRIS AND THE PRINCIPAL IN

3566
1 CHARGE FOR THE SWEETWATER PROGRAM, I OBVIOUSLY WAS SIMPLY EAGER
2 TO RESPOND TO IT AND COMPETE FOR IT AND FELT WE WERE -- THAT OUR
3 TRACK RECORD WAS GOING TO ASSIST US IN A BIG WAY TO WINNING THE
4 RECOMPETE.
5 Q. LET ME MAKE SURE I'M UNDERSTANDING CORRECTLY THE TIME
6 FRAME THERE. IN 2006 WHEN THE BOND WAS PASSED, IN NOVEMBER,
7 PRIOR TO THAT, THAT SEPTEMBER TIME PERIOD, IS THAT WHEN
8 DR. GANDARA BECOMES THIS NEW SUPERINTENDENT OF SWEETWATER?
9
10
A.
Q.
YES, THAT'S MY RECOLLECTION.
DID YOU HAVE ANY TYPE OF EXISTING, PREEXISTING
11 RELATIONSHIP WITH DR. GANDARA?
12
A.
NO.
13
Q.
WHEN WAS THE TIME PERIOD THAT YOU FIRST MET HIM;
IF YOU
14 RECALL?
15 A.
I MET HIM EITHER BEFORE THE BOND MEASURE PASSED OR
16 AFTER THE BOND MEASURE PASSED.
17 Q. CAN YOU DESCRIBE IN TERMS OF THE RELATIONSHIP OR YOUR
18 INTERACTIONS WITH DR. GANDARA HOW THAT WAS GOING?
19 A. THE FIRST TIME I MET DR. GANDARA ACTUALLY WAS -- MY
20 RECOLLECTION WAS SOMEWHAT OF AN UNCOMFORTABLE MEETING, BECAUSE
21 ACTUALLY I HAD LEARNED THAT HE WAS MAD AT HARRIS AND THAT HE
22 WANTED TO LET ME KNOW WHY HE WAS MAD OR UPSET OR -- AND WHAT
23 APPARENTLY TRANSPIRED -- I ONLY CONVEY WHAT CHRIS DUNNE TOLD ME
24 TRANSPIRED, WHICH IS WHAT LED TO CHRIS DUNNE BEING IN HOT WATER
25 WITH DR. GANDARA, WHICH IS WHAT PROMPTED ME TO COME DOWN TO MEET
26 WITH HIM.
27 CHRIS DUNNE, WHO HAD BEEN, OVER THE SUMMER, WHILE KATY
28 WRIGHT WAS ON RESERVE DUTY DOING SECURITY IN THE PHILIPPINES, I

3567
1 UNDERSTAND -- CHRIS DUNNE HAD BEEN THE PROGRAM DIRECTOR FOR
2 PROP BB AND WAS THE ACTING EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF FACILITIES AND
3 ACTUALLY SAT AT THE BOARD TABLE DURING BOARD MEETINGS IN LIEU
4 OF -- IN KATY WRIGHT'S ABSENCE. AND SO HE -- I WANT TO SAY
5 FOR -- FROM MANY RESPECTS, HE WAS VIEWED AS STAFF. HE EVEN
6 SUPERVISED KATY WRIGHT'S STAFF. BUT WHEN KATY WRIGHT RETURNED
7 FROM THE PHILIPPINES -- APPARENTLY CHRIS HAD MET WITH DR. GANDARA
8 AND DR. GANDARA ASKED CHRIS TO DO SOMETHING. HE SAID CAN YOU --
9 I NEED YOU TO DO THIS -- I FORGOT WHAT IT WAS, BUT I NEED IT BY
10 THURSDAY AND IT WAS TUESDAY.
11 AND CHRIS TOLD -- KATY WRIGHT EITHER HAD JUST RETURNED OR
12 SHE WASN'T THERE WHEN HE ASKED HER TO DO WHATEVER IT WAS. CHRIS
13 TOLD HIS -- THE CLIENT'S SUPERVISOR, THAT HE HAD
14 ORGANIZATIONALLY, WHICH WAS KATY WRIGHT, HE SAID -- TOLD KATY,
15 DR. GANDARA WANTS ME TO DO THIS BY THURSDAY. SHE SAID, "DON'T
16 WORRY ABOUT IT." THIS IS ACCORDING TO CHRIS. "DON'T WORRY ABOUT
17 IT. I'LL HANDLE IT. I'LL GO TALK TO HIM." WELL, CHRIS DIDN'T
18 GO TALK TO HIM. OH, NO. CHRIS WASN'T SUPPOSED TO GO TALK TO
19 HIM. KATY WRIGHT WAS SUPPOSED TO TALK TO HIM.
20 CHRIS DIDN'T DELIVER TO THE SUPERINTENDENT WHAT THE
21 SUPERINTENDENT ASKED OF HIM AND HE WAS FURIOUS AND HE ACTUALLY
22 WANTED TO LET ME KNOW THAT, AND HE SAID -- HE SAID, "RANDY, THIS
23 IS" HE SAYS, "I'M JUST SHOCKED THAT YOUR STAFF DOESN'T KNOW
24 THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TITLE OF SUPERINTENDENT AND THE TITLE
25 OF DIRECTOR OF FACILITIES. AND IF I ASK HIM TO DO SOMETHING,
26 THAT HE WOULDN'T KNOW THAT HE EITHER NEEDS TO DO IT OR TELL ME
27 WHY HE'S NOT GOING TO DO IT." AND I SAID, "WELL, I APOLOGIZE
28 THAT THAT OCCURRED, BUT ACCORDING TO CHRIS HE TOLD KATY WRIGHT

3568
1 THAT YOU'D GIVEN HIM THIS ASSIGNMENT AND SHE TOLD Hnl NOT TO DO
2 IT." AND HE SAID, 'WELL, HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN SMART ENOUGH TO
3 COME TELL [vIE." THAT WAS MY -- PRETTY MUCH MY FIRST ENCOUNTER
4 WITH JESUS GANDARA.
5 Q. WERE YOU ABLE TO ESTABLISH ANY TYPE OF' RELATIONSHIP
6 WITH DR. GANDARA OTHER THAN THAT PRIOR TO THE INTERVIEW PROCESS
7 FOR THE: PROGRAI'I ~1ANAGEMENT ISSUES? DID YOU HAVE MORE
8 INTERACTIONS WITH HIM?
9 A. 1'14 TRYING TO RECALL THE TIME FRAt-IE UNDER WHICH I
10 LEARNED THAT DR. GANDARA WAS WALKING CHULA VISTA MIDDLE SCHOOL
11 WITH GREG SANDOVAL AND RENt: FLORES AND A STATE ASSEMBLY PERSON
12 WHOSE Nlu"IE I DON'T RECALL. BUT I LEARNED THAT DR. GANDAR], ~ms
13 POINTING OUT ALL OF THE FLAWS IN THE CONSTRUCTION AT CHULA VISTA
14 MIDDLE SCHOOL. HE WAS POINTING OUT THAT THE STUCCO PATCHWORK
15 THAT WAS OBVIOUS ON THE EXTERIOR SKIN OF CLASSROOM BUILDINGS AND
16 HE WAS CITING SOME t'AULTY GUTTER WORK. THIS IS ACCORDING TO
17 RAM':m LEYBA. AND HE \~AS BASICALLY POINTING OUT ALL OF -- THAT
18 HARRIS WAS DOING A I,OUSY dOB. AND THIS CAUGHT ME BY SURPRISE,
19 YOU KNOW, FOR T\~O REASONS.
2!) ONE WAS WASN'T THE FACT THAT RENE FLORES WAS DOWN AT
21 SWEE'l'vJATER -- I GUESS I WASN'T NECESSARILY SURPRISED BY THAT. I
22 CERTAINLY KNEW 'l'HAT EVERY COMPANY HAS THE OPPORTUNITY TO COMPETE
23 FOR WORK. I DID HAPPEN TO HAVE A PREVIOUS ,'IORKING RELATIONSHIP
24 vliTH TEE SEVILLE GROUP. I'LL POINT THAT OUT. IN 1996 WHEN I WAS
25 THE PROGRAM DIRECTOR ON THE CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE, THE SEVILLE
26 GROUP WAS PROVIDING OUTREACH SERVICES AS A SUBCONSULTANT TO
2 7 D~1/ JM, THE COMPANY I WAS WORKING FOR. AND RENE t'LORES' S SON,
28 JEFF FLORES, WHO NOW HAS HIS OWN COMPANY -- BUT JEFF t'LORES WAS

3569
1 THE OUTREACH CONSULTANT POINT PERSON IN THE STAFFING PLAN TO
2 PERFORM OUTREACH TO DISADVANTAGED BUSINESSES AND HE WASN'T DOING
3
4
IT, AND I SO I LET HIM GO. AND THEY COMPLAINED TO THE
PRESIDENT OF CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE, WHICH I EXPLAINED WHAT OUR
5
EXPECTATIONS WERE, AND SHE BACKED ME.
AND SO THE SEVILLE GROUP,
6
7
ALTHOUGH THEY WORKED AT CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE FOR SIX MONTHS AS AN
OUTREACH CONSULTANT PROVIDING JEFF FLORES WORKING 20 HOURS A WEEK
8
9
PERFORMING OUTREACH THAT WASN'T
IT ACTUALLY WAS OCCURRING.
THAT I COULDN'T DOCUMENT THAT
10
I WILL POINT OUT THAT IF YOU GO ON THEIR WEBSITE, THE
11
SEVILLE GROUP'S WEBSITE,
IT SAYS THEY WERE THE PROGRAM MANAGERS
12
FOR CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE'S RECOVERY FROM THE EARTHQUAKE.
AND I
13
14
15
GUESS THEY CERTAINLY CAN STATE THAT THEY HAD SOME FORM OF ROLE,
BUT THEY WEREN'T THERE FOR SIX OF THE SIX AND A HALF YEARS THAT I
WAS THERE.
16
SO THE FACT THAT RENE FLORES WAS
DOWN AND THEY WERE POINTING
17
OUT -- THEY WERE WALKING THE CAMPUS THAT WE
DIDN'T DO THE
18
MODERNIZATION FOR.
THEY WERE WALKING CHULA VISTA MIDDLE SCHOOL.
19
20
21
22
THE SCHOOL I TOLD YOU ABOUT IN THE BEGINNING WHICH WAS MODERNIZED
UNDER THE CONSTRUCTION MANAGEMENT OVERSIGHT OF 3D/INTERNATIONAL
OR 3D/I. SO I SAID, IS THIS A COINCIDENCE? JESUS GANDARA IS
BRAND-NEW. MAYBE HE DOESN'T KNOW THAT WE DIDN'T MODERNIZE THAT
23
CAMPUS.
AND SO I FELT IT APPROPRIATE THAT I HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY
24
25
26
27
TO TELL HIM THAT.
WITHOUT TELLING HIM THAT I KNEW WHAT HE WAS SAYING TO THOSE
INDIVIDUALS, I SIMPLY WANTED TO POINT OUT TO HIM WHEN HARRIS
ARRIVED AND WHICH OF THE SCHOOLS WE WERE RESPONSIBLE FOR
28 MODERNIZING. AND I SAT -- THAT OPPORTUNITY CAME DURING A LUNCH

3570
1 THAT EITHER RAMON LEYBA SET UP FOR ME SO I COULD SHARE IT OR
2 DIANNE RUSSO, I DON' T RECA[~L WHOM, BUT THE THREE OF US WELL,
3 IT WAS THE FOUR OF US, JESUS GANDARA, RAMON LEYBf'./ WHO WAS THEN
4 COO, DIANNE RUSSO, AND MYSELF. ON THAT OCCASION I LET THE
5 SUPERINTENDENT KNOW 'rHAT HARRIS WAS NOT THE PROGRAM MANAGER OR
6 THE CONSTRUCTION lvIANAGER FOR CHULA VIST.Z', tEDDLE SCHOOL.
7 Q. WERE YOU ABLE TO HAVE ANY TYPE OF CORDIAL RELATIONSHIP
8 WITH DR. GANDARA?
9
A.
NO.
NO.
10
Q.
IN TERMS OF THE SELECTION PROCESS FOR THE PROGRAH
11 MANAG::R
12 A. I SHOULD CLARIFY. I DON'T KNOW HO\~ TO CHARACTERIZE
13 CORDIAL. IT ~jAS -- IT WAS YOU KNOW, IT lAIASN'T
14 CONFRONTATIONAL. IT WAS JUST -- I HAD MINIMAL INTERACTIONS WITH
15 HIM.
16 Q. APPROXIMf'.TELY HOW MANY INTERACTIONS, BEING THAT YOU
17 l'IEREN' T THE ON-SITE PERSON THERE, DO YOU THINK YOU HAD FROM THE
18 Tlt--1E THAT HE vIAS HIRED UNTIL THE TIME THAT YOU WERE INVOLVED IN
19 THE INTERVIEvJ PROCESS FOR PROGRAI, MANAGER?
20
A.
PROBABLY NO t10RE THAN THREE.
THREE.
21
Q.
DID YOU EVER GET AN OPPORTUNITY TO TAKE HIM TO ANY
22 DINNERS, TAKE HUJ TO FLEMING'S OR MORTON'S OR ANY PLACE LIKE
23 THAT?
24
A.
NO.
25
Q.
WHAT ABOUT ,ZI,NY
-- WELL, LET ME KEEP GOING vETH THE
26 SELECTION PROCESS ITSELF. WERE YOU INVOLVED WITH THE ACTUAL
27 RESPONSE TO THE RFQ FOR THE PROGRAM MANAGEMENT?
28 A. YEAH. I WROTE THE ENTIR::TY OF THE RESPONSE, THE

3571
1 STATENENT OF QUALIFICATIONS. I AUTHORED IT. I SUBNI'l''l'ED IT. WE
2 WERE SHORT LISTED, NOTIFIED, AND I LED THE INTERVIEW 'l'EAN AND
3 WE
4
5
6
7
8
Q. TELL US ABOU'l' TEE IN'l'ERVIEvl TEAM IN T:::R1·1S OF I'IHAT DID
YOU GUYS DO FOR AN INTERVIEW?
A. WELL, WE PREPARED A POWERPOINT THAT HIGHLIGIITED WHAT WE
IIAD ACCOMPLISH:::D IN TilE LAST THREE AND A HALF YEARS, THREE YEARS.
WE AC'l'UALLY HIGHLIGHTED TilE DIE'FERENTIATORS OF v/H1'.T ",mOE PROP BB
9
10 i
A SUCCESS AND A SUCCESS FOR THE STUDENTS AND TilE CONMUNITY.
THERE ARE -- WE SUBNITTED I'l' RIGHT WITH OUR QUALS PROPOSAL IN
AND
11
12
I'lRITING AND IT lr-lAS
HEADLINES WH:::CH WAS
PART OF TilE POI'lERPOINT -- THE NEvVSPAPER
"SvIEETvIATER KNOWS THE ABC' S 0: SCHOOL
13
14
CONSTRUCTION" AND IT -- Til ERE 'S ANOTHF,R NEWSPAPER IIEADLINE.'
WASN'T QUOTED IN THAT ONE. CHRISTOPHER DUNNE WAS. BUT WE HAD
15 BEEN -- THERE WAS A TV PRESS CONF'ERENCE. ~IE HAD ACTUALLY -- KATY
16 ,'mIGHT SAID, "RANDY, I DOK"1' LIKE DOING THESE THIKGS." SO IN
17 FRONT OF -- THIS IS NOT -- WE HAD TIIAT PIIOTO IN OUR POWERPOINT,
18 THIS BATTERY OF TV CREWS AND CAMERAS ROLLING WHERE I WAS TALKING
19 ABOUT THE ACCELER1'.TION OF' THE PROGRAM AND THE: SUMMER SPRINT
20 SUCCESSES 1'JW TilE ESCALA':'ION SAvn:GS 1'.ND ~IHY WE DID IT, AND IT
21 WAS ON TV.
22 BUT ANnlAY, THAT WAS IN OUR Po\~ERPOINT. AND WE SAID THIS IS
23 WHAT WE SAID WE vlERE GOING TO DO AND TillS IS WHAT WE DID. ~IE HAD
24 CHANGE ORDERS THAT ARE WELL WITHIN INDUSTRY STANDARDS. OUR
25 PROGRAN MANAGEMENT FEE IS 2.9 PERCENT OE' THE PROGRAM, WHICH IS
26 UNDE:R THE 3 PERCENT THAT WE HAD BUDGETED :OR IT, AND WE WERE --
27 YOU KKO\'l, ~jE ~ERE WRAPPIKG UP 1'. REALLY IdCE BOW AROUND A NICE
28 SUCCESSFUL DELIVERY OF PROJECTS. SO vJE PRESENTED TO THE PANEL 0:

3572
1
2
3
4
5
EIGHT AND .•.
Q. FROM THERE WERE YOU INVITED TO COME BACK TO AN
ADDITIONAL INTERVIEW?
A. YES. I WILL SAY WE DID LEARN FROM ACTUALLY RAM6N LEYBA
{"HO TOLD US WE {"ERE IN FIRST PLACE AFTER THE INTERVIEW -- AFTER
6 THE PAPER SCREENING AND INTERVIE~1 PROCESS. RAM6N WAS AMONG THE
7 EIGHT -- HE LET US KNOW WE WERE IN FIRST PLACE, BUT THAT IT
8 \~ASN'T OVER. ALTHOUGH, THE RFQ DIDN'T 'Cl'.LK ABOU':' A SECOND
9 STEP -- OR A THIRD STEP. THERE'S THE QUALS EVALUATION, A SHORT
:!.O LISTING AND INTERVIE\~, AND 1':' SAID l'. RECOMMENDATION WAS GOING TO
11 GO TO THE BOARD. BUT HE ADVISED US THERE WAS A NEW -- A THIRD
12 STEP CotHNG. AND WE RECEIVED A LETTER THAT THERE It/OULD BE A
13 SECOND INTERVIEW AND THAT WE WOULD BE AFFORDED TEN l"'INUTES TO
14 PRESENT OUR QUALS AGAIN lIND THlI.T THE SELECTION WOULD BE MADE
15 AFTER THAT SECON:J INTERVIEW.
16 Q. THAT WAS A NEW PART OF THE PROCEDURE; THAT YOU WERE ,JUST
17 INFORMED OF?
18 A. I'M SORRY?
19 Q. THAT WAS A NEW PART OF THE PROCEDURE YOU WERE JUST
20 INFOR~mD OF, THIS ADDITIONAL INTERVIEW?
21 A. YES.
22 Q. I THINK WE'RE fvlOVING ALONG A'=' A DECENT ENOUGH PACE. I
23 WANT TO MAKE SURE MS. ASHE GETS A BREAK AS WELL AS YOURSELF. WHY
24 DON'T viE TlI.KE A TEN-[v'[INUTE COURTESY BREAK AND TH'SN WE' LL corv~E
25 BACK AND WE'LL PROCEED AGAIN.
26 GRlI.ND JURY FOREPERSON: GRAND JURY ?ROCEE:JINGS AND
27 INVESTIGA'CIONS l'.RE SECRET. YOU ARE, THEREFORE, ADMONISHED ON
28 BEHALF OF THE SAN DIEGO SUPERIOR COURT AND THE CRHlINAL GRl'.ND

3573
1 JURY NOT TO DISCLOSE YOUR GRAND JURY SUBPOENA OR YOUR GRAND JURY
2 APPEARANCE TO ANYONE, AND NOT TO REVEAL TO ANY PERSON ANY
3 QUESTIONS ASKED, OR ANY RESPONSES GIVEN, IN THE GRAND ,JURY, OR
4 ANY O'1'HER MATTERS CONCERNING THE NATURE OR SUBJECT OF THE GRAND
5 JURY'S INVESTIGATION, WHICH YOU LEARNED ABOUT BY YOUR GRAND cTURY
6 SOBPOENA OR DURING YOUR GRAND ,JURY APPEARANCE, EXCEPT TO YOUR OWN
LEGAL COUNSEL.
THIS ADMONITION CONTINUES UNTIL SUCH TIME AS THE
8 TRANSCRIPT OF THE GRAND JURY PROCEEDING IS MADE PUBLIC, OR UNTIL
9 DISCLOSURE IS OTHER\~ISE AUTHORIZED BY THE COURT OR BY OPERATION
10 OF LA,,/. VIOLATION OF THIS ADMONITION IS PUNISHABLE AS CONTEMPT
11 OF COURT.
12 t1R. SCHORR: DO YOU UNDERSTAND AND AGREE TO ABIDE BY THAT
13 ADMONITION?
14 THE WITNESS: YES.
15 MR. SCHORR: THANK YOU, SIR. IIJE' LL TAKE OUR BREAK AND WE'LL
16 GET BfI.CK WHEN YOU GUYS fI.RE ALL BACK. THANK YOU.
17 (RECESS. )
18 GRAND JURY SECRETARY: \'iE HAVE ALL 16 GRAND JURORS ARE HERE.
19 BY MR. SCHORR:
20 Q. BEFORE WE GO ON IHTH THE QUE;S1'IONS ABOUT THE INTERVIEW
21 OR THE ADDITIONA::" IN'.rERVIE\~ PROCESS, I JUST WANT TO ASK YOU A
22 COUPLE QUESTIONS THAT WE RECEIVED FROl'l THE GRAND JURY BEFORE I'IE
23 GET TOO FAR AFIELD.
24 QUESTION 263 FROM GRAND ,JUROR NO. 16. 1'1' RELA'1'ES BACK JUST
25 A FEW MINUTES. IT SAYS, "WHICH SEVILLE GROUP CLAIMS TO BE, IF
26 YOU KNOW, 'l'HE PROGRAM MANAGER FOR NORTHRIDGE?" THERE IS NOW SGT,
27 WHICH IS RENE FLORES, AND THERE IS SCS, WHICH IS JEFf' FLORES.
28 WHEN YOU REFERENCED THAT, \'JERE YOU SPEAKING TO ONE IN PARTICULAR?

3574
1 A. I WAS REFERRING TO THE SEVILLE GROUP, WHICH IS
2 RENE FLORES'S COMPANY. I HAVE NOT CHECKED SEVILLE CONSTRUCTION
3 SERVICES, INC., \~HICH IS THE SON'S COMPANY. I DON'T KNOW vlHETHER
4 IT'S ON HIS WEBSITE OR NOT.
5 MR. SCHORR: OKAY. JUST A REt4INDER, OBVIOUSLY, TO THE JURY.
6 'rHIS IS DIFORM-lI.TION THJl.T HE'S REPRESENTING FRm4 OUTSIDE. HE HAS
7 PERSONAL KNOWLEDGE FRO~l CHECKING THE \~EBSITE OF SGI.
8 IS THAT CORRECT?
9 THE WITNESS: I' t" ALWAYS n:TERESTED HOW PEOPLE ARE
10 PORTRAYING THEIR ROLE ON THAT VERY ~lONut~ENTAl. PROGRAM.
11 MR. SCHORR: SURE. I 't~ REMINDING THE JURY NOT TO DO ANY
12 INDEPENDENT RESEARCH TO LOOK AT ANY WEBSITES OR ANYTHING ELSE.
13 NOT THAT I HAVE SEEN OR HEARD YOU'VE DONE ANYTHING, BUT JUST A
14 CONSTANT REMINDER.
15 Q. 264. QUESTION NO. 264 FROM GRAND JUROR NO.2 IS, "WAS
16 THE FACT THAT HARRIS WAS NOT RESPONSIBl.E FOR YOUR PREDECESSOR'S
17 SHODDY WORK AT CV MIDDLE SCHOOL EVER BROUGHT UP DURING THE FINAL
18 SELECTION PROCESS?"
19
20
A.
Q.
NO.
SO GETTING INTO THE LAST OR I ASSUME TH::: NEXT
21
INTERVIE\~, THE NE\~ INTERVIEW, CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT THAT IN TERMS
22
OF \,IHAT YOU WERE ASKED TO DO?
DID YOU FIND OUT AHEAD OF TIt'IE
23
ABOUT
WERE YOU GOING TO BE DOING A PRESENTATION OR WHAT Ii/AS
24
25
26
GOING TO BE TAKING PLACE AND WHO DID YOU UNDERSTAND 'I'HE INTERVIEW
WOULD BE WITH?
A. WE RECEIVED A ONE-PAGE LET'l'ER THAT STI PULA TED THAT
27 THERE WAS THIS FOl.l.OW-UP, SECOND INTERVIEW AND THAT WE \"OULD BE
28 AFFORDED TEN MINUTES TO PRESENT OUR QUALIFICATIONS TO THIS SECOND

3575
1 INTERVIEW PANEL; THAT WE WERE REQUIRED TO BRING THE PRESIDENT OF
2 OUR COMPANY AND THAT THE LEAD PERSON FOR SWEETWATER AND THE
3 PRESIDENT WERE ALL THAT WOULD BE ALLOWED TO ATTEND THAT SECOND
4 INTERVIEW PANEL. I DON'T RECALL WHETHER THERE WAS A DESCRIPTION
5 OF WHO THE PANEL WOULD BE. JUST THE LOCATION AS TO WHERE IT
6 WOULD TAKE PLACE.
7 Q. WAS THIS A NORMAL PROCEDURE, THAT YOU WOULD BE ASKED TO
8 BRING THE PRESIDENT OF YOUR COMPANY AS WELL AS THE LEAD PERSON TO
9 AN ADDITIONAL INTERVIEW?
10 A. NO. IN MY 17 IN MY 15 YEARS OF RESPONDING TO RFQ'S
11 AND BEING SHORT LISTED AT A VERY HIGH RATE AND PARTICIPATING IN
12 MULTIPLE SHORT-LIST INTERVIEWS, I'VE NEVER SEEN A LETTER THAT
13 REQUIRED THAT THE PRESIDENT OF THE COMPANY ATTEND THE FOLLOW-UP
14 INTERVIEW. THAT'S TYPICALLY THE LEAST PERSON OWNERS ARE
15 INTERESTED IN MEETING BECAUSE THEY ARE THE FURTHEST AWAY FROM THE
16 DELIVERY OF THE ACTUAL SERVICES IN TERMS OF THE PEOPLE ON THE
17 GROUND DOING THE WORK. SO IT WAS SOMEWHAT -- IT WAS VERY, VERY
18 UNUSUAL.
19 Q. I HAVE AN ADDITIONAL QUESTION, 265 FROM GRAND JUROR
20 NO. 16. IT INDICATES, "HOW LONG WAS THE FIRST INTERVIEW THAT YOU
21 HAD DONE?"
22 A. THE FIRST INTERVIEW WAS PROBABLY IN TOTAL AROUND
23
24
25
26
27
28
45 MINUTES, WITH A 25-MINUTE PRESENTATION OPPORTUNITY AND
15 MINUTES OR SO OF QUESTIONS.
Q. AND THE FOLLOW-UP QUESTION WAS, "WAS TEN MINUTES SHORT
FOR A SECOND INTERVIEW, IF YOU HAVE ANY CONTEXT?"
A. YES, THE COMBINATION OF BEING AFFORDED TEN MINUTES FOR
A FOLLOW-UP INTERVIEW AND THE FACT THAT JUST THE PRESIDENT AND I

3576
1 WOULD BE ATTENDING, THE COMBINATION JUST DIDN'T SEEM VERY -- IT
2 WAS VERY UNUSUAL. IT WAS ...
3 Q. TELL US ABOUT WHAT TOOK PLACE. DID YOU ATTEND THIS
4 ADDITIONAL INTERVIEW?
5
A.
YES.
6
Q.
WHO WAS
PRESENT FOR IT FROM THE SCHOOL SIDE?
7
A.
ON THE DISTRICT SIDE THERE WAS THE SUPERINTENDENT,
8 JESUS GANDARA; THE CHIEF OPERATING OFFICER AT THE TIME, RAMON
9 LEYBA; AND A WOMAN, I DON'T RECALL HER NAME. SHE WAS A STAFF
10 ATTORNEY WHO WORKED FOR BONIFACIO GARCIA'S FIRM, THE LEGAL
11 COUNSEL.
12 Q. WAS THAT MS. BANUELOS, AEROBEL BANUELOS; DO YOU RECALL?
13 A. AEROBEL, THAT'S WHO IT WAS, YES. AND BOTH AEROBEL AND
14 RAMON LEYBA HAPPENED TO BE ON THEY WERE ON THE PANEL OF EIGHT
15 THAT RANKED US FIRST. JUST THOUGHT I'D POINT THAT OUT.
16 Q. AND IN YOUR EXPERIENCE, IS IT NORMAL TO HAVE A
17 SUPERINTENDENT ON THE INTERVIEW PANEL?
18 A. OVER THE COURSE OF THE LAST DECADE OF WORKING ON THESE
19 TYPES OF PROGRAMS, THE SUPERINTENDENT IS -- OCCASIONALLY
20 PARTICIPATES IN A PANEL, BUT I'VE NEVER SEEN IT WHERE THEY WERE
21 PART OF A NARROWER PANEL. I'VE SEEN A SUPERINTENDENT ON A PANEL
22 OF 12 PEOPLE AND THE SUPERINTENDENT HAPPENS TO BE AMONG THOSE IN
23 ATTENDANCE. I SAW THAT AT AN INTERVIEW AT PALO ALTO UNIFIED
24 SCHOOL DISTRICT AND A FEW OTHERS, BUT I'VE NEVER SEEN A
25 SECOND-PHASE INTERVIEW WITH A SUPERINTENDENT.
26 Q. IN TERMS OF THE INTERVIEW ITSELF, FROM THE SCHOOL SIDE,
27 WHO WAS THE ONE CONTROLLING OR LEADING THE INTERVIEW?
28 A. ONE HUNDRED PERCENT OF WHAT WAS COMING FROM THE

3577
DISTRICT WAS FRm~ SUPERINTEND"N n GANDARA.
2 Q. I'IALK US THROUGH WHAT HAPPENED.
3 A. WELL, WE WALKED IN. I WAS -- ARRIVED THERE WITH GUY
4 ERICKSON, THE PRESIDENT OF HARRIS & ASSOCIATES. HE HAPPENED TO
5 HAVE ANNOUNCED HIS PLAN rO RErIRE IN THE THREE MONTHS PRIOR. AND
6 c-EFF MY n~t~EDIATE S:JPERVISOR, SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT AND
7 BOARD MEMBER OF HARRIS -- WE 'I'HOUGHT IT APPROPRIATE TO HAVE JEFF
8 COOPER ATTEND AS WELL SO THAT WE HAD BOTH THE CURRENT PRESIDENT
9 AND THE TRANSITIONING THE PERSON WHO WOULD BE THE PRESIDENT OF
10 C'HE COMPANY, IE' ~IE WERE SCCCESSF'JL IN THIS PURSUIT, IN JCLY OF
11 2007, ~IAS SCHEDULED TO BE c-EFF COOPER. SO WE ARRIVED \"ITH GUY
12 I ARRIVED WITH GUY ERICKSON AND JEFF COOPER AND WE PROCEEDED INTO
13 THE CONFERENCE ROOM THERE },T rHE HEADQUARTERS WITH DR. GANDARA
14 AND AEROBEL BAN'JELOS AND R.I'116N LEYBA. SO I CAN DESCRIBE HOI'/ THAI'
15 INTERVIEIi, liJENT?
16
Q.
PLEASE.
17
A. WE ARRIVED. I HAD TAKEN OUR POWERPOINT SLIDES AND
18 REDUCED 'I'HEt'1 TO BASICALLY 18-INCH BOARDS, FROt'1 CORE BO)".RDS, AND
19 PUT C'HEt'1 ON A 'I'RIPOD AND SET THEH UP REA:JY TO GIVE A TAB::'E':'OP
20 REDELIVERY 0" O:rR PRESENTATION }\ND DO IT IN SO~1EWHAT OF AN
21 ACCELERATED MANNER. SO THAT WE CO:rLD AGAIN SHOW OUR HIGHLIGHI'
22 THE S:rCCESSES AND THE COMMUNITY AND PRESS, THE POSITIVE PRESS.
23 p.ND WE ARRIVED AND I JUS'!' WANT TO DESCRIBE THAT 1'1' SEEr-lED
24 TO t~E THAT DR. GANDARA ,'lAS T::1IS WAS JUST GOING TO BE A VERY
25 • FUN THING FOR HIM TO CONDUCT. AND I SAID, "WELL, ~IE' RE READY TO
26 GIVE OUR PRESENTATION." AND HE SAID, "NO, YOU ARE NOT" "YOU
27 DON'T GET TO GIVE YOUR PRESENTATION AGAIN." YOU Dr D THAT
28 ALREADY. \'IE :JON' 'I' NEED YOU TO DO THAT. BUT, BY THE \

3578
1 Cll.N YOU SHOI'/ ME YOUR DRlVE'" S LICENSE? I JUST ~)ANT -- AND CAN
2 YOU S"OW ME YOU" BUSINESS CARD? I WANT TO HAVE EVIDENCE THAT YOU
3 .ll.RE IN FAC'1' '1'"E PRESIDENT OF H.ll.RRIS & ASSOCIATES." I THOUGH'I'
4 TH.ll.T WAS A LITTLE BIT ODD, WHICH WE COMPLIED WITH, AND THEN I
5 PROCEEDED TO -- HE TOLD US THERE'S THREE QUESTIONS. I SAID OKAY.
6 AND HE SAID, "WELL, GUY, I SUPPOSE" "I SUPPOSE THIS IS
7 FOR YOU, OR COULD BE FOR JEFF OR -- BUT THE FIRST QUESTION IS I
8 WANT YOU GUYS TO TELL ME ABOUT YOUR DIVERSITY POLICY AT HARRIS."
9 AND GUY SAl D, "I' tvl HAPPY TO TAKE THAT," AND HE DESCRIBED HARRIS'S
10 DIVERSITY PROGRAtvl, OU" COtvll':ITMENT TO DIVERSITY, OUR -- ,'lAS ABLE
11 TO CI~E DATA AND STATISTICS AS TO THE DIVERSE NATURE OF THE
12 COtvlPANY AND OUR COtvlMITtvlENT TO DIVERSITY AND DISADVANTAGED
13 BUSINESSES AND SO ON. AND DR. GANDARA APPEARED TO JUST NOT EVEN
14 BE PAYING ATTENTION.
15 NOW, I'LL TELL YOU, RAtvl6N LEYBA WAS LOOKING ACROSS THE ROOM
16 JUST -- I MEAN, HE WASN'T SAYING ANYTHING. HE CERTAINLY APPEARED
17 TO BE PAYING ATTENTION, AND I RECALL THE ATTORNEY ,'lAS SEEtvlED
18 TO BE PAYING ATTEN':'ION. SO ':'HAT WAS QUESTION NO. 1.
19 THEN HE SAID, "QUESTION NO.2." HE SAID, "RANDY, THIS ONE
20 IS FOR YOU." AND AGAIN, SMILING, AND KIND OE' -- "WE'LL SEE HOW
21 YOU DO ON THIS ONE. YOU GUYS DID OKAY ON THAT ONE." AND HE
22 SAID, "TELL tvlE THE ETHNIC AND RACIAL MAKEUP OF YOUR PROJECT
23 TEAM." AND I SAID, "SURE." I WENT THROUGH THEM I SAID CHRIS
24 DUNNE, CAUCASIAN; l':UHAMI'IAD TALLE IS !'

3579
1 THAT IS JUST FANTASTIC." AND I --
2 Q. JUST FOR THE RECORD, BECAUSE THIS IS TRANSCRIBED WE
3 DON'T A::.."myS GET 'l'EE TONE DOviN IN TRANSCRIPTION. ~IHAT TYPE OF'
4 TONE IS HE SPEAKING IN I1HEN HE'S TELLING YOU THIS?
5 A. I FELT LIKE I WAS IN A JIMMY KH1MEL SKIT; THAT HE WAS
6 JUST REALLY KIND OF LAUGHING AT THE SITUATION. lmD I SAID,
7 "WELL, DR. GANDARA I DO WORK \1ITH THESE PEOPLE." AND I SAID,
8 "BUT THERE'S ACTUALLY PHYSICAL EVIDENCE. YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE
9 WHAT ~lY TEAl'l IS COMPRISED OF." BECAUSE IF YOU LOOKED ON THE
10 BOARDS -- IN THE WATERI'IARK OF OUR POI'JERPOINT SLIDES AND ON THE
11 BOARDS, ,1E HAVE TAKEN I, PHOTO WITH ALL [vJY TEl'M MEMBERS ,1EARING
12 HARD HATS. I ~lEAN, YOU CAN TELL AN AFRICAN-AMERICAN PERSON
13 FROM -- IT WASN'T A FADED ENOUGH WATERMARK 'l'HA'l' YOU COULDN' '1' SEE.
14 ALTHOUGH THAT WASN'T -- I WASN'T USING THAT OBVIOUSLY TO CHEAT,
15 BECAUSE I KNEI', THE MAKEUP OF MY OWN TE.z\M, BUT I POINTED IT OUT TO
16 HIM. AND HE GOES, "OH, vm,.i." HE GOES AND -- HE SAID, "OKl'.Y,
1 7 ':'HANKS. "
18 HE8E'S THE THIRD QUESTION. HE SAID, "RANDY, THIS ONE IS
19 ALSO FOR YOU." I SAID, "OKAY." HE SAID, "I'M GOING TO DESCRIBE
20 A SITUATION FOR YOU AND I WANT YOU TO TELL ME WHAT YOU ARE GOING
21 TO DO." AND I SAID, "OKl'.Y." HE SAID, "THERE'S A CONTRACTOR THAT
22 THERE;' S SOME DIRT THAT THEY ,,)ANT TO POUR" -- rE :JOESN' T Hl'.VE A
23 CONSTRUCTION BACKGROUND. THAT'S V/HY I SPECIFICALLY REt1EMBER THE
24 CONTEXT' UNDER "lHICH HE WALKED THROUGH THIS. HE SAID, "THERE'S
25 SOME DIRT THAT A CONTRACTOR WANTS TO POUR CEMENT ON THAT ISN'T
2 6 READY TO BE -- '1'0 HAVE CEMENT AND YOU KNOW IT .Z\ND THE CONTRACTOR
27 SAYS THEY WANT TO DO IT ANYWAY; THAT THEY WANT TO POUR THE
28 CEMENT, AND YOU KNOW THE CONTR.z\CTOR SHOULDN'T. Bur THE

3580
CONTRACTOR GOES TO RAHON," AND HE'S POINTING '1'0 RAMON l,EYBA
2 SITTING NEXT TO HIM, "AND RA~10N SAYS TELLS THE CONTRACTOR '1'0
3 GO AHEAD AND POUR IT, AND YOU i!"IND OUT ABOUT IT. WHAT I'IOULD YOU
4 DO?" I SAID, "I WOU;:,D TELl, YOU, DR. GANDARA. I WOULD BRING IT
5 IMl'lEDIATEl,Y '1'0 YOUR ATTENTlot;." AKD I COULDN' '1' EVEN GET -- I
6 SAID, "I WOULD GO TO YOU." AND HIS RESPONSE WAS, "GREAT ANSWER,
7 RANDY. GREAT ANSWER. YOU REALLY NAILED THAT ONE."
8
9
1G
11
Q.
P ..
Q.
A.
P.ND YOU ARE AGAIN -­
OKAY.
-- DESCRIBING A TONE?
A TONE OF JUST -- IT WAS A VERY STRANGE TONE THAT 'rHE
12 SUPERINTENDENT WAS TAKING -- MAKING VERY LIGHT OF -- LIKE I SAID,
13 I FELT LIKE I "lAS IN A I DON'T KNOW, OK A GAl'lE SHo\~. IT "lAS
14 AS THOUGH, DING, DING, DING YOU GOT THAT ONE. AND THEN IT WAS
15 THANK YOU, VERY MUCH. AND WE LITERALLY WALKED OUT, LIKE "WHAT
16 JUST HAPPENED THERE? WHAT WAS THAT?"
17
18
19
20
21
Q. I HAVE A COUPLE ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS.
HR. SCHORR: IT'S 266.
GRAND JURY SECRETARY: YES, 266.
BY MR. SCHORR:
Q. FROM GRAND JUROR NO. 17. "DURING THIS TNTERVIEI'i
22
23
24
PROCESS DID, DR. GANDARA ~lENTION
.n.BNORMAL ITIES?"
A. NO.
THE CHU:"'A VISTA MIDDl,E SCHOOL
25
Q. ANYTHING ABOUT THE SECOND QUESTION W.n.S DEPENDENT ON THE
26
FIRS':' SO I'LL NOT ASK IT.
ANYTHING IN CONTEXT IN TERMS Of WHAT
27
28
YOU HP,D DONE IN THE PAS':' OR YOUR QUALIfICATIONS OR ANYTHING Of
SllBS':'ANCE REALLY IN THE --

3581
1
2
A. NO. NO, THAT Wl',S IT. NOTHING.
Q. WAS THERE AN ADDITIONAL -- DO YOU RECALL WHE'I'HER OR NOT
3
4
5
THERE WAS AN ADDITIONAL PERSON, A RALPH MUNOZ,
BEEN PRESENT FOR THAT INTERVIEW,?
A. RAPHAEL MUNOZ,?
THAT COULD HAVE
6
Q.
SOlvJETHING LIKE THAT.
7
A.
I
DON'T RECALL A FOURTH PERSON.
8
Q.
OKAY.
DO YOt; KNOW WHO THAT INDIVIDUAL IS?
9
A.
THE NAME SOUNDS FAMILIAR. AND, I MEAN, I DEFDIITELY
10 HAVE MET HIM. I DON'T KNOW WHETHER HE'S AN AREA SUPERINTENDENT
11
OR .••
12
Q. OKAY. AE"I'ER THE INTERVIEW, DID YOU -- DID YOU END UP
13 HAVING ANY TYPE OF COMMUNICATION \vITH MS. QUINONES, PEARL
14 QUINONES?
15 A. YES.
16 Q. IN TERMS OF MS. QUINONES, CAN YOU DE:SCRIBE -- WE'RE NOW
17 IN 2007. HAD YOU DEALT WITH MS. QUINONES PREVIOUSLY, EITHER
18 WHILE YOU \vERE THERE 1'.'1' HARRIS OR DURING THE BUILD-UP OF THE
19 RESPONSE TO THE RE'P PROCESS? HOW DID YOU KNOW MS. QUINONES?
20 A. I FIRST MET MS. QUINONES ON THE OCCASION OF -- I WAS
21 CALLED BY ANDY BERG, WHO WAS ON THE CITIZENS BOND OVERSIGHT
22 COt>1NiTTEE -- AN:J = PRESENTED ALL OF THE !10NTHLY PROGRESS REPORTS
23 TO 'l'HE CITIZENS BOND OVERSIGH':' CONN:TTEE, AND SO I KNE\~ WEO ANDY
24 BERG ~IAS. AND HE CALLED ME AND ASKED HE TO JOIN HIN FOR LUNCH
25 WITH PEARL QUIt10NES BECAUSE SHE WANTED TO TALK ABOUT A PROJECT
26 LABOR AGREENENT AND PUTTING A PROJECT LABOR AGREENENT IN PLACE AT
27 SWEETlvATER. AND I TOLD ANDY BERG OVER THE PHONE THAT IN LIGHT OF
28 THE FACT THAT HE ~JAS -- 1-IORKED FOR AN ELECTRICIAN FIRM hND WhS A

3582
1 MEMBER OF THE SAN DIEGO ELECTRICAL CONTRACTORS ASSOCIATION, TO
2 WHICH IF THERE WAS A PLA HE AND HIS FIRMS WOULD BE A BENEFICIARY
3 THEREOF, THAT IT WAS INAPPROPRIATE FOR HIM TO CALL ME AND ASK ME
4 TO GO TO A LUNCH AND TALK ABOUT A PROJECT LABOR AGREEMENT. I
5 TOLD HIM I WOULD RUN IT BY KATY WRIGHT BEFORE I WOULD AGREE TO
6 MEET WITH HIM. AND I DID.
7 I RAN IT BY KATY WRIGHT AND SHE MARCHED ME INTO BRUCE
8 HUSSON, THE COO AT THE TIME, OFFICE AND BRUCE PROCEEDED TO SAY
9 THAT HE HAD A PLA AT SAN DIEGO UNIFIED FOR THEIR PREDECESSOR BOND
10 MEASURE AND THAT IT COST THEM HANDSOMELY IN TERMS OF THE UNION
11 DUES THAT WERE PAID AND THAT HE DOESN'T CARE IF I MEET WITH ANDY
12 OR NOT; THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE A PROJECT LABOR AGREEMENT AT
13 SWEETWATER. HE SAID, "GO AHEAD AND MEET." SO I DID. AND I WENT
14 AHEAD AND MET, BUT I -- AS I EXPLAINED, I WAS THE PROGRAM
15 DIRECTOR FOR THE LOS ANGELES COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT BOND
16 PROGRAM AND THAT BOARD, UP IN LOS ANGELES, HAD VOTED PRIOR TO THE
17 BOND MEASURE PASSING TO PUT -- SHOULD IT PASS THEY WOULD PUT A
18 PROJECT LABOR AGREEMENT IN PLACE. SO UPON BEING AWARDED THAT
19 CONTRACT AS THE PROGRAM DIRECTOR, ONE OF MY FIRST MISSIONS OR
20 TASKS WAS TO NEGOTIATE THE PROJECT LABOR AGREEMENT WITH THE 11
21 UNIONS IN LOS ANGELES. I HAD A PLA EXPERT SUBCONSULTANT AND
22 LEGAL COUNSEL SPECIALIST WORKING FOR ME AND I NEGOTIATED AND THEN
23 PUT IN PLACE PLA AT LACCD.
24 I ALSO HAD A PROJECT LABOR AGREEMENT MANAGEMENT PLAN SO I'M
25 PREPARED TO MANAGE ONE IF THERE WERE ONE. BUT I CAN ALSO SPEAK
26 TO THE PROS AND CONS AND NOT BEING AN ADVOCATE FOR OR AGAINST
27 PROJECT LABOR AGREEMENTS AND IT'S UNDER THAT CONTEXT THAT I
28 AGREED TO MEET FOR LUNCH AND HAVE MY PLA MANAGEMENT PLAN AND BE

3583
1 PREPlmED TO TALK ABOUT THE BENEFITS AND OTHER THINGS.
2 SO l'iE MET FOR LUNCH. I TOLD HIM I HAD EXPERIENCE ,HTH IT.
3 PEARL QUINONES ASKED ME l'IIiAT I FELT ABOUT THEH. I SAID I DON'T
4 HAVE l\ FEELING ABOUT THEM ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. I \'lOULD JUST
5 TELL YOU HOW THEY WORK, HOW MUCH THEY COST, WHAT PROGRAHS CAN
6 COME OUT OF THOSE AND .·mAT ALTERNATlVES THERE ARE TO PUTTlNG IN A
7 FULL-B[,OWN PLA.
8 YOU CAN PUT IN A PROJEC1' STABILIZATION AGREEMENT AND ACHIEVE
9 THE APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAMS THAT YOU WOULD HAVE IN A PLA. YOU
10 CAN ALSO ',JeRK TOWARDS PUTTING TOGETHER AN APPRENTICESHIP PROGRAt"l
11 SO THAT THE SWEET\~ATER VOC.n.TIONALLY FOCUSED YOUTH WOULD FIND A
12 WAY TO VOCATIONAL POSITIONS AS A TRANSITIONING OPPORTUNITY. YOU
13 CAN DO ALL THAT IHTHOUT A PLA. AND I SIHPLY WANTED TO STATE THAT
14 A PLA WOULD NOVE HARD CONSTRUC1'ION DOLL.n.RS INTO THE UNION HALL
15 DUES IF YOU WENT THAT ROUTE.
16 WE THE LUNCH WAS OVER. I TOLI) BRUCE HUSSON AND KATY
17 WRI GHT HOW THE LUNCH WENT. A:W ACCORDING TO BRUCE HUSSON, HE
18 CALLED UP ANDY BERG AND CHEWlm HIM OUT AND TOLD HIM IF YOU \'iANT
19 TO GET KICKED OFF THE CITIZENS BOND OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE YOU'LL
20 HAVE ANOTliER SUCH MEETING, BUT YOU ARE UNDER NO CIRCUt"lSTANCES TO
21 BE ADVOCM'ING BOAi

3584
1 STAT El1ENT . UNLESS BASI:~D UPON THAT STATEMENT YOU DID SOIVlETHING OR
2 REACTED UPON OR DEALT WITH l1S. QUINONES OR l1R. BERG DIFFERENTLY
3 OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, I~E! LL DISREGARD THAT STATEl1ENT.
4 A. OKAY. WELL, I DO HAVE SOME FOLLOW-UP AS A FRAl'1E OF
5 REFERENCE. ANDY BERG DID CALL ME UP. HE WAS UPSET AT l1E THAT I
6 GOT HUI[ IN TROUBLE. THAT WAS -- THERE WAS A CONVERSATION.
7 Q. OKAY. AGAIN, E'OR THE PURPOSE OF THIS HEARING, IT! S
8 REALLY NOT A CRITICAL FOCUS OF THE HEARING EITHER WAY SO I'LL ASK
9 THAT WE DISREGARD THAT ASPECT OF IT.
1C YOU !eSTABLISHED THAT YOU HAD NET MS. QUINONES. NOW, BACK MO
11 THE TIME FRA1VlE AFTER YOU HAD THIS INTERVn;W -- THIS INTERESTING
12 INTERVIEW WITH DR. GANDARA lIND OTHER INDIVIDUALS THAT \'lERE;
13 PRESENT AT THAT INTERVIEW. DID YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY '1'0 [VlEET
14 IHTH MS. QUINONES PRIOR TO THE OFFICIAL SELECTION OF WHO WAS
15 GOING TO BE THE PROGRAl1 1'1ANAGER?
16 A. YES, I DID.
17 Q. HOW DID THAT r~EETING GO -- DID S'1E GIVE YOU ANY
18 INFORMATION ABOUT THE PROCESS?
19 A. YES.
2C
21
22
Q.
A.
Q.
WHAT TOOK PLACE?
MS. QUINONES TOLD l1E THAT WE WERE DONE.
rs THIS PRIOR TO THE BOARD ACTUALLY VOTIKG FOR THE
23 CONTRACT?
24
25
A.
Q.
YES.
WHAT DID SHE SAY?
26
27
28
A. SHE SInD THAT ARLIE; AND GREG HAVE ALREADY CUT A DEAL
AND THAl' I WAS DONE. AND I SAID, "WELL, WAI'I' A MINUTE. IT TAKES
THREE FOR ME TO BE; DONE." AND sm; SAID, "RANDY, ,JIl1MY" -- SHE

3585
1 WAS REFERRING TO JIM CARTMILL, BUT SHE REFERRED TO HIM AS JIMMY.
2 SHE SAID, "JIMMY WILL VOTE HOWEVER ARLIE TELLS HIM TO VOTE SO I'M
3 VOTING WITH THEM BECAUSE IT DOESN'T MATTER AND YOU'RE OUT."
4
Q.
WHAT WAS
YOUR RESPONSE?
5
6
TO DO"
A.
I SAID, "OKAY. GOT IT." YOU KNOW, "YOU ARE ENTITLED
I WASN'T IN ANY WAY TRYING TO SWAY ANYONE. I WAS
7 SIMPLY WANTING TO GATHER A LITTLE BIT OF PERTINENT FACTS AS TO
8 WHAT WAS TRANSPIRING.
9 Q. WAS THERE ANY EXPLANATION OR ANY SPECIFICS GIVEN TO YOU
10 BY MS. QUINONES ABOUT -- DISCUSSION ABOUT THE POOR WORK GOING ON,
11 ANY PROBLEMS WITH HARRIS, ANY JUSTIFICATION OTHER THAN A DEAL HAD
12 BEEN CUT AS TO WHY HARRIS WOULDN'T BE SELECTED?
13 A. NO. NO, THIS WAS -- SHE REFERRED TO RENE ON A FIRST
14 NAME BASIS AND REFERRED TO -- SHE SAID THAT GREG AND RENE ARE
15 FRIENDS FROM A LONG TIME BACK.
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
Q. AND DID SHE TELL YOU THEN THAT IT WAS GOING TO BE RENE
FLORES'S FIRM THAT WOULD GET THE CONTRACT?
A. NO. SHE SAID -- SHE CHARACTERIZED THAT GREG AND RENE
GO WAY BACK AND THAT WE WERE DONE.
Q. DID YOU END UP DECIDING WHETHER OR NOT TO ATTEND THE
BOARD MEETING WHERE THE ACTUAL SELECTION OR VOTE WOULD TAKE
PLACE?
23
A.
YES,
I DID.
24
25
Q.
A.
TELL US ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED THERE.
I FELT THAT SOMEHOW -- I FELT AND OUR TEAM THAT WORKED
26 TIRELESSLY FELT THAT SOMETHING WASN'T RIGHT ABOUT THIS, BUT THAT
27 IF THERE WAS GOING TO BE A VOTE, THAT WE WERE GOING TO ALL BE
28 THERE TO -- RIGHT IN THE FRONT ROW. THE PEOPLE THAT WORKED

3586
1 12 HOURS A DAY, WE WERE GOING TO BE IN THE FRONT ROW AND WATCH
2 THEl"l VOTE US OUT. AND SO MY STAFF -- I DECIDED THAT SINCE WE
3 WERE NOT AFFORDED THE OPPORTUNITY TO PRESENT OUR QUALS AT THE
4 SECOND INTERVIEW THAT SORRY, ABOUT THAT. THAT -- EXCUSE
5 ME -- THAT WE WERE GOING TO PRESENT IT. I WAS GOING TO PRESENT.
6 SO I ASKED FOUR ME.MBERS OF MY STAFF TO FILL OUT A THREE-MINUTE
7 PUBLIC COMMENT CARD AND DEFER ALL THEIR MINUTES TO ME AND,
8 ACTUALLY, I THINK FIVE PEOPLE DID, AND I THINK WE HAD 15 MINUTES,
9 BUT THEY SAID THEY WILL ONLY GIVE t·lE 12. I KNo\~ SANDI SMITH
10 ANNOUNCED THAT 'I'HERE vlERE ALL THESE THREE-MINCTE CARDS PULLED.
11 SO I PROCEEDED TO ':'HE PODIUM WITH MY TABLETOP POj~ERPOINT AND
12 I WALKED -- I DIDN'T EXPECT THIS AT ALL. SORRY. ANYWAY, OTHER
13 THAN REBCILDING CAL STATE NORTHRIDGE, v/HICH IS PROBABLY MY
14 PROUDES':' ACHIEVEMENT, BEING THE JI.RCHITECT OF, Ul'l -- AND DIRECTOR
15 OF DOING THAT MEANINGFCL WORK AT SWEETWATER WAS MY SECOND
16 PROUDEST ACHIEVEMENT. AND TO BE USHERED OUT THE WAY WE WERE I
17 JUST I DIDN'T WANT IT TO HAPPEN WITHOUT MY TEAM KNOWING THAT
18 WE WERE GOING TO NOT GO OUT WITHOUT A FIGHT AND NO':' GO OUT
19 WITHOUT REALLY THE RECORD BEING "mA'I' IT WAS.
20 SO WE HAD THE BOARDS ALL READY AND I'LL GET SOME
21 COMPOSURE HERE IN JI. SECOND. BCT I PUT THE BOARDS CP AND I
22 PRESENTED IT AND I WAc.,l\ED THEM TlIROUGH AND I c.,ITE?J,LLY -- LIKE I
23 TOLD YOU, I HAD THE PHO'rOCOPY OF THE NEWSPAPER ARTICLES
24 THEMSELVES, 'I'HE HEADLINES THAT H SWEETWATER KNOWS THE ABC'S OF
25 CONSTRCCTION" AND THE OTHER ONE. I SAT DOWN. CAME TO A VOTE.
2 6 IT WAS A VOTE FOR TIlE SEVILLE GROUP. WENT DOWN 4 -1 AND VIE WALKED
27 OUT AND I GOT ON THE 405 AND I SAID, "I HATE SAN DIEGO." IT'S A
28 NICE PLACE TO LIVE, BUT I'LL BE HONEST, I DIDN'T WANT TO COME

3587
1 BACK. BUT -- SORRY ABOUT THAT. I DON'T KNOvl vlHERE THAT CAME
2 FR01'1.
3 Q. NO, IT'S COMPLETEI,Y UNDERSTAN:JABLE. OBV:.OUSLY, YOU
4 OEVOTED A LOT OF YOUR TIME AND ENERGY TO THE 'tJORK YOU 010 IN 'l'HAT
5 AREA AND IT'S VERY POWERFUL.
6 AFTER THAT, HARRIS OBVIOUSLY WAS NOT SELECTED. IS
7 MR. MERCADO, VIAS HE THE ONE VOTE FOR -- OR AGAINST SGI/GILBANE?
8 1... YES.
9 Q.:N TERMS OF YOUR DEALINGS W:TH l-lR. MERC.".DO, HAD YOU
10 EVER TAKEN 1'1R. MERCADO TO ANY TYPE OF :JINNER OR BALL GAME
11 ANYTHING LIKE THAT?
12 A. NO. JAIME MERCADO WAS WAS VERY OUTSPOKEN ABOUT
13 HE or ON' T WANT TO MEET VlITH ANYBODY FOR ANY REASON ANYHOW,
14 ANYWHERE, ANYPLACE, EVER. VERY RESPECTABLE MAN.
15 Q. IN TERl"lS OF HARRIS'S POLICIES, IF YOU ARE AWARE OR WERE
16 AWARE AT THE T':t'lE, 1;-]OULD THEY DO CAHPAIGN DONAT':ONS TO IND:=V:=DUAL
17 BOARD IVlEMBER' S CAMPAIGNS?
18 A. YES.
19 Q. WHAT ABOUT LIKE PROPOSITIONS, WOULD THEY CONTRIBUTE TO
20 PROPOSITIONS?
21
22
A.
Q.
YES.
WERE YOU A::"LOIvE:J TO DO ANY TYPE OF ENTERTAINl-1ENT OR
23 SOCIA::"IZING ,UTH BOARD !-lEMBERS, EITHER SUPPORTING A FOUNDA'I'lON,
24 ATTENDING THOSE TYPE OF EVENTS, OR HAVING A l'lEAL WITH THEM IF
25 THERE viAS AN OCCASION?
26 A. WE::"::", I WILL SAY THAT THERE -- CERTAINLY YOU ARE
27 AL::"OvIED TO MEET WITH A BOARD MEMBER AND TAKE A BOARD l'lEMBER TO
28 LUNCH OR D:NNER. 3U? GIVEN THE FAC~ THAT -- 1"-!:: OT'ER T:.!ING THA?

3588
1 WAS SOMEWEAT OF AN INTERESTING DEVELOPMENT vIAS WHEN THE RFQ CAME,
2 OUT EOR PROGRAM '1ANl'.GEMENT ORIGINALLY, IT HAD A CLAUSE IN IT THAT
3 SAID RESPONDENTS .l\RE PRECLUDE:D FROM CONTACTING BOARD ~lEMBE:RS.
4 AND I ACTUALLY WAS PLEI'.SED TO SEE THAT CLAUSE IN THERE. ONLY TO
5 FIND IT THERE: WAS A REVISION TO IT ISSUED AND THE ONLY
6 REVISION WAS THE: REMOVAL OF THAT CLAUSE. AND SO IT PROMP'l'ED, YOU
7 KNOW, SOME DISCUSSION BETWEEN JEFF COOPER AND I, MY BOSS, THE
8 FUTURE PRESIDENT AT THE TIME, THAT, YOU KNOW, WHY WOULD THEY
9 REMOVE 'I'HAT? THEY REI'10VED IT TO AFFORD SOMEBODY ACCESS TO BOARD
10 t4EMBERS AND WE OUGHT TO AT LEAST -- BECAUSE TEAT RESTRICTION EAS
11 BEEN REl>10VED, ~iE NEED TO REACH OUT IN THE ~iAY TH.'\T ~iE CAN TO
12 SI'1PLY DEI'10NSTRA':'E TO THE BOARD 1'1::'1BERS wmu I'IE' VE DONE FOR '1'HE'1.
13 AND SO THAT' LED TO -- I WENT TO JIM Cl'.RTI'1ILL' S VIT~lIN
14 BUSINESS DOWN -- I DON'T KNOW WHERE IT IS, DOWN IN SOUTH BAY,
15 SAN DIEGO, AND HE SHOWED ME AROUND HIS PLANT. AND I JUST TOLD
16 HIM THAT -- I JUST TOLD HIM THAT WE HAVE ENJOYED WORKING HERE AND
17 WE'RE PLEASED TO BE WORKING HERE. AND HE ACTUALLY POINTED OUT HE
18 SAID, "YEAH, RANDY, I EAVE" HE, SHOWED ME IUS RE-ELECTION
19 BROCHURE. HE'S ONE OF THE ONES TEAT HAD BEEN RE-ELECTED IN THAT
20 PREVIOUS NOVEl'1BER. AND THE LEFT-HAND S-DE OF EIS TRI-FOLD ~iAS
21 PROP BB, 11 Y::ARS AHEAD OF SCHEDULE, 72 tlILI..ION ESCALNI'ION
22 SAVINGS. HE SHARED ~IITH ~lE, "I

3589
1 ORGAN::ZATION TO \~HICH SHE EITHER IS THE PRESIDENT OF OR IS ON THE
2 BOARD OF OR IS ACTIVE IN. AND I RECEIVED AN EfvlAIL r'ROM SANDRA
3 SI"lITH, THE BOARD SECRETARY, THAT SAID ARE YOU, "RANDY, ::S HARIUS
4 GOING TO CONTRIBUTE TO THE" -- I DON'T KNOW HO~i TO PRONOUNCE THE
5 CARANGALAN OR WHATEVER.
6
7
8
9
10
Q. WE'LL SAY THAT'S ACCURATE BECAUSE IT'S JUST ON THE
TRANSCRIPT.
A. ARE YOU GOING TO CONTRIBUTE AT THE SAl'~E LEVEL THAT YOU
CONTRIBUTED LAST YEAR?
Q. I'M PULLING UP AS YOU ARE SPEAKING DOCUfvlENT NO. 57742,
11
WHICH INDICATES WHAT YOU'VE DESCRIBED, AN EICAIL FROfvl fvlS.
SfvlTTH TO
12 YOURSELF REQUESTING $2,000. YOU CAN KEEP GOING IN TERMS OF THE
13 DESCRIPTION.
14 A. IT SAID THERE WAS A REQUEST r'OR US TO CONTRIBUTE AT THE
15 SAME LEVEL AS THE PREVIOUS YEAR AND I DIDN'T KNOW THAT '~IE
16 CONTRIBUTED THE PREVIOUS YEAR. THE PREVIOUS YEAR I i'IOULD HAVE
17 BEEN IN LOS ANGELES AND SO I~AYBE THE REQUEST CAME TO CHRIS DUNNE
18 OR IT CAME TO ,TAVIER SAUNDERS OR IT FOUND ITS vlAY TO ICY BOSS,
19 JEFF COOPER UNBEKNOWNST TO ME.
20 SO A REQUEST TO CONTRIBUTE AT T:1E SAME LEVEL AS LAST YEAR
21 LED TO NE PUSHING IT FORWARD SO T:1AT IT COULD BE ACTED ON IN THE
22 CAPACITY BY JEF'F COOPER '10 WHICH HE DID. HE APPROVED THE
23 PAYMEN m • THE PAYMENT WAS MADE AND MS. RICASA INVITED tJ:E '10 GO TO
24 THE EVENT, AND I BELIEVE IT WAS AT T:1E THERE'S A RESTAURJI,NT ON
25 THE OTHER SIDE OF L STREET NEAR THE BAY. IT WAS AN EVENT THERE
26 THAT I A::ENDED.
27 Q. AND THEN WE'?'E PULLING UP 57770. DOES THIS APPEAR TO
28 BE A LETTER. FROM ROBERT RICASA, THE SCHOLA?,SHIP CHAIRMAN OF 'I'HAT

3590
1 SA~lE SOCIETY, INDICATING TO YOURSELF THE TIME AND THANKING YOU
2 FOR YOUR GENEROSITY OF THAT EVENT?
3 A. YES. AND I BELIEVE ROBERT RICASA IS ARLIE RICASA'S
4 BROTHER.
5 Q. I "ANT TO GO THROUGH A COUPLE DIF~~ERENT THINGS VERY
6 QUICKLY, SOME EXPENSES THAT WERE GIVEN '1'0 US. "/HERE DO YOU
7 CURRENTLY WORK, SIR?
B A. I WORK FOR STV CONSTRUCTION, INC.
9 Q. OKAY. WE'LL GO OVER A COUPLE OF DOCUi'IENTS REAL QUICK.
10 A. I JUST WANT YOU ALL TO KNOW I DON'T HATE SAN DIEGO. AT
11 ",HE TUIE I DID. AT THE TIt'IE I DID.
12 Q. WE'LL PULL UP 57777. PROBABLY FOUR SEVENS. WE'RE
13 GOING TO GO THROUGH -- IF vIE CAN TURN IT. IF WE CAN'T, EVERYONE
14 CAN TURN THEIR HEAD.
15 I'LL GO THROUGH A COUPLE DIFFER2N'l' ITEMS ON TCIERE. ON
16 2/21/07 IT INDICATES BUON GIORNO IN THE AMOUNT OF $123. IT LISTS
17 PEARL QUINONES, BOARD MEi'!BER. AND THEN ON 3/6/07 AT PO PAZZO BAR
18 & GRIL:, FOR $173, PEARL QUINONES, BOARD ME[VIBER. IT INDICATES
19 DINNER AND DISCUSS PROP BB, DINNER TO DISCUSS PROGRAI"! O. THEN
20 3/15/07, BUON GIORNO, PEAE'tL QUINONES, BOARD MEMBER, $215.94.
21 DINNER TO DISCUSS PROGRAM BB.
22 DO YOU REC}I,LL THESE DIFFERENT DINNERS OR EVENTS TAKING
23 PLACE?
24
A.
YES.
25
Q. WAS ANYONE ELSE PRESENT BESIDES IVlS. QUINONES FOR 'l'HOS2
26 DINNERS?
27
A.
NO.
28
Q.
IN ~ERMS
OF THE DINNERS THEMSELVES, WAS A NORIVIAL AIJJOUNT

3591
1 OF FOOD OR :)RINK CONSUl·JED IN TERMS OF DID teS. QUINONES ORDER A
2 MEAL AND YOU ORDER A MEAL?
3 YES.
4 Q. SOI-1E OF THESE ARE A LITTLE BIT $200 FOR TWO PEOPLE;
HOW ClU1 YOU EXPLAIN SOMETHING LIKE THAT WOULD OCCUR?
6 A. PF~]',RL QUINONES LIKES -- ENJOYS A GOOD STEAK AND WINE:.
7 SO AND I ACTUALLY I'M A "NO CARB." I EAT .0, LOT OF STEAK AND
8 VEGETABLES OR CHICKEN AN] VEGETr,BLES. AND SO THE $200 DINNERS
9 "WULD HAVE ENCONPASSED, YOU KNo\~, PRIME FILET JvlIGNON OR -- AND A
10 BOTTLE OF RED "nNE ON THE I~ORE EXPENSIVE SIDE OF' THE t1ENU,
11 Q. IN TER1"S OF p, DINNER LIKE THIS, IN THE COURSE OF YOUR
12 CAREER HAVE YOU HAD DINNERS LIKE THIS WITH OTHER FOLKS IN O'fHER
13 DISTRICTS, OTHER BOARD ~1EMBERS, SUPERINTENDEN'rS, HIGH-LEVEL
14 EMPLOYEES? IS IT ABNORt4AL FOR YOURSELF TO MEET WI'rH SOMEONE LIKE
15 THA'f AND HIIVE A DINNER LIKE THAT?
16 A, IT'S -- IT'S NOT ABNORMAL. I'r HAPPENS. AND SO YES.
17 IN LOS ANGELES, THERE ]"RE SIJvlILAR CIRCUl"lSTANCES IVHERE THOSE TYPES
18 OF DINNERS AND THAT TYPE OF EXPENSE IS A RESULT.
19 Q. OKAY • ~jHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO, WE'VE BEEN DOING TH IS
20 ALL [,LONG, ~IE JUST MARK DOWN FOR DEMONSTRATIVE PURPOSES A VALUE
21 ASSOCIATED WITH THE DIFFERENT F~VENT. SO WE:' VE GONE THROUGH ]" LOT
22 OF' EVENTS. IT HELPS US TO REME:-1BER EVENTS. WE'LL INDICATE FOR
23 THESE DIFFERENT DATES 'I'HE APPROXIMATE AMOUNT THAT IS GOING TO BE
24 ATTR::BUTED TO THE INDIVIDUAL BOhRD :-1EJvlBERS.
25 SO E'OR 2/21/07, FOR INSTANCE, WE'LL INDICATE FOR BUON GIORNO
26 THAT'S A $123 :-1EAL. ~IE weI, SPLIT THhT IN HhLF MINUS THE TIP TO
27 INDICATE hPPROXIMA'l'ELY 845 FOR DINNER WITH NS. QUINONES. FOR
28 3/6/07 IT'S $173. SPLITTING THA':' IN HALF ~jE'LL PUT IT AT

3592
1
2
l\PPROXINAT3:LY $65 NINUS THE TIP FOR [V]S. QUINONES. AN:::J FOR
3/:5/07 IT'S $215. SPLITTING ':CHAT IN HALF AND THEN NINUS THE TIP
3
\~E' LL PUT 'l'HAT AT APPROXlNA':'ELY $80 FOR ["lS. QUINONES.
ANY OTHER
4
5
6
BOARD NENBERS THAT YOU HAD NEALS 1'1ITH THAT YOU CAN RECALL?
A. YES. I HAD A DINNER WI':'H GREG SANDOVAL.
Q. AND YOU WANT TO EXPL!,IN THE CIRCUNSTANCES OF THE DINNER
7
WITH NR.
SANDOVAL.
8
A. U)1, I RECEIVED A CALL FRON EITHER JAVIER SAUNDERS, THE
9
HARRIS SI,N DIEGO REGIONAL MANAGER,
OR OUR MUTUAL BOSS, WHICH ~jAS
10
JEFF COOPER,
INDICATING THAT GREG SANDOVAl, HAD REQUESTED A
11
12
CONTRIBUTION TO HIS STATE ASSElvJBLY Cl,[V]PAIGN AND THAT JAVIER AND
JEFF COOPER WOUL:::J HAVE ALREADY DISC:JSSED IT, BECAUSE THE REQUEST
13
FOR THAT CONTRIBUTION DIDN'T COME FROM NE, :::JIDN"I' COME TO ME
FROM
14 SAND::

3593
1 A. YES.
2 Q. AND SO FOR MR. SANDOVAL WE'LL JUST WRITE DOWN 3/26/07,
3 DIVIDING 300 BY THREE TAKING OFF T'1E TIP AMOUNT. \'lHY DON"r WE
4 SAY APPROXIMATELY $75 FOR MR. SANDOVAL.
5 ALSO NOTICE THAT THERE'S -- THAT IN APRIL OF 2007, YOU HAD A
6 COUPLE DIFFERENT OR -- EXCUSE ME. ONE DINNER MEETING WITH RAIv16N
7 LEYBA. HAD YOU GONE TO DINNER -- DO YOU RECALL HAVING DINNER
8
9
WITH RAM6N LEYBA?
A. YES.
10
11
Q.
A.
AND THE PURPOSE OF THE DINNER WITH MR. LEYBA?
W.n.S TO IlAVE SOME -- RA~16N LEYBA HAD EXPLn.INED ON
12
13
PREVIOUS OCCASIONS THAT HE WAS A LONG-TIME FRIEND OF GREG
Sl'.NDOVAL'S, AND SO HY DINNER WITH Rl'.M6N WAS SIHPLY CHECKING IN
14
,,11TH HH1.
'1E CONVEYED TO HE ON A PREVIOUS OCCASION OR MORE THAN
15
ONE PREVIOUS OCCASION T'1.n.T CHRIS DUNNE HAD BEEN lvlAKING HIH LOOK
16
REALLY GOOD MEl HAKING Hn'! I,oOK LIKE HE KNEI-J WH,ZIT
HE vJAS DOING AS
17
18
.n. COO, THAT RAM6N LEYBA, HIS PREVIOUS HISTORY AT SviEETWATER W,ZIS
IN THE ACADEMIC SIDE AND ACADEHIC ARENA AS AN ASSISTANT
19
SUPERINTENDENT AND OTHER AD~!:NISTRATIVE
RESPONSIBILITIES AND NONE
20
21
22
23
OF THEM RELATED TO SCHOOL CONSTRUCTION, AN0 THAT HE WAS -- THAT
HE ENJOYED WORKING WITH CHRIS DUNNE IN THE MONTHS THAT HE WAS THE
COO, LEADING UP TO T'1AT TIl-JE, A~W HE CERTAINLY FELT TH}\T \'E WERE
THE BEST TEAH, BUT HE ALSO, WITHOUT TELLING ME ANYTHING -- HE
24
DIDN'T VERBALIZE WHAT
I THINK HE KNEW WAS HAPPENING, BUT HE LET
25
26
27
28
IT BE KNOWN THAT THIS ISN'T GOING TO GO \,IELL. THIS ISN'T --
THERE WAS MORE NOT SAl D AND CONVEYED THROUGH BODY L.n.NGUAGE.
THAT! S vlHAT THAT DINNER I'lAS.
Q. SO YOU'RE DESCK':BTNG TO US THE IIvlPRESSION mHAT YOU

3594
",ECEIVED F",OM THE CONVERSATIONS THAT YOU HAD \'11TH HIM?
2
A.
THOSE WERE IMPHESSIONS, YEAH.
3
Q. I HAVE A COUPLE ADDITION.Z\L QUESTIONS. AND ,'IE' RE AL~lOST
4 INTO OUH LUNCH BREAK. I' t1 PRETTY lvJUCH nNISHED ,'lITH T'HE
5 QUESTIONS THAT I HAVE FOR YOU. THE QUESTIONS THAT I HAVE AHE
6 FHOM MEt1BERS OF THE GRAND JUHY. THIS IS KIND OE' MY WAHNING TO
7 THEM IF YOU WANT TO H,z\VE ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS.
8 MH. SCHOHR; QUESTIO:, NO. 267 --
9 GRAND JUHY SECRETAHY: 267, YES.
10 BY !vIR. SCHORR:
11 Q. -- IS FROM GRAND JU",OR NO.9. AFTER NOTInCATION OF
12 THE SELECTION OF SGI, DID YOU REQUEST A DEBRIEFING AS TO WHY YOUR
13 COt1PANY WAS NOT SELECTED ANC!, IF SO, DID YOU RECEIVE ONE?
14 A. YOU KNOW, I DON'T RECALL REQUESTING A DEBRIEFING. LIKE
15 I SAID, I GOT IN t1Y CAR AND DROVE UP THE 5 FREEWAY AND WENT HOME.
16 I DON'T RECALL THAT WE REQUESTED. I THINK IT ~I.ZJ..S DEEMED A
17 FOREGONE CONCLUSION THAT -- - MEAN, IT ';JAS eVER.
18 Q. QUES~ION NO. 267 (SIC), GRAND JUROR NO. 13. IN TERMS
19
20
OF THE ;)INNER WITH PEARL QU:;:NONES,
WHEN SHE TOLD YOU HARRIS ,'lAS OUT?
DIC! PEARL QUINONES CONTACT YOU
WAS IT OVER THE PHONE, BY
21
22
23
24
25
26
EMAIL OR FACE-TO-FACE? HOW DID THAT CONTACT TAKE PLACE WHEN SHE
WAS TELLING YOU?
A. IT WAS IN PERSON.
Q. DID SHE ELABORATE ON WHAT THE DEAL HAD BEEN CUT BY
RICASA ANC! SANDOVl'.L?
A. NO ELABORATION OTHER THAN THE DEAL - THAT A DEAL HAD
27 BEEN CUT. NO, NO':'HING NORE.
28 Q. HAD YOU EVER HAD, IN ALL OF YOUH CAREEH, A PROCESS THAT

3595
1
TOOK PLACE THAT WAS SIMILAR TO THE PROCESS THAT 'rOOK PLACE HERE
2
3
IN SliN DIEGO ~nTH
PROP O?
THE SELECTION OR NONSELECTION OF HARRIS ,~ITH
4
5
A. I HAVEN'T, NO.
Q. HAVE YOU EVER BEEN APPROACm;;o BY p.~ BOARD MEt1BER
6
ANYWHERE ELSE \~HERE
THEY INFORi'lED YOU THAT THE REASON YOU DIDN'T
7
GET SELECTED WAS BECAUSE SOi'lE OTHER DEAL WAS CUT?
8
9
Ie
11
A.
Q.
NO.
IF I MIGHT APPROACH, I'LL SHOW YOU A COUPLE DOCUMENTS.
(GRAND JURY EXHIBIT 91, QUINONES FORM 7CC MOCKUP
mOM HARRIS 2CC7, MARKED FOR IDEN'I'IFICATION.)
12 (GRAND ,JURY EXHIBIT 92, SANDOVAL FORM 7CC MOCKUP
13 FROM HARRIS 2007, l"IARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.)
14 BY MR. SCHORR:
:'5 Q. ,,)HAT THEY ARE IS GRAND JURY EXHIBIT NO. en AND 92.
16 'rHIS IS THE DEMONSTRATIVE. I'LL SHOW YOU GRAND JURY DOCUMENT
17 NO. 91 EXCUSE ME. IT ~JST SAYS THAT IT'S A FORM 7CC FOR PEARL
18 QUINONES AND IT HAS THAT IT'S IN 2007. AND IT INDICATES THREE
19 DIFFERENT DATES 2/21, 3/6 AND 3/15 OF '07, SOME AMOUNTS LISTED
20 NEXT TO IT, AND IT LISTS HARRIS & ASSOCIATES AND THE NAi'~E. THIS
21 IS JUST OBVIOUSLY, NOT -- YOU'RE NOT NECESSARILY AUTHENTICATING
22 THE ACCURACY OF THE EXACT AMOUNTS OF $45 BUT THE PROCESS IN ,~H=CH
23 l'iE vlENT THROUGH TO WRITE THAT DOWN AND THAT IT INDICATES WHAT WE
24 HAD DISCUSSED.
25
26
A.
Q.
YES.
THE SECOND DOCUMEN'I', WHICH IS 92, AND THAT RELATES TO
27 !'olR. GREG SANDOVAL, AND 'CHAT 'I'ItvIE PERIOD BEING THE SAME IN 2007,
28 INDICATING ONE t-IEAL AT MORTON'S IN THE AMOUNT OF $75. ALSO

3596
1 DlDICl\TING HARRIS & l\SSOCIATES. IS THAT WHAT IT INDICATES?
2 A. YES.
3 MR. SCHORR: OKAY. WELL, SIR, I'M NOT SEEING ANY 2\DDI'rIONAL
4 QUESTIONS FROM OUR GRAND ,JURY. I WANT TO THANK YOU FOR MAKING
5 YOURSELF AVAILABLE TO US AND DISCUSSING THIS \~ITH US. AND AT
6 THIS POINT IN TIME OUR FOREPERSON IS GOING TO EXCUSE YOU.
7 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: YOU ARE REMINDED THAT YOU ARE STILL
8 AD~jONISHED.
9
THE WITNESS:
OKAY.
10
MR. SCHORR: WE'LL TAKE OUR ONE-HOUR RECESS. WE'LL COME
11 BACK AT ~:OO. THANK YOU.
12
(LUNCH RECESS.)
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28

3597
1
2
3
SAN DIEGO IF'ORNIA THURSDAY DECEMBER 13 2012 1: 02 ?M.
* * *
PRO C E E DIN G S
4 * * *
5 I'1R. SCHORR: MR. SECRETARY.
6 GRAND JURY SECRETARY: WE HAVE 16 GRl'\ND JURORS P'.ND TRUST US WITH TH2
15 FACT TEAT THER2 IS RELEVANCE TO IT AND THAT I WOULD LOV" TO PUT
16 IT ALL IN CONTEXT AT THE TIME THAT I! M ACTUALLY PUTTING IT ON. I
17 THINK T'"!AT IDEALLY THAT WOULD B2 }l. MORE APPROPRIATE WAY TO GO SO
18 THhT EACH TIME WE WENT THROUGH SOM2THING, WE COULD REFER TO WHY
19 -- HOW AND WHY IT IS SIGNIFICANT. UNFORTUNATELY, IT WOULD BE
20 SIGNIFICANTLY t-lORE TIME CONSUMING TO DO SO. I '[vI \~ORKING ON THE
21 ASSUMPTION THAT SOME OF THESE KEY DATES I'lILl, -- AND SOM" OF THE
22 CALENDARS .I>.ND EVERYTHING WILL TRIGGER SOME PRIOR TESTItvlONY OR
23 YOUR R"CALL OF PRIOR TESTIMONY THAT YOU SAW. OF COURSE, THER,,'S
24 BEEN A TON SO TH"RE' S NO WAY IT WILL T'

3598
1 INSTANCE, EMAILS THAT I'.RE BETWEEN TWO DEFENDANTS; 1 CAN'T JUST
2 GIVE YOU THAT EMAIL. I~E NEED TO UNDERSTAND -- \~E vlANT YOU TO SEE
3 THE EMAIL. IT MIGHT HAVE CONTEXT 01'; IT, aUT I CAN'T JUST SHOW IT
4 TO YOU WITHOUT EXPLAINING HOW WE GO':: IT. SO MR. GIAD1E SERVES
5 THA':: PURPOSE. WE ARE ACTU.".LLY MAKING PROGRESS I'II'::H HIM. WE ARE,
6 OF COURSE, STI.LL ON SCHEDULE. l'M KNOCKING ON WOOD, BUT I WOULD
7 LIKE TO TRY TO KEEP A SCHEDULE.
8 OUR GOAL TODAY IS TO HAVE t1R. GIAIME FOR PROBABLY I'.BOUT AN
9 HOUR THIS AFTERNOON AND MR. ORTIZ IS COMING BACK IN AT 2:00. I'::
10 WAS SUPPOSED TO BE THIS t10RNING BUT WE HAD SOME ISSUES, WHICH I
11 CK,MLY EANDL2D. AKD THEN WE'LL PUT HIl>l ON. WE'RE EXPECTING TO
12 BE AN HOUR, IF' '::HAT. WE HIIVE SOMEONE BEHIND HIM I'.BOUT A
13 HALF-HOUR IN CASE I'IE GO SHORT WITH HIM. THAT PERSON IS FROM
14 ReFL. AND THEN DEPENDING ON HOW WE ARE WITH MR. GIAIME AND ON
15 TIME AND EVERYTHING, WE vilLI, BE SOON I'IRAPPING UP IN TERMS OF '::HAT
16 TESTIMONY. TOMORROW IS AN ALL DAY POTENTIAL OR S1,OTTED FOR
17 MR. AMIGABLE TO GO THROUGH THINGS.
18 GRAKD JUROR NO. 15: ED BAGAPORO WILL BE TESTIFYING?
19 MR. SCHORR: NO.
20 GRAI,D JUROR NO. 13: HE'S ON THE -- HE'S ON '::HE LIST.
21 . I1R. SCHORR: NO':: EVERYONE ON THE 1,1 ST, E'OR ONE REASON OR
22 ANO'::HER, WILL BE TESTIFYING. FRANKLY, WE ONLY HAVE ONE NEW
23 \'lITNESS. SO WE HAVE GIAIME IS GOING TO BE AN OLD I'IITNESS A
24 PRIOR \"iITI'iESS. ORTIZ IS A PRIOR ~H'rNE:SS. HENRY AMIGABI~E IS A
25 PRIOR I'IITKESS. THEN THE RCFL PERSON, WHO IS NOT AS A LIS'I'ED
26 WI':'NESS. ALL THE OTHER .. ilTNESSES ARE NOT GOING TO BE Cl,LLED FOR
27 ONS REASON OR ANOTHER. PAR':' OF IT IS WE t1AKE THS DETERMINATION
28 AS WE GO, DO viE NEED THEM, WHAT IS THE SIGNIFICANCE, WHAT HURDLES

3599
1 WOlLD WE POTEN'l'IALLY OVERCOME. AND AS I TALKED ABOUT AT T'1E
2 BEGINNING, NOT EVERYONE THAT'S INVITED NECESSARILY ATTENDS AKD
3 THERE CAt, BE OTHER REASONS FOR IT. YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE A NEGATIVE
4 THOUGH:' TO THAT. IT'S JlST HOW IT GOES.
5 YOU WILL BE OFFERED ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY -- I'M TELLING YOU
6 NOW TO THINK ABOU'I' I:'. IN THE BEGINNING YOU WERE :'OLD :F THERE
7 ARE WITNESSES THAT YOU ARE REQUES:'ING THAT YOU BELIEVE WOUL~ HAVE
8 SOME TYPE OF EXCULPATORY INFOR~):l,TION, LIKE INFORMATION TH.ll.'I' I-IOULD
9 ?ROVE THE INNOCENCE OF .ZI.NY OF THE DIFFERENT POTENTLZ>..L SUSPECTS,
10 THEK YOU NEED TO LET US KNOW W'10 YOU WOULD WANT TO HAVE CO~E IN
11 .".ND ~IE' LL MAKE OUR BEST EFFORTS TO GET THAT IN OR GET TESTIMONY
12 FROM THEt'l IN SOt1E POINT I T'1INK MS. ASHE OR DONNA WILL BE CONFIRMING
15 ~lITH YOU TH.Z>..T YOl DON'T HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL WITNESSES THAT NEED
16 TO BE CALLED. BUT WITHOUT FURTHER ADO, ~IHAT I l'lOULD LIKE TO DO
17 IS CONTINUE I'lITH ",JR. GIAIME AND CONTINUE WITH OUR PROGRESS.
18 OUR HOPE AND GOAL IS THAT WE'RE DONE ESSENTIALLY WITH
19 TES'l'I~ONY HOPEFULLY TOMORROW. IT ~nGHT BE TH!".:' IT SPILLS A
20 LITTLE BIT lNTO MONDAY, BUT OUR GOAL IS TO BE PRESENTING IT TO
21 YOU AT SO~E POINT IN TIt>1E ON MONDAY, ~JHICH WOULD BE GOOD :F WE
22 CAN STICK \H'rH THAT.
23
24 VINCENT GIAIME,
25 GRAND JURY WITNESS, HAVING BEEN PREVIOUSLY SWORN, WAS EXAMINED
26 AND TESTIF'IE:J AS FOLLOWS;
27
28 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: YOU ARE REt-1INDED THAT YOU ARE ST:;:LL

3600
1 UNDER OA':CH IN THIS t'JATTER.
2 TEE WITNESS: YES, MA'AH.
3
4
EXAl"'fINATION
5
6
BY HR. SCHORR:
Q. SIR, JUST FOR THE RECORD, AGAIN, YOUR NAME.
7
A.
VINCENT GIAIME, G-I-A-I-M-E.
8
Q. AND WE'RE GOING TO GO ON AND CONTINUE WITH WHAT WE WERE
9 DOING. WE'LL LOOK AT 56065, RELATED TO SEPTEt1BER 27, 2009, AND
10 THIS APPEARS TO BE AN ~TINERARY FOR A RATING AGENCY TRIP FOR
11 SOUTH~]ESTERN COHt'JUNITY COLLEGE FROM SEPTEI'lBER 27TH THROUGH THE
12 30TH OF 2008.
13 DO YOU RECOGNIZE THAT DOCUI'lENT?
14 A. YES.
15 Q. IF WE CAN GO BACK OUT AND EXPAND. IT INDICATES Sot1E
16 TRANSPORTATION TO HOTEL AND HOTEL RESERVATIONS FOR I'lR. SAL -- OR
17 MS. SALCIDO AND I'lR. WILSON. THEY ARRIVE ON 9/26. AND DESCRIBES
18 TEE FLIGHT NUMBER FOR I'lR. CHOPRA AND HR. ALIOTO. THEY ARRIVED
19 THE NEXT DAY, 9/27. ARRIVAL FOR HR. WILSON AND MS. SALCIDO IS
20 JFK AIRPORT. FOR CHOPK~ AND ALIOTO TO NEW YORK AIRPORT. AND
21 IT'S SEPTEI'lBER 27TH, SUNDAY. I'lEET IN HOTEL LOBBY PRIOR TO
22 DINNER, AND IT INDICATES 7:00 P.H. DINNER AT THE COAST.
23 GOING ON TO 56066, AND IT'S AN ITINERAR'f FOR SEPTEI'lBER 28TH,
24 A 1'l0NDAY, TALKING ABOUT PRF;SENTAT ION REHEARSAL AT PIPER JAFFRAY,
25 CAR SERVICE PICKUP, THE l"lOVIE RATINGS PRESENTATION, THE CAR
2 6 SERVICE PICKUP, l"'fEET IN THE HOTEL LOBBY, THE DINNER AT THE
27 FELIVIA.
28 MOVING ON TO SEPTEI'lBER 29TH, CAR SERVICE, AND THEN THE 10:00

3601
1 IN THE MORNING, 10:00 O'CLOCK, A RATINGS PRESENTA'I'ION FOR
2 I STANDARD & POOR'S.
3 ~1OVING ON TO 56067, FOR SEP';'EM!ER 30TH, 8: 30 IL M. CAR
4 SERVICE PICKUP AT HOTEL. IT INDICATES SALCIDO FLIGHT BACK, NEW
5 YORK AIRPORT. CHOPRA AND .~IOTO, ALSO FLIGHT BACK FROM NEI'l YORK
6 AIRPOR';'. AND WILSON SAYS RETURN TRIP ARRANGED BY JOHN.
7 DOES THAT APPEAR TO BE THE ITINERARY FOR THE TRIP WE'VE BEE~1
8 DISCUSSING?
9 A. YES.
10 Q. DO YOU KNOW HOW YOU CANE IN POSSESSION OF THESE
11 DOCUMENTS?
12 A. I BELIEVE THIS WAS OBTAINED EITHER THROUGH THE
13 SOUTHWESTERN CONMUNITY COL"EGE DISTRICT OR PURSUANT TO THE SE.z\RCH
14 WARRANT THAT WAS PROVIDED TO -- SERVED ON ALTA VISTA.
15 Q. 57175, REFERRING TO SEPTEMBER 28, 2009. IT MAY BE
16 DIFFICULT TO SEE. IT'S ["lS. QUINONES'S CALENDAR. DO YOU SEE A
17 SEPTEt4BER 28TH, HENRY, AT P. F. CHANG' S?
18
A.
YES.
19
Q.
MOVING TO 6376, OCTOBER 5TH, 2009.
IS THIS
20 D::

3602
1 IT?
2 A. YES. I RECOGNIZE THE PHONE NUMBER AS BEING
3 MR. CABELLO'S MOBILE TELEPHONE NUMBER.
4 Q. AND THEN FOR 43855, ON OCTOBER 9TH, ARE ~jE LOOKING AT
5 THE ALTA VISTA EXPENSE REPORT?
6
7
A.
Q.
YES, FOR MR. CABELLO.
DOES THAT INDICATE FOR SAN DIEGO HISPANIC CHAMBER OF
8 COMIY1ERCE TWO DIFFERENT AI10UNTS, ONE FOR SOUTH BAY FISH & GRILL,
9 ANOTHER FOR ROMESCO' S . DO YOU SEE '1'HOSE?
10
11
A.
Q.
YES, SIR.
MOVI"lG ON '1'0 37438, WH}\T IS IT 'fHAT \"IE' RE LOOKI"lG AT
12 HERE FOR OCTOBER 10TH, 2009?
13 A. AGAIN, THIS IS -- I BELIEVE THESE ARE TICKETS TO THE
14 AMPHITHEATER, FOR THE CRICKET WIRELESS AlY1PHITHEATER, AND THESE
15 TICKETS ~jERE F'OUND PURSUANT TO A SEARCH WARRANT ON HR. SANDOVAL'S
16 RESIDENCE. THE ONE TICKET OR BOTH TICKETS ARE ANNOTATED JOSE
17 HIRELES.
18 Q. DO YOU KNOW WHETHER OR NOT THESE WERE REPORTED BY
19 MR. SANDOVAL?
20
21
A.
Q.
MR. SANDOVAL DID NOT REPORT THESE IN HIS FORM 700.
OCTOBER 12TH, 2009, 57176, AGAIN FOR OCTOB2R 12TH.
22 THIS IS PEARL QUINONES'S CALENDAR. DO YOU SEE WHERE IT INDICATES
23 OCTOBER 12TH, HELICOPTER RIDE?
24
A.
YES, I
DO.
25
Q.
1827::., DR. GANDARA'S CAI,ENDAR FOR OCTOBER 16TH -- AND
26 IS THAT ALL OF OCTOBER 16TH? DOES IT INDICAT.'" 9:30 A.l

3603
1 Q. ON 16165 FOR OCTOBER 24, 2009, WHAT IS IT THAT WE'RE
2 LOOKING AT?
3 A. THIS WAS A RECEIPT FOR LODGING FOR NICK ALIOTO F.T THE
4 SOU"rH COAST ~lINERY IN THE AMOUNT OF $343.90.
5 Q. DOES IT APPEAR TO BE A RECEIPT THAT WAS PAID BY NICK
6 ALIOTO, OR CAN YOU TELL?
7 A. I CANNOT TELL WHO -- I BELIEVE THIS WAS PAID --
8 AL'rrIOUGH, WHEN YOU LOOK UP ON THE LEFT-HAND SIDE CORNER UNDER
9 NICK ALIOTO, THliT' S OBVIOUSLY MR. ALIOTO'S NANE, BUT THE ADDRESS
10 IS THE ADDRESS FOR TEE SEVILLE CONSTRUCTION SERVICES IN P1\SADENA.
11 AND SO THERE IS NO INDICATIONS OF" -- IF MR. ALIOTO PAID THIS OR
12 IF THIS WAS P1\ID POR BY SCS.
13
14
15
Q.
A.
Q.
OIOW. 18670, 1\ND IS THIS KARL BRADLEY'S FORM 7007
THAT'S CORRECT.
FOR 2009. I BELIEVE IT'S SIGNED IN 2010.
16 GOING TO 18671 IT INDICATES l'lARI1\CHI GOLF SPOT FOR 10:30,
17 2009, IN THE AMOUNT OF $100 1\ND PAID FOR BY SEVILLE GROUP, 1\S
18 WEU" 1\S PADRES B1\SEBALL TICKETS FOR $80?
19 1\. THAT'S CORRECT.
20 Q. THAT'S BY DALY ARCHITEC"rURE?
21 A. YES, SIR.
22 Q. 37435, FOO"r8ALL TICKETS FOR NOVEl'lBER 15, 2009,
23 INDIC1\TING H£CTOR ROMERO, VALUE OF $200 £ACH; IS "rHA'l' CORRECT?
24
25
26
1\. TH1\T'S CORRECT.
Q. AND DO YOU KNO~1 WHERE THOSE TICKETS WERE FOUND?
A. YES. THESE WERE LOC1\TED 1\1' l'lR. SZ'lNDOVAL' S RESIDENCE
~7
L,
28
PURSUANT TO A SEARCH WARRANT.
Q. AN] DID MR. SANDOVF.L REPORT THOSE TICKETS?

3604
1
A.
MR.
S[INDOVAL REPORTED RECEIVING ONE TICKET VALUED AT
2
$200.
3
4
5
Q.
A.
Q.
FROM HAR CONSTRUCTION?
FROt1 HAR CONSTRUCTION, THAT'S CORRECT.
18274, AND IS THIS DR. G.'mDARA' S CALENDAR INDICATING ON
6 THE DATE OF NOVEMBER 16, 2009, MR. HECTOR ROMERO?
7
8
A.
Q.
'l'HAT'S CORRECT.
GO TO 38402. DO YOU "NOW vlHAT n IS viE' RE LOO"ING AT
9
10
~1
12
13
14
HERE FOR NOVEMBER 24TH?
A. YES. I BELIEVE THIS viAS THE SCHEDULE OR LISTING OF THE
BOARD MEMBERS TO ATTEND THE 2009 CSBA ATTENDANCE AND THE DINNER
LIS'l' AT THE CUCINA URBANA RESTAURANT IN Sl'.N DIEGO.
Q. GOING ON TO 38403, 1'1' LISTS PEARL
A. PEARL QUINONES.
15
16
17
Q.
PL
Q.
-- QUINONES FROM SWEETWATER?
THAT'S CORR8CT, SIR.
MOVING ON TO 38391, AND LOOKING AT THIS, IT APPEARS TO
18 BE THE A BOARD EVENT CALENDAR FOR S\'JEET'imTER SCHOOL DISTRICT
19 2009, NOVEMBER 27, 2009 THROUGH OCTOBER 23, 2010, AND IT HAS
20 LISTS OF ACTIVITIES. GOING TO WEDNESDAY DECEMBER 2ND ON THE
21 CALENDAR FOR 6:00 P.M., 00ES IT IN~ICATE THE INVITATION TO THE
22 BOARD, MAIL ,~AS RECEIVED 11/13 AND IT LISTS RICASA PLUS ONE AS
23 WELL AS L6PEZ PLUS ONE FOR THE EL VITRAL RESTAURANT, SGI, CM
24 HOLIDAY DINNER?
25
26
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT.
57254, MS. QUINONES -- 8XCUSE ME. MS. L6PEZ'S AHENDED
27 FORM 700 FRO~l 4/2/2012 E'OR THE YEAR 2009. ON THAT AMENDED E'ORM
28 FOR DECEMBER 1ST, DOES IT'NDICATE NO','J THE HOLIDAY DINNER FOR THE

3605
1 SE:VILLE G",OUP --
2
3
4
5
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
THAT'S CORRECT.
IN THE Ml0UNT OF $607
YES, SIR.
18275, DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR FOR DECEMBER 2ND, 2009.
6
7
8
9
10
11
:2
13
14
15
16
DOES IT INDICATE THAT NTD SKY BOX AT THE DIAMOND T, IS THAT vJHAT
IT INDICAC'ES?
A. YES, SIR.
Q. 57254, BACK TO BERTHA LOPEZ'S AMENDED FORM 700 FOR THE
DATE OF DECEMBER 2ND INDICATING A BOAT CRUISE FROM GCR IN THE
AMOUNT OF $507
A. YES, SIR.
Q. ~iE:' LL GO TO JANUARY 3RD, 2010, 47352. THERE'S MORE
CHARGERS TICKETS. DO YOU REC.n.LL ~mERE THESE WERE FOUND?
A. I BELIEVE THESE, '{JERE FOUND AT MR. CABELLO'S RESIDENCE.
Q. ANYTHING OF SIGNIFICANCE RELATED TO THESE TICKETS THAT
17 YOU l\RE AWl'.RE OF? I'M NOT POINTING YOU TO ANYTHING IN
18 PARTICULAR.
19
20
A.
Q.
NOT THAT I'M AWARE OF.
OKAY. JANUARY 5TH, 2810 -- WE'LL LOOK AT 1420'. IF
21 YOU CAN EXPLAIN \~HAT THIS DOCUMENT IS.
22 A. THIS IS AN INVOICE FROM SEVILLE CONSTRUCTION SERVICES
23 TO SOUTHWESTERN COLLEGE ADf)RESSED TO ~1R. JOHN 'HLSON. IT'S m,TED
24 1/.5/2010. IC' BASICALLY INDICATES CONSULTING. I BELIEVE
25 THAT'S--
26
27
Q.
A.
REVENUE?
-- REVENUE FOR THE PERIOD OF DECEMBER 1ST THROUGH
28 DECEMBER 31ST, 2889, AND IT INDICATES THE RATE AND THE AMOUNTS.

3606
1
Q. AND THE DATE OF THIS BEING 1/5/2010, DO YOU KNOW THE
2
SIGNIFICANCE IN TERMS OF JOHN oHLSON'S Et

3607
1 CABELLO TO JMGS43 INDICATING LETTER -- ATTACHMENT LETTER TO
2 J. GANDARA, AS "JELL AS ANOTHER LETTER, J. GANDARA, PROPOSAL AND
3 SCHEDULE?
4 P.. YES. THAT EMAIL ADDRESS.JMGS43@AOL.COM. I KNO~i IT TO
5 BE DR. GANDARA'S PERSONAL EMAIL ADDRESS.
6 Q. 5541, THE Et'>1AIL FRON MS. QUINONES TO RENE FLORES,
7 1/25/2010. "I :LI\VEN'T HEARD fROM YOU. "JHERE AND 1i'lHEN ARE WE
8 MEE'l'ING? DON' 'I' STRESS t-lE L," SOMETHING.
9 A. YES.
10 Q. 57178, WE'RE LOOKING A'l' JANUARY 26, 2010. DO YOU SEE A
11 Cp.LENDp.R E,JTRY THAT INDICATES RENE?
12 A. YES, THAT'S CORRECT.
13 Q. WE'LL GO TO 10595, ,JANUARY 26TH. RENE FLORES, SGI
14 GROUP, PREPARED FOR ROSY FLORES BUT TOTAL FOR RENE FLORES. DO
15 'lOC SEE A CHARGE FOR THE BUTCHER SHOP IN THE AMOUNT OF $76.797
16 .1\. YES, SIR.
17 Q. 37448 RELIl,TED TO FEBRW'IRY 27, 2007, CONCENTRATING ON
18 THE TICKET THAT INDICATES CULTURE CLASH IN AMERICA, 2/27/2010.
19 DO YOU SEE THIS TICKET WHERE IT INDICATES ,JAIME ORTIZ?
20 A. YES, SIR.
21 Q. I'1HERE \~AS THAT FOUND?
22 A. AGAIN, THIS I'IAS FOUND PURSUANT TO A SEARCH l'iARRANT AT
23 MR. SANDOVAL'S RESIDENCE.
24 Q. THEN 11343 FOR THAT SAt'>1E DATE, FEBRUARY 27,2010. WE
25 SEE A:, EXPENSE 1/\ THE AMOUNT OF' $182 FOR A TICKET TO SAK DIEGO
26 REP AS WELL AS $661 FOR FLEl'HNG'S. IS THAT FOR "'IR. JAIME ORTIZ?
27 A. YES.
28 Q. 36488. I'LL DRAW YOUR ATTENTION TO A RECEIPT THAT

3608
1 INDICATES HOTEL DEL CORONADO ]I,ND IT INDICATES THREE ADULT
2 BRUNCHES, TWO CHILD BRUNCHES, FOR A TOTAL DUE OF $292.97, WITH
3 TIP TOTAL 322.97, AKC IT S[,YS ]llViIGABLE FAl"lILY.
4 DO YOU HAVE A RECOLLECTIOl\ AS TO WHERE THIS RECEIPT WAS
5 FOUND?
6 A.
7 RESIDENCE.
YES, SIR.
THIS WAS SEIZED FROM MR. NICHOLAS ALIOTO'S
8
9
Q.
A.
DO YOU KNOW THIS RECEIPT TO BE PAID FOR BY MR. ALIOTO?
YES, SIR.
10 MR. SCHORR: JUST MAKING THAT CLEAR. t4R. ALIOTO PAl C E'OR
11 THREE ACULT BRUNCHES, TWO CHILDREN'S BRGNCHES, RELATED TO HOTEL
12 DEL CORONADO. I'M NOT t4AKING THAT CLEAR. AND IT :::NDICATES FOR
13 THE AtHGABLE FAtViILY. TEE TYPES O~ THINGS WHERE I WANT TO l"lAKE
14 SURE THAT I POINT OUT TO YOU VERY CLEARLY WHEN SOt4ETHING WAS PAID
15 FOR OR SOMETHING THAT IS EXCULPATORY-TYPE INFORMATION.
16 MR. ALIOTO PAID FOR SOMETHING FOR, EXCULPATORY-TYPE INFORMATION.
17 20194 FOR MARCH 1ST, 2010. THIS IS JESUS GANDARA'S
18 CALENDAR. AND LOOKING AT 11:30 A.M. IT INDICATES, "HENRY
19 AMIGABLE. HE'LL PICK YOU UP"?
20
A.
THAT'S CORRECT,
SIR.
21
Q.
FOR 37205 ON MARCH 3RD, 2010, DOES IT INDIC]I,TE -- IS
22 THIS GREG SZ\NDOVAL'S CALENDAR?
23
24
A.
Q.
YES, SIR.
"EVENING OUT"?
25 A. YES, FOR MARCH 'rHE 3RD, 2010.
26 Q. OKAY. ON 13980, YOU HAVE A RECEIPT FOR NOVEMBER 3RD
27 FOR -- SORRY. THAT'S NOT THE RECEIPT WE'RE LOOKING FOR. NICOS
28 STEAK & CHOP IN THE AMOUNT OF $83.19?

3609
1
2
A. YES, SIR.
Q. 39702. THIS IS AN EMAIL FRO!>! !>!S. QUINONES INDICAT ING
3
ON !>!ARCH 8, 2010, "DEAR LADIES, HERE ARE !>!Y
LATEST NEWS THAT I
4
SHARED ~1=TH MARl SAL AND JvlARI1', L1'.ST WEEK. AFTER ALMOST 20 YEARS
5
OF WORKING FOR SAN YSIDRO SCHOOL DISTRICT, I 111',S
LAID 0;;7 FROM MY
6
7
8
9
JOB. THE REASON THEY GAVE ME WAS BUDGET CUTS, BUT NOT TRUE. IT
WAS A POLITICAL MOVE ON THE PART OF MY OPPONENT TO TRY TO GET ME
OUT OF THE RACE. ONE OF THE BOARD MEMBERS ~lHO LED THE CHARGE AND
MADE THE l"lOTION '1'0 GET RID OF MY POSITION WORKS FOR HIJvl, TO'I'ALLY
10 WRONG, UNETHICAL," THREE EXCLAMATION POINTS. "SO NOW I HAVE NO
11 JOB AND IN 'l'HE NI DOLE OF NY CAMPAIGN."
12
13
WARRANT?
IS THAT AN ENAIL TH1',T WAS FOUND PURSUANT TO THE SEARCH
14
A.
YES, SIR, IT WAS.
15
Q.
20195 FROM ~lARCH 10, 2010.
DO YOU SEE FOR MARCH 10TH
16
17
THIS IS DR. GANDARA'S CALENDAR?
A. YES, SIR.
18
Q.
DOES IT INDICATE, "I,UNCH, HENRY AMI GABLE ,
RO!>!ESCO'S"?
19
A.
THAT'S CORRECT.
20
Q.
36379. THIS APPEARS TO SE A JvlEMORANDUM ON
21
MARCH
16, 2010, ON SWEETWATER UNION HIGH SCHOOL DISTRICT
22
LETTERHEAD;
IS THAT CORRECT?
23
24
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
Q. IS IT FROf:.l ARLIE RICASA, BOARD PRESIDEl\T, AN::! JESUS M.
25
26
GANDARA,
lL
THE SUPERINTF;NDENT?
YES, SIR.
27
28
ACTIVITY"?
Q. DOES IT INDICATE, "PROHIBITED POLITICAL CAMPAIGN

3610
1 A. YES.
2 Q. AND DOES IT GO THROUGH, "AS YOU KNOW, CALIFORNIA LAW
3 AND SWEETWATER UNION HIGH SCHOOL DISTRICT POLICY PROHIBITS THE
4 USE OF DISTRICT FACILITIES AND EQUIPMENT FOR RESOURCES FOR
5 POLITICAL CAMPAIGNING PURPOSES. IN THE PAST ELECTION SEVERAL
6 VIOLATIONS" -- "IN THE PAST ELECTION YEARS SEVERAL VIOLATIONS OF
7 THIS PROHIBITION HAVE FORCED US TO SEND DISTRICT WIDE REMINDERS
8 AND DIRECTIVES ENJOINING POLITICAL ACTIVITY USING DISTRICT
9 RESOURCES ON CAMPUS SCHOOL SITES" -- "CAMPUSES OR AT DISTRICT
10 EVENTS.
11 "IN THIS ELECTION YEAR OF 2010, WE HAVE AGAIN BEEN RECEIVING
12 NOTICE THAT POLITICAL CAMPAIGN ACTIVITY IS TAKING PLACE ON
13 DISTRICT PREMISES DURING WORKING HOURS. WE ARE WRITING TO REMIND
14 ALL DISTRICT PERSONNEL AND ANY CANDIDATES OR THEIR VOLUNTEERS
15 THAT IT IS UNLAWFUL AND PROHIBITED BY WORK POLICY TO SOLICIT
16 DISTRICT PERSONNEL FOR POLITICAL CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTIONS, SUPPORT
17 FOR VOTES DURING THEIR DISTRICT WORKING HOURS, USE DISTRICT
18 RESOURCES OR FACILITIES INCLUDING DISTRICT EMAIL OR FIRST CLASS
19 FOR POLITICAL CAMPAIGN PURPOSES, ENGAGE IN POLITICAL CAMPAIGN
20 ACTIVITY ON ANY DISTRICT PREMISES OR AT ANY DISTRICT EVENT
21 OCCURRING ON DISTRICT PREMISES.
22 "YOU SHOULD FEEL FREE TO COMMUNICATE ANY CONCERNS ON THESE
23 ISSUES, OR REPORT ANY VIOLATIONS, TO ANY ADMINISTRATOR, THE
24 ASSISTANT SUPERINTENDENT OF HUMAN RESOURCE OR SUPERINTENDENT.
25 THE DISTRICT WILL INVESTIGATE EACH INCIDENT AND TAKE ACTION AS
26 APPROPRIATE." SIGNED ARLIE RICASA, BOARD PRESIDENT, AND JESUS
27 GANDARA, SUPERINTENDENT.
28 IS THAT WHAT WE WE'RE LOOKING AT.

3611
1
2
A.
Q.
YES, SIR.
34102. THIS IS MARCH 23, 2010.
3 WE'LL GO ON TO 34105. SORRY, 34104. 34102, AGAIN. THIS IS
4 A LETTER FROM MR. ALIOTO TO MR. CHOPRA. AND THIS INDICATES
5 I'LL READ THIS LETTER TO YOU. IT'S A LITTLE BIT LONG. I
6 APOLOGIZE.
7 "DEAR DR. CHOPRA, I AI'~ WRITING TO COfV:tJfUNICATE TO YOU A
8 SITUATION ~ElICH IS BECOt1ING INTOLERABLE TO tJfE WITH REGARD TO THE
9 CONDITIONS UNDER \~HICH I' tJf ~iORKnJG HERE ON C.l\t.JPUS. I BROUGHT
10 THIS TO YOUR ATTENTION BEFORE A:,D I GREATLY APPRECIATE THE MORAL
11 SUPPORT THAT YOU HAVE PROVIDED, BUT I Al'1 ASKING FOR SOME MORE
12 FORMAL INTERVENTION AT THIS POINT.
13 "WHEN YOU HIRED ME, YOU EXPRESSED A CLEAR DESIRE THAT I
14 CREATE AN ENVIRONtJfENT OF ACCOUNTABILITY FOR BOTH STAFF AND
15 tJfANAGEt.JENT. I BELIEVE THAT I'VE MADE GREAT EFFORTS AND HAD SOME
16 SUCCESS IN DOING SO. I HAVE SENT CLEAR r.1ESSAGES THAT WE MUST PUT
17 p.N END TO THE PORNOGRAPHY, ONLINE SHOPPING, PRIVATE BUSINESS
18 OPERATIONS, 11ISUSE OF EQUIP~lENT AND VEHICLES, INSUBORDINATION AND
19 A HOST OF OTHER PROBLEtJfS CREATE::J BY SOME OF THESE EM?LOYEES. TEE
20 FEEDBACK, AS ONE ~IGET EXPECT, EAS BEEN ONE OF BEING LABELED AN
21 INTnlIDATOR. THERE IS A BELIEF TH.l\T SOtJfE EtJfPLOYEES ARE ENTITLED
22 TO DO WHATEVER THEY WANT AND TO USE DISTRICT RESOURCES IN ANY ';>IAY
23 THEY WANT AND THEY VIEW ANYONE TRYING TO PUT AN END TO IT
24 OP?RESSIVE.
25 "ON TEE BUDGET FRONT, I EAVE INS'l'l'I'U'I'ED MUCH STRONGER AND
26 MORE MEANINGFUL PROCESSES FOR TRANSFERRING FUNDS AND HAVE
27 INITIATED THE GENERATION OF EQUIPMENT AND TECHNOLOGY LONG-TERtJf
28 PLANS. MOST OE' THE FEEDBACK ON THIS HAS BEEN POSITIVE; HOWEVER,

3612
1 SOtv:E OF IT HAS BEEN QUITE N2GATIVE. IN PARTICULAR, DEAN ARNOLD
2 HAS AND QUITE HOSTILE. SHE'S HAS RESPONDED TO EACH CHANGE WI'I'H
3 ACCUSATIONS OF ADMINISTRATIVE RETALIATION AND/OR HARASSr·~ENT. IN
4 FACT, I UNDERSTAND THAT HER STAFF OPENLY REFERS TO ME AS 'EMPEROR
5 NICHOLAS' DURING THE STAFf MEETINGS. APPARENTLY, MY REFUSAL TO
6 ALLOW THE PURCHASE OE' 22 NEW STEINWAY PIANOS THAT ARE NOT
7 BUDGETED (ESTIMATED COST OF ABOUT A HALF MILLION DOLLARS) DOESN'T
8 SIT WELL I'iITH THEM. OR, MAYBE IT IS f'IY REE'USAL TO l'I.PPROVE, ON AN
9 URGENT BAS=S, AN :::QUIPl>1ENT LIST (ALSO HUNDREDS 01" THOUSANDS OE'
10 DOLLARS) E'OR A BUILDING THAT ISN'T BUILT YET 1I.ND E'OR WHICH MAI,Y
11 ITEMS HAVE NO COST IDENTIFIED.
12 "SINCE COl-UNG TO SWEETW.lITER COMMUNITY COLLEGE, IT IS
13 APPARENT THAT VARIOUS Er~PLOYEE GROUPS ACTIVELY ARE WORKING TO
14 PRESSURE YOU AND/OR THE GOVERNING BOARD TO EXPEDITE YOUR
15 RETIREMENT. THEY HAVE BEEN QUITE PLAIN WITH ME AND MOST EVERYONE
16 ELSE THAT TH:::S IS THEIR INTENT. IN MY ROLE, IT IS MY JOB TO
17 SUPPORT YOUR ROLE AND POS:::TION J\S WELL AS TO LEAD THE VARIOUS
18 DEPARTMENTS THAT YOU HAVE CHARGED ME IHTH THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR.
19 THESE GROUPS INTERPRET ANY STATEMENT OF r'AST OR OPINION THAT
20 SUPPORT YOUR DECISIONS AND/OR POSITIONS BY ME (AND OTHERS) AS
21 UNASCEPTABLE AND, OVER THE PAST MONTHS, HAVE" -- CONTINUING TO
22 THE NEXT PAGE, 34103
23 " __ BECOME MORE :::XPRESSIVE TO ME AND OTHERS AS TO POTENTIAL
24 R8TALIATION ON THEIR PlIRT AGAINST ~jE IN THE FUTURE.
25 "I AM 1>N 8XPERENSED ADYlINISTR1>TOR 1>ND AY! SOMEWHN.:' USED TO
26 V:::=LED THREATS FROM UNIONS. I'IHAT IS HAPPENING ?T THIS COLLEGE,
27 HOW8VER, IS QUITE OVER THE TOP. 'rHE BEHAVIORS, STATEM8NTS AND
28 ACTIONS ON THE PART OF V?RIOUS ELEMENTS OF THE FACULTY UNION ARE

3613
1 ADDING SIGNIFICAN':'LY TO THE STRESS LEVEL UNDER WHICH I AM
2 FUNCTIONING AND IS No\~ RISING TO A LEVEL WHERE UNFOUNDED
3 ACCUSATIONS BY THEt-l ARE CLEARLY INTENDED TO IMPUGN MY
4 PROFESSIONAL REPUTATION AND EVEN INTIMIDA'l'E MY OWN DIREC'I'
5 REPOR'l'S. RECENTLY, FOR EXAMPLE, THE SCEA VICE PRESIDEN'I' SAID AT
6 AN AOC MEETING THAT HE WONDERED IF OUR RFP'S WERE AWARDED BASED
7 ON SEX OR CAMPAIGN CASH EXCHANGES~ THERE WAS NO INDICATION AS TO
8 HOW SUCH A STATEMENT WAS JUSTIFIED. THEY ALSO RECENTLY
9 DISTRIBUTED A FLYER [,ROUND CAMPUS WITH IKACCURATE IKFORt"lATION
10 RIDICULIl,G A BUDGET PRESEN':'A'I'ION 'l'HAT MY STAFF AND I ~jORKED ON
11 FOR DOZENS OF HOURS AND THAT WAS PRAISED BY EVERY I'IEt1BER OF THE
12 GOVERNING BOARD. THESE ARE JUST TWO EXAMPLES OF THEIR BEHAVIORS,
13 BUT I \~ANT TO GIVE YOU TWO MORE TO ILLUSTRATE HOW BAD THEY ARE
14 GETTING.
15 "A CONVERSATION OCCURRED RECENTLY BETWEEN A FORMER AND
16 CURRENT COLLEGE EMPLOYEE AND A VENDOR THAT REPORTS TO t1E.
17 NR. HENRY AMIGABLE, OUR PROPOSITION R PROGRAN DIRECTOR, RECENTLY
18 W2NT TO DINt;ER WITH FORMER VICE PRESIDENT GREG SAKDOVAL. SHORTLY
19 B2FORE 'I'H2 DINt;ER, MR. SANDOVAL S2NT A TEXT TO MR. ANIGABLE
20 INF'ORMING !lIlYl THi"T PROFESSOR JAIME SALAZAR WOULD ALSO BE COMING
21 TO DINNER."
22 RECALL NOW, THIS IS MULTIPLE LEVELS OF HEARSAY. IT IS NOT
23 OFFERED E'OR THE TRUTH.
24 "DURING THE COURSE OF THE DINNER, MR •• IlJ.JIGABLE WAS INFORM2D
25 THAT THE SCEA UKIO)! WAS GOING TO DEFEAT THE INCUt"lBENT GOVERNING
26 BOARD MEMBERS, FIRE YOU AND TEEN FIRE l'1E BECAUS:: I AN '':'OUR BOY. '
27 THIS IS A CONTINUATION OF EFFORTS BY UNIONS WHO ARE INTENTIONALLY
28 TELLING MY STAFF THAT I I~ILL NOT BE HERE LONG AS THEY ARE GOING

3614
1 TO GET ME TERMINATED AND THAT THEY SHOULD BE CAREFUL ABOUT BEING
2 SEEN AS SUPPORTIVE TO ME.
3 "PROFESSOR MAX BRANSCOMB HAS ENGAGED IN A SMEAR CAMPAIGN
4 AGAINST ME SINCE HE BECAME AWARE OF THE FACT THAT THE SUN WAS
5 BEING AUDITED. THIS AUDIT WAS TRIGGERED AS A RESULT OF THERE
6 BEING A SIGNIFICANT DECREASE IN REVENUES AT THE SUN DESPITE THE
7 FACT THAT THE ADVERTISEMENTS CONTINUED TO BE PRINTED IN THE
8 PAPER. SPECIFICALLY, HE HAS REPEATEDLY ACCUSED ME OF STOPPING
9 PAYMENT ON SOME INVOICES. HE HAS BEEN TOLD REPEATEDLY BY LAURA
10 SALES AND I THAT THIS IS NOT TRUE. I HAVE OFFERED TO TAKE A LIE
11 DETECTOR TEST IF HE WOULD AND HE WILL NOT. I HAVE ASKED HIM FOR
12 ANY EVIDENCE AT ALL THAT HE EVER REPORTED THAT HE WAS HAVING ANY
13 PROBLEMS GETTING INVOICES PAID AND HE CANNOT. THE SUN THEN
14 PRINTED A STORY SAYING THAT I STOPPED PAYMENT ON THEIR BILLS AND
15 FROZE THEIR BUDGET WITHOUT EVEN ASKING ME IF THAT WAS TRUE. THIS
16 IS OF PARTICULAR CONCERN TO ME."
17 I'LL SKIP THROUGH THE NEXT PART. IT WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR
18 YOUR READING AS IT BECOMES RELEVANT.
19 31- 34104. "I'M ASKING THAT I BE PROVIDED A COPY OF THE
20 BRANSCOMB LETTER AND ANY COMMUNICATION BETWEEN GB MEMBERS
21 REFERENCING ME; THAT THE SUN PRINT AN IMMEDIATE RETRACTION OF THE
22 STATEMENTS THAT I FROZE THE BUDGET AND STOPPED PAYMENTS ON THEIR
23 BILLS AND THAT THE COLLEGE MAKES ITS BEST EFFORTS WITHIN THE
24 CONFINES OF THE LAW TO PUT AN END TO THE THREATS, INTIMIDATION
25 AND HARASSMENT BY THESE TWO UNIONS AGAINST ME AND MY STAFF.
26 "IT'S BEEN AN HONOR TO WORK FOR YOU AND THE COLLEGE AND I
27 LOOK FORWARD TO CONTINUING TO DO SO WELL INTO THE FUTURE.
28 "SINCERELY, NICHOLS ALIOTO, VICE PRESIDENT OF BUSINESS AND

3615
1 I"INlmCIAL AFFAIRS. n
2 DOES THAT APPEAR '1'0 BE A LE'I'TER WRITTEN BY MR. ALIOTO?
3
A. YES, SIR.
4 MR. SCHORR: THE PURPOSES OF PRESENTING THIS LETTER TO YOU,
5 AS I SAID, IS TO PRESENT THINGS THAT POTENTIALLY COULD BE
6 EXCULPATORY. WHETHER OR NOT THIS IS EXCULPATORY -- I PRESENT IT
"/ TO YOU ONLY FOR YOU TO MAKE THE DETERHINI'.TION OF WHETHER OR NOT
8 HR. ALIOTO FELT FORCED TO DO OR Cot-1?ELLED TO DO THINGS HE HAY OR
9 MAY NOT HAVE BEEN ACCUSED TO DO OR IS I~RONGLY BEING ACCUSED OF
10 ANYTHING THAT HE MAY OR "lAY NOT 3E ACCUSED OF DOING. THAT'S FOR
11 YOU TO DECIDE. BUT I HAVE CERTAIN OBLIGATIONS. AND IF I SEE
12 TH.I'.T SO~lETHING COULD BE INTERPRETED AS EXCULPATORY I JUST WANT TO
13 t~.lI.KE SURE TO PUT IT IN FRONT OF' YOU AS GRAND ,JURORS AND ALLOW YOU
14 TO MAKE YOUR OWN DECISION.
15 Q. 37206. I'IE'RE LOOKING AT THE TIME PERIOD MARCH 8,
16 2010 MAYBE NOT. WE'LL MOVE ON.
17
18 Q.
tvJARCH 27TH.
YEAH, I DON' 'I' KNOW WHY 1 SAID M.lI.RCH 8TH. THAT W,ZI.S THE
19 NEXT THING. WHAT DOES IT IND:CATE E'OR MARCH 27TH?
20 A. CHIAPAS TRIP. TR:::P TO HELL. AND THEN 6:00 p.[V1.,
21 SOUTH\'IEST COLLEGE SWC GI'LA."
22
23
24
Q.
A.
Q.
AND THAT'S GREG SANDOVAL'S CALENDAR?
YES, SIR, IT IS.
18535. THIS IS MARCH 8TH, SWEE'I'WATER UNION HIGH SCHOOL
25 DISTRICT MEETING AGENDA ITEM. IS THIS B-04 APPROVAL OF
26 EDUCATIONAL AND CULTURAL VISIT TO CHIAPAS, MEXICO, FOR THE
27 PURPOSE OF ESTABLISHING A SISTER SCHOOL, F'ROM MARCH 27TH TO
28 APRIL 3RD, 2010?

3616
1 A. YES, IT IS.
2 Q. CAN YOU PULL BACK ON THAT, PL2ASE. AND I' t-l TRYING TO
3 SEE IF rr I'lDICATES THE NAMES OF THE ATTEND2ES. LET'S LOOK AT
4 18536. WE'LL CONTINUE ON.
5 DO YOU K'lO,,] ,,]H2THER OR NOT NS. EVENTUALLY REPORTED
6 THAT TRIP ON FORM 700?
7 A. YES, SHE DID.
8 Q. 18701, IS THIS THE 1'.NENDMENT FORM 700, WHE:RE SHE
9 18702. THIS IS NOW 2012. AND SHE I'lDICATES THE TRIP AS A GIFT
10 FOR THE AI",OUNT Of THE TRANSPORTATION, B2ING $1,200; IS THAT
11 CORRECT?
12 A. THAT'S CORRECT. THIS CAtvTE TO LIGHT -- MS. LOPEZ, WHEN
13 SHE CAME TO OUR OFFICE, SHE MADE SOME CONPLAINTS, AND ONE OF THE
14 ISSUES WAS THAT SHE COMPLAINED THAT DR. GANDARA FAILED TO REPORT
15 THIS TRIP ON HIS FORM 700 AND SHE POINTED THAT OUT TO US AT THAT
16 THeE.
17 Q. DO YOU RECALL APPROXIMATELY WHEN IT WAS THAT SHE
18 POINTE:D THAT OUT IN RELATION TO HER ANE'lDED FORg 7007
19 A. LET ME TAKE A LOOK AT THE DATE OF THE AME'lDED, WHEN
20 THIS WAS AMENDED.
21 Q. SHE AMENDED IT 4/12/2011.
22 A. v,E t·IET WITH HER I THINK JUST AROUND THIS TIME FRAME SO
23 T CAN'T REgEgBER EXl"CT DAY. I THOUGHT I1' WAS gAY THE 5TH, BUT I
24 COULD BE -- THAT WAS gy RECOLLECTION.
25 Q. APPROXIgATELY THREE: \',EE:KS AFTER THE AtJ[E'lD!~ENT; IS THAT
26 CORRECT?
27
A.
THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
28
Q.
BUT THE ORIGINAL DATE OF THE TRIP WAS
E'OR THE YEAR

3617
1 PRIOR?
2
A. IT WAS YES, SIR, DURING THAT TIME FRAME.
3 r'lR. SCHORR: BUT THE ORIGINA," REPORTING WOULD HAVE BEEN --
4 SO IN 2011, IT WOULD HAVE HAD TO REPORT IT, AND THEN MARCH, APRIL
5 TIrvJE PERIOD, AND THEN THE AMENDr.1ENT APPEARS JUST A ,"ITT,"E Brr
6 AFTER THAT REPORTING TIME PERIOD, IF THAT MAKES SENSE. THE
7 AMENDMENT. IT'S NOT LIKE IT WAS A YEAR AFTER THE TRIP -- WELL,
8 IT WAS A YEAR AFTER THE TRIP. BUT IT WAS ONLY A FEW WEEKS AFTER
9 THE DESIGNATED TU1E THAT SHE HAD TO HAVE REPORTED IT AND PRIOR TO
10 HER COr.UNG IN AND CO'1PLAINING TO MR. GIAIME ~HAT DR. GANDARA
11 DIDN'T REPORT IT.
12 THE WITNESS: INTERES'rING TO NOTE I S THAT THE THREE
13 INDIVIDUALS THAT DID ATTEND 'fHIS TRIP WAS DR. GANDARA, BERTHA
14 L6PEZ AND GREG SANDOVA,". BOTH MR. SANDOVAL AND GANDARA FAILED TO
15 REPORT THIS TRIP ON THEIR CALIFORNIA FORM 700'S.
16 MR. SCHORR: LET'S PULL BACK A LITTLE BIT ON THAI. AND IN
17 TERfI>lS OF THE SCHEDULE THAT IS REPORTED UNDER -- IT'S SCHEDULE E,
18 WHICH IS GIFT RELATED TO ?RAVEL PAYMENTS AND ADVANCES -- SO JUST
19 TO REMIND THE GRAND JURY THAT THERE IS A LIMIT OF $420 RELATED TO
20 TRAVEL PAYMENTS, GOING BACK TO FPPC TESTIMONY.
21 IF YOU ARE BEING PAID -- IF YOUR TRAVEL IS BEING PAID FOR BY
22 AN AGENCY AND YOU ARE ON A BUSINESS RELATED TYPE OF' TRIP ,"IKE
23 THIS, OR YOUR O\~N AGENCY IS PAYING F'OR IT, NOT SOME;ONE ELSE IS
24 ?AYING F'OR YOU TO DO A BUSINESS TRIP, BUT YOUR OWN AGENCY IS
25 PAYING FOR IT, YOU ARE ALLOl'iED TO EXCEED THE AMOUNT OF' $420.
26 YOU'D HAVE TO REPORT IT, BUT THERE ISN'T A LIMITATION, IF THAT
27 MAKES SENSE.
28 IT'S SCHEDU,"E E VERSUS SCHEDULE D, WHICH IS ,JUST DEALING

3618
1 WITH THE STRAIGHT GIFTS. DIFFERENT FROM, LET'S SAY, A DIFFERENT
2 ORGANIZATION. LET'S SAY, HYPOTHETICALLY, SGI OR SOt,1EONE WAN'rED
3 TO PAY FOR HER TO GO ON A TRIP THAT WAS DEALING WITH THE
4 BUSINESS, THEN YOU "iOULD HIWE ?EPORTING OBLIGATIONS. EVEN THOUGH
5 IT'S BUSINESS RELATED, IT'S AN OUTSIDE AGENCY OR OUTSIDE COMPANY
6 THAT IS P1WING FOR THAT TRIP AND THAT WOULD BE GIF':' REQUIREMENTS
7
8
VERSUS SCHEDULE E.
Q. SO WE'LL CONTINUE ON. I'LL GO 13507, WHICH IS
9 F.PRIL 1ST, 2010. AND IS THIS THE SUBCONSULTANT AGREEMENT BETWEEN
10 SEVILLE CONSTRUCTION SERVICES AND JOHN WILSON?
11 A. YES, SIR.
12 Q. AND I BELIEVE WE'VE ALREADY GONE INTO THIS A LITTLE
13 BIT.
14 MR. SCHORR: IT CONTINUES THROUGH 13515 IN CASE YOU GUYS
15 If/ANTED TO LOOK IN MORE DETAIL ABOUT THE SUBCONSULTANTS AGREEMENT.
16
17
18
Q.
A.
Q.
WE'LL GO ON TO 37207. MR. SANDOVAL'S DAY PLANNE? --
YES, Ie' IS, SIR.
-- FOR APRIL 2ND, 2010? DOES THAT INDICATE LAKERS GAME
19 AT 7: 30 P.lvJ.?
20 A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
21 Q. WE'LL LOOK AT 11337 FOR APRIL 10, 2010. THIS IS JAIME
22
23
24
ORTIZ'S CREDIT CARD RECEIPT; IS THAT CORRECT?
A. YES t SIR.
Q. AND IT INDICATES ON APRIL 10, 2007, THE MARINE ROOM IN
25
26
LA JOLLA 521 -- $521.31.
A. YES, SIR.
DO YOU RECALL THAT?
27
28
Q. WE'LL GO ON NOW '1'0 -- DID YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO
REVIEW BERTHA'S DESK CALENDAR?

3619
1
A.
YES, I
DID.
2
3
Q.
A.
DID YOU SEE ANYTHING ANNOTATED 0:.1 4/10/2010?
YES, SIR.
4
Q. "IHNr DID IT INDICATE?
5
IL
IT INDICATED DINNER WI'I'H ORTIZ, IN PARENTHESES,
6
CELEBRATION DINNER.
I BELIEVE IT WAS ORTIZ'S BIRTHDAY.
7 Q. DID IT INDICATE SPECIFICALLY WHOSE BIRTHDAY IT WAS?
8 A. I BELIEVE IT WAS DINNER WITH THE ORTI Z ES, WITH ORTI Z ' S
9 BIRTHDAY. ACTUALLY, IT SAYS, "DIN:.IER InTH ORTIZ, CELEBRATION
10 DI:.I:.IER BIRTHDAY."
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
Q. OKAY. BUT INDICATING A DINNER FOR THi'.T DATE W:::TH JAIME
ORTIZ?
A. THAT'S CORRECT. MS. DID NOT REPORT THAT IN HER
CALIFORNIA FORM 700.
Q. I'LL GO TO 37207 FOR APRIL 16TH. IS THAT GREG
SANDOVAL'S CALENDAR FOR APRIL }6, 2010?
A. YES, S:;:R.
Q. DOES THAT INDICATE DINNER WITH HECTOR R.?
A. YES, SIR.
20 Q. 37207, STILL ,mERE WE ARE. GOING ON TO APRIL 17TH, THE
21 NEXT DAY. IT INDICATES 5:00 P.M. PADRES W:::TH JAIME ORTIZ?
22 A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
23 Q. 37449. DOES THAT INDICATE FOR THE SAME DAY,
24 APRIL ;7'1'H, PADRES TICKETS THAT ARE LABELED JAmE ORTIZ FOUND AT
25 GREG SANDOVAL'S RESIDENCE?
26 A. YES, SIR.
27 Q. E'OR 11337, JAIME ORTIZ'S CREDIT CARD FOR THAT SAME
28 DATE, APRIL }7, 2007. DOES IT INDICATE SOt1E VARIOUS EXPENSES AT

3620
1 PETCO PARK AS ~JELL 1',S DONOVAN'S STEAKHOUSE IN THE A~10UNT OF
2 $458.03?
3 A. YES, SIR.
4
5
6
7
8
Q. 37208, FOR GREG SANDOVAL'S DAY PLANNER FOR THE DATE OF
APRIL 19TH. DOES THAT INDICATE 12: 00 P. M. LUNCH WITH RENE?
lL I'iITH RENE, nHll.T' S CORRiOCT, SIR.
Q. AND WE'LL GO TO 43687. LOOKING AT GARY CABELLO'S
RECEI PT FOR 4/23, DOES IT INDICATE, DINNER SWEETWATER, GREG
9
10
SANDOVAL AT URBAN SOLACF~
At;lOUNT OF $ 81. 60?
IN THiO AMOUN'I' OF $22.75, AS WELL AS THE
11
A. THAT'S CORRECT, SIR.
12
Q.
WAS THIS REPORTED BY MR.
SANDOVAL?
13
A.
HE ClICl NOT REPORT ':'HE DINNER ON HIS FOR"! 700.
14 Q. ~IE'LL GO TO APRIL 25TH, THAT DAY. APRIL 25, 2010, GARY
15 CABELLO'S SAME EXPENSE RECEIPT, DOES THAT INDICATE DINNER WITH
16 SWEETWATER, DR. GANDARA -
17 A. THAT'S CORREC':'.
18 Q. -- BENTO NOODLES?
19 37207, GREG SANDOVAL'S C)\LENDAR FOR APRIL 30TH. DO YOU SEE
20 WHERE HE INDICl'.TES 6:00 P.M. FIGHT AT JAIME O.?
21 A. THAT'S CORREC':'.
22 Q. ~lHY DON' T ~jE DO JUST ONE OR TvlO HORE AND WE'LL JUST GET
23 YOU OFt' AND LET OUR NEXT WI'I'NESS COME ON.
24 9304. 'I'lllS MEASURE A BOND PROGRAM E'OR SEVILLE CONSTRUCTION
25 SERVICES DEALS '{11TH THEIR NUMBER OF HOURS AND ,;,OTAL TO BE BILLED.
26 THIS IS 5/11/2010 FOR JOHN WILSON, PROGRAM LIAISON E'OR SNACK BAR.
27 TOTAL NUMBER OF HOURS 57, BILL RATE $165, MAKING IT $9,405. AND
28 BUILDING 570 PROJECT, 61 HOURS, $165, FOR $10,065. IS THAT

3621
1 CORRECT?
2 A. YES, SIR, IT WAS A TOTAL OF $19,470.
3 Q. 13522 FOR JUNE 4TH. IT'S ANOTHER INVOICE FROM JOHN
4 WILSON TO SEVILLE CONSTRUCTION SERVICES, ATTENTION HENRY AMI GABLE
5 ON 6/4/2010. DOES THAT DEAL WITH HIS CONSULTANT BALANCE DUE IN
6 THE AMOUNT OF $16,400?
7 A. YES, SIR.
8 Q. WHY DON'T WE GO AHEAD AND STOP THERE NOW FOR YOURSELF.
9 MR. SCHORR: AND IF WE CAN HAVE MR. GIAIME REMINDED OF THE
10 ADMONITION.
11 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: YOU ARE REMINDED THAT YOU ARE STILL
12 ADMONISHED.
13 THE WITNESS: YES, MA'AM.
14 THE COURT: IF EVERYONE CAN WAKE BACK UP -- NO OFFENSE TO
15 MR. GIAIME. WE'RE RUNNING THROUGH A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT THINGS.
16 WE'LL CALL OUR NEXT WITNESS AFTER ...
17 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: YOU ARE REMINDED THAT YOU ARE STILL
18 UNDER OATH IN THIS MATTER.
19
20 JAIME ORTIZ,
21 GRAND JURY WITNESS, HAVING BEEN PREVIOUSLY, WAS EXAMINED AND
22 TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS:
23
24 EXAMINATION
25
BY MR.
LUDWIG:
26
Q. GOOD AFTERNOON, MR. ORTIZ. THANKS FOR COMING BACK.
27
A.
GOOD AFTERNOON.
28
Q. HOPEFULLY, THIS WILL NOT BE TWO DAYS IN LENGTH LIKE

3622
1
LAST TIt4E.
IT WILl, BE A FEW QUESTIONS AND REt-mINING ITEMS AND WE
2
3
4
CAN GET YOU OUT OF HERE.
LIKE ,'IE I~ERE DOING BEFORE, l'iE \~ANT TO COVER SOME EVENTS AND
THINGS AND CONVERSATIONS MEMORIALIZED MOSTLY IN EMAILS AND CREDIT
5
CARD STATEMENTS.
SO WE LEFT OET I THINK IN JANUARY OF 2011 AS
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
FAR AS OUR CHRONOLOGY GOE:S.
THERE'S A REFERENCE TO POSSIBLE DINNER IN THIS Et4.lUL HERE
~IE'RE PUTTDJG UD ON THE SCREE;)J, NO. 18160. IT ADDE.lI,RS TO YOU --
"'ROM YOU TO HS. RICAS.ll. CONCERNING SUITE & TENDER. SU~TE & 'I'ENDER
THAT'S A RESTAURAN'I'; CORRECT?
A. YES.
Q. WAS THIS IN REFERE;)JCE TO A DINNER THAT ACTUALLY TOOK
PLACE?
14
• ll. .
I BELIEVE SO, YES .
15
Q.
DO
YOU RECALL ANYTH:NG SPECIFIC ABOUT THIS DINNER, \~HAT
16 WAS THE PURPOSE OF IT, OR ANYTHING THAT HAPPENED THAT IS
17 MEMORABLE '1'0 YOU?
18 A. UM, I BELIEVE THE PURPOSE WAS A GENERAL GET-TOGETHER
19 AND IT I~AS KIND OF A \~ELCOME FOR JOHN t~CCANN BECAUSE HE WAS, I
20 BEL:EVE, ;)JEI'ILY ELECTED IN NOVEJV:BER. AND IT I~AS JUST A
21 GET-TOGETHER, AND I THI;)JK THE ATTE;)JDEES I~ERE ARLI E AND ED, JOHN
22 AND HIS WIFE, AND THE SUPERINTENDENT AND HIS WIFE. I' H NOT
23 ENTIRELY SURE IF IT WAS JOHN OR JIM WHO WENT.
24 Q. OKAY. BUT IT'S MS. RICASA, HER HUSBAND, MR. BAGAPORO
25
YOURSELF
YOUR WIFE TOO?
26
A.
YES.
AND THE SUPERINTENDENT AND HIS WIFE?
27
2B
Q.
A.
OKAY. ~lS. QUn::)ONES?
NO.

3623
1
2
Q.
DO YOU RECALL THE APPROXlI-1ATE r,MOl)t,T OF THE CHECK?
NO IDEA.
3
Q.
I ASSUME WHATEVER IT WAS
YOU PICKED UP THE TAB?
4
A.
I WOULD ASSUME SO, YES.
5
Q.
WAS THERE ANOTHER NEVER MIND. WE HAVE ANOTHER EMAIL
6 HERE, 6026. THIS APPEARS TO BE ANOTHER Et1AIL BETWEEN YOURSELF
7 AND ~1R. FLORES. I F ,"IE CAN BLOW THE TOP OF TH]"T UP. DATED
8 MARCH 6, 2011. AGA:::N, I'r'S DOCUMEKT 6026. IT SEEMS TO CONCERN
9
10
11
12
MR.
GANDARA AND A CHECK.
DO YOU RECALL ANY EVENTS THAT THIS HAPPENS TO REFERENCE?
A. I DO NOT.
Q. IT HAS BONNY I.N THERE. DO YOU HAVE ANY RECOLLECT:::ON AS
13
14
15
TO WHETHER OR NOT THAT'S BON!,Y GARCIA?
A. IT PROB]"BLY IS. I DON'T REl-cEl-cSER WHAT THr,T l'iAS.
Q. OKr,\Y. HO~] ABOUT THE TOP LINE WHERE IT SAYS, "BONNY CUT
16
17
INTO YOUR PARTY."
EVENT OR ANYTHING?
DOES THAT RING ANY BELLS AS FAR AS ANY TYPE OF
18
19
20
21
22
23
A. I DON'T BELIEVE WE Hl',D A PARTY. NO.
Q. I H]"VE ANOTHER E14JUL FROt1 THE KEXT DAY EXCHANGE, AGAIN
BETWEEN YOURSELF ]"ND [-CR. FLORES. EXPAND THAT ]" LI'l'TLE BIT.
1-1ARCH 7TH. THIS IS DOCUMENT NO. 6028.
DO YOU REMEMBER THIS EMAIL EXCHANGE OR ANY EVENTS REFERENCED
HERE?
24
A.
I
DON'T.
25
Q.
O.KAY. I'LL SHm'i YOU 6045. LET teE SEE IF THIS HAS ANY
26 MEANING FOR YOU. IT'S ANOTHER EI·1AIL BETWEEN YOURSELF AND
27 MR. FLORES, DATED MARCH 26TH. "BERTHA CALLED. ASKED ME IF WE
28 MET WITH GANDARA AND BOUGHT HIM DINNER. I SAID I DID NOT ATTEND.

3624
1 I DID NOT TELL HER YOU THAT AND LANCE WENT. SO STICK TO THE
2 STORY. HOPE YOU DID NOT SAY OTHERWISE. n
3 A. YEAH.
4 Q. WHAT WAS HAPPENING HERE?
5 A. IT WAS AT -- IT '''AS AT THE CABAY (PHONE:TIC) CONFERENCE
6 IN LONG BEACH AN::l vJE HAD DINNER THERE AND BONNY WAS THERE. IT
"7 '''AS JENNIE (SIC) AND HIS WIFE. IT ''JAS AT A STEAK RESTAURANT.
8 DON'T KNOW WHICH ONE. }">.ND BONNY, DR. GANDARA, HIS \"IFE, l'1YSELF
9 ALONE, AND THERE'S ANOTHER GRO'JF THERE -- THERE ~JAS ANOTHER
10 SUPERINTENDENT THERE, BUT FROM SOl'1EWHERE IN L. A.
11 Q. ~JHAT WAS TEE REASON TEAT YOU KIND OF CONCE]I.LED THE
12 DINNER, THE FACT THAT YOU BOUGHT DINNER FOR DR. GANDARA AND
13 MS. LOPEZ?
14 A. BECAUSE BERTHA AND DR. GANDARA DIDN'T GET ALONG AND SHE
15 WAS -- SHE WANTED -- BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T GE,T ALONG WE KIND OF
16 TRIED TO SEPARATE THEM.
17 Q. ANY IDEA WHAT THE CHECK VALUE WAS THAT NIGHT FOR THE
18 DINNER?
=- 9 NO I ':lEA.
20 WAS IT OVER $50 FER ?ERSOW?
21 PARDON?
22 \vAS IT APPROXU1ATELY $50 OR HORE PER PERSON'?
23 I THINK IT'S PROBABLY MORE.
24 OKAY. WE HAVE ANOTHER EJVAIL UP HERE. THIS IS DOCUMENT
25 WE'LL START FROM THE BOTTOM. IT! S DATED J'JNE 18,
26 2011, TO YOURSELF FROM MR. FLORES CONCERNING APPARENTLY A PARTY
27 WITH MS. QUINONES.
28 DO YOU UNDERSTAND ~IHAT THIS EMAIL IS ABOUT?

3625
1
A.
CAN I SEE THE TOP PART OR THE BOTTOM PART?
2
Q.
THAT WAS THE EARLIER EMAIL.
THIS IS THE RESPONSE
3
4
5
6
APPARENTLY FROM YOU.
A. I WISH I WOULD HAVE PHRASED THAT A LITTLE BIT
DIFFERENTLY.
Q. AND IT SAYS, "GOOD THING YOU DIDN'T HAVE TO COME DOWN
7
TO MEET WITH MS. WONDERFUL."
WHO MIGHT THAT BE?
8
9
A.
Q.
PEARL.
SO WHAT -- AFTER REVIEWING THIS, WHAT DOES THAT ENTAIL?
10 WHAT IS THE BACKGROUND?
11 A. THIS WAS WHEN THE SUPERINTENDENT -- THAT SOUTHWEST HIGH
12 MEETING WAS WHEN THE SUPERINTENDENT WAS LET GO.
13
14
15
16
Q. OKAY.
A. AND THAT REFERENCE TO JAIME BONILLA WAS -- WAS TO
PERSUADE PEARL TO VOTE TO LET THE SUPERINTENDENT GO.
Q. WHY WAS THAT IMPORTANT TO PERSUADE MS. QUINONES? WHY
17 WAS IT IMPORTANT TO YOU OR YOUR COMPANY TO LET GO OF DR. GANDARA?
18
A.
IT WASN'T, TO OUR COMPANY,
IMPORTANT TO DO THAT.
19
Q.
WHAT WAS THE REASON BEHIND PERSUADING HER TO VOTE TO
20 LET GO OF DR. GANDARA?
21 A. WE WEREN'T DOING THAT. WE WEREN'T PERSUADING HER TO DO
22 ANYTHING.
23 MR. SCHORR: IF YOU DON'T MIND, I WANT TO ASK A COUPLE
24 QUESTIONS.
25 BY MR. SCHORR:
26 Q. WHY WOULD BONILLA HAVE AN INTEREST IN THROWING SOME
27 MONEY AT PEARL QUINONES TO GET HER TO VOTE GANDARA OFF?
28 A. BECAUSE OF ALLEGIANCE WITH BERTHA.

3626
1 Q. AT THIS POINT IN TIME, QUINONES IS ON -- I'IE CAN
2 PROBABLY CHECK THE DATE:, BUT SHE'S ON THE: SIDE OF DR. GANDARA
3 PRIOR TO THE FIRING?
4 A. I THINK SHE'S ON THE F'ENCE. THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING.
5 Q. IN TERMS OF THROWING Sot-1E: MONEY HER WAY TO BUY HER
6 VOTE, l'lIIAT TYPE OF THROWING 1-10NE:Y ARE WE TALKING ABOUT? I'/RITING
7 HER A CHECK SOMEWBE:RE OR SUPPORTING HER CAMPAIGN OR SUPPORTING
8 SOMETHING SHE:'S INTERESTED IN?
9 A. I DON'T KNOW. THAT WAS SPECULATION ON MY PART BASED ON
10 T~E EART.,:::ER COMMENT. I DON'T KNOltI SPECIFICS REGARDDIG IF' THERE
11
12
13
\VAS A CHECK CUT \vHATEVER DIRECTION, BUT STRATEGICALLY IT WOULD
MAKE SENSE BASED ON TBE ALLEGIANCES THA'l' PEOPLE HAD AT THE TIME.
Q. THEY NEEDED IN ORDER TO GET' THREE TO GET RID OF'
14
DR. GANDARA,
PEARL QU:fiONES WOULD HAVE TO GO TO TBE SIDE OF
15
16
17
BERT~A LOPEZ. AND vmo ~IOULD BE THE THIRD?
A. IT ENDED UP BEING 5-0, THE DECISION '1'0 DO IT.
Q. RIGHT. BUT WHO WOULD BE THE THIRD -- ONCE YOU GET TO
18
THREE, THEN nHE OTHER '1'WO DON'T MATTER.
THEY CAN POTENTIALLY
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
VOTE WITH THE REST OF THEf:.1 TO MAKE IT SE:E:M LIKE IT I S FIVE.
A. I BELIEVE JOHN WAS THE THIRD.
Q. OKAY. YOU ARE NOT SURE?
A. 1'1'1 NOT SURE, BECAUSE nHIS HAPPENED IN CLOSED SESSION.
Q. GOTCHA. YOUR COMMENT IS t40RE SPECULATION AS TO WIIE'l'HER
OR NOT A VOTE WAS BOUGHT; YOU DON I T HAVE ANY Ac'rUAL EVIDENCE OR
ANY OBSERVATIONS OR 'rALKED TO P,NYONE THAT TOLD YOU?
A. CORRECT, '1'IIA'::' WAS SPECULA?ION.
MR. SCHORR: OKAY. SORRY.
28
BY MR.
LUDWIG:

3627
1 Q. LET I S GO OVER A COUPLE CALENDAR APPOINTfvIEN'1'S. 'I'HIS ONE
2 IS 6178. IT REFERENCES DINNER W1'I'H BERTHA -- 6173 REPRESENTS
3 DINNER \

3628
1 Q. V'IE'LL PUT TWO PAGES OF THE SAME Et4AIL STARTING M'
2 PAGE 6187 AND 6188. STARTING AT THE BOTTOH, INDICATING WHO IT'S
3 FRm~, IT APPEARS FROM YOU, MR. ORTI Z, TO r~R. FLORES. WE CAN
4 STF.RT ON THE LEFT SIDE TOP AND C;UST GO THROUGH IT. "RENE, TALKED
5 TO JOHN AND HE GAVE t1E A RECAP Of' THE I~EETING. HE SAID BASICALLY
6 THAT DIANNE KIND OF SHUT DOWN PROP 0."
7 YOU ARE SHAKING YOUR HEAD. ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THIS
8 EMAIL?
9 A. YES. I WROTE IT, YES.
10 Q. "SHE IS SAYING THAT THE DISTRICT NEEDS THE MONEY FOR
11 CASH FLm~. JOHN AND ARLIE WERE VERY SPECI F'IC THAT SHE WAS NOT TO
12 USING FACILITIES FUNDS FOR CASH FLOW PURPOSES. I TOLD HIN THAT
13 SHE WAS ALREADY BORROWING THE MONEY. HE COULDN'T BELIEVE IT. HE
14 ASKED ME TO KEEP IT CONFIDENTIAL SO HE COULD TALK TO ED ABOUT IT.
15 JOHN SAID THAT ARLIE AND HIN WERE PRETTY STRONG IN THEIR
• 6 TAG-~EAMING IN :JRIVING THE ?OINT HOl1E WITH ED AN::J AFTER A l'IHILE
17 HE SlUD ED "lAS GETTING THE PICTURE AND SAID, 'WELL, YOU'RE THE
18 BOSSES. ,n
19 WE'LL KEEP READING HERE. "THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE A
20 SUBSEQUENT PROP 0 t1EETING IN THE NEXT 30 DAYS. THEY ASKED DIANNE
21 TO LOOK AT OTHER OPTIONS FOR CASH FLOW AND TO BRING THEM LEGAL
22 OPINIONS. I ASKED HIM I~HAT WP,S GOING ON HAPPEN TO TIlE
23 $55 t1ILLION THAT' S LEFT OVER RIGHT NOW. HE SAD ARLIE AND HI;:"l
24 WANTED TO SPEND IT BUT NEEDE:J TO KEEP I'IORKING ON DIANNE AND' ED.
25 THEY DIRECTED ED AND DIANNE TO GET A POLLING FIRH TO :JETERNINE
26 WHETHER ANOTHER PROPOSITION WOULD BE LOOKED UPON FAVORABLY BY THE
27 PUBLIC. C;OHN ASKED ED WHY I WASN'T AT THE MEETING. ED SAID THEY
28 WANTED TO TII.LK TO THEt-l, ARLIE AND C;OHN, BEFORE THE BOARD TALKED

3629
1 TO ~~E. DON'T KNO\-, ,'1HAT THAT MEANS. ANYWAY, THAT WAS IT. n
2 AND 'I'HE FINAL PORTION ON THE NEXT PAGE, "LOOKS LIKE WE'RE AT
3 WAR WI'l'H ENE~cES BOTH FOREIGN A~D DOMESTIC. AS IF TtlE :-lIDN'1' HAVE
4 OUR HANDS FULL ALREADY WITH THE PUBLIC SCRUTINY, NOW WE HAVE TO
5 DEAL WITH AN OPEN INSIDER ENEMY IN DIANNE. WE'LL BE OKAY, BUT WE
6 NEED TO KEEP OUR FRIENDS STRONG. GIVE ME A CALL TOMORROW. n
7 YOU MIND PU'I"rING SOME CONTEXT TO THIS AND HELP EXPLAIN WHAT
8 IS HAPPENING.
9 A. AT THAT POINT IN TIME WE HAD U:mER CmJSTRUCTION NINE
10 MAJOR CONSTRUCTION PROJEC'I'S AND OUT OF WHAT WAS A TOTAL OF ABOUT
11 $256 MILLION OF FUN:-lING THAT \'1E HAD AVAILABLE UN:-lER PROP O. l"iE
12 HAD COMMITTED ABOUT 200 OF IT IN CONSTRUCTION PROJECTS AND
13 CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS WITH THE FIRST NINE PROJECTS. SO THERE WAS
14 ESSENTIALLY 55, $56 !'lILI,ION LEFT OVER THAT l"iASN'T COMMITTED. AND
15 IN CONSTRUC'I'ION YOU NEED TO BUILD WHEN P::

3630
1 \'l/HER!c THE STATE DOESN'T GIV!C ';'HEM THE ENTIRETY OF THEIR FUNDING
2 SO IN ANY GIVEN t1Ot1ENT THEY NEED TO BORROW FROt·l OTHER FUNDS TO
3 MAKE PAYROLL OR \'JHl,TEVER THEIR OBLIGATIONS ARE, AND SHE I~AS
4 BORRm-nNG FRat"l PRO? 0 AND FROf1 THE STATE MATCHING FUNDS THAT l'iERE
5 GIVEN TO PROP 0 THAT t1ADE UP THE $256 l"lILLION TOTAL.
6 SO LONG STORY SHORT, SHE l'iAS USING THAT $55 MILLION FOR
7 OTHER OBLIGATIONS AND SHE SlUD, "YOU CAN'T MOVE FORWARD WITH YOUR
8 PROJECTS BECAUSE I NEED THIS MONEY TO TAKE CARE OF MY
9 OBLIGATIONS." IN OUR CONVERSATIONS WITH THE BOARD MEMBERS
10 OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE, AND JUST OUR EXPERIENCE IN SCHOOL
11 CONSTRUCTION FOR MANY YEARS, WE KNEW THAT THAT WAS -- THAT WASN'T
12 CORRECT, THAT IvAS AGAINST THE BOND LANGUAGE, THAT WAS AGAINST THE
l3 STATE MATCHING FUNDS, THE l'lAY THEY ~JERE ALLOCATED. THEY SAID
14 THEY NEED TO BE USED SPECIFICALLY FOR CONSTRUCTION FUNDS.
15 AND MANY DISTRICTS BORROI'i FUNDS FRO~l OTHER FUNDS BUT AS LONG
16 AS YOU DON' '1' NEED THAT MONEY IMMEDIATELY, AS LONG AS IT'S IW'1'
17 :MPEDING PROGRESS, YOU KNOI'i, IQHATF,VER. IT'S LIKE IN A BAt.:K AND
18 THE BANKS ARE LOANING IT ';'0 OTHER INVESTORS OR WHATEVER, BUT I'JHEN
19 YOU NEED THll.'1' lYJON!CY YOU HAVE ACCESS TO IT AND YOU CAN USE IT FOR
20 THE PRIMARY PURPOSE IT WAS GIVEN '1'0 YOU.
21 AND THE VOTERS ALLOWED THE DISTR:C'I' '1'0 HAVE THAT MONEY '1'0
22 mPROVE FACILITIES AND THE STATE ALLOCATION BOARD AND THE STATE
23 FUNDING GAVE 'rHAT MONEY TO THE DISTRICT TO IMPROVE THEIR
24 FAC:LITIES. SO AT THAT POINT SHE WAS -- SHE WAS STOPPING US FROM
25 MOV:NG FORWARD vETH ESSENTIALLY THE PROGRAM BECAUSE SHE WANTED
26 '!,HA'!, MONEY FOR HER CASH FLOW PURPOSES. SHE SAID IT OUTRIGHT
27 SEVERAL TIMES IN SEVERAl, MEETINGS THAT WE HAD.
28 AND THERE WAS AN AUDIT REPORT THAT OUTLINED THAT, AND SO THE

3631
1 BOARD \~AS IN THE PROCESS OF STOPP ING THl,T, AND DR. GANDARA, WHEN
2 HE ~JAS THERE, HE STOPPED THAT PRACTICE AND TOLD HER YOU CANNOT
3 USE THAT FOR -- THAT MONEY. SO WE WERE -- WE WERE IN THE PROCESS
4 OF PRIORITIZING. AND IN THE f'lIDDLE OF THAT DR. GANDARA WAS LET
5 GO. ED BRAND WAS BROUGHT IN. AND THERE WERE CERTAIN ALLEGIANCES
6 vHTH E:J BRAND AND DIANNE RUSSO BECAUSE THEY \~ENT BACK TOGETHER.
7 SO WHEN ED BRAND WAS 3ROUGHT INTO THE PICTURE, DIANNE RUSSO WENT
8 BACK ON TO HER POS1'1'10N THAT "I NEED THIS MONEY FOR CASH FLOW, n
9 WHEN DR. GANDARA HAD ALREADY STOPPED THAT. ED BRAND SAID -- SO
10 ESSENTIALLY SHE WAS TRYING TO STOP THE FORWlI.RD PROGRESS OF THE
11 BOND PROGRIIM WITH THAT $55 ~1ILLION. SO THAT WAS THE CONTEXT OF
12 THIS.
13 SO THE MEETING THAT I REFERENCED THERE WAS A SUBCOMt1ITTEE
14 THAT THE BOARD FORMED TO DISCUSS FACILITIES, AND IN THAT THEY
15 WERE GOING TO DISCUSS THE PRIORITIES OF THE NEXT ROUND OF
16 PROJECTS. AND AT THA'I' r~EETING DIANNE RUSSO MENTIONED TO THEM
17 THAT SHE NEEDED THAT MONEY FOR CASH FLOW, AND THAT'S 'I'HE DIALOGUE
18 THAT I EXPLAINED TO RENE WHAT HAPPENED.
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
Q. PRIOR TO THIS, WAS MS. RUSSO SOMEONE VIEWED AS FRIENDLY
TOWARDS SGI AND PROP 0 OR WP.S SHE ALWAYS SOMEONE HOSTILE?
A. SHE WAS p.LWAYS sm·lEWHP.T HOSTILE. I THINK SHE WAS
FAcRLY HAPPY ,11TH THE WORK AND CLOSE TO THE PREVIOUS PROGRAM
MANAGERS SO THERE WAS ALWAYS SOME HOSTILITY.
Q. WHEN YOU SAY "PREVIOUS PROGRAM MANAGERS," YOU MEAN THE
FOLKS AT GILBANE OR PRIOR --
A. NO, HARRIS/GAFCON.
Q. WHEN YOU REFERENC'C THER'C "KEEPING YOUR E'RIENDS STRONG,"
28
WHO AT THIS POINT IN TmE -- \~'C' RE TALKING AUGUST 2011.
WHO DID

3632
1 SGI CONSIDER TO BE REAL SUPPORTE;RS AND PROPO:-.JE:-.JTS?
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
A. THE E'1TIR": BOARD.
Q. AND THE E:NTIRE BOARD, OKAY.
A. AND TilE ENTIRE BOARD WAS I GOT TH": FE":LING THAT THEY
ALWAYS APPRECIATED HEARING KIND OF THE INSIDE POLITICS OF WHAT IS
REfI.LLY GOING ON AND i\LWAYS TOLD US "LET US KNOvJ, YOU K'1 Ol'i ,
vJHAT" -- "("HAT IS REALLY GOING ON SO WE C."'N BE AWARE OF' IT."
Q. YOU MENTIONED THAT ED BRAND WAS SOME,~HAT ALIGNED WITH
9
10
11
MS.
RUSSO ON THAT POSITION OF CASH FLo\~.
A. VERY MUCH.
Q. DID YOU TAKE ANY STEPS TO TRY TO SWAY HR. BRAND OR
12
13
BRING HIM TO YOUR SIDE?
A. I GAVE HIM A COHPLETE PRESENTATION ON -- HE WAS VERY
14 NEl'i TO THE POSITION AND vJASN'T AWARE \tIHAT WE HAD DONE. I GfI.VE
15 lin, A PRESENTATION OF ALL THE PROJECTS, ,mST A COMPLETE
16 PRESENTATION ON THE HISTORY OF' PROP 0 AND WHERE I'IE I'IERE
17 F'INANCIALLY AND THE PRIORITIES GOING FORWARD. BUT HIS NUMBER ONE
18 CONCERN WAS THE DISTRICT'S F'INANCIAL CONDITION, AND TH.".T' S
19 CERTAINLY -- DON'T FAULT HIM FOR THAT, BUT WE HAD A ;:)IFFERE:-.JT
20 OPINION ON \~HETHER THEY COULD USE BOND MONEY AND FACILITIES NONEY
21 FOR CASH F'LOW.
22 Q.
DO YOU KNOW IE' THEY ULTIMATELY DID USE THE MONEY FOR
23 CASH FLOW?
24
A.
YES.
25
Q.
I'LL PULL UP ANOTHER EHAIL HERE.
':'HIS IS A COUPLE DAYS
26 LATER ON AUGUST 14TH, DOCUHENT 6190, BETWEEN YOURSELF AND
27 HR. FLORES. IT REFERENCED A MEETING I'lITH BERTHA, A DINNER
28 t~EETING IHTH I ASSUME THAT'S BERTHA LOPEZ AN;:) POSSIBLY vOHN

3633
1 MCCANN, ARLIE RICASA?
2 A. YES.
3
Q.
DO YOU RECALL IF SUCH A DDlNER EVER TOOK PLACE?
4
A. I BELIEVE IT DID. I'M NOT ENTIRELY SURE WHERE AND
5 WHEN.
6 Q. SO I HAVE ANOTHER ONE OF YOUR CREDIT CARD STATEMENTS.
7 THIS IS A PARTIAL PIECE OF IT. IT'S 6240. WE'RE GOING TO ZOOM
8 IN 01, 1'. PORTION RELATED TO SEPTEMBER 16TH OF LAS~ YEAR. TEERE' S
9 A FEi'l ENTRIES FOR AN'l'HOLOGY RESTAURANT. THREE I THINK
10 SPECIFICALLY. ONE FOR $545.49, ANOTHER FOR $25, AND A THIRD FOR
11 $134, APPARENTLY ALL AT THE SAME LOCATION, ON THE SAME DATE.
12 DO YOU RECALL A TRIP TO ANTHOLOGY THAT DAY?
13 A. I DO.
14 MR. LUmHG: I'VE BEEN ADMONISHED .1\1\0 IT'S TIME FOR OUR
15 BREAK.
16
MR. SCHORR:
IT'S NOT FRON t1E.
17
MR. LUDWIG: HOLD THAT THOUGHT, AND THE FORE PERSON HAS AN
18 ADMONISHMENT OF HER OWN.
19 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: YOU ARE REMINDED THAT YOU ARE STILL
20 ADMm:ISHED.
21
MR. LUmnG: SO 1'lE mISE ALL BEEN ADMONISHED.
22
THE WITNESS:
I'VE NEVER LOOKED UP 'l'HAT I~ORD.
23
24
25
MR. LUDWIG: IT'S NEANS WARNED. BE BACK IN A F'EW MINUTES.
(RECESS. )
MR. LUDWIG: ALL RIGHT. t4R. ORTIZ, WELCOME BACK.
26
THE I~ITl\ESS:
THANK YOU.
27 GRAND JURY SECRETARY: WE HAVE ALL 16 GRAND JURORS PRESENT.
28 BY NR. LUDWIG:

3634
1 Q. WE WERE TALKING ABOUT ANTHOLOGY ON SEPTEMBER 16, 2011.
2 YOU SAID YOU RE~jEMBERED THAT EVENT. WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF
3
4
5
6
7
GOING TO ANTHOLOGY THAT NIGHT?
A. IT ~JAS -- SEPTEMBER 16TH IS MEXICAN INDEPENDENCE DAY,
AND THERE 'iIAS A BIG [vlARIACHI CONCERT THAT JEFF NEVIN FROM
SOUTHWES':'ERN COLLEGE ~IAS PERFOR~nNG "lITH HIS GROUP AND WE GOT
INVITED THROUGH THE: ~1I'.RII'.CHI SCHOLARSHI P FOUNDATION. \~E ,1ERE
8
GIVEN TICKETS TO GO TO THE EVENT.
SO THAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF THE
9
10
11
12
13
EVENT. IT ~IAS KIND OF A FESTIVE OCCASION AND GOOD MUSIC. THAT
WAS 'I'HE REASON WE ,",EN I' .
Q. WAS THERE A COST ASSOCIATED WITH JUST WALKING IN THE
DOOR?
A. THERE WAS, AND I BELIEVE \~E GOT THE TICKETS FOR FREE
14
15
FOR THE EVENT.
BELIEVE.
THEY ,1ERE DONATED FROM THE -- FROM JEFF, I
16
Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY RECOLLECTION AS TO HO\~ "'lOCH THE TICKETS
17 NOR~~LLY COST?
18 A. $20.
19
Q.
HOW MANY TICKETS DID YOU GET?
20
A.
I
GOT TWO.
21
Q.
OKAY.
WHO ELSE WAS IN ATTEND1\NCE THAT NIGHT?
22
23
24
25
26
IL ~JITH ME AND MY ~IIFE, BERTHA LOPEZ AND HER HUSBAND,
JOSE. AND GREG SANDOVAL WAS THERE AS ~IEL:::' WITH HIS WIFE, BUT AT
A DIFFERENT TABLE AND DIFFERENT ADMINISTRATORS FROM THE DISTRICT
"iERE THERE.
Q. Nm~, THE CHARGES, DO YOU RECA:':' WHAT THESE THREE
27
CHARGES ARE?
WHAT THEY REFERENCE?
28
A. THE FIRS'I' ONE WAS FOR THE DINNER AND WINE THAT ,",E HAD

3635
1 1'.T TH::: EVE:NT. THE SECOND ONE I I M NOT SURE. 'fHE THIRD ONE ~lAS
2 DRINKS AFT:::RWARDS AT THE BAR.
3
4
5
Q. SO EXCLUDING THE MIDDLE $25 CHARGE, B:::CAUSE ~iE DON'T
KNm'i WHA'f TH.n.T ,'lAS -- WHAT 'l'HAT RELATES TO :::XACTLY, vJERE THE 545
AND THE 134, WOULD THAT BE FOR ITEMS CONSUMED JUST BY THE FOUR OF
6 :OU, YOUR WIFE, YOURSELF AND THE, LOPEZES?
7 A. THE 545 vJOULD BE. THE LOPEZ:::S \~EREN'T THERE FOR TH:::
8 LAST CHARGE.
9 Q.
SO -- BUT THE SANDOVAL'S WERE AT A DIFFERENT TABLE;
10 RIGHT?
11
12
13
A.
Q.
A.
YES.
DID :OU PAY FOR THE,IR DINNER?
NO.
14
Q.
OKAY.
IF WE TAKE 20 PERCENT 'l'lP OUT OF 545, WE HAVE
15 454 SPLIT FOUR WAYS. WE HAVE ABOUT, WHM', $1107 SO $110.
16
17
. n..
Q.
THA':' SOUNDS ABOU':' RIGHT .
WHO WOULD BE HAVING THE DRINKS THAT ARE THE SUBJECT OF
18 THAT THIRD CHARGE?
19 A. I':' WAS MYSEU', HY I'iIFE, AND SOME ADMINISTRATORS THAT W:::
20 SAW THERE. I THINK JEE'F WAS -- BOUGHT SOHE DRINKS FOR J:::FF AS
21 WELL.
22
23
24
Q.
A.
Q.
OKAY.
I NEEDED A DRINK AFTER THAT.
YOU SAY THAT WAS -- ~1AS THERE A P1'.RTICULAR INCIDENT
25 THAT HAPPENED?
26 A. YES. AFTER DINNER AND BEFORE THE DRINKS WHEN THE EV:::N':'
27 W.n.S OVER, AROUND 10ISH, THE LOPEZES LEFT AND "IE SA,,) SOME FOLKS
28 ':'HAT \~E KNEW. I'lE WERE ON THE SECOND FLOOR -- AND ANTHOLOGY HAS

3636
1 THREE FLOORS -- AND WE HAD SEEN SOME FRIENDS THAT WE KNEW ON THE
2 E'I RST FLOOR. SO \~E WANTED TO SAY HI TO THEM. SO WE SAID
3 GOOD- BYE TO THE LOPEZES AND 1 \~ENT TO THE RESTROOM. I TOLD MY
4 vIIE'E," I'LL SEE YOU AT THEIR TABLE." I \'1ENT TO THE RESTROOM
5 PRIOR TO GE'I'TING THERE AND AT 'I'HE RESTROOM I Rl',N INTO HECTOR
6 RO!':lERO.
7 AT E'IRST HE WAS IN 'I'HE URINAL WI'I'H HIS BACK FACING TOWARD
8 ME. SO I DIDN'T -- I THOUGHT IT WAS HIM BUT I WASN'T SURE. SO I
9 vlENT TO THE URn~AL NEXT TO HH1 A)JD DID)J' T SEE H:::S FACE l'.:m SAvl
10 SOMEBODY Wl\S;{ING -- THEN HE WENT TO \'1AS;{ HIS HANDS. AND I WAS
11 JUST IN CASE I WANTED TO KIND OF WAIT UNTIL HE LEFT BEFORE GOING
12 TO WASH MY HANDS. BUT HE WAS STALLING. SO ANY~JAY, I TURNED
13 AROUND AND PROCEEDED TO THE SINK, AND IT WAS HIM, AND HE -- WE
14 HAD PROBABLY A nlO-I'IINUTE-LONG CONVERSATION ::~I T;{E "ESTROOt"!.
15 IT WAS JUST HI~l AI·m I IN THE RESTROOI'! AND HE \'lAS CLEARLY
16 VERY UPSET AT -- HE HAD BEEN RELEASED FROM TWO OE' THE PROJECTS
17 THAT HE Wl\S DOING, HIS COMPANY WAS DOING FOR SWEETWATER, BECAUSE
18 THEY WEREN' '1' PERF'ORMING AND THEY WEREN' 'I' -- THEY vJEREN' T
19 PE"FORt1I:JG. SO THEY WERE RELEASED, BUT HE BLAMED ME FOR BEING
20 ONE OF THE PRINCIPAL REASONS FOR THEIR RELEASE. AND HE SAl;) THAT
21 WHAT WE DID TO HIM -- IT WAS A PROFANITY T"ADEN TIRADE THAT HE
22 HA;). BUT HE SAID ESSENTIALLY THAT ME THAT WHAT WE DID TO HIM
23 WASN' '1' RIGHT AND THAT HE IvAS GOING TO HE USED A LOT OF
24 P"OF.".N::TY. BUT SCREW US UP -- SCRE\-l US UP, r.1E AND MY FAMILY,
25 Tm\T HE HAD ALREADY TAKEN CARE OF IT, l\ND THAT WE WE"E GOING '1'0
26 GET F'ED UP, THAT HE SAID, "THERE'S NOBODY HERE IN THE
27 RESTROOM RIGHT NOW AND THAT'S WHY I'M TELLING YOU THAT," SO WHEN
28 IT HAPPENS, YOU KNm~ "mo THE HIT Cl'.ME FROH, ESSENTIALLY, AND THIS

3637
1 WAS ALL IN SPANISH. I'!' WAS A CONVERSA'l'ION WE WERE HAVING IN
2 SPANISH. AND AT THAT POIN':' I J:;ST vJANTED TO GET 0:;'1' OF THERE. I
3
4
WAS - IT'S PRETTY SCARY TO HAVE SOMEBODY TELL YOU THAT.
Q. HOW DID YOU INTERPRET ~iHAT HE WAS SlWING TO YOU?
5 A. THAT HE HAD HIRED SO~jEONE TO -- AT THAT PO I N':' r I
6 THOUGH'!' IT WAS ':'0 KILL US.
7 Q. YOUR ~IHOLE FA~nLY?
8 A. I~ELLr THAT'S WHAT HE SAID. AND SO I ~lANTED TO LElWE.
9 I REACHED TO~lARD THE DOOR AND HE DID THE SAt"1E TIME AND HE YELLED,
10 "DON'T ':'O:;CH ME." I TOLD HI!~ I WANT ':'0 LEAVE. ANJ HE KIND OF
11 Fl.INCHED. I THOUGHT -- I FEl.T THAT ANY S:;DDEN MOVEMENT THl'.T I
12 WOULD ~ffiKE vJOl;LD ESCALA':'E INTO A PHYSICAL CONFRONTATION AND I
13 DIDN'T WANT TO DO THAT. SO AS WE WERE LEAVING THE RESTROOM HE
14 KIND OF OPENED THE DOOR AND WALKED IN FRONT OF ME AND SAID,
: 5 "REMEMBER ~iHAT I ~OLD YOU" OR "DON 1 T FORGET "mAT I '::OLD YOCl" OR
16 SOMETHING. "YOU GUYS ARE GOING ':'0 GET F' ED UP AND" -- "AND 11" S
17 ALL ':'AKEN CARE OF," AND SO ON. '!'HERE WAS A PRET'l'Y DETAIl.ED EMAIL
::'8 THAT I SENT THE DlW AFTER, THAT YOU GUYS PROBABLY HlWE, TO THE
19 SUPERINTENDENT AND THE BOARD.
20 AND AF'l'ER THAT, IT TURNS OUT THAT HE WAS SITTING RIGHT NEXT
21 TO WHERE OClR FRIENDS WERE AND NO t10RE THAN EIGHT, TEN FEET AWAY
22 AND THE SANDOVAL'S vJERE THERE. THEY HAD LEFT BY THAT TIME, BUT
23 IT "lAS HECTOR, HIS ,nFE, JAH1E SALAZl'.R AND HIS WIFE. l'.ND AS I
24 WENT TO OUR FRIENDS TABLE, I SHOOK JAIME'S HAND. I DIDN'T
25 REALIZE THAT HEC'I'OR vJAS AT THAT 'l'ABLE, BECAUSE HE -- I ?ASSE:D HIM
26 WHEN WE WERE COtUNG OUT OF THE RESTROOM AN) I FOCClSED ON OUR
27 TABLE. l'.N D 'l'HAT' S WHEN I ORDERED A COUPLE DRINKS, BECAUSE I
28 NEEDED IT AT THAT TIME. AND THEY LEFT ':'HE: JAItJiE SALAZhR AND

3638
1 HIS WIFE AND 'rHE RO[v1EROS LEFT OR GOT OUT FROM THE TABLE AND I~ENT
2 TO THE BAR, AS IT TURNED OUT. AND WHEN THEY LEFT, JAIME GAVE ME
3 HIS HAND AS WELL TO SAY GOOD-BYE ]\ND HIS WIFE, AND HECTOR vJAS
41'HERE AS I V'IAS SHAKING HANDS. I SHOOK IT, AND THA'l' viAS HECTOR'S
5 HAND, AND HE SAEl, "REKEt·1BER WHAT I TOLD YOU AND LOO,(ED teE
6 STRAIGHT IN THE EYES," FAIRLY MENAC:::NG LOOK, AND THEN THEY LEE"l'
7 OR vlALKED TOWARD THE DOOR.
8 TURNED OUT THAT THEY STAYED AT THE BAR, AND I WANTED TO
9 LEAVE BUT I DIDN'T WANT TO RUN INTO THEM ON THE STREET. SO WE
10 STAYED THERE, AND ~lHEN I WAS GLANCING OVER TO SEE IF THEY HAD
11 LEFT, THEY WERE AT THE BAR AND I SAW THAT HE ,~AS SPECIFICALLY
12 LOOKING IN t.JY DIRECTION. I DON'':' KNOW IF I'M OVERANALYZING IT,
13 BUT THAT'S WHAT 1'1"1 SEEING. UNTIL FINALLY THEY LEFT AND viE
14 WAITED ANOTHER HALF-HOUR AND ':'HEN LEFT OURSELVES. SO THAT WAS
15 ':'HE INCIDENT. I FILED A POLICE REPORT AND GOT A RES':'RAINING
16 ORDER, TEMPORARY RESTRAINING ORDER, AND THAT l'llAS IT.
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
Q. IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU DID OR SAID AS A RESULT OF
WHAT YOU EXPERIENCED THERE?
A. HOW DO YOU ~jEAN?
Q. DID THAT CHANGE ANYTHING YOU DID IN CONNECTION WITH
YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH SWEETWATER OR ANY BUSINESS DEALINGS YOU
HAD?
A. NO, NOT REALLY. I WAS JUST VERY I THOUGHT THIS
THREAT I~AS ~1UCH t·JORE SEVERE THAN THE PREVIOUS ONE THAT ::: l'HOUGHT
viAS SEVERE FRot') H=Iv]. I viAS PRETTY UPSET FOR A WEEK OR SO. I
26
MRA~:,
UPSET -- NOT UPSET BUT SHA,(EN AND WORRIED FOR T':lAT PERIOD
27
28
OF TWE.
Q. WHAT BECAME OF ALL THIS?

3639
1 A. WE HAD -- THERE WAS, LIKE I SAID, A TEMPORARY
2 R2STRAINING OR::)ER GRAN'l'ED. l'iHEN IT I'JAS HE}\RD TO MAKE IT
3 P2RMAN2NT, THE JUDGE THAT HEARD IT F2LT THAT THIS COULD HAVE BEEN
4 RELATE::) TO 'rHE~ LAWSUIT THAT HE HAD FILE::) AGAINST THE DISTRICT AND
5 AGAINST US, hND DISMISSE::) THE RESTRAINING ORDER.
6 Q. HAVE YOU HAD ANY FURTHER CONTACTS, POSITIVE OR
7 NEGA'l'IVE, WITH MR. ROMERO SINCE THEN?
8 A. JUST AT THE Hjo~ARINGS FOR THE RESTRAINING ORDER. I
9 MEAN, WE DIDN'T HAVE CONTACT. WE WERE JUST IN THE SII.ME ROOM.
10
11
12
13
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
NO FURTHER THREATS OR ANYTHING?
NO.
AND 1 ASSUME NOTHING HAPPENED TO YOU OR YOUR FAMILY?
NO.
14
Q. THAT'S GOOD. WANT TO SWITCH GEARS A LITTLE BIT AND
15 TALK ABOUT SOME TEXT MESSAGES. WE HAVE A GRID UP HERE. IT SAYS
16 IN-BOX, SENT, THE PHONE NUMBERS, NAMES, MESSAGF,S, DATES, TIMES.
17 IS THIS COMING FROM YOUR PHONE?
18
A.
NO.
19
Q.
I'JE HhVE HIGHLIGHTED ONE HERE, h MESSAGE.
IT GOES TO
20 YOU. }\ND I CA::.l REPRESENT TO YOU THIS IS MS. QUII~ONES'S PHO)lE.
21 DATED OCTOBER 11.
22
23
24
25
26
27
A.
Q.
RECEIVING
A.
Q.
A.
THAT'S ARLIE'S PHONE.
IT'S ARLIE'S PHONE? OKAY. Dm~S THIS RING A BELL, YOU
THIS MESSAGE FROM HER?
YES.
WAS THERE A DINNER All' THIS PLACE?
YES, IT WAS AN EVENT.
28
Q.
.".::.l
EVENT?

3640
1 A. ARLIE WAS BEING RECOGNI ZED F'OR -- I THINK IT viAS 100
2 ONE OF THE 100 LEADING FILIPINO WOMEN IN THE UNITED STATES OR
3 SOMETHING LIKE THAT, AND SHE HAD MENTIONED THIS TO US IN -- AT
4 ONE OF TH:': EVENTS, ]"ND WE BOUGHT A TABLE FOR THE EV:':NT, AND THOSE
5 ~,ERE THE PEOPLE TEAT WERE GOING TO BE SITTING AT THE TABI,E.
6
7
8
9
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
DO YOU REMEMBER HOW MUCH TEE TABLE COST?
I DON'T. IT \~AS IN SAN FRAKCISCO.
DO YOU REMEMBER WHERE IN SAN FRANCISCO?
IT WAS A HOTEL. I Cl\J-/' T REME~1BER THE NAM:': QE' THE
10 HOTEL.
11 Q. BECAUSE IT WAS AN OUT-OF-TOWK EVENT, DO YOU RECALL IF
12 SGI PAD FOR ANY OF' THE TRAVEL OR HO'I'EL .Zl,CCOI>lMODATIONS?
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
TRIP
A. vIE DID NOT. I WAS ACTUALLY IN LAS VEGAS ON A PERSONAL
AND FLEvl JUST FOR THAT EVENT ]\.ND FLEI'I BACK.
Q. OKAY.
A. JUST FOR THE DINNER AND FLEW OUT.
Q. I TH"INK \~E' R:': ALMOST DONE.
A. OKAY.
MR. SCHORR: I'LL JUMP IN REAL QUICK, IF THAT'S OKAY.
20 BY I'IR. SCHORR:
21 Q. ONC:': -- PRIOR TO DR. GANDARA LEAVING, DID DR. GANDARA
22 HAVE WOULD HE SOLICIT YOU TO DOKATE TO MEMBERS OF THE BOAR;),
23 MAKE CAM?AIGN VONATIONS TO BOARD MEt'IBERS?
24
A.
MYSELF PERSONALLY?
25
Q.
ON BEHALF OF YOUR COMP]\.NY,
BUT WOULD HE T]\.LK TO YOU
26
ABOUT DONATING ~IHAT
HOW MUCH THE BOARD MEMB:':R WOULD NEED?
27
A.
HE WOULD.
28
Q.
DID THAT CHANGE ~mEN
DR. BRAND -- DID DR. BRAND ALSO

3641
1
2
3
4
SOLICIT YOU FOR CAMPAIGN DONATIONS?
A. YES, HE DID.
Q. CAN YOU EXPLAIN HOW OR WHEN THAT WOULD TAKE PLACE.
A. UM, I'r HAPPE',ED ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS. '['HE FIRST TIt'lE
5 V/1\S REGARDING PEARL AND HELPING HER RETIRE DEBT FROM HER ASSEMBLY
6 RACE, AND PEARL H.IW ACTUALLY CALLED ME BEFORE THAT SAYING THAT
7 DR. BRI\"ID -- TELLING ME, HEY, DR. BRAND JUST ASKED HE IE' SHE
8 WANTED HH1 TO ASK ME FOR SOME HELP OR SGI FOR Sm~E HELP TO RETIRE
9 HIS DONATION AND SHE THOUGHT THAT WAS A LITTLE BIT STRANGE, SHE
10 TOLD 14E, BUT SHE SAID JUST EXPECT THE CALL. I SAID OKAY. AND HE
11 DID.
12
13
Q.
A.
DID SHE ASK YOU FOR HELP HERSELF?
SHE HAD BEFORE. I DON'T KNOW HO~j MUCH WE GAVE HER FOR
14 HER ASSEMBLY RUN, BUT SHE NEEDED TO RETIRE DEBT AND SHE NEEDED
15 MORE HELP. SO I SAW DR. BR}\ND IN THE PARKING LOT AND HE
16 MENTIONED THAT PEARL NEEDED SOME HELP AND I DON'T REMEMBER IF HE
17 SAID .1\ SPECIFIC m40UNT, BUT IF WE CAN HE:,P HER THAT WOULD BE
18 GREAT. THAT WAS ONE OCCASION. AND THEN HE tolENTIONED -
19
20
Q.
A.
DID YOU END UP HELPING HER PER HIS REQUEST?
I DON'T BELIEVE SO. I DON'T REMEtolBER, BUT = DON'T
21
22
23
24
BELIEVE SO.
Q. DID YOU DO ANYTHING OR SAY ANYTHING TO ANYBODY BASED
UPON WHAT HE HAD TOLD YOU?
A. I HAD TOLD PEARL THAT HE HAD, IN FACT, TALKED TO tolE
25 ABOUT IT AND I TALKED TO RENE ABOUT IT AS WE:,L, AND --
26 Q. WHAT \~AS tolS. QUINONES'S REACTION?
27
28
A.
Q.
TO WHAT SPECIFICALLY?
TO THE FACT THAT DR. BRAND IS TRYI!,G TO HELP HER RETIRE

3642
1 HER DEBT.
2 A. SHE WAS A LITTLE BIT SURPRISED THAT SHE THOUGHT HE WAS
3 TRYING TO GET ON HER GOOD SIDE BY DOING THAT AND \~AS A LITTLE
4 SURPRISED THAT HE HAD EXPRESSED REACHING OUT TO US BECAUSE, YOU
5 KNOW, IT WAS PERCEIVED THAT HE DIDN'T WANT TO BE TOO CLOSE TO US
6 OR S0l1ETHING LIKE THAT. SO THE FACT THAT HE WAS REACHDIG OUT TO
'I US, I THINK, TO HER SHOWED SOMETHING POSITIVE IN THE RELATIONSHIP
8 WAS DEVELOPING OR A LEVEL OF TRUST OR COMFORT, I GUESS.
9 THE SECOND TIME THAT HE ASKED US FOR I'~ONEY WAS FOR JIM AND
10 FOR JOHN. THEY BOTH NEEDED ABOUT 20,000 COMBINED. THEY NEEDED
11 ABOUT $20,000, AND HE ASKED IF WE COULD PROVIDE THAT TO THE!'! AND
12 THAT I'r ~lOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED IF WE DID. SO AT THAT TIl'lE
13 HE ASKED ONLY ['IYSELF. AND SUBSEQUENTLY, I THINK n' WAS ON
14 DECEt1BER 6TH OR 5TH OF LAST YEAR, RENE AND I WENT TO LUNCH IHTH
15 DR. BRAND AID HE ASKED CS AGAIN AT LCNCH, AT THE SOCTH BAY FISH &
16 GRILL, IF WE CAN DONATE TO Jn~!'S CAMPAIGN AND TO JOHN'S CAMPAIGN,
17 TOTALING ABOUT $20,000. AND WE SAID THAT WE WOULD AND THAT, I:c!
18 FACT, WE WERE GOING TO HAVE LCNCH OR WE WERE GOING TO SEE JOHN
19 AND JIM THAT DAY OR THE :c!EXT DAY WITH PART OE' THE MEETINGS THAT
20 WE HAD WITH THEM. A:c!D RENE SAID THAT HE WOULD MENTION TO THEI·1
21 ~HAT viE ,~ERE DOING THIS BECAUSE OF DR. BRAND SO HE vJOJLD GET
22 CREDIT FOR THE DONATION TO THEIR Cl\MPAIGNS AND HE SAID THAT HE:
23 APPRECIATED THAT. AND WHE:c! WE MET WITH JOHN AND WITH JIM WE SAID
24 THAT WE HAD MET W:TH DR. BRAND A:-1D THAT HE HAD ASKED US TO
25 CONTRIBUTE TO THEIR CAMPAIGN AND WE WOULD HAPPILY DO THAT.
26
27
28
Q.
A.
Q.
DID YOU
WE ::nD:C!' T. AND ABOUT "A tJ:ONTH LATER WE WERE SUSPENDED.
ARE YOU WELL, STRIKE THAT. I'LL JUST FINISH UP

3643
1 HERE, A COUPLE THINGS.
2 : HAVE SOt'lE PHOTOGRAPHS. THIS ONE IS ON 37508. WHO IS IN
3 THIS PICTURE? WHO DO WE SEE HERE?
4 A. MY IHFE -- THAT'S ME, MY WIFE, JOSE AND BERTHA L6PEZ.
5 TI1:::S IS AT THE MARINE '\OOl>1.
6
7
8
Q.
A.
Q.
IT'S YOU AND THE L6PEZES?
YES.
DO YOU REMEMBER THE DATE Ot THAT?
9
A.
I
DON'T.
10
Q.
WAS THERE A CELEBRATION?
MAYBE A BIRTHDAY?
11
12
13
14
A. CAN YOU ZOOM IN ON THE PICTURE? I THINK IT WAS
BERTHA'S BIRTHDAY.
Q. NEXT ~IE HAVE 37523. I~HO DO \~E SEE IN THIS PICTURE?
A. I WAS MUCH SKINNIER THEN. THAT'S dAIME BONILLA AND HIS
15 WIFE, I"'YSELF, NY WIFE, AND YURI CALDERON.
16 Q. DO YOU REMEt;1BER vlHERE THIS PHOTO viAS TAKEN, OR W.ll.S
17 THERE ANYTHING ABOUT THE BACKGROUND THAT LEl\DS YOU TO BELIEVE I'I'
18 ~IAS TAKEN AT A CERTAIN PLACE?
19 A. 'l'HAT WASN'T AT THE l-lARINE ROOM. I CON'T RECOGNIZE THE
20 BACKGROUND.
21 Q. THIS IS 37549. EVERYONE APPEARS TO BE DRESSED THE, SAME
22 AS THEY I'JERE IN THE LAST
23 A. THAT'S AT BE,\THA' SHOUSE. CAN YOU ZOOM IN A LI TTLE
24 BIT? I BELIEVE THAT'S BERTHA'S HOUSE, AND 1'1" S PROBABLY ON HER
25 BIRTHD1W. SHE HAC A PARTY AT ONE Ot HER BIRTHDAYS. I DON'T KNOW
26 WHAT YElI.R IT ~JAS.
27 Q. ONE LAST PICTURE I HAVE HERE, 37527. AND THAT'S
28 [vjR. BONILLA AGAIN?

3644
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
UH-HUH.
YOURSELF AND YOUR WIFE?
YES.
THIS IS AT A DIFFERENT EVENT?
IT'S PROBABLY AFTER A PADRES GAME.
GO BACK TO THIS OTHER PHOTOGRAPH.
THAT'S JOSE LOPEZ, JAIME'S WIFE, JAIME, AND BERTHA.
ONE LAST QUESTION HERE. THIS IS QUESTION --
9
MR. LUDWIG: WHAT IS THIS?
10 GRAND JURY SECRETARY: 268.
11 MR. LUDWIG: 268. I'M NOT SURE WE CAN ASK IT SO WE'LL PASS
12 ON THAT, FROM GRAND JUROR NO. 16.
13 MR. SCHORR: IT CALLS FOR SPECULATION.
14 MR. LUDWIG: ANY MORE QUESTIONS BEFORE WE SAY GOOD-BYE TO
15 MR. ORTIZ? MR. SCHORR WILL SHOW YOU THE SCHEDULES AGAIN, LIKE WE
16 DID THE LAST TIME.
17 (GRAND JURY EXHIBIT 93, GANDARA FORM 700 MOCKUP
18 2011, MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.)
19 BY MR. SCHORR:
20 Q. I'LL SHOW YOU WHAT HAS BEEN MARKED AS GRAND JURY
21 EXHIBIT NO. 93, WHICH IS JESUS GANDARA FOR THE YEAR 2010 AND IT
22 LISTS ONE DINNER. SAYS JAIME ORTIZ IN THE AMOUNT OF $50.
23 (GRAND JURY EXHIBIT 94, AMIGABLE AGREEMENT WITH
24 D.A., SEVEN PAGES, MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.)
25 BY MR. SCHORR:
26 Q. 94 IS FOR BERTHA LOPEZ, ONE DINNER ON 9/16/2011 FOR THE
27 AMOUNT OF $110. AND THEN GREG SANDOVAL, AGAIN, SGI, 9/16/2011 --
28 THAT'S NOT RIGHT.

3645
1 THE WITNESS: NO, THAT'S NOT RIGHT. GREG WASN'T -- I DIDN'T
2 PAY FOR ANYTHING FOR GREG.
3 MR. SCHORR: CORRECT. OKAY. NO. 95 WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE
4 ADMITTING -- OR NOT GOING TO BE REFERENCING. 94 WAS THE LAST
5 ONE. SO 95 WE'LL GET RID OF IT. WE'LL REUSE 95 AT A LATER POINT
6
IN
TIME.
YOU SAID SANDOVAL WAS NOT ON THE DINNER.
7
Q.
WAS
SANDOVAL PART OF DRINKS?
8
A.
NO, HE WAS AT HECTOR ROMERO'S TABLE DOWNSTAIRS --
9
Q.
OKAY.
10
A.
-- DOWNSTAIRS.
11
Q.
THANKS FOR POINTING THAT OUT TO US. WE JUST LOOKED AT
12
93
AND 94.
AND DO THOSE APPEAR TO BE ACCURATE REPRESENTATIONS OF
13 WHAT WE DISCUSSED?
14
15
16
A. YES.
MR. SCHORR: OKAY. WE'LL CROSS THESE OUT.
MR. LUDWIG: AGAIN, WE THANK YOU FOR YOUR TESTIMONY TODAY,
17 AND THIS IS THE LAST WEEK. I BELIEVE THE FOREPERSON HAS ONE MORE
18 THING TO SAY TO YOU.
19 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: YOU ARE REMINDED THAT YOU ARE STILL
20 ADMONISHED.
21
THE WITNESS:
I AM ADMONISHED PERMANENTLY.
22
23
MR. SCHORR: YOU ARE.
MR. LUDWIG: IF YOU RECALL THE INITIAL ADMONITION THAT SHE
24 READ A LONG TIME AGO, IT'S REALLY UNLESS OR UNTIL THE TRANSCRIPT
25 IS RELEASED OR IT'S OTHERWISE BEEN AUTHORIZED BY A COURT TO ALLOW
26 YOU TO SPEAK FREELY ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED.
27
28
THE WITNESS: OKAY. THANK YOU.
MR. LUDWIG: THANK YOU.

3646
1 THE FOREPERSON: PLEASE RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND.
2 DO YOU SOLEMNLY SWEAR THl'.T THE EVIDENCE YOU SHALL GIVE IN
3 THE ~lATTER NOW PENDING BEFORE THIS GRAND JURY SHALL BE THE TRUTH,
4 THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUe;'H, SO HELP YOU GOD.
5 THE WITNESS: I DO.
6
7 3?E C l'T RHOlIDES,
8 GRAND ,JURY ,'IlTNESS, HAVING BEEN DULY SWORN, WAS EXAtvlINED AND
9 TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS:
10
EXAMINATION
12 BY t4R. LUDlHG:
13 Q. GOOD AFTERNOON, SIR. THANKS FOR BEING HERE. WOULD YOU
14 MIND STARTING US 00'1' BY TELLING OS YOUR FULL NAf'.lE AN:) SPELL Ie;'
:5 FOR THE R~CORD.
16 A. SURE. NY NAf'.lES IS BRE':'':' RHOADES. =.AST NM1E IS SPELLED
17 R-H-O-A-D, LIKE DAVID, -E-S.
18 Q. THANK YOU, f'.lR. RHO,1\D~S. AND WHAT IS IT Tt!.Z';T YOU DO FOR
19 A LIVING?
20
21
22
23
24
25
A. I Ar~ A DISTRICT ATTORNEY INVESTIGATOR CURRENTLY
ASSIGNED TO THE SAN DIEGO REGIONAL CONPUTER FORENSIC LAB.
Q. DO YOU MIND BRIEFLY WALKING US THROUGH THE STEPS YOU
TOOK I'IlTH YOOR EDUCATION, TRAINING AN:) CAREER THP,T ."'LLOWED YOU TO
HAVE THE POSITION 'I'HAT YOO HAVE NOW.
A. SURE. I ORIGIN.ll.LLY STARTED AT RCFL BACK IN 2006 AS A
26 MENBF,R 0, THE CHULA VISTA POLICE DEPAR~'NENT. AS A TRAINEE I "lENT
27 THROUGH THE SAN DIEGO RC,L'S CART PROGRAM. CART STANDS FOR
28 COtJIPUTER ANALYSIS RESPONSE TEAM. THEY HAVE A SET Of' TRAINING

3647
1 TEAT THEY USE FOR .I',LL OF THEIR E'OREKSIC EX.I',MINERS. IT'S A
2 VARIETY OF CLASSES. IT STARTS OFF WITH VERY BASIC DATA RECOVERY
3 AND ANALYSIS. 1'1' TEACHES YOU HOW '1'0 PRESERVE EVIDENCE. THERE'S
4 A Nut~BER OF CLASSES l'iHICH TEACH YOU THE SOFTWARE TOOLS THA'I' l'lE
5 USE. I ALSO HOLD THE IND:JSTRY STANDARD A+ CERTIFICATION, BOTH IK
6 THE HARC\I'IARE AND THE OPERATING SYSTEM SIDE. I ALSO HAVE NET+
7 CERTIFICATION. AND AS PART OF CONTINUING ED:JCATION IqE DO A
8 YEARLY OUT-OF-HOUSE CLASS, A YEARLY IN-HOUSE CLASS, AND A
9 PROFICIENCY TEST EVERY YEAR THAT I'VE 1'IAINTAINED SINCE 2006.
10 Q .'
AND PRIOR TO 2006, DID YOU EAVE ANY UNDERGRADUATE
11 EXPER:ENCE IN cm·IPUTER SC:ENCE OR ANYTHING OF THAT SORT?
12 A. NO.
13 Q. THE FACILITY I'IHERE YOU l'lORK, THE RCFL, TELL US ABOUT
14 rrHAT.
15 A. CJRRENTLY OR THE r'IAIN LI',B? I'M CURRENTLY IN A
16 DIn'ERENT LOCATION THAN I WAS DURING THIS TIME PERIOD.
17 Q. ~IELL, WE'LL EVENTUALLY BE TALKING [,BOUT SOME COt1PUTERS
18 TEA'!' WERE ANALYZED. DID THAT TAKE PLACE .1"1' YOUR CURRENT
19 LOCA'l'ION?
20 A. NO, 'rHAT'S AT THE MAIN FACII,ITY.
21· Q. LET'S TALK ABOUT TEE MAIN FACILITY.
22 A. OKAY. IT'S AN F.B.I. FACILITY THA':' IS STRICTLY
23 ~IAINTAINED. YOU HAVE TO BE AN EXAJ'1INER TO HAVE ACCESS. WE HAVE
24 HIRSCH BADGES THAT ALLOW US IN AND OUT. IT IS A TOP SECRET
25 FACILITY, WHAT WE CONSIDER OPEN SECRETS; WE'RE ALLOWED TO HAVE
26 EVIDENCE SITTING OUT AS PART OF OUR PROCESSING.
27 Q. WHA'1' IS THE~ PURPOSE OF THE RCFL?
28 A. IT! S TO BASICJI.LLY -- IT'S TO MAINTAIN AND PRESERVE

3648
1 EVIDENCE AND TO DO FORENSIC ANALYSIS, DIGITAL MEDIA THAT IS
2 SUBMITTED TO US TO ASSIST CASE AGENTS IN THEIR INVESTIGATIONS.
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
Q. WHO RUNS THE MAIN LAB?
A. IT'S RUN BY THE F. B. I. BUT WE ARE A TI\SK FORCE SO WE'RE
l"J.z\DE UP OF A VARIE'I'Y OF INDIVIDUALS FROM DIFFERENT AGENCIES
WITHIN THE COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO.
Q. DOES THE RCFL HAVE ANY PARTICULAR CREDENTIALS OR
ACCREDITATION AS A LAB, IN GENERAL'?
FL YES, ~jE DO. l'lE HAVE VERY STRICT STl',NDARDS THAT ARE PUT
10
FORTH BY THE NA'I'lONAL PROGRAM OFFICE.
WE'RE ALSO ASCLC CER'I'lFIED
11
AtD WE HAUlTAIN THAT CER'rFICATION ON A FIVE-YEl',R BASIS.
SO WE
12
HAVE PEOPLE THAT COME IN AND INSPECT OUR FACILITIES FROM BOTH THE
13 LB.1. AND FROM OUTSIDE.
14 Q. ASCLD MEANS NOTHING TO ME. DO YOU MIND ENLIGHTENING
15 US.
16 A. IT'S THE AMERICAN -- I KNEW YOU WERE GOING TO SAY THAT
17 BEC.Z\USE l'iE HAVE OUR INSPECTION COMING UP. IT H.Z\S TO DO IHTH
18 CRIME LAB DIREC';'ORS. IT'S A FEDERAL ASSOCIATION THNl' PUTS DOvlN
19 ACCREDITED STl',NCl',RCS FOR CRIlJIE LABORATORIES. AND IT'S NOT JUS';'
20 CONPUTER FORENSICS; THEY ALSO DO BASIC CRINE LABORATORIES AT
21 POLICE DEPARTMENTS. THOSE LABORATORIES HANDLE THAT DNA EVIDENCE
22 OR BALLISTIC EVIDENCE. SO IT'S A NATIONAL STANDARD.
23 Q. ACHIEVING THAT ASCLD ACCREDITATION, DOES THAT REQUIRE A
24 PART:CULAR LEVEL OF EFFORT? IS IT DIFE'ICU::'T TO ACH:EVE?
25 A. IT'S QUITE A SIGNIFICANT UNDERT.z\KING. THERE'S A LOT OE'
26 EFFORT THAT'S PU'l' INTO IT. IT'S BASICAL::'Y A REVIEW OF ALL YOUR
27 POLICIES AND PROCEDURES AND THE WAY YOU RUN YOUR, ESSENTIALLY,
28 BUSINESS IN THIS CASE. IT IS VERY STRICT STANDARDS AND IS VERY

3649
1 DIFFICULT TO ATTAIN.
2 Q. ARE THERE ANY OTHER STANDARDS OR ACCREDITATIONS FOR 'rHE
3 MAIN LAB WHEN IT COMES TO ANALYZING AND PRESERVING DATA ON
4
5
COMPUTERS?
A.
NOT ASIDE FROM WHAT WE ALREADY HAVE IN PLl'.CE, NO.
6
Q.
DID YOU BECo!~jE
INVOLVED IN THE INVESTIGATION WHICH
7 BRINGS YOU HERE TODAY PARTICULARLY AS IT RELATES TO OFFICIALS IN
8 THE SOUTH BAY AREA WITH THE SWEET~lATER AND SOU'rIlWESTERN SCHOOL
9 DISTRICTS?
10 A. YES, I DID. I'M ONE OF '['HE THREE OPERATIONS IvJANAGERS
11 AT THE RCFL. I THINK I HAD A MEETING IN LATE 2011 \'lITH DISTRICT
12 ATTORNEY INVESTIGATOR JOE CARGEL AND VINCE GIAIME AND I ALSO
13 BELIEVE THERE WAS A DISTRICT ATTORNEY WITH US IN REFERENCE TO
14 THIS CASE. AND IT WAS DECIDED AT THE TIME, SINCE THE
15 INVESTIGATION WAS BEING HANDLED BY THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S
16 OFFICE, THAT I WOULD BE ASSIGNED AS THE LIAISON FOR THE
17 INVESTIGATORS.
18 Q. YOU SAID YOU WERE ONE OF THREE OPERATIONS MANAGERS. IS
9 THAT STILL YOUR CURRENT JOB OR WAS THAT AT THE TH1E?
20 A. I 'f1 STILL AN OPERATIONS MANAGER. I HAVE MOVED FROM THE
21 I'JAIN LAB "mERE THERE ARE TWO, UP TO THE ICAC, OFF-SITE, l'lHICH =S
22 THE INTERNET CR::rJIES AGA=NS'l' CHILDREN PORTION OF OUR LAB.
23 Q. OKAY. AS RELATES TO THIS CASE, WHAT DUTIES AND
24 RESPONSIBILITIES DID YOU HAVE AS ONE OF THREE OPERATIONS MANAGERS
25 AND LIAISON FOR THIS INVESTIGl',TIO"I?
26 A. AS AN OPERATIONS MANAGER, I'I" S BASICALLY JvlY DUTY TO RUN
27 MY TEAM. WHEN I WAS AT THE MAIN LAB I HAD A TEAM OF UP TO TEN
28 PEOPLE AT A TIME. I MANAGED CASELOADS. I WAS LIAISON FOR

3650
1 OOTSIDE AGENCIES WHO vWULD REQUEST ASSISTANCE FRO,,! THE RCE'L,
2 \'iHETHER IT ~lAS ON AN IN-HOUSE EXA~lINATION OR 'fHEY NEEDED ON-SITE
3 IMAGING. I WOULD BE THE LIAISON AND WE'D TRACK DOWN MEMBERS FROM
4 NY TEAM AND ASSIGN THE APPROPRIATE PEOPLE BASED ON THE NEEDS.
5 I WOULD ~IENTOR THE TRAINEES THAT WE HAVE, ASSIGN THEM
6 ~IENTORS, AND THEN ALSO I DID QUALITY REVIEW OF ALL THE REPORTS.
7 ~iE HAVE A SET OF STANDARDS ?HAT THE RCFL FOLLOWS REGARDING THE
8 REPORTS, SO MY JOB AS AN OPERATIONS MANAGER IS TO REVIEII,
9 EVERYBODY'S REPORTS TO MAKE SURE THEY ARE IN LINE WITH SOP'S OR
10 POLICIES AND PROCEEDINGS.
11 Q. THOSE STANDARDS AND POLICIES AND PROCEDURES AS RELATES
12 TO THOSE REPORTS, ARE THOSE NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED STANDARDS AND
13 POLICIES AND PROCEDURES?
14 A. NATIONALLY, I vlOULD SAY IN THE REALM OF THE RCFL, SINCE
15 WE ARE A NATIONAL, UM -- BUT IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT IS ASCLD
16 RELATED. WE HAVE A SET OF POLICIES AND PROCEDURES SET DOWN BY
17 OUR PROGRAM OFFICE cJUST FOR THE RCFL.
18 Q. 1'101'" BACK TO THI S CASE HERE. or 0 YOU WORK WITH
19 MR. CARGEL AND MR. GIAIl>IE IN CONNECTION WITH THE EXECUTION OF
20 VARIOUS SEARCH \"ARRANTS IVITE THIS CASE?
21 A. I DID NOT ACTUALLY ASSIST ON THE SEARCH \"ARRANTS. MY
22 ASSISTANCE WAS ON THE BACK SIDE ONCE THE DIGITAL MEDIA IIIAS
23 OBTAINED AND THEY SUBMITTED IT TO THE LAB. I ASSISTED \"ITH
24 ASSIGNING THE CASES.
25 Q. NOW, WERE YOU AWARE THAT MR. CARGEL AND OTHERS
26 SUBNITTED OR LOGGED INTO EVIDENCE CERTAIN ITEMS TnAT THEY HAD
27 SEIZED PURSUANT TO SEARCH 1'1ARRAN'I'S IN THIS CASE?
28 A. YES.

3651
1
2
3
Q.
A.
Q.
WERE THOSE ITEMS GIVEN A PARTICULAR REPORT NUMBER?
YES.
WOULD THAT BE 110311 AND THEN FOLLOWED BY A UNIQUE
4 IDENTIFYING SUFFIX WITH A LETTER?
5
6
7
A. A LOT OF LETTERS AND A LOC' OF NUMBERS.
Q. HOW MANY STRIKE THAT.
WEN:' DO YOU CALL IT l'iHEN YOU WRITE A REPORT?
IS THAT AN
8 INCIDENT OR A WORK ORDER 0" WHAT IS THAT?
9
10
A.
Q.
WE CALL IT A SERVICE REQUEST.
A SERVICE REQUEST. DO YOU KNOW HOW t'-!ANY SERVICE
11 REQUESTS WERE CONNECTED WITH THIS CASE?
12 A. I BELIEVE THERE WE"E A TOTAL OF 32.
13 Q. ALL IDENTIFIED WITH TItAT SAME INITIAL NUMBER SEQUENCE,
14 011, BUT THEN DELINEATED BY THE LETTER?
15 A. YES. 11 STANDS FOR THE YEAR. DEPENDING ON THE ORDER
16 OF CASES AS THEY COME IN, I THINK IT'S ASSIGNED THE NEXT SET OF
17 NUMERICAL NUl"lBE"S. SO THE 0311 \~AS TilE 311TIt CASE THAT ARRIVED
18 AT THE LAB T'!AT YEAR. OUR TYPICAL DESIGNATION WITH THE LEC'TER
19 \,IOULD BE EAC'! TH1E A NEW SERVICE REQUEST Cl\t·jE IN IT ,~OULD GET A
20 NE\~ LETTER. EACH TIl"lE C'HAT SOMETHING DIFFERENT HAPPENED AND THEY
21 CAME BACK INTO RESUBt"lIT EVIDE:NCE, ,'IE WOULD GO FROf'.'l 311-A TO - B TO
22 ALL TItE WAY IN ORDER, ALL THE WAY TO THE END OF THE LINE.
23 Q. ARE YOU ABLE TO LIST FOR US THE NUMBERS FOR ALL TItE
24 SERVICE REQUESTS?
25 A. I WOULD HAVE TO REFER TO A SPREADSHEET THAT I PREPARED
26 AT THE TIME.
27 Q. WOULD IT HELP REFRESH YOUR MEMORY?
28 A. YES f IT WOULD.

3652
1
Q.
PLEASE DO SO.
2
A.
OKAY.
DO YOU \'iANT HE TO ?ECITE THE ENTIRE CASE NUMBER
3 O? CAN WE GO ~IIIH THE LETTERS ]I.ND NU:1BERS?
4
5
6
7
8
9
Q. I1E CAN GO WITH \,IHATEVER IS UNIQUE TO El'.CH SE:RVICE
I ASSU:1E THEY ALL ARE: PRECE:DED BY 11-0311.
A. YES, THEY DO. THAT'S THE PREFIX FOR ALL THE CASES. WE
HAVE A CASE A-01 AND A-02, B-01 AND B-02, C-Ol AND C-02, D-01,
E-Ol, F-Ol, G-01, H-Ol, 1-01, J-01, K-01, L-Ol, M-01, N-Ol, 0-01,
P-OI, Q-01, R-01, S-Ol, T-01, U-01, V-01 AND V-02, ,,]-01 AND If/-02,
10
X-OI AND
X-02 AND
X-03, AND Y-01.
11
Q.
DID .Z\LL
THOSE: SERVICE REQUESTS INVOLVE COMPUTERS OR
DID
12 SOME INVOLVE OIHE? ELECT?ONIC D~VICES?
13
A.
SOI1E INVOLVED OTHER ELECT?ONIC DEVICES.
14
Q.
~/OULD
THOSE BE TELEPHONES AND SO FORTH?
15
A.
THAT'S CORRECT.
16
Q.
FOCUSING ON COMPUTERS, WERE YOU
INVOLVED OR DID YOU
17 OVERSEE THE PRESENTATION AND ANALYSIS OF DATA ON COMPUTERS?
18 A. YES, BOTH. I OVERSAW THE ENTIRE PROJECT AND I ALSO
19 \'lORKED EANDS-ON I'/ITH A PORTION OF IT.
20 Q. WERE ALL 'rHE STRIKE T'IAT.
21 IS THERE A STANDARDIZED SET OF' PROCED[;RES AND P?OTOCOLS THAT
22 ARE [;TILIZED BY YO[; AND YO[;R TEAI1 AT RCF'L vlHEN IT CONES TO
23 PRESERVING AND EXTRACTING AND ANALYZING DATA ON COMPUTER?
24
25
A.
Q.
YES.
DO YOU MIND TELLING US WHAT THAT IS.
26
A.
SURE.
'I'YPICALLY IiIHAT HAPPENS WHEN A CASE AGENT SERVES
27 A SEARCH \qARRANT AND THEY HAVE COLLECTED COMPUTERS OR OTHER ITEMS
28 AN;) D:::GITA::" MEC:::A, THEY I'/ILL BRING IT TO THE FRONT COUNTER OF THE

3653
1 RCFL. ONCE AT THE FRONT COUNTER, THEY FILL OUT WHAT WE CALL A
2 SERVICE REQUEST. IT GIVES THE BASIC DATA OR THE BASIC
3 INFORt~ATION ABOUT THE CASE AND ALSO LISTS THOSE THINGS THE CASE
4 AGENT IS LOOKING FOR AS PART OF THE EXAt1INATION.
5 FRO[J; THERE IT'S LOGGED INTO OUR EVI DENCE CONTROL SYSTEM.
6 EACH ITEM IS SEALED IN AN ANTI STATIC PLASTIC 8.'\G AND IS THEN
7 ENTERED INTO OUR EVIDENCE CONTROL FACILITY. SO THAT'S THE
8 INITIAL INTAKE PORTION OF IT.
9 FROM THAT PORTION, THE CASE IS ASSIGNED TO ONE OF THE
~O FORENSIC EXA[~INERS WHO WOULD TEEN CHECK OUT TEAT Pl'.RTICULAR PIECE
, , OF EVIDENCE FROM THE EVElENCE CONTROL FACILITY. THEY .. iOULD
12 DOCUMENT THE CONDI'l'ION OF 'rHE ANTISTATIC BAG AND THE PACKAGING TO
13 MAKE SURE THAT EVERYTHING CONTINUED TO BE SEALED AT THE TIME THAT
14 THEY RECEIVED THE EVIDENCE. THEY WOULD PHOTOGRAPH AND DOCUMENT
15 THAT INFORMATION.
16 FROM THERE, THE COMPUTERS OR CELL PHONES OR l'iHATEVER THE
17 DIG::Tl\:;:' MEDHI ,,;OULD BE ~iOULD BE REMOVED FROM THE BAG AND
18 PHOTOGRAPHED AGAIN. AND FROl-1 THERE, DEPENDING ON THE TYPE OF
19 NEDlA IT IS, A COMPUTER OR ll. THUMB DRIVE, WE WOU.LD ASSIGN A BAR
20 CODE NUMBER TO THE VARIOUS PIECES FOR FUTURE IDENTIFICATION.
21 IN THE CASE OF A CONPUTER, WE ASSIGN A BAR CODE TO THE
22 CHASSIS OF THE CONPUTER, IvHICH WOULD HAVE AN S NUMBER IN FRONT OF
23 IT, STANDING FOR SYSTEt1. "lB'D ASSIGNED A SEPARATE BAR CODE, AN
24 H N[J['1BER, FOR THE HARD DRIVE ON THE SYS':'~~N. WI\NT ME TO CONTINUE?
25
Q.
PLEASE.
26
A. OKAY. ONCE WE HAVE DONE THE DOCU~1ENTATION AND THE
27 PHOTOGRAPHS AND 'I'HE BAR CODING OF THE INFORMATION, THE FIRST
28 THING WE DO IS MAKE SURE WE'RE GOING TO PRESERVE THAT PARTICULAR

3654
1 PIECE OF ORIGINAL EVIDENCE. I'iHAT ~lE DO IS \~E HOOK IT UP TO A
2 COMPUTER VIA A WRITE BLOCKING DE:VICE, WHICH ALLOWS INFORMATION TO
3 FLOW FROM OUR TARGET TO ~lHERE WE ~lANT IT TO GO, BUT NO
4 INFORMATION FROM OUR COMPUTER BACK TO THE TARGET. SO THAT'S HOW
5 WE E:NSURE: OUR ORIGINAL PIECE OF EVIDENCE IS NOT TAINTED IN ANY
6 FASHION.
7 THEN \~HAT WE DO IS MAKE WHAT I"lE CALL A BIT-BY-BIT PHYSICAL
8 IMAGE OF THE ORIGINAL INFORMATION. IF YOU PICTURE YOUR HARD
9 DRIVE AS A VERY LARGE CHECKER BOARD \~ITH HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OR
10 SOMETIMES EVEN MILLIO'lS OF LITTLE STORZl.GE SPACES, \~HAT \~E DO WHEN
11 WE MAKE THE IMAGE IS COPY EVERY SINGLE BIT OF INFORMATION ON
12 EVERY ONE OF THE~~ FROM THE STI,RTING SECTOR TO THE ENDING SECTOR
13 SO THAT WHEN ~IE ARE DONE OUR H1AGE IS AN EXACT DUPLICATE COpy OF
14 I~HAT ~IE S'],ARTED \~ I TH.
15 EVERY']'IIING F'ROM THAT POINT ON IS DONE, AS PART OF OUR
16 EXAMINATION, ON THE COpy THAT WE'VE NADE. WE PUT AWAY THE
17 ORIGINAL EVIDENCE FROM THERE SO THAT WE DON'T WORK WITH THAT ANY
18 LONGER.
19
20
21
22
Q. IS THE ORIGINAL EVIDENCE, THE CO~jPUTER FOR EXANPLE, IS
THN!' RE'l'URNED TO 1ilHOEVER OWNED IT?
A. TYPICALLY WE JUST RETURN IT TO THE EVIDENCE CONTROL
FACILITY. FOR SAFETY' S SAK~~, l'iE KEEP IT \'iITHIN THE LAB \'iHILE
23
24
WE'RE STILL RZl.INTAINING OR DOING Ql;R INVESTIGF.TION.
TIMES WHERE HARD DRIVES DO NOT COOPERATE; SOt1ETI~lES
THERE ARS
WE HAVE
25
ELECTRICAL PGLSES OR BRO~1NOUTS
OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT THAT
26
AFFECTS THE QUALITY OF THE IMAGE.
IF WE l'iERE TO HAVE GIVEN BACK
27
THE EVIDENCE PRIOR TO COtJIPLETING OUR IMAGE OR COMPLETING OUR
28 EXANINATION, WE WOULDN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO FALL BACK ON. SO WE

3655
1 PUT THAT BACK IN THE EVIDENCE CONTROL FACILITY UNTIL WE'RE
2 COMPLETELY DONE. ONCE WE ARE ASSURED WE'VE Ml\DE IT COMPLETELY
3
4
5
THROUGH OUR INVESTIGATION vIE CAN RETURN THAT ORIGINAL EVIDENCE.
Q. TO THE EXTENT THAT WHATEVER COMPUTER YOU ARE I'.NALYZING
HAS -- IF IT'S EQUIPPED WITH ANY TYPE OF TRANSMISSION DEVICE OR
6
7
TECHNOLOGY OR BLUETOOTH OR WIFI OR A CELLULAR CONNECTION,
THERE A WAY TO DISABLE THAT TO 11AKE SURE 'l'HERE' S NO DATI'.
:::S
8
EXC~I\NGED
REMOTELY DURING THE PROCESS?
9
A. YES. TYPICALLY WHEN THE COMPUTERS ARE FIRS'l' BROUGHT
10 INTO THE LAB, THEY ARE CHECKED TO 11AKE SURE THEY ARE IN THE OFF
11 POSITIOt,. USUAI,LY CO~1PUTERS, WE DON'T HAVE TO ",ORRY ABOUT
12 WIRELESS. THERE'S NOTHING WIRELESS IN OUR LABORA'l'ORY. IT'S
13 FORBIDDEN WITHIN F.B.I. SPACE. NONE OF THE ITEMS ARE CONNECTED
14 TO ANY TYPE OF NETWORKING.
15
16
17
I F vIE' RE 'l'ALKING ABOU":' A CE.I.I. ?HONE 0" OTHER DEV:CE SIMILAR
":'0 THI'.T, THERE ARE THINGS CALLED FA"ADAY BAGS. 1'1" S A BAG THAT
YOU CAN PLACE THE PHONE INSIDE OF WHICH THEN BLOCKS ANY SIGNAL '1'0
18
THE PHONE, WHICH ALT"m~S
YOU TO GO INTO THE PHONE AND fvlANIPULATE
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
IT TO PUT IT INTO AIRPLANE MODE ~IKE YOU ,'IOULD \~HEN YOG GOT ONTO
AN AIRPLANE TO MliKE SURE THAT YOG' RE NOT RECEIVING ANY SIGNAL YOU
WOU.],D GET FROM THE CARRIER, WHICH THEN WOULD PROHIBIT ANY CHANGES
BEING MADE TO THE PHONE.
Q. LET'S GO BACK '1'0 THE COtcPUTE""S. YOU ~EF'T m'F' AT THE
POINT WHERE YOU JUST CREATED A 1"11 RROR IMAGE OF 'I'HE HARD DRIVE.
WHAT HAPPENS THEN WITH THIS COPY THAT YOU'VE MADE?
A. FIRST THING WE DO RIGHT AFTER "IE II,AKE THE COPY IS TO
27
ENS[;RE THAT THERE'S A WI,SH VALUE MATCH.
WHAT HAPPENS DuRING THE
28
IMAGING PROCESS IS THE COMMERCIA~ SOFTWARE TOOL THAT iilJE USE THAT

3656
1 ['lAKES THE IMAGE ANALYZSS 'l'HE DATA ON THE ORIGINAI. SVIDENCE HARD
2 DRIVE, AND ONCE OUR COPY IS MADE IT ANALYZES THE SAME DATA ON OUR
3 COpy TO l':AKE SURE THAT THE 'l'WO V.1\LUES ARE EXAC'rL Y THE S.1\r-1E, SO
4 WE HAVE WHAT WE CALL AN MD5 HASH VALUE THAT WE USS FOR
5 COMPARISON, THE FIRST THING WE WOULD DO IS MAKE SURE THS HASH
6 VALUES MATCH SO THAT BEFORE WS SVEN STARTED OUR PROCESS l'iS KNEI'1
7 THAT WE WERE STARTING WITH A GOOD PISCE OF SVIDENCE,
8 Q. DID YOU UNDERTAKE THAT PROCESS IN ALL 32 SERVICS
9 RSQUESTS THAT YOU DISCUSSED fERE?
10 A. YES. :::T' S .1\CTUALLY DONS A Nur"iBER OF TIMES DURING THE
11 PROCESS THAT WE PREPARED THESE FOR, TO MAKE SURE THAT AS WE WENT
12 THROUGH THE PROCSSS NOTHING HAD CHANGED SO WS COULD KIND OF DI
13 CASE SO~lETHING HAPPENED ALONG THE WAY, \lIE COULD STOP IT BEFORE \lIE
14 GOT TOO FAR.
15 IN ADDITION TO THE ORIGINAL HASH VALUE, TtlE 1'10ULD TRANSFER IT
16 TO A BACKUP HARD DRIVE TH1'.T WE ltlOULD PUT 1'.S AN ARCHIVE. SO I'JE
17 WOULD ALWAYS KEEP A COpy OF AN ARCHIVE IN CASE viE HAVE TO GO BACK
18 TO COURT AG.1\IN AND FURTHER ANALYSIS IS NSSDED. SO ImEN WE COPY
19 THS INFORMATION FROM OUR ORIGINAL IMAGS TO OUR ARCHIVE, WE WOULD
20 REHASH IT TO MAKE SURE THAT HASH WAS GOOD.
21 IN THIS PARTICUL1\R CASS, I'm PREPPED EACH OF' THE CASES FOR .1\
22 CASE AGENT INVESTIGATIVE REVIEl'i. PART OF THAT PROCESS WAS TO
23 COPY THE ORIGINAL IMAGE AND ALL THE PROCESSING ONTO EXTERNAL HARD
24 DRIVES, \~HICH THEN WOULD BE PLUGGE') INTO ANO,['HSR CQt.1P:JTSR FOR THE
25 REVIEW. SO WHEN THE INIAGE WAS MOVED FROM ONE DEVICE TO ANOTHER
26 DEVICE IT WAS HASHED AGAIN.
27 I'JHEN WE ACTUALLY DO THE: CAIR PROCESS:NG, BECKJSE I'.:" S BEING
28 TOUCHED BY A PIECE OF SOFTvIARE, IVHEN THE PROCESSING IS DONE, viE

3657
1 W'.SH THE VALUE l'.GAIN. SO BY THE TINE WE' RE DONE WITH THIS CASE,
2 EACH ITEN HAS PROBABLY BEEN HASHED rOUR, rIVE OR SIX TIMES.
3
4
Q.
A.
NOW,
A CHANGE IN THE HASH VALUE WOULD SIGNIrY WHAT?
SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE THERE WAS A TAINTING OF THE
5 EVIDENCE.
6 Q.
WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF YOU ENCOUNTERED A HASH MARK THAT
7 ~lAS -- THAT DEVIATED FRON THE ORIGINAL?
8 A. WE' 0 HAVE TO TRY 'ro FIGURE OUT WHERE T'IE PROBLE~1 WAS,
9 BUT WE \'IOULD HAVE 1'0 B.z\CKTRACK OUR STEPS TO GET BACK TO A PLACE
10 WHERE WE HAD A GOOD HASH VALUE.
11 SOMETIMES IN A HARD DRIVE SECTORS GO BAD. IT HAPPENS. SO
12 YOU COULD HAVE A HARD DRIVE THl'.T HAS A GOOD NATCH AND 14 DAYS
13 LATER WHEN YOU'RE DONE WITH YOUR PROCESSING HAVE A BAD NATCH
14 BECAUSE A GROUP OF SECTORS WENT BAD. IT HAPPENS ON OCCASION.
15 FROM THERE I'JE GO BACK EITHER TO OUR ORIGINAL ARCHIVE OR ~JE WOULD
16 GO BACK TO THE ORIGINAL EVIDENCE hKD START ['ROM SCRATCH. IT JUST
17 DEPENDS I'mERE WE hRE IN THE PROCESS.
18 Q. YOU REVIEWED THE ANhLYSIS, THE HASHINGS rOR ALL THE
19 CO~1PUTERS IN THIS CASE?
20 h. lOOK "f KNOW THAT I DID ALL OF THE REVIEWS. I THINK
21 ONE Or THE OTHER OPERATIONS MANhGERS DID. BUT I DID hS PART Ot'
22 HY REVIEW PROCESS !oI!AKE SURE THAT THE HASH VALUES HATCH FOR THOSE
23 CASES THAT I DID REVIEW.
24
25
Q.
A.
DID YOU NOTICE ANY ANOMALIES OR INCONSISTENCIES?
NO.
26
Q.
OKAY.
ONCE YOU MADE THE VARIOUS COPIES AND ASSESSED
27 THE H.".SH VALUES, WHAT H.".PPENS THEN?
28 A. IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE WE WERE PREPPING IT FOR WHAT WE

3658
1 CALL THE CAIR PROCECCTRE, CASE AGENT INVESTIGATIVE RFVIElv. IT WAS
2 A PROCESS TEAT WAS IMPLEMENTED BY OUR NATIONAL PROGRAM OFFICE
3 BACK IN THE MIC 2000' S TO HELP WI1'H CASELOAD.
4 ESSENTIALLY, WHAT IT DOES IS IT TAKES THE EVIDENCE AND
5 PROCESSES IT IN ONE OF OCTR COMMERCIAL SOFTI1ARE TOOLS THAT WE
6 ACT:JALLY :JSE BUT PROCESSES :'1' IN A WAY THAT ALLOY.S A CASE AGENT
7 TO LOOK AT THE CASE FOR HIMSELF.
8 WE TEACH WHAT WE CALL A CAIR CLASS TO INVESTIGATORS WHO ARE
9 INTERESTED IN DOING THESE TYPES OF INVESTIGATIONS. SO EVERY CASE
10 AGEN':' WHO DOES A CAIR Cl\SE HAS BEEN TRAINED, HAS GONE THROUGH A
11 FULL EIGHT-HOUR DAY, WHICH INCLUDES A SIGNIFICANT PORTION OF THAT
12 TIME BEING HANDS-ON,
13 THE ADVANTAGE TO HAVING IT PREPPED FOR CASE AGENT
14 INVESTIGATIVE REVIEW IS THAT THE CASE AGENT KNo\~S HIS CASE 3FTe'ER
15 THAN ANYBODY ELSE DOES. IT WOULD BE VERY DIFFICULT IN A TYPICAL
16 Cl',SE, }\.ND I WOULD DEFINITELY Sl',Y THIS IS PROBABLY AN ATYPICAL
17 CASE -- IT WOULD BE VERY HARD FOR AN EXAMINER WHO DOESN I T KNO\v
18 THE NAMES, DATES, TIMES, PLACES, THINGS LIKE TEAT -- IT vlOULD BE
19 VERY D::FFICULT FOR US TO LOOK AT SOHE OF THAT INFORMATION AND
20 RECOGNIZE ITS IMPORTANCE. BUT FOR THE CASE AGENT BEING SO FAR
21 INVOLVED IN THE INVESTIGATION, THINGS TEAT WERE MEANINGFUL '1'0 THE
22 CASE AGENT MIGHT NOT BE MEANINGFUL TO ME. SO l'HAT'S WHY WE PICK
23 THIS PARTICULAR t4ETHOD OF EXMHNATION SO THA'f BOTH THE
24 INVESTIGATORS ASSIGNED WOULD HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO LOOK liT THE
2;:'
VOCUMENTS AND LOOK AT OTHER PRINTED INE'ORMl'SION AND GIVE THEM THE
26 BEST CHANCE TO FIND THE INFORMATION THEY WERE LOOKING FOR.
27 Q. SO IN THIS MATTF,R IT ~JOULD BE MR. CARGEL AND
28 MR. GIAIME?

3659
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
YES.
ANYONE ELSE?
YES.
WHO MIGHT THAT BE?
I BELIEVE 1 SA,v MR. SCHORR THERE A COUPLE OE' TIMES.
NOT AS A CASE AGENT?
KO. NO, HE ItJAS PRESENT DURING Sor~E OF THE REVIEWS.
8
Q.
SO IT'S THE CASE AGENTS, [vIR.
CARGEL AND MR. GIAHIE, WHO
9 ARE DECIDING WHAT INFORMATION TO FLAG, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD;
10 RIGHT?
11 A. THAT'S CORRECT.
12 Q. ~iHAT HAPPENS TO THE INH)RMATION THAT THE CASE AGENTS
13 IDENTIFY AS BEING SIGNIFICAKT?
14 O?:.AY. THE ONE BENEFIT OF THIS PART ICULAR PROGRAfYl IS
15 IT'S NICE -- THIS PARTICULAR TOOL TP.KE:S llLL THE EVIDENCE THAT IS
16 ON THIS PARTICULAR HARC DRIVE AND IT PUTS INTO SEPP.RATE
17 CATEGORIES. WE LIKE TO CALL THEM CONTAINERS. SO THERE'S A
18 CONTAINER THAT CONTAINS ALL THE PICTURES, ALL THE DOCUMENTS, ALL
19 THE t"lOVIES. SO DEPENDING ON WHAT ITEMS THEY WOULD BE LOOKING
20 FOR, THEY COULD OPEN UP THE CON'I'AINER WITH I)OCUMENTS AND THEY
21 COULD REVIEvJ EVERY DOCUl-IE:lT ':'HA'I' vJAS ON THERE.
22 IE THEY DECIDED IT WAS RELEVANT TO THE CASE, THEY DID WHAT
23 IS CALLED A BOOKI'IARK. THERE I S A PARTICULAR WAY THAT YOU CAN
24 RIGHT CLICK ON THE ITEM. YOU SAY BOOKt1ARK, YOU NAME IT WHAT YOU
25 WANT TO NAME IT, AND IT TURNS A DIFFERENT COLOR AND IT PUTS IT IN
26 A DIFFERENT PART OF THE PROGRAM TO LET US KNOW THAT THAT I S A
27 PIECE OF EVII)ENCE THAT THEY FIN:) RELEVANT TO 'I'HEIR CASE.
28 SO THEY "IOULI) DO THAT FOR EVERYTHING THAT THEY WOeLD BE

3660
1
LOOKING FOR, AND WHEN THEY ARE DONE WITH THEIR REVIE~i
THEY WOULD
2
3
4
5
6
RETURN THE HARD DRIVE TO THE RCFL AND THEN WE IWULD C"EATE A
REPORT FROM ALL THE INFORf'lATION THN[ THEY HAD GATHERED DURING
THEI" INVESTIGATION.
Q. THE MANNER IN WHICH THIS PROGRAM COMPARTMENTALIZES THE
DIFFERENT TYPES OF THINGS, INFORMP.TTON FOUND ON THE HARD DRIVE
7
Atm CONTAIl,ERS, AS YOU SAY, DOES THAT AFFECT IN ANY ~iAY
THE ~iAY
8
9
10
11
THE DATA IS USED OR SEEN BY THE USER? FOR EXAMPLE, IF THERE'S AN
EI1AIL THAT HAS BEEN SEGREGATED INTO A PARTICULAR DOCUI1ENT
CONTAINER, AS A CASE AGENT, WHEN I V lEW THAT, I'lILL I SEE ~IHAT
LOOKS TO BE THE O"IGEJAL EMAIL IN ITS ORIGDlhL FOR!1?
12
lL
YES.
13
Q. OKhY. THE REPORTS THAT YOU SAID ARE GENERATED FROI1 THE
14
BOOKMARKING,
IS THhT DhTh EXTRACTED FROM THE H./l.RD DRIVE AND
15
~6
PRESERVED SOI1EHOW IN PRINTED FORM?
A. TYPICALLY \~HEN THEY ASK FOR THE FO:,.wOW-U? REPORT,
:c 7 THERE I S A PROCESS IN THE SOFT\~ARE TOOL THAT ALLo\~S US TO EXPORT
18 ALL OF THE INFORMATION THAT THEY WANT. IT hCTUALLY EXPORTS THE
19 FILE AND ["lAKES A NICE, NEAT WEB-PAGE-LIKE REPORT. SO WE PUT IT
20 ON A CD OR A DVD, DEPENDING HO\~ BIG IT IS, AND IT LISTS ALONG THE
2~ LEFT SIDE OF THE REPORT THE NAME OF THEIR BOOKMARK, AND vlHEN THEY
22 CLICK ON THhT IT BRINGS THE OTHER SIDE OF THE ?hGE TO ALL THE
23 ITEI1S THAT THEY BOOKMARKED. IF THEY WANT TO LOOK AT A PICTURE OR
24 ANY DOCU~lENT, THEY CLICK ON THE LINK TO IT AND IT B"INGS THEM
25 RIGHT TO THE DOCUNENT OR TO THE PICTURE. SO IT IS VERY E.Z\SY ~O
26 FO~LOvJ AND VERY ~iELL ORGANIZED.
27 Q. WHAT IF A DEFENSE COUNSEL OR AN ATTORNEY REPRESENTING
28 AN ACCUSED WANTED TO ACCESS THE HARD DRIVE. IS THAT POSSIBLE?

3661
1 vlOULD YOU PROVIDE A COpy OR WOULD YOU SE:ND THEM TO THE FACILITY?
2 HOW DOES THAT vlCRK?
3
A. viE PROVIDE A DISCOVERY COPY TO THE DEFENSE SO THA'I"
4
EITHER THEY CAN THE>ISELVES OR HIRE THEIR OWN
INVESTIGA'l'ORS OR
5
6
7
8
9
PROFESSIONALS TO EXAI'IINE THE HAR:-J DRIVES FOR WHA'I'EVER THEY ARE
LOOKING FOR.
Q. WOULD THE DISCOVERY COPY ENCOMPASS EVERYTHING ON THE
Hf\RD DRIVE OR ONLY THE ITEMS BOOKJ'1ARKED BY A CASE AGENT?
A. AS PART OF DISCOVERY, IT vlOULD PROBABLY ENCOt'1PASS
10 EVERYTHING. WE WOULD GIVE THEM NOT ONLY A BIT-FOR-BIT COPY OF
11
12
THE ORIGINAL HARD DRIVE, BUT THEY WOULD ALSO GET COPIES OE' THE
REPORTS AND THE FINISHED PRODUCT REPORT THAT WE WOULD EXPORT AT
13
THE END SO THEY CAN SEE ~IHAT
ITEMS WE HAD BOOKMARKED AND THEN BE
14
15
16
17
ABLE TO HAVE THEIR SPECIALIST GO BACK AND RE-EXAMINE TO MAKE SURE
THAT THOSE ITEMS WERE ACTUALLY THERE.
Q. BACK IN THE PROCESS THAT WE'VE DESCRIBED OF THE IMAGING
AND THE COPYING AND THE HASHING AND THE CAIR PACKAGE AND THE
18
BOOKMARKING AND THE REPORT GENERATION,
IS THAT THE PROCESS THAT
19
20
21
~]AS E'OLLO~IED FOR EACH INSTANCE I'lITH THE COMPUTERS IN THIS CASE?
A. NOT EVERY -- THERE ARE '1'1'10 ITEMS ON MY LIST Tl-L;;T ARE
CELL PHONE; EXAMINATIONS, AN:-J CELL PHONES TAKE PLACE IN A
22
DIFFERENT STYLE.
SO CELL PHONES DON'';' FOLLOW THE SAME PROTOCOL.
23
24
25
26
27
28
Q. OKA:. MR. CARGEL DISCGSSED THAT WITH US ALREA:-JY. JUST
FOCUSING ON COMPUTERS.
A. OKAY. 'l'HERE WERE TWO OTHER CASES THA';' INVOLVED ON-SITE
H1AGING WHICH WAS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THAN THE PROTOCOL ~lE' VE
DESCRIBED PREVIOUSLY.
Q. I BELIEVE MR. CARGE!, EXPRESSED THAT AS WELL.

3662
1
A.
OKAY.
2
Q. PERHAPS NOT FULLY. t4R. CARGEL DESCRIBED JVlAKING IMAGES
3 AND COPYING DATA ON SITE. WOULD IT BE UP TO YOU FOLKS AT RCFL TO
4 THEN FURTHER ANALYZE WHAT WAS COPIED m; SITE?
5 A. YES.
Q. IS THAT THE POINT l'iHERE YOU \~OULD START MAKING HASH
7 ]v;ARKS AND SO FORTH?
8 A. YES. DEPENDING ON THE TYPE OF ON-SITE IMAGING -- AND I
9 BELIEVE IN BOTH THESE INSTANCES IT INVOLVED PULLIl,G INFORMATION
10 OFF OF A LIVE SERVER. SO THE HASH VALUE WORKS A LITTLE BIT
11 DIFFERENTLY IN THAT IN A LIVE SERVER WHEN YOU ARE PULLING THE
12 INFORMATIOK, DEPEK)ING ON \~HEL-IER YOU ARE PULLIKG Et4AIL OR
13 CALENDAR EVENTS, THE ITElvJS ON THE SERVER SITE CAN CHANGE BEFORE
14 EVERYTHING YOU'VE COPIED COMPLETES. SO ,"/HAT I~E WOULD DO IS THE
15 D1FOi=

3663
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
PART OF THE CAIR PROCESSING THAT PARTICULAR PIECE OF SOFTWARE,
WHEN WE PROCESS IT FOR CAIR, LOOKS FOR DELETED FILES AND PUTS
1'HEM IN A SEPARATE CATEGORY SO THAT YOU CAN SEE THAT THESE; FILES
ARE PRESENT ON THE COMPUTER BUT THEY HAVE BEEN DELETED.
Q. WAS THAT THE EXTENT OF RCFL'S INVOLVEMENT IN THIS CASE
WITH REGARD TO THE FII\AL REPORTS OF GENERATING THE BOOKMARKED
DATA AND SO FORTH?
A. YES, AS FAR AS I KNO~1. IF THE CASE AGENT AT SOME POINT
9 NEEDS ADDITIONAL ANJI,LYSIS BASED ON NE~i INFORI'1ATION THAT THEY
10 OBTIUN, THEY CAN SUBt,lIT ANOTHER SERVICE REQUEST AND WE CAN DO
11 FOLLOW-UP FROI·l THERE.
12 ~1R. LUDWIG: I THINK THAT'S ABOUT ALL I HAVE FOR YOU. DOES
13 ANYONE HJlSE ANY QUESTIONS?
14 GRAND JUROR NO. 17: I'M FASCINATED.
15 t~R. SCHORR: I HAVE A QUESTION. ,ruST OUT OF CURIOSITY, HOW
16 DOES THIS CASE IN SIZE COMPARE TO YOUR NORMAL CASES?
17 THE WITNESS: IT DOESN'T, ACTUALLY. TH S IS -- I'VE BEEN AT
18 THE LAB SIl,CE 2006. THIS IS THE LARGEST CASE THJI,T I PERSONALLY
19 HIWE EVER I'JORKED ON. I ONLY K::.lOW OF ONE OTHER CASE THAT IGGI[M
20 HAVE BEEN A LITTLE BIT LARGER, BUT I HAD NO INVOLVEt4ENT IN THAT.
21 THAT WAS RIGHT ABOUT THE TIME; I STARTED IN 2 OC 6.
22 MR. LUDWIG: THIS IS QUESTION 169?
23 GRAND JURY SECRETARY: 269.
24 BY MR. LUDWIG:
25
Q.
269, JUROR NO.9. "CAN YOU RETRIEVE TRASH MESSAGES?"
26
A.
TRASH t4ESSAGES LIKE: ITE1·1S WHERE YOU
PUT THEM IN THE
27 RECYCLE BIN? YES, ABSOLUTELY. WHAT PEOPLE DON'T REALLY
28 KNOW -- THIS IS A FASCINATING PART ABOUT NY JOB AND I FIND THE

3644
1
2
3
4
5
6
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
A.
Q.
UH-HUH.
YOURSELF AND YOUR WIFE?
YE:S.
THIS IS AT A DIFFERENT EVENT?
IT'S PROBABLY AFTER A PADRES GAME.
GO BACK TO 'rHIS OTHER PHOTOGRAPH.
7
8
9
10
11
12
A. THAT'S JOSE LOPEZ, JAHm'S 'HF'E, JAIME, AND BERTHA.
Q. ONE LAST QUES'rION HERE, THIS IS QUESTION -
MR. LUD\~IG: WHAT IS THIS?
GRAND JURY SECRETARY: 268.
MR. LUD~nG: 268. I'M NOT SURE WE CAN ASK IT SO WE'LL PASS
ON THAT, FROM GRAND JUROR NO. 16.
13
MR. SCHORR:
11' CALI,S FOR SPECULATION.
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
MR. LUDWIG: ANY MORE QUESTIONS BEFORE WE SAY GOOD-BYE TO
MR. ORTIZ? MR. SCHORR WILL SHOW YOU THE SCHEDULES AGAIN, LIKE WE
DID THE LAST TIME.
(GRAND JURY EXHIBIT 93, GANDARA FORM 700 MOCKUP
2011, MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.)
BY MR. SCHORR:
Q. I'LL SHOW YOU vJHAT HAS BEEN MARKED AS GRAND JURY
21
EXHIBIT NO.
93, WHICH IS JESUS GANDARA FOR THE YEAR 2018 AND IT
22
23
24
LISTS ONE DINNER. SAYS JAIME ORTIZ IN THE AMOUNT OF $50.
(GRAND JURY EXHIBIT 94, L6PEZ FORM 700 ["lOCKUP
2011, MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.)
25
BY t'lR.
SCHORR:
26
27
28
Q. 94 IS FOR BERTHA L6PEZ, ONE DINNER ON 9/16/2011 FOR THE
At,mUNT OF $110. AND THEN GREG SANDOVAL, AGAIN, SGI, 9/16/2011 -­
THAT'S NOT RIGHT.

3665
1 ALLOCATED SPACE CONTAINS ALL OF THE ACTIVE FILES ON YOUR
2 COMPUTER, SO ALL OF YOUR DOCUMENTS AND YOUR PICTURES AND YOUR
3 SYSTEM FII.ES, EVERYTHING THAT IS NEEDED TO OPERATE T'1AT COMPUTER
4 IS IN ALLOCATED SPACE.
5 UNAI.I.OCATED SPACE IS AN AREA THA'l' IS lWAII.ABLE FOR NEW
6 FILES, KIND OF THINK OF IT AS -- WE DID THIS WHEN I WENT THROUGH
7 TRAINING - AS A VIDEOTAPE. I I'IOULD BE IN VERY BIG TROUBLE IF I
8 TOOK MY WEDDING VIDEOTAPE, WEICH WAS ~'OUR HOURS LONG, AND DECIDED
9 I WAS GOING TO POP IT INTO ':'HE VCR AND RECORD THE ':''1REE-HOUR
10 CHARGER GAME. NOT ONLY WOULD I BE IN BIG TROUBLE, I'D BE IN
11 REALLY BIG TROUBLE. BUT WHE"'E I 'I-! GOING WITH THIS IS ~HE ACTIVE
12 AREA OF T'1AT PAR'I'ICU~I'IR TAPE IS THE THREE HOURS or THE CHARGER
13 GANE, BUT j'i'E HAVE RESIDUE OF THE LAST HOUR or MY j~EDDING VIDEO,
14 AND THAT'S KIND or WHAT ALLOCATED AND UNA::'::'OCA'l'ED SPACE Dor~S.
15 SO WHEN WE EMPTY THE RECYCLE BIN, THAT rILE IS STILL SITTING
16 IN THAT STORAGE SPACE UNTIL IT'S REWRl'l'TEN OVER AGAIN. SO ALL
17 THE COt'lPUTER DOES IN THIS MASTER BOOT RECORD WHEN WE TALK ABOuT
18 POIN'I'ERS, ORIGINALLY IT POINTED TO THE F'ILE AND IT POINTED TO THE
19 RECYCLE BIN. WHEN WE DELETE IT, IT JUST ERASES 'rHE POINTER, BUT
20 IT DOESN'T ACTUALLY ERASE THE FILE. THE FILE IS S"'ILL SITTING
21 RIGHC' THERE. SO YOU CAN RECOVER THAT rILE BASED ON 'rHE HEADER
22 INFORt1ATION or THE FILE AND THE FOOTER INF'ORMATION. THE SOFTWARE
23 TOOLS KNOW THAT IT'S A DOCGMENT OR II PICTURE AND IT'S ABLE TO
24 RECOVER IT AND PUr;' IT INTO THE APPROPRIATE CO::lTAINER.
25 WHEN YOG REFORMAT YOU'RE NOT -- WE'RE ,JUST TALKING FORM..I'IT
26 WE'RE NOT GETTING RID OF' THE L"NALLOCATED SPACE; WE'RE SH1PLY
27 WIPING THE MASTER BOOT RECORD C;:'EAN SO THAT IT DOESN'T KNOW j~HERE
28 ANY OF THE E'Il.ES ARE. SO IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S NOT THERE, BUT

3666
1 TECHNICALLY IT'S ST:LL THERE.
2 IF YOU WANT TO GET RID OF' THAT FlU;, YOU HAVE TO WIPE YOUR
3 liARD DRIVE, AND WIPING IS ESSENTIALLY WRITING A KNOWN VALUE IN
4 EVERY SINGLE SECTOR OF THAT PARTICULAR COMPUTER SO THAT
5 EVERYTHING IS GONE.
6 Q. WOULD THAT BE REFORMATTING IT'?
7 A. NO, TIIAT WOULD BE WIPING. REF'ORMATTING SIMPLY STARTS
8 YOUR INDEX FROM SCRATCH AND ERASES ALL THE PO:::NTERS SO 'THAT THE
9 COMPUTER DOESN'T KNOW THAT THERE ARE ANY FILES THERE.
10 Q. BUT THE FILES WOULD S'rILL BE THERE?
11 A. TilE n LES WOULD ST IIoL BE THERE.
12 Q, SO IT'S WIPING?
13 A. vHPING IS YOUR BEST BET IE' YOU DON'T N.zl.NT ANYBODY TO
14 FIND THE INFORMATION ON YOUR COJV1PUTER, WHICII IS NHY IF YOU IIAVE A
15 CO:

3667
1 I'M GOING TO LOOK DOVIN THE FILE STRUCTURE TO A ?ARTICULAR AREA
2 WHERE IT'S STORED, BUT 1'1" S NOT GOING TO BE THS SAI{E PLACS ON THE
3 LINUX t~ACHINE OR ON A t1ACINTOSH l"ACHINE. THE BASICS P.RE THE
4 SAME, BUT YOU HAVE TO HAVE SPECIALTY TO KNOW TO WHERE TO LOOK FOR
5 THE OTHER THINGS.
6 t1R. SCHORR: P.NYTHING ELSE? WE ';'HANK YOU FOR YOUR TESTIMONY
7 ';'ODAY. ';'HERE IS AN ADMONITION TO BE READ TO YOU.
8 GRAND JURY FOREPERSON: GRAND JURY PROCEEDINGS AND
9 INVES'rIGATIONS ARE SECRET. YOU ARE, THEREFORE, ADMONISHED ON
10 BEHALF OF THE SAN DIEGO SUPERIOR COURT AND THE CRIMINAL GRAND
. , JURY NOT TO DISCLOSE YOUR GRAND JURY SUBPOENA OR YOUR GRAND JURY
12 APPEARANCE '1'0 ANYONE, AND NOT '1'0 REVEAL ';'0 ANY PERSON ANY
: 3 QUESTIONS ASKED, OR ANY RESPONSES GIVEN, IN THE GRAND JURY, OR
14 ANY OTHER MAT'l'ERS CONCERNING THE NA'l'URE OR SUBJECT OF THE GRAND
15 JURY'S INVESTIGATION, WHICH YOU LEARNED .".BOUT BY YOUR GRAND JURY
~ 6 SUBPOENA OR DURING YOUR GRAND JURY A??EARANCE, EXCEPT TO YOUR OWN
17 LEGAL COUNSEL. THIS AD~lONITION CONTINUES UNTIL SUCH TIME AS THE
18 TRANSCRIPT OF THE GRAND JURY PROCEEDING IS MADE PUBLIC, OR UNTIL
19 DISCLOSURE IS OTHER~lISE AUTHORIZED BY THE COURT OR BY OPERATION
20 OF LAW. VIOLATION OF THIS ADMONIT:ON IS PUNISHABLE AS CONTEMPT
21 OF COURT.
22 MR LUDWIG: THANK YOU FOR COMING TODAY.
23 THE WITNESS: THANK YOU.
24 MR. SCHORR: ALL RIGHT. UNLESS THERE'S OTHER I'lATTERS THAT
25 WE NEED TO DISCUSS -- I'M SEEING A HAND.
26 GRAND JUROR NO.2: I [AlAS GOING THROUGH I~Y NOTEBOOK HERE AND
27 LOOKING AT THE CHARGES FOR THE INDIVI DUALS. EV: DEN'l'L Y SOl'lETHING
28 VERY IMPORTANT HAPPENED ON APRIL 19, 2010, AND SOI'1ETHING ELSE ON

3668
1 JUNE 1, 2010. I DON'T FIKD EITHER OF 7HOSE DIITES IK THE
2 TD1ELINE. IF I Wp.NT THAT INFORt.!lATION, HOW DO I KNOW WHAT
3 HAPPENED ON THOSE T~1O DATES?
4 MR. SCHORR: ~HOSE '{ELATE TO SOUTHWESTERN COLLEGE'?
5 GRAND JUROR NO.2: THAT li

1 STATE OF CA~IFORNIA
2 COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO
SS:
3
PEOPLE OF THE S':'A'I'E OF CALIFORNIA
k
J
VS.
6
7
~I.~OTO,
CASE NO.
ET AL.
SCD235445
8
VOLUME 23
9
10 I, BETTY J. ASHE, AN OFFICIAL REPORTSR FOR THE SUPERIOR
11 COUR':' OF THE STATE OF CALIFORN IN AND FOR THE COUNTY OF
12 SAN DIEGO, DO HEREBY CERTIFY:
13 THAT, AS SUCH REPORTER, I REPOR'rED STENOGRAPHICALLY THE
14 PROCEEDINGS HAD IN THE ABOVE-ENTITLED CAUSE, AND THAT THE
15 FOREGOING TRANSCRIPT, CONSIS':'ING OF PAGES NUMBERED 3531 THROUGH
16 3668, INCLUSIVE, IS A FULL, TRUE, AND CORRECT TRANSCRIPTION OF MY
17 SHORTHAND NOTES TA~EN DURING ':'HE PROCEEDINGS ON DECEMBER 13,
18 2012.
19 DATED THIS 9TH DAY OF JANUARY, 2013, AT SAN DIEGO,
20 CALIFORNIA.
21
22
23
24
25
m{lJK
~~'¢~=I..1;-nt~. CSR NO. 4844
OFFICIAL C T REPORTER
SAN D:EGO S PERI OR COURT
26
27
28