New Eastern Europe Issue 1

100 Interview The Caucasus, a Journey in Time – A conversation with Wojciech Jagielski
require fi nancial support. And the camp
that could fi nance such a revolution has
more and more of its own problems.
Colonel Yuri Budanov’s murder proves
that Russia does not keep the situation under
control. Who do you suspect is responsible
for his murder?
Seven shots in the head. I would not be
surprised if it was done by the Chechens as
an act of revenge. Budanov was among the
most hated Russian offi cers in Chechnya.
Not even Putin was detested so much. For
Russians, on the other hand, Budanov was
as a hero. I believe that for someone who
had a score to settle with him, the situation
was a perfect opportunity to avoid any suspicion
and cast it on the Chechens. We do
not know whose tracks to follow. Budanov
was not the fi rst Russian offi cer to be killed
this way. Viktor Polyanichko, the Russian
governor in North Ossetia and Ingushetia
was also shot dead. He was infamous for
his role in the fi rst Chechen war.
How strong is public support for the idea
of an Islamic caliphate in the Caucasus?
Followers of the caliphate are considered
terrorists and no one wants to support them.
Aside from war, nothing has ever united
the Caucasus. Th e question is – were they
really united when faced with war or were
they temporarily forced to do so by Russia?
Th e Caucasus is also the regional centre
for all sorts of conspiracy theories. Akhmed
Zakayev claimed that Dokka Umarov, along
with the idea of caliphate, was created by
the Russian secret service to discredit the
independence movement. Th e Chechens
lost a lot of respect for Shamil Basayev
when he invaded Dagestan. Even today
one can hear stories about the amounts
of money Basayev accepted from Boris Berezovsky
(Russian MP and oligarch in the
1990s – editor’s note) on the Côte d’Azur
to give Russia a pretext to invade Chechnya.
A caliphate movement that would
aspire to become politically infl uential in
the Caucasus is not going to get any public
support. Th e nations conquered by Russia
a long time ago and secularised would have
a very diffi cult time accepting Sharia law.
How do you see the status of women in
the Caucasus?
Th ey do not play a prominent role in politics.
One can mention Nino Burjanadze
from Georgia. But apart from her, there
really isn’t anyone else.
Th ese are typically male societies. Th ere
exists a hidden matriarchal structure
present in the whole Caucasus. Zviad
Gamsakhurdia’s wife infl uenced his political
decisions. But, men get jealous of
leadership roles played by the heads of
families, politicians, warriors. Georgian
women are not allowed to sit at the table
and by the same token they are not allowed
to engage in politics. I would have real
diffi culty listing the fi rst ladies in many of
these countries, even though I specialise
in this area of the world. Perhaps I would
be able to say more about the wife of
the fi rst president of independent Armenia
who was a scientist. Th e fi rst lady of
Azerbaijan, Mehriban Aliyeva got a lot of
publicity at the time when her husband
came to power. Mikheil Saakashvili’s wife