LARRY KORNFELD INTERVIEW with Steve Bottoms, 9.95 - Judson ...

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SJB: Irene was saying how you shouldn't force a theory onto things - you should findout what the artists think they're doing, not just invent your own theories.LK: Let the theory emerge. That's what we were doing. We let the play emerge. I dida production of a play at Judson, little three character play by Ken Brown, who wroteThe Brig, and it's a funny little play about [...?...] Crystal was in it, no she was in thesecond production. And we let it emerge. We found it. And it ended up being acharming, funny, kind of moving piece. Ken was in the playwrighting class of theActors' Studio with Harold Clurman, and Clurman said bring the piece in. Webrought it to the studio, presented it [blah blah blah] Clurman said "well that's justwonderful, thankyou Ken thankyou Larry blah blah: now would you please, for theclass, tell us how you went about achieving the goal that you wanted". I said wellHarold actually we never did set out to achieve anything. And he laughed and saidthat's impossible, it was too good to just happen. Ken said, I'm sorry Harold "wedidn't talk about its structure, we explored it and let it happen, let it take its shape".And Harold Clurman got furious, he got just furious, he thought that we were playinga game and being just snotty. And we couldn't tell him that weren't being snotty, wewere being very serious, that we'd worked very carefully on the piece, but not fromthe position of going for something. Now I am also able to very much set a goal for apiece and go for it (but also letting things happen), but in this piece it didn't work thatway. In the Stein pieces I didn't know how they were going to end up.LK: Well I'll tell you a story. Al Carmines and I would be working on the middle ofthe play, and he had just brought a new piece [of music] in. We always worked insequence: he would teach them the songs in the morning, and in the afternoon andevening I would direct. He was writing the songs at night. And we built it like that,everything that we then did would be affected by what we had already done. And inthe middle of the piece I said 'How the hell is this going to end?' And that's what we'dgot to do: we'd discover it. In Circles, Al wrote the last song first, we knew exactlyhow it had to end, but we did not know how we were going to get there. That's theelement of chance I'm talking about. That you have all kinds of ideas when you director write, you may know the ending, you may know the beginning, you may know themiddle, but how are you going to get there? If you really do know you're going tocreate a formula piece. That's why you need to be involved in a theatre that says: youcan fail. Because you can take the chance, without knowing how it's going to workout. As every poet does, as every musician does.SJB: That happened when I staged Promenadereally loved the results, and others hated it.myself last year - and some peopleLK: I always say that: some people are going to love it, some are going to hate it. Ifyou're going to do a play that a LOT of people have to love, in order to buy theexpensive tickets for it, you're going to have to find a form that doesn't conflict. Andif you're very honest with yourself, and say I really need to make some money, and I
want to do this by the formula, and you know you're taking the money for it -- wellsometimes you have to do that, but don't pretend it's art! ... In those days I was alsoa hothead, I was also very arrogant: I'm not now [smile], I was also - people said Iwas to a certain extent sometimes very mean, because I wanted it to happen: IT HADTO HAPPEN! And I always want people to open up and let things happen ... Anotherwonderful thing that I go by in my life - I tell this to students often - is that I wasdoing What Happened, and Joan Baker, after the piece opened, she carne to me andshe said 'I loved working on this piece' (she did, most of the people hated working onit, until after it was over and then they'd realise ...) She said 'I loved working on it -you built a beautiful golden cage around me, which I was free to fly in.' And I kind ofloved that remark - along with some modifications - because I think that's what adirector does: creates these wonderful cages and shapes and boundaries, orextensions!, which ultimately you have around you. You can't create ultimatefreedom, ultimate openness, because then people just disperse like a dance doesoutside, it disappears. You have to create the boundaries, and help structure people'swork, so that they can move with great freedom, anywhere within it. And I feel freeto say to an actor: the character can't go that way, the play can't go that way: findanother way, that'll be a beautiful way. Also I will say to an actor 'you were very goodthere: that's very right, very appropriate, very honest, it moved you: it's boring!Because it's not theatrical.'
Page 6 and 7: -- from song to song in one play: w
Page 8 and 9: The church's mission was very spiri
Page 10 and 11: LK: Yeah. I was always very fond of
Page 12 and 13: of the truck driver, who's the chor
Page 14 and 15: young playwrights, poets, who had a
Page 16 and 17: LK: The theatre was originally form
Page 18 and 19: SJB: Michael Smith said somewhere t
Page 20 and 21: LK: Remy Charlip's work. Almost any
Page 22 and 23: SJB: Yes. But was there a tension,
Page 24 and 25: happened with the best of Off-Off-B
Page 26 and 27: So they really retained the quality

LARRY KORNFELD INTERVIEW with Steve Bottoms, 9.95 - Judson ...

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