NAELA News August, 1999 - National Academy of Elder Law ...

TM
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
by Rebecca C. Morgan, Esq.
Introduction
In February, on
behalf of NAELA, I
attended a longterm
care conference.
Laury Adsit,
our executive director,
Jay Kearns and
Al Chiplin (who
are working on the
LTCI certification
project) attended as
well. During the
conference, Jane
Bryant Quinn, a
well-known syndicated
columnist,
gave a keynote address
that covered a
wide range of issues, including Medicaid
planning and long-term care insurance.
After her speech, we introduced
ourselves and talked with her briefly
about NAELA and Medicaid planning.
During our conversation, she agreed to
be interviewed for the NAELA News. At
the conclusion of the interview, I gave
her a standing invitation to attend our
programs and she kindly agreed to review
this article prior to publication for
accuracy.
My goal for this interview was to
get her thoughts on a number of different
topics in her own words. This
Jane Bryant Quinn
article appears in a
question and answer
format.
Having the opportunity
to interview
Jane Bryant
Quinn was a highlight
of my presidency.
I hope you
find this article informative.
Mechanics
of the
Interview
I solicited
questions from
NAELA’s Executive
Committee and others,
consulted with the Treasurer,
Geraldine Champion, who was a journalist
previously, and developed a
lengthy list of questions that I sent to
Ms. Quinn the day before the interview.
We sent her information about NAELA.
Laury and I talked with her by telephone
– she was very gracious and answered
my questions for 50 minutes – and I
think she would have even allowed me a
few more!
The Interview
RCM You write a number of articles on
issues that affect our clients,
including the Social Security,
Medicare, and long-term care.
What drew you to those issues?
Quinn They are all leading consumer
issues of our times. They involve
public policy, they involve people’s
money, they raise moral and social
issues that are important. As all of
us get older, they become increasingly
important to a larger portion
of the population. How are we
going to pay for aging? Who is
going to pay? This certainly is a
very big issue in personal finance.
RCM You see these issues continuing, I
assume, to increase or to continue
their importance?
Quinn Because they are not solved. We
(continued on page 2)
August 1999
Volume XI ● Issue IV
In this issue...
President’s Message .................. 3
When the Con Artist Comes ........ 18
Peripatetic Essay ..................... 20
Members In The News ............... 22
Dealing With the Media ............. 24
1

NAELA News ● August 1999
Chapter Presidents
National Academy of
Elder Law Attorneys
ARIZONA
Kay Richter
Tucson, AZ
(520) 318-1301
CAROLINAS
Diana Armatage Johnston, CELA
Hendersonville, NC
(828) 693-0811
Francelle C. Millender, CELA
Columbia, SC
(803) 733-3433
NORTHERN CALIFORNIA
Gregory Wilcox, CELA
Berkeley, CA
(510) 665-8400
SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA
Elizabethanne M. Angevine
Whittier, CA
(562) 464-1150
COLORADO
R. L. Steenrod, Jr.
Denver, CO
(303) 534-5100
FLORIDA
G. Mark Shalloway, CELA
West Palm Beach, FL
(561) 686-6200
KANSAS
Kristin L. McCord
Mission, KS
(913) 831-4045
ILLINOIS
Howard S. Berk
Chicago, IL
(312) 603-0800
MASSACHUSETTS
John J. Ford
Lynn, MA
(781) 599-7730
MISSOURI
Craig C. Reaves, CELA
Kansas City, MO
(816) 756-2100
NEW JERSEY
Eugene Rosner, CELA
Clark, NJ
(732) 382-6070
TEXAS
Julia E. Merkt
El Paso, TX
(915) 545-1063
WASHINGTON
Sean bleck
Seattle, WA
(206) 340-2200
Please note that this list does not include the
NAELA chapters currently in formation.
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 1)
have not yet reached any
agreement as to how we are
going to pay for them and who is
going to get the services or the
income. Until we reach that
agreement, it is going to be an
open sore.
RCM I know that there are a lot of
issues that we have to deal with.
Do you think any of these are
more pressing than the others?
Quinn Everything is pressing. The
Medicare trust fund is closer
to being in trouble than the
Social Security trust fund is,
but I don’t think I would put
one over the other. All of
these issues are important. I
don’t think I would rank them.
RCM
Let’s switch to the issue of
long-term care. I know that
the President has introduced
a proposal and I’ve read a few
of the things you’ve written
about it. What do you think
about the proposal?
Quinn I am not a big fan of his
proposal. I think it’s mainly to
help caregivers. It gives them
a tax credit. It does not help
people who do not pay taxes.
Also it doesn’t help lower
income people who are giving
care. It would only apply in
the most serious cases of
home care, and then it would
come to something like $3.00 a
day. That’s not going to help a
whole lot. The proposal honors
people who do home care
without really helping them a lot.
The budget for it is something
like $5.5 billion. At the same
time, they’re cutting a much
larger sum out of Medicare,
including Medicare home care.
It would be more sensible to
allocate this money to Medicare,
including home care, rather than
give a certain group of caregivers
RCM
$3.00 a day. It’s nice to recognize
caregivers but the tax code
isn’t there to recognize things.
Also, there’s no guarantee that a
tax credit would add to the
amount of home care available.
I would prefer to see the money
in the general program.
Do you think that the general
public realizes the shortcomings
of this proposal, or do
you think they just say, “oh,
the President’s trying to do
something about long-term
care?”
Quinn Oh, probably, the latter, which
is what’s intended. Unless, of
course they read my column
and maybe acquired a different
view.
RCM
In your writings you have
made reference to the fact that
you’ve had personal experience
with long-term care
giving. Would you be willing
to share your personal story
with us?
Quinn Not in great detail, but I will
tell you briefly. My mother-inlaw
lived with us for nine
years after she became
physically incapable of living
on her own. It was not
Alzheimer’s but it was a
progressive dementia of
another sort. We had home
care, and kept her with us until
it became too difficult. For her
last three years, she was in a
nursing home.
RCM Based on your personal experiences,
do you recommend that
Congress do something else other
than what the President’s
proposing?
Quinn Well, that’s one of the issues. We
could afford home care for my
mother-in-law. So why should I
get $1,000 on my tax return to
help me when I could afford to
pay it? We did what we did
because she was my husband’s
(continued on page 4)
2

NAELA News ● August 1999
President’s Message
by A. Frank Johns, CELA
This is the first message
of my term as NAELA president.
I am approaching these
messages in the same manner,
and hopefully at the same high
level, as Clifton B. Kruse, Jr.,
did during his tenure as
NAELA President. You may
not yet know Clifton. You may
get to know him by reading his
column, “The Peripatetic Essayist,”
in the NAELA News.
Clifton was insistent
that Laury
Adsit write an executive
director’s
column that addressed
the operation
and function of
NAELA, while he
as president addressed
the vision
and future of
NAELA, its members
and its members’
service to
their vast numbers
of older clients. I intend to follow my
mentor’s suit, striving to be as successful
as he was.
In this first president’s message, I
am sharing my remarks delivered at the
A. Frank Johns
“In the middle of that
sleepless night, I
outlined the goals and
objectives for NAELA
during my term as
president.”
The NAELA News is published by the
National Academy of Elder Law Attorneys, Inc.
1604 N. Country Club Road ● Tucson, AZ 85716-3102
520/881-4005 ● 520/325-7925 Fax ● www.naela.org
© Copyright NAELA 1999
Articles appearing in the NAELA News may not be regarded as legal advice. The
nature of elder law practice makes it imperative that local law and practice be
consulted before advising clients. Statements of fact and opinion are the responsibility
of the author and do not imply an opinion or endorsement on the part of the
officers or directors of NAELA unless otherwise specifically stated as such.
opening of the NAELA Symposium
in San Diego, titled
Been Thinking About It!; and
the comments delivered at
the annual business luncheon
on May 22, 1999, titled
The History, the Spirit, the
Challenge and the Charge.
I am taking the liberty to place
these in writing to you all
because less than 10 percent
of you were able to attend the
symposium. For
those of you who
were there, I hope
these are refreshing
recollections of
what was said.
Been
Thinking of
It!
As I stood before
several hundred
symposium
attendees, I was
somewhat unnerved.
President Rebecca Morgan had
just delivered superb remarks, commenting
on the successes attained by the
NAELA leadership through the course
(continued on page 14)
Publications Chair .......................................................... Howard J. Altas, CELA, Melville, NY
Co-Editor .............................................................................. Alex L. Moschella, Somerville, MA
Co-Editor ......................................................... William J. Brisk, CELA, Newton Highlands, MA
Associate Editor ............................................................. Sharon K. Gruer, Great Neck, NY
Associate Editor ................................................................... Steven H. Stern, Islandia, NY
Executive Director ........................................................................... Laury L. Adsit, Tucson, AZ
Communications Director ................................................. Jihane K. Rohrbacker, Tucson, AZ
Communications Coordinator .................................................. Carolyn A. Smith, Tucson, AZ
Graphic Designer ......................................................................... Kristin L. Hager, Fishers, IN
Board Of Directors
2000
National Academy of
Elder Law Attorneys
PRESIDENT
A. Frank Johns, CELA
Greensboro, NC
PRESIDENT-ELECT
Judith A. Stein, Esq.
Mansfield, CT
VICEPRESIDENT
Howard J. Atlas, CELA
Melville, NY
TREASURER
Charles Patrick Sabatino, Esq.
Washington, D.C.
SECRETARY
William J. Browning, CELA
Worthington, OH
PASTPRESIDENT
Rebecca C. Morgan, Esq.
St. Petersburg, FL
DIRECTORS
Donna R. Bashaw, CELA
Laguna Hills, CA
Thomas D. Begley, Jr., CELA
Moorestown, NJ
Dennis J. Christensen, Esq.
Mount Pleasant, SC
Joyce M. Collins, Esq.
Hyannis, MA
Ronald A. Fatoullah, CELA
Great Neck, NY
Dan Kellogg, CELA
Renton, WA
John (Jay) F. Kearns, CELA
West Hartford, CT
Bernard A. Krooks, CELA
New York, NY
Julia E. Merkt, Esq.
El Paso, TX
Alex L. Moschella, Esq.
Somerville, MA
Julie R. Osterhout, CELA
Fort Myers, FL
Steven C. Perlis, CELA
Arlington Heights, IL
Mary T. Schmitt Smith, CELA
Bloomfield Hills, MI
John J. Wargo, CELA
Racine, WI
Stuart D. Zimring, Esq.
North Hollywood, CA
EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR
Laury L. Adsit
Tucson, AZ
MANAGING DIRECTOR
Deborah J. Barnett
Tucson, AZ
3

NAELA News ● August 1999
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 2)
RCM
mother, which is I think is what
most families do— taking care of
relatives, because you love them.
We have a limited amount of
Federal money. I don’t see
offering tiny tax credits for things
people would do anyway. It’s
better to use this money to add to
the amount of health care—for
example, by adding to Medicare’s
home care program. Distributing
services through tax credits is
highly inefficient. It’s not clear
that it adds to the supply, and
it’s not clear where the money
ultimately goes.
Long-term care insurance is
something that has been
around awhile. It’s been gaining
more attention and more
support. People are becoming
more aware of it and are
investigating the feasibility of it.
Our members, where they believe
it’s appropriate for their clients,
make recommendations to them
about long-term care insurance,
but sometimes they’re going to
see clients who are going to be
either not eligible or they’ve been
denied insurance coverage
because they are too old or too
sick. What would you suggest
for people like that who haven’t
made the plans ahead of time?
Quinn I have no suggestions for them.
If they’re too old or too sick to
buy long-term care coverage—
well, this is one of the arguments
for having universal care in this
country. Today, if you can’t afford
care and don’t have insurance,
you’re stuck. You have to spend
down for Medicaid. We’re the
only developed country in the
world that does not have a
universal health system for its
citizens, and I think that’s a shame.
We’re the richest, and we can’t
give our citizens universal care. If
we had universal care, the problem
you just outlined to me would not
occur.
RCM Is part of the problem getting
others to plan ahead?
Medicare Fraud Fighters
Program Kit Available
Billions of taxpayer dollars are lost each year through fraudulent Medicare
charges. AARP is partnering with the federal government to help stop
this waste of public funds. As part of a national awareness campaign, AARP
offers a free training kit to disseminate information to Medicare beneficiaries
about misspent Medicare funds. The kit includes an 11-minute videotape that
outlines the steps Medicare beneficiaries can take to help spot questionable
charges. Moderated by Washington, DC TV news personality Maureen Bunyon,
the video describes how Medicare fraud, waste and abuse can happen, the
questions to ask when reviewing a Medicare statement, how to check out any
concerns, and where to report questionable charges. You will also receive sample
program agendas, scripts, and brochures.
Single copies of the free Medicare Fraud Fighter Program Kit (D 16880)
are available from AARP Fulfillment, 601 E Street, NW, Washington, DC
20049. Please allow 4 weeks for delivery. The VHS video is appropriate for
showing to older consumers at meetings, senior centers, nutrition sites, or consumer
forums. The video is also available in Spanish and in other formats by
special request to the AARP Medicare Fraud Team at the above address.
Quinn If you plan ahead and you buy
insurance younger, you don’t
run into the old-and- sick
problem. If you are sick, there
is nothing you can do.
RCM
As the elder law attorneys, we
see the boomers usually in the
context with problems regarding
their parents. But how do
we convince them or what
should we be stressing to
them to make them understand
the importance of their
planning for their retirement
and for their long-term care
needs?
Quinn I think that’s hard to do at this
point because the boomers
have other expenses. They
have college on their minds.
They may think they haven’t
saved enough money for
retirement. They have a lot of
other expenses that have to be
handled, before they think
about long-term care. Also,
they may feel that, by the time
they’re 85 or 90, the government
will pay, or some other
system will be in place. And
that is not entirely illogical.
You can’t predict how longterm
care will be handled 30
years from now. They may be
reluctant to pay for something
that could become obsolete. In
approaching boomers, the
insurance companies have not
been creative enough. They need
to look into current needs. For
example, they might sell boomers
a disability policy that becomes a
long-term care policy when they
retire. That gives them value now,
as well as future value, and builds
a payment into their budget. A
couple of insurers are trying things
like this. I think that that’s the
path more companies will take.
Now it’s possible that boomers
will get more interested in straight
long-term care. More employers
are offering group long-term care,
which raises awareness. Assuming
(continued on page 5)
4

NAELA News ● August 1999
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 4)
this coverage is portable, some
of the boomers might keep it
when they move to another job.
RCM When we have clients in our
office and we’re talking to them
about long-term care and the
viability of a policy, are there any
particular points or advice that
you would give us for our clients?
Quinn The things that you know
already. A policy should be
comprehensive. It’s useful to
have inflation adjustment when
you’re younger, although when
you’re much older it matters
less. Look for a level premium–
along with disclosure that your
class of premiums might still go
up in price. It is important, I
think, for people who buy these
policies to know that in the
future, if the company concludes
that it has mispriced the policy,
the cost of the entire class of
policies may increase. People
who buy this insurance need to
have the financial resources to
pay a higher price in the future,
just in case. Low-cost long-term
care is almost certain to go up. I
like policies where the payments
are pooled for both home care
and nursing home care so you
don’t have two separate divisions–this
money over here for
nursing home and that money
for home care. When you’re
looking at a limited budget, you
want a long waiting period
which, presumably, you would
fill with your own savings. If
you could pay for nursing-home
care for the first six months or
even 12 months, you’d lower
your insurance costs. Alternatively,
you could buy a larger
daily benefit. How long a
benefit to buy? Three years is
probably a reasonable average.
Some people might want five
years. The cost of permanent
coverage—say, 20 years—is
pretty high. That might not be
the best use of your money.
RCM
Who then do you believe should
buy long-term care?
Quinn Anybody who wants to protects
assets. They’d rather have the
insurance policy pay than pay
themselves. I can’t see making
yourself poor in order to buy
long-term care insurance. You
have to have the income to buy
it, plus a strong desire to use
your assets for something other
than your own care.
RCM
You know some of our members
do Medicaid planning for their
clients and I know you have written
on the issue of Medicaid planning
and transfers. Do you see a case
where Medicaid planning would be
appropriate?
Quinn I think that there is a legitimate
concern, where there’s a spouse at
home. However, there are already
many protections for the spouse at
home, which need to be examined
before you do Medicaid planning.
I also think that if planning is done
to protect the spouse at home, and
the other spouse does indeed go
into a nursing home, it would be
proper for states to recover the
Medicaid money from the estate,
when the second spouse dies. I
believe very strongly that people
ought to pay for themselves,
instead of pushing the bill onto the
taxpayers. I think it’s shocking that
people with money still want the
public to pay.
RCM
Let me talk to you for a few
minutes about Social Security. It’s
a hot topic this year. The President
has a proposal for reform. The
Republicans are going to make
their own suggestions on how to
save it. If you were in charge
and you could reform Social
Security, what would you do?
Quinn I think that the best plan on the
table right now is the President’s
plan. It’s a smart idea, to use the
surplus to pay the federal debt.
You can get the debt down to very
low levels. Then, when we need
extra funds to cover boomers’
retirements, it would make sense
to borrow some of that money
back. There are times in this
country when we’ve borrowed
enormous sums, for things that
were deemed essential. We had
huge debts in the wars of course
and then worked them down. We
had big debts in the 1980s. In the
upcoming years, we could work
down the debt almost to zero, if all
the surplus were saved. In 2020
or so, we could re-borrow to pay
off Social Security claims.
Basically, that’s what the President
is looking at. He also wants to put
part of the trust fund into the stock
market, in the form of equity-fund
investments. I think that’s an
intelligent approach. All the state
pension funds do it. Every private
pension fund does it. Over the
long-term, equities give you higher
yields—so you wouldn’t have to
worry so much about cutting back.
The privatization plans on the
table have a lot of ideological
support, but no one has shown me
yet how they are going to work, in
a practical sense. They’re talking
(continued on page 6)
Attention Readers!
If you purchased the Jack Stevens book, Avoiding the Tax Traps in
Your IRA, at the NAELA Symposium, please fax or e-mail your name
and address to the NAELA office so that Jack can provide you updates
in the law as they occur. Please fax to (520) 325-7925 attention:
Debbie Barnett or e-mail her at dbarnett@naela.com.
5

NAELA News ● August 1999
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 5)
about taking two percentage
points of your Social Security tax
and putting it into private
accounts. Some 40 million
workers would be putting in less
than $80 a year. What does that
cost to manage? Who’s going to
manage it? Probably the
government, but how? How does
the government keep track of
millions of people as they move
from place to place? Last year
something like 99,000 tax
refunds were returned because
of the wrong address. How is
anyone going to keep track of
150,000,000 Social Security
accounts? How do you split
them in case of divorce? Who
gets what? Does the government
have to keep track of
everyone who gets divorced?
You can see that the practical
questions are stunning. Recently, a
study was done of three counties in
Texas that, in the early 1980s,
withdrew from Social Security.
Public employees can’t do that
now, but they could back then.
They withdrew and set up private
accounts. The cities contributed
even more to their accounts than
employers do under Social
Security. Yet almost 20 years later,
both lower-income people and
spouses at home were getting less
out of these than Social Security
would have paid. Social Security
tips toward spouses at home and
lower earners, which doesn’t
happen in the private accounts. In
Texas, the winners were people
with more money, the losers were
people with less money. I don’t
think we’ve had a public discussion
of whether we want to risk that
kind of outcome. Supporters of
privatization talk as if everyone will
do better with personal accounts,
and that’s not true.
RCM Proponents for the privatization
refer to Chile’s system. Is that a
good comparison for us?
Quinn That’s what everyone says, so I got
a lot of data from people who have
studied Chile’s system. Chile has
an easy way of handling small
accounts—hard-to-find people,
migrant workers, agricultural
workers, that sort of thing —they
leave them out of their privatized
system. Some 40 percent of
Chileans aren’t included. Their
system is aimed toward the urban
middle–and working class.
Chileans pay 18 to 30 percent out
of their accounts each year for
money management. I think that’s
pretty unreasonable. So this isn’t a
model we can use. In fact, I was
pretty stunned when I looked at it.
RCM
In terms of health care, Medicare
of course is a big issue. So much
has happened to it recently. If
you could do it, what would you
do to change Medicare?
NAELA Programming:
Time for a Change?
As we begin our second decade, many members have voiced an opinion that
NAELA should look at making some changes in its programming. If you have
any thoughts or suggestions, please write me. As NAELA Programs Committee
Chair for 1999-2000, my committee and I plan to review all suggestions, to have
a focus group discuss programming and to make recommendations to the full
board of directors in 2000. Your suggestions can be sent to: Julie Osterhout,
10175-4 Six Mile Cypress Parkway, Fort Myers, FL 33912.
Quinn There are very few choices on
Medicare. With an aging
population, better drugs and
wonderful medical technology,
medical care will cost us more.
You either deny care or conclude
that the national medical bill is
going to be higher, because we, as
American voters, want to
consume more care. There isn’t
any rule that says what percentage
of the gross national product
should go to medical care. The
public and the nation decide this
and I think we’ll ultimately decide
that it should be a higher fraction
than it is today. Good health is
worth buying. I spent less of my
personal money on my health at
25, I’m going to spend more at
75. The question is, who’s going
to pay–right now nobody wants to
pay. We want our health, but we
don’t want higher payroll taxes, or
higher Medicare premiums.
Eventually, I believe that we’ll pay
both. Why refuse people medical
care when we’re a rich nation and
can afford it?
RCM Some have suggested that if we
are going to change Medicare we
ought to add a Part D for longterm
care. Do you think people
would be willing to accept more
taxes for health care?
Quinn I think we need to consider taxes
for the basic medical system
before we even begin to think
about long-term care. To me,
long-term care is something
people need to save for or cover
with personal insurance. You save
money all your life to take care of
yourself in your old age. Well,
long-term care is taking care of
yourself in your old age. I think
that should still be a private
responsibility, unless you truly
have no money. I strongly
support the Medicaid program.
I just don’t support people going
on Medicaid artificially.
RCM
The President is looking at a
couple of proposals regarding
(continued on page 7)
6

NAELA News ● August 1999
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 6)
Medicare. One is to lower the
eligibility age and the other is
the issue of coverage of
prescription drugs. What’s your
reaction to those two proposals?
Quinn Lowering the eligibility age:
that proposal would have people
buying into Medicare, so they
would presumably be paying their
own way. It’s for the tens of
thousands of early retirees who
lose coverage before 65. In
theory, it’s a good idea. As long
as you’re paying own way, you’re
not adding to the financing
problems we already have with
Medicare. In practice, unfortunately,
the sick would buy in and
the well might not, so you would
have adverse selection. The
program’s expenses would be
much higher than the government
originally thought. To me,
this is one of the holes in the
fabric that is best cured by
having universal care, so that
everyone is in the insurance
pool. What happens with all
this patchwork coverage is that
we shift our costs around, with
the healthy people trying to
dodge them. That runs up the
price. It creates distortions and
adds to the overhead. Ultimately,
universal care is the
only solution.
RCM This idea of prescription drugs
is very popular.
Quinn Having the government pay for
prescription drugs is highly
popular. Paying for it yourself
is not. They’re probably going
to try to do it. It’s a good idea,
but it’s ultimately going to cost
you, in premiums or taxes. It’s
not going to come free.
RCM Isn’t the possibility of the cost
for the coverage of prescription
drugs huge?
Quinn Yes, it is huge. But I think there
needs to be some coverage of
prescription drugs. When
Medicare started, drugs didn’t
do all the things they do today.
There are all kinds of things
Mark Your Calendars!
The 2000 NAELA Unprogram
will be held
February 11-13, 2000
in
Dallas, TX at the
Embassy Suites, Outdoor World
DFW Airport
Grapevine, TX
For more information, contact Jenifer Mowery,
(520) 881-4005, ext. 114 or
e-mail jmowery@naela.com.
that can be cured with drugs that
were not curable then. Drugs
should be available, but paid for
with taxes and structured as
catastrophic care. Say, you pay
the first $2,000 and the program
pays everything above that.
There are various ways of
designing a drug benefit. But
however you design it, it will
cost money and we’ll have to
pay for it. If taxpayers don’t
want to pay, it shouldn’t be in
the program.
RCM One of the things that we have
seen as a result of the changes in
the Balanced Budget Act with
home care, is a number of
people who are losing their
home care coverage and being
told this happened as a result of
the change in the law. They’re
not eligible for long-term care.
For some of them it’s a crisis.
Do you have any suggestions on
how we could go back into the
Medicare law and change it so
that these folks aren’t going to
get hurt this way?
Quinn I think there needs to be home
care. The Medicaid programs are
not strong enough on home
coverage, and should be
improved. It would be nice to
have this as a larger part of
Medicare, but not if you’re
unwilling to pay for it–in
premiums or taxes. These things
are very clear to me. You can’t
have it if you won’t pay for it.
We’ve got to decide.
RCM Where would you put that in
terms of Medicare; maybe
increase the Part B premium?
Quinn Yes, probably. We’d probably
need higher taxes and higher
premiums. One of the problems
with home care, of course, is the
need for clear definitions.
What, exactly, is essential? What
conditions are reasonable to
handle at home? You can’t just
say, “I’m an old lady. Come and
help me.” You need tough
eligibility standards. Some
people haven’t liked that.
(continued on page 8)
7

NAELA News ● August 1999
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 7)
RCM
In terms of managed care and
HMOs, last year in Congress
both parties had a proposal on
patients’ rights. One of the
differences that was often made
between the Republican
proposal and the Democrat
proposal was that the Democrats’
proposal gave the patients the right
to sue. The managed care HMO
issue is back before Congress this
year and they’re hoping this year to
do something regarding patient
rights. Would you like to see
Congress give patients the right to
sue the managed care plans or the
HMOs?
Quinn I think that the right to sue is not
the ideal solution. However, what
we have now is worse. Today,
managed care can deny you, in
most states, with no accountability.
If they’re wrong, it’s your
problem, not theirs. So there’s an
incentive for plans to say no
more than they otherwise would.
There’s no question about it.
That’s how incentives work.
Lawsuits are not the best solution
because they’re a lottery. Some
people win big tickets, some
Mark Your
Calendar!
NAELA’s Washington State
Chapter will hold its annual
meeting in Seattle, WA on
September 24, 1999.
NAELA President A. Frank
Johns, CELA, will be the
featured keynote speaker.
For more information,
contact meeting chairperson
Janine Lawless at
(206) 782-9535.
people win nothing, some don’t
sue at all. Lawsuits also put
insurers and doctors into a
defensive posture. They hide
records. Nobody can find out
what really happened, because
they’re all looking for the
scapegoat. My preference is
something no one is suggesting:
that’s some form of nofault.
If you are injured in a
hospital, you’d get paid by
your own insurer. There’s a
designed program, defining
what’s covered—rather like
worker’s comp. No-fault would
also encourage hospitals to be
more forthcoming, when
something goes wrong. It’s
usually not one bad doctor or
nurse. It’s a whole system. A
lot of little things go wrong,
with catastrophic results. If
you had no-fault, there would
be more incentive to look at
how these systems work, to
correct these little failures. But
no-fault won’t happen. You
can’t even get it through for
auto insurance, in most states.
That leaves third-party review,
using systems not connected
with or indirectly controlled by,
managed care plans. You need
a lottery or revolving system for
choosing arbitrators. Review has
to be very timely. It has to happen
in 24 hours, when there’s a lifethreatening
case. But I don’t think
you’re going to get a timely review
system, either. So then we come
back to lawsuits, as the only option
even halfway on the table.
RCM Do you think it’s likely we’re going
to get anything this year from this
Congress?
Quinn The normal rule is that nothing
passes in an election year. However,
there was one election year,
maybe it was ’94, when all of a
sudden, lots of things passed,
because the public wanted them.
That could happen again. But it’s
most unlikely that something as
big as Social Security reform
could pass.
RCM So you don’t think we’ll get
Social Security or Medicare
reform this year?
Quinn Well, we’ve had a lot of Medicare
reform already, you know. We’re
in the process of cutting the
growing payments to providers.
The Balanced Budget Act ’97 cut
Medicare by $112 billion
between 1997 and 2002. We’ve
got this experiment with Medicare
called the Part C program.
It started in a few states and will
expand to the rest of them this
year. I don’t think much more is
going to happen now.
RCM: What about the Medicare
Commission?
Quinn They’ve proposed a radical
reform that privatizes Medicare.
It’s similar to something they did
for state retirees in Kentucky.
Retirees were given a lot of
options, for private plans. They
kept their equivalent of Medicare—their
fee-for-service plan.
What happened is just what you’d
expect. The people in good health
went off into the private plans,
the sick people stayed with the
indemnity plan, and the indemnity
plan went broke. The same
thing would happen with
Medicare. People would turn to the
private sector when they were
healthy. When they got sick or
started quarreling with their HMO,
they would go back to the plan.
You would have an even more
screwed up system. There’s a
strong push to privatize everything,
but I think it would be a
bad choice for Medicare. It
would also run up the cost. The
overhead for Medicare is much
lower than the overhead for
private systems. Also, the
government has done a better job
of controlling costs than the
private health system has.
Everyone seems to think that the
government doesn’t know how to
(continued on page 9)
8

NAELA News ● August 1999
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 8)
RCM
do anything. But it offers
universal health care, to people
65 and up. The private system
can’t manage that, for people
under 65. There’s also less
bureaucracy in Medicare. One of
the things that beat the Clinton
health care plan was that chart
showed the incredible bureaucracy
the plan would create. I
was tempted to try to draw a
chart showing the bureaucracy of
all the current overlapping health
care systems, with every insurer
having different rules and forms.
But I couldn’t find a piece of
paper big enough to hold it!
Author’s note: The Medicare
Commission was unable to
reach a consensus on alternatives,
and is no longer meeting.
One last question on health care.
Until I had read your articles, I
wasn’t aware about the independent
advocate for medical care.
Do you think there’s a need for
something like that?
RCM
CONGRATULATIONS
Certified Elder Law Attorneys
The following individuals have recently
completed the requirements to become a
Certified Elder Law Attorney by the National
Elder Law Foundation. Congratulations!
Quinn We’re all looking for something that
would make it possible for people
to make a timely appeal, deal with
denials, have their case looked at
by a disinterested party. Some
people say, “Gee, I want to have
this treatment, because I think it’s
going to be good for me,” but
maybe it isn’t good at all. You
need somebody to say that, whom
you trust. A good example is the
question of bone-marrow transplants
for women with late-stage
breast cancer. The medical
evidence for transplants is dubious.
But it became a huge political issue,
because women were saying
“They’re letting me die. They’re
not giving me this bone marrow
transplant. It’s the last chance to
save my life.” Now, there’s
evidence that bone marrow
transplants work in other types of
cancers, but not necessarily in latestage
breast cancer. Nevertheless,
most HMOs cover it now. The
politics required it. Some states
passed laws saying that it has to be
covered. Maybe that’s right, but
we don’t really know. On issues
like this, people need to believe
that whoever’s making the decision
doesn’t have a conflict of interest,
and is going on medical information,
not the need to keep a bigger
bonus pool.
I want to talk to you about the
future and get your ideas on some
of these issues. We’ve been talking
in our organization for several years
about the future and the changes
not only as the boomers age, but
the changes that are occurring in
the way law is practiced as well.
What you think are going to be the
big issues of facing the elderly in
ten years or twenty years?
Quinn That’s a hard one. I’m not good
with crystal balls. Obviously,
health care will be a huge issue.
Second, a lot of retirees will leave
their companies with very big
401(K)s, and there’s going to be a
whole industry of brokers,
planners, agents, and con men
who will try to take that money
Linda Ershow-Levenberg, CELA
Clark, NJ
Linnea J. Levine, CELA
Stamford, CT
Tracy Speck Neisent, CELA
Oklahoma City, OK
For more information on how to be come a Certified Elder Law Attorney,
contact Brittany Betz at (520) 881-1076, ext. 116, e-mail: bbetz@naela.com.
RCM
away. There will probably be
growth in financial fraud.
Financial fraud has been a big
problem and I think you’re
probably right: as more people
have more money, it’s only going
to grow.
Quinn It’s going to grow tremendously.
The bigger question is–when you
leave the company with your
401(K) check–who do you get to
manage it? That’s the piece that
I’m looking at.
RCM
In terms of the issues and the
problems that are faced both today
and tomorrow by seniors, what role
would the media play helping the
public as we look for solutions to
some of these problems?
Quinn No more than the role it always
plays, which is reporting
information, providing analysis,
bringing ideas to the marketplace
where everybody can discuss
them. That’s our role.
RCM
In 20 years, when some of the
boomers are going to be
retired, who’s going to be in
the nursing home?
(continued on page 10)
9

NAELA News ● August 1999
Exclusive to the NAELA
News: An Interview with
Jane Bryant Quinn
(continued from page 9)
Quinn Why do you think it would be
any different than it is today?
Except maybe they’ll be a little
older than they are today.
RCM
Are they going to be older and
frailer?
Quinn I don’t see why they should be
frailer. Unless we start denying
people health care, we’ll be
healthier longer.
RCM
Okay. About the boomers and our
use of credit cards, do you think it
will change when we are elderly?
Quinn Tell me why you ask that
question. That question
surprises me.
RCM
I think a lot of people use credit
cards to purchase things these
days and while you’re working,
it’s one thing when you have an
income. But once you retire
and your income is based upon
Social Security, your pension,
or whatever, do you think
people will still use credit cards
as freely as they might while
they are working?
Quinn Well, they won’t use them as
freely because their incomes will
be lower. As people get older,
they reduce their debt. There is
evidence now that more people are
paying off credit cards in full, and
credit card debt relative to income
is going down. Total credit card
debt is going up but, relative to
income, it is going down. As
people get older, they pay more
attention to their debts and the
boomers will be no different. But
they will continue to use cards for
convenience. There’s a strong case
for having cards when you’re older.
Buying by catalog or on-line is a
great help to seniors who can’t
easily get out.
RCM
Has there been any research in
whether spending habits change
as you get older?
Quinn Well, yes. There’s a lot–the
government collects data.
Spending habits definitely
change. Peak spending years
are roughly 45 to 55 and then
spending starts to drop. There’s
a point at which you have your
stuff. You don’t need new stuff.
That’s when you start buying
financial security, instead. You
start saving more, investing
more. I can’t give my mother
RCM
anything for Christmas. She
doesn’t want anything. She says
“Why do I need anything more?”
You reach the stage when you
don’t need anything. A new pair
of stockings, that’s all.
What is the most important role
you see that elder law attorneys
play for their clients?
Quinn I’m not sure I can answer that,
because I don’t practice elder
law. Obviously, you tell your
clients what the law is. I guess
I’d suggest that you remind clients
of their social responsibility. To
understand what they should pay
for, versus what the taxpayer
should pay.
Jane Bryant Quinn is an award-winning
columnist for Newsweek, writing on issues
affecting personal finances. Her columns
also appear in the New York Daily News
and Good Housekeeping Magazine. She is
the author of Making the Most of Your
Money, a comprehenisve guide to personal
finance, published by Simon and Schuster
and updated in 1997, and is the author of
the 1978 best-seller, “Everyone’s Money
Book.” An Emmy Award winner, Ms. Quinn
previously worked for CBS News and
recently co-hosted an investment series,
“Beyond Wall Street,” running on the
Public Broadcasting System.
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10

P A I D
A D V E R T I S E M E N T
NAELA News ● August 1999
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11
23

NAELA News ● August 1999
Internet Corner
Using the Internet Can Make
You a Better Elder Law Attorney
by David Goldfarb, Esq.
The Internet has become an indispensable
tool for elder law attorneys. It
provides immediate access to up-to-date
information—although verifying the accuracy
of the information
is up to you. It also
provides a means
of communication
with other
attorneys and
clients.
What You
Need
You of course
need a computer,
Internet access, an e-mail
program, and a Web browser. Today,
it is almost impossible to
buy a computer that does not
have everything you need to
get started using the Internet.
Since surveys show that
most people who buy a computer
for the first time identify
accessing the Internet as a major
reason for their purchase, most
computers make it easy to get online.
So if you have yet to take the plunge in
accessing the Internet, there’s no longer
an excuse not to get online! In this article,
we’re going to show you what the
Internet has to offer the elder law attorney,
and how the Internet can make you
a better elder law attorney.
What You Get
The World Wide Web
The “content” accessible over the
World Wide Web includes government
information, law school libraries, case
databases, and commercial information
sites. Normally you would have to resort
to search engines on the Internet to
locate the material you want to find. But
many legal sites now provide lists of
“links.”
For example, Cornell Law School’s
Legal Information Institute (LII) has a
comprehensive list of many Web resources.
The LII collection of state legal
materials compiles, state by state,
Internet-accessible sources of the constitutions,
statutes, judicial opinions, and
regulations for the 50 states plus
D.C. and the U.S. territories and
affiliated jurisdictions. It is at
http://www.law.
cornell.edu/states/. LII
also provides the United
States Code, Code of
Federal Regulations,
and a method
to search all federal
Circuit Courts of
Appeal. See http://
www.law.cornell.edu/.
American Law Source hosts
ALSO! at http://www.l awsource.com/
also/ that provides a comprehensive
listing of links to
state laws, judicial
opinions,
forms, sources
of commentary
and practice aids.
Here are just
some of the sites on the
Web that are useful to elder
law attorneys.
Information Provided by the
Federal Government:
● Health Care Financing Administration
Information on Medicaid
and Medicare at http://
www.hcfa.gov/
● HCFA’s State Medicaid Manual
for Download in WordPerfect
format at http://www.hcfa.gov/
pubforms/stmcaid/mcaidtoc.htm
● Social Security Administration’s
Handbook at http://www.ssa.gov/
OP_Home/handbook/ssa-hbk.htm
● The IRS home page with
downloadable tax forms and
publications at http://
www.irs.ustreas.gov/plain/
State Specific Material:
● Cornell LII State Specific Material
at http://www.law.cornell.edu/states/
● American Law Source ALSO! at
http://www.lawsource.com/also/
● State Search Service of the National
Association of State Information
Resource Executives (NASIRE) at
http://www.nasire.org/ss/
● The State Court Locator of The
Villanova The Center for Information
Law and Policy at http://
www.cilp.org/State-Ct/
● State Web Locator of The Villanova
Center for Information Law and
Policy at http://www.cilp.org/State-
Agency/index.html
● Municipal Codes Online from
Seattle Public Library at http://
www.spl.org/govpubs/
municode.html
● State Tax Forms from the Federation
of Tax Administrators (FTA) at http:/
/www.taxadmin.org/fta/
FORMS.html
Court Decisions:
● A finder for federal court decisions
is at http://www.law.emory.edu/
FEDCTS/
● The State Court Locator of The
Villanova The Center for Information
Law and Policy at http://
www.cilp.org/State-Ct/Law schools
● ABA List of Law Schools at http://
www.abanet.org/legaled/
ALPHA.HTML
● USC Law School Locator at http://
www.usc.edu/dept/law-lib/librarys/
locators.html
● The University of Kansas School of
Law provides the Kansas Elderlaw
Network (KELN) at http://
www.ink.org/public/keln/
Organizations That Provide
Elder Law Related
Information:
● National Academy of Elder Law
Attorneys at http://www.naela.org/
● National Health Law Program at
http://www.healthlaw.org/
● National Association of Social
Security Claims Representatives at
http://www.nosscr.org/
(continued on page 13)
12

NAELA News ● August 1999
Internet Corner
(continued from page 12)
●
●
●
Bet Tzedek Legal Services
(California) On-Line Guide to
Social Security Programs,
Medicaid and Nursing Home Law
at http://
comquest1.comquest.com/bettzedek/
Nursing Home Abuse and
Neglect Information Center at
http://
www.nursinghomeabuse.com/
Families USA’s Medicaid Clearing
House at http://
www.familiesusa.org/medicaid/
E-Mail
You can use e-mail to stay in touch
with other elder law attorneys and to
communicate with clients. E-mail is an
excellent tool for setting up appointments
and communicating questions. E-
mail is not secure and there may be questions
about whether the attorney-client
privilege attaches to communications
posted on the Internet. Therefore, you
should consider carefully before giving
legal advice or putting confidential communications
in e-mail. There are encryption
programs to insure a degree of privacy
to e-mail, but it is prudent to be
cautious at this stage of Internet development
and not use e-mail for confidential
communications.
If you don’t know someone’s e-mail
address you might be able to find it
though one of these search engines on
the Web:
● WhoWhere? From Lycos at http:/
/www.whowhere.lycos.com/
● Yahoo People Search at http://
people.yahoo.com/
● Internet Address Finder at http://
www.iaf.net
Listservs
Listservs are e-mail communities.
By subscribing to a listserv, you can
send a communication to all members
by just sending one message. You subscribe
by sending a special message to
an e-mail address. Some listservs are
open to anyone; others have restrictions—for
example, NAELA’s listserv
is open only to members. Once you
are subscribed you will receive in your e-
mail program all the messages that are sent
to the listserv. You will also be given an
e-mail address that you can use to post
messages to the listserv. There are a few
listservs where the owner posts messages
and announcements, but you as a subscriber
cannot post messages. These are
usually used for product information and
announcements. Others have strict rules
of etiquette about what can be discussed
and when. You will be sent any special
rules when you first subscribe. Follow
the discussion on the listserv for a few
days before you send a message; otherwise
you can get “flamed” for not following
the listserv’s rules of etiquette.
Information on Legal Listservs:
● Lyonette Louis-Jaques Law Lists at
http://www-user.lib.uchicago.edu/
cgi-bin/law-lists
● Findlaw’s LegalMinds at http://
legalminds.findlaw.com/
Listservs of Interest to Elder
Law Attorneys:
[I have included either websites
where more information about
subscribing can be found or
instructions on how to subscribe.
When following the instructions
below for subscribing, do not
include the quotes (“ “) in your
message.]
● National Academy of Elder Law
Attorneys: see http://
www.naela.org/
● American Bar Association Probate
& Trust Law listserv: send this
message: “subscribe aba-ptl ” to
listserv@home.ease.lsoft.com
● Other ABA Real Property, Probate
& Trust Law Section listservs: see
http://www.abanet.org/rppt/
listservs.html
● American Bar Association Tax
Section: send this message:
“subscribe aba-tax” to
listserver@abanet.org
● Americans with Disabilities Act and
disability related law listserv: send
this message: “subscribe ADA-Law
” to
listserv@vm1.nodak.edu
● Elder Law List: send this message:
subscribe elderlaw-l ” to
listserv@topeka.wuacc.edu
● Estate Planning: send this message:
“subscribe estplan-l” to
listserv@netcom.com
● Health Law: send this message:
“subscribe HealthLaw-L ” to
listserv@lawlib.wuacc.edu
Most of these lists have hundreds
of participants and each of these lists can
add 20 or more messages to your daily e-
mail! For example, the NAELA listserv
for Friday, May 7, 1999, had 75 messages.
Almost all lists provide as an alternative
a “digest” format. This format provides
one daily message containing all of that
day’s traffic. When you subscribe, the
“welcome message” you receive will usually
advise you about switching to the
digest format.
Newsgroups
Newsgroups are discussion groups
that use a newsgroup reader usually provided
with your e-mail reader or browser.
Once you join a newsgroup you can look
at a list of topics and messages that have
been posted and reply by posting your
own message to the discussion. There
are not as many newsgroups dealing with
elder law related topics as there are
listservs.
Sites for Finding Newsgroups:
● DejaNews at http://
www.dejanews.com
● Reference.Com at http://
www.Reference.Com
● List of Newsgroups at http://
www.liszt.com
● Tile.Net at http://www.tile.net/news
The Internet is a “dynamic” resource.
Two warnings: (1) There is no
guarantee of the accuracy of information
on listservs, newsgroups and on the
Web. (2) The content of the World Wide
Web is continually changing and being
updated. Visit your favorite sites frequently,
but make sure the information is
up to date!
David Goldfarb is a partner in the law firm
of Goldfarb & Abrandt in New York, NY.
13

NAELA News ● August 1999
President’s Message
(continued from page 3)
of year in which she has presided. Stuart
Zimring, NAELA’s 1999 Symposium
Chair, had also given inspiring remarks
about two cultural icons to whom he
looked for inspiration. But as I started
into my remarks, Stu, while trying to be
helpful, attempted to pour me a glass of
water, spilling it around the podium and
splashing it on me. I commented that Stu
had a rather creative way of getting the
hook. President Morgan then quipped
Calendar of Events
October 9-13, 1999
The National Guardianship Association’s
Annual Conference, “NGA Leading the
Way: Ethics in Guardianship, 2000 and
Beyond,” Chicago, IL at the Holiday
Inn City Center. Contact Jenifer
Mowery at (520) 881-6561, ext. 114 or
by e-mail at jmowery@mgmtplus.com.
October 21-24, 1999
National Association of Professional
Geriatric Care Managers’ Annual
Conference, “Re-Weaving the Fabric of
Care: New Teams, Options and
Partners,” U.S. Grant Hotel, San
Diego, CA. Contact Jenifer Mowery
(520) 881-8008, ext. 114 or e-mail
jmowery@mgmtplus.com.
November
National Family Caregivers Month. For
more information, contact NFCA (800)
896-3650 or visit www.nfcacares.org.
November 11-14, 1999
The National Academy of Elder Law
Attorneys’ 1999 Advanced Elder
Law Institute, “The Next Millennium
of Service: Sharpening the Cutting
Edge,” Hyatt Regency O’Hare,
Chicago, IL. Contact Jenifer
Mowery (520) 881-4005, ext. 114,
or e-mail jmowery@naela.com.
that I had only two minutes, whereupon
I turned to the group and declared, “If
your honor please, in summation…” I
followed with the following:
Been Thinking About It!
Beyond insomnia, deep in a crevasse
of the night, I’m hardly awake,
barely asleep. The soft, warm hues of
our children’s last nightlight stretch from
the hallway in cubist form, dancing surreal
with my night terrors across the bedroom
ceiling. Shouldn’t be, but here at
the beginning of February, 1999, I can’t
stop thinking about it. Been thinking
about it for months. It has crept into my
mental space since September. Now that
it’s February, I’m bordering on terrified,
afraid that I’m already late for it. So late
that there is no time to say hello,
goodbye. I’m late! I’m late! I’m late!
I know just what it is, when it
started, and who started it. It is that feeling
as the leader of NAELA that it all
goes so fast that there is no time to start,
that there is no time to finish. It started
in September. I was warned that it was
not too early to begin preparing NAELA
goals and objectives for 1999-2000, and
to identify those who should be invited
to accept committee, task force and SIG
chair appointments.
President Rebecca Morgan started
it. With her strengths in organization,
planning and foresight, Becky was experiencing
what so many past presidents
have shared with me is a real
struggle with the NAELA presidential
term. Becky, and Bill Overman before
her, and Ira Weisner, Dan Fish, Clifton
Kruse, Cindy Barrett and Vincent
Russo (those past presidents whom I’ve
been able to call and talk with about the
term of president) all mentioned that
much of their presidential terms were
gone before they started directing the
movement and direction of NAELA. The
ever exceptional teacher, Professor Morgan
took the opportunity to offer instruction
to this willing student. Although
the words “start now” settled in
the folder of my “things to do” memory
file, they actually sprouted seeds of torment
in my gut.
Almost dosed off. But just thinking
that I was about to sleep jolted me back
to it. I opened my eyes enough to rejoin
the surreal dance of images and night
terror, brought on by the tormenting gut
check. My night dance choreography
escalated to constant twisting, tossing
and turning. Anne, disturbed from her
restful sleep, asked what was the matter.
In response to my down played, understated
“can’t sleep,” Anne compassionately
offered advice, hoping that it
would at least return her, if not me, to
sleeping bliss.
My worry is more intense this night
than in December when I last struggled
through this surreal dance. Actually, I
had something to show for that night.
In the middle of that sleepless night, I
outlined the goals and objectives for
NAELA during my term as president. I
prepared the outline as a draft memo to
Becky Morgan, Judy Stein and Laury
Adsit. Now, in its final form, I share it
with all NAELA members.
For months, I contemplated goals
and objectives. My contemplation centered
on three areas: (1) Administrative
- NAELA’s organization and leadership;
(2) Practice Development - NAELA’s direction,
training and education of members
and elder law attorneys in ethics
that impact elder law; and (3) Substantive
Law - NAELA’s focus on the substantive
areas of capacity and guardianship.
Administrative -
NAELA’s Organization
and Leadership
The first area is the business and
organizational function of NAELA, identifying
as a goal improved transition and
transfer of leadership from one year to
the next. With assistance and support
from the NAELA Executive committee,
board, and management team, the objective
of this area is the planning of
continuous NAELA leadership education
and training.
To accomplish this goal, President
Morgan appointed the NAELA Leadership
Task Force, chaired by out-going
immediate past president William H.
Overman. The task force is undertaking
(continued on page 15)
14

NAELA News ● August 1999
President’s Message
(continued from page 14)
a careful examination of possible objectives
that, if achieved, would be the basis
by which we will successfully attain
the goal. Our initial thoughts are more
fully developed in a position paper that
includes the identification of the task
force members. The position paper is
available upon request from NAELA.
Practice Development -
NAELA’s Development, Training
and Education of Members
The second area is the development,
training and education of members,
identifying as a goal renewed examination
of ethics within the elder law practice.
President Morgan appointed
Clifton Kruse to chair NAELA’s Professionalism
Task Force, which will help us
develop NAELA’s position on critical
changes in the ABA Model Rules of Professional
Responsibility that will impact
the practice of elder law. One recommendation
to the task force is a plan that
would effectively present NAELA’s position
to the ABA, and in other forums.
The task force is currently working on a
proposal to develop a NAELA ethics
conference.
Substantive Law - NAELA’s
Focus on Capacity and
Guardianship
The third area represents academywide
interest in NAELA, focusing on the
substantive areas of capacity and guardianship.
The focus involves the examination
of how these subjects are embraced
by practitioners from assessment,
diversion and engagement to litigation,
and expanding the context to the
elder law attorney as guardian, trustee
or estate administrator. Accomplishing
the capacity and guardianship goal has
been initiated through the targeted objective
of re-convening NAELA’s Wingspan
Guardianship Conference Task
Force. Another position paper, further
explaining the goals and objectives in
this area, is available from NAELA.
The challenge of the objectives associated
with each goal requires such
timing, planning and budgeting that the
objectives will not be realized during my
term in office. Hopefully, this advanced
planning, started during President
Morgan’s year and continued through
my term will be NAELA’s goals and objectives
that will be realized for many
years to come.
We invite you to learn the history of
NAELA, to experience the camaraderie
of NAELA’s members and to join in the
challenge that awaits NAELA, it’s members
and elder law attorneys at this turn
of the year, the decade, the century and
the millennium.
At the NAELA Business Luncheon,
Becky Morgan gave the President’s
Award to the National Senior Citizens
Law Center. Burton Fretz, NSCLC Executive
Director, accepted the award with
powerful remarks about the partnership
of NAELA members and NSCLC to advocate
and litigate the elder law issues
of the day, striving to serve older Americans
in the judicial process. As Burton
closed, Anne leaned over to me and commented
that he nailed it.
Laury Adsit, NAELA’s Executive
Director, then delivered the executive
director’s remarks which were unique.
Laury had on her mind and in her heart
concerns about community and the tragedy
that occurred in Littleton, and that
had just happened in Atlanta that day. Her
comments stirred us all. Anne leaned
over to me and said again, “She nailed it.”
Now I must admit I was already anxious
about my remarks. This didn’t help. With
controlled terror, I gave these remarks:
The History, The Spirit, The
Challenge and The Charge
It’s either the end of a long night
Or the beginning of a longer day.
After a day of getting ready to leave
the office
Anne and I have finished a night of
getting ready to leave home.
It’s approaching 2 a.m. as Anne
finishes packing the last of five carry
on bags to take on the flight with
Catherine, Abe and Win.
Add that to the eight huge pieces of
luggage,
the box of sundry mechanical and
entertainment gadgets for a 7-hour
flight,
and three book bags, containing
homework due once they return to
school
and you have a logistical nightmare;
for any one that is but the logistical
general – Anne
We’re heading to San Diego for the
NAELA Symposium
Where we will be reminded of history,
inspired by kindred spirits,
Where we will focus on the challenges,
embrace the commitment and carry
the charge.
The History
The Johns Family
The history of Anne, Catherine, Abe,
Win and me
Has been chronicled through the years
at NAELA events.
When honored at NAELA events, I
have at times invited Anne, Catherine,
Abe and Win to accept the honor with
me.
In 1995, at the symposium in New York,
when inducted as a NAELA Fellow,
I asked Anne to stand, in recognition
with me
As my wife, my children’s mother, my
companion, my lover and best friend.
In 1996, at the symposium in Boston,
When honored as the second Theresa
Award winner
I asked Anne and all my children to
stand, accepting the award as the
Johns family as I spoke about kindred
spirits.
Last year, at the 10th anniversary of
NAELA in the Bahamas,
When elected president-elect of
NAELA,
Anne, Catherine, Abe and Win joined
me in celebration when I noted how
Each of us are kindred spirits in the
NAELA family.
(continued on page 16)
15

NAELA News ● August 1999
President’s Message
(continued from page 15)
This year is no different for my
family and me
Our lantern on the stern shines on
our place in NAELA’s family history,
Shines in our space of kindred spirits,
Guiding us on uncharted paths of
future dreams and direction.
The NAELA Family
The history of NAELA is a showcase
of those who lead the country in
elder law.
From starting the first certification
in elder law;
To legislative advocacy over OBRA
’93 and BBA ’97;
To litigation and amicus advocacy
for the rights of older Americans,
NAELA has labored in all areas of
elder law, providing support for its
members in sustaining and serving
their clients.
From ‘88 to ‘98, the history of
NAELA is an identity forged in the
aging frontier,
Molding the very essence of elder
law;
Defining the scope and the standards
by which elder law is practiced; and,
Creating a conduit through which
elder law attorneys have communicated.
Even more, the history of NAELA is a
continuing convocation of colleagues
Where members return year after year
to receive the invocation of kindred
spirits.
The Spirit
The intuitive notion is that we are
kindred spirits
Do you remember Vincent, Ira and me
The Italian, the Jew and the Arab -
Kindred spirits
In this life joined by magical, mystical,
heavenly spirits
Theresa and Justin
Spiritual intermediaries between our
families and God
Angels who because of faith and belief
Brought the Theresa Foundation to life
?
Brought you here
And guide you
On uncharted paths of future dreams
and direction.
Its the same spirit that embraced the
NAELA founders,
the same spirit that drove NAELA
presidents through the first decade of
NAELA’s leadership.
The same spirit that continues to drive
many of them long after their terms,
Along with Vincent and Ira, consider
Cindy Barrett’s undaunted commitment
to raise and enlighten elder law
attorneys to serve their clients on a
higher plane,
Consider Clifton Kruse’s pastoral,
but powerful admonitions to elder law
attorneys to serve their clients with
compassion ,
Consider Scott Severns’ tireless
charge to elder law attorneys to
advocate and litigate against those
who are abusing, neglecting and
injuring their clients
and consider Allan Bogutz’s practical
wisdom to instill in elder law
P A I D
attorneys a light hearted way to
ground their focus and energies on
their clients
They are kindred spirits, guiding us
on uncharted paths of future dreams
and direction.
The Challenge and The Charge
As NAELA moves into the future
NAELA’s leadership has focused on
the challenges that face NAELA.
I have invited them to accept a
commitment to responsibly perform
their duties, targeting the goals and
objectives presented to NAELA this
morning.
The charge for NAELA’s leadership
and me is to successfully shoulder the
burdens of NAELA’s history and
successes.
We are not alone.
With us always are the kindred spirits
guiding us
on uncharted paths of future dreams
and direction.
Won’t the rest of you join us?
A D V E R T I S E M E N T
Elder Law
Practice Opportunity
URBAN INCOME IN RURAL AREA
Experienced Elder Law Attorney is willing to sell well established and highly productive
practice in growing rural California retirement area to the right person(s). Practice
includes a highly trained and experienced staff, in place production and management
systems (including seven upgraded networked workstations), well established referral
base and an expanding service area in which to grow. Sales price based on gross
income averaged over past three years and training required for buyer(s). Seller is
willing to remain in practice part time and to facilitate smooth and seamless transition.
Purchase requires adequate down and/or collateral. Serious buyers contact Robert
Fleming, 330 N. Granada Ave., Tucson, AZ 85701 [(520) 622-0400/fleming@elderlaw.com].
All inquiries will be handled confidentially.
16

NAELA News ● August 1999
Make Plans to Celebrate National
Family Caregivers Month
Share the Caring in National Family Caregivers Month
Over 25 million Americans provide unpaid, long-term care to loved ones. Caregiving is more than a one-person
job, yet one family member most often caries the responsibility alone says the National Family Caregivers Association.
The NGCA is asking for our help to “Share the Caring” for National Family Caregivers Month in November.
We support the NFCA’s effort to “Share the Caring” and recognize November 1999 as National Family Caregivers
Month. The National Family Caregivers Association reports that family caregivers provide over 90 percent of all longterm
health care in America and that:
● 26 percent of adults provide care to a family member.
● Another 23 percent expect to become a caregiver in the future.
● 75 percent of caregivers are women.
● A 1998 study estimated the value of unpaid health care provided by family caregivers at $196 billion a year.
Reach out – The NFCA asks us to reach out with activities that increase awareness of the roles and needs of
family caregivers in our community.
Recognize and Celebrate – The NFCA asks our help to recognize the contributions of family caregivers in our
community and celebrate with events, communications and activities, during National Family Caregivers Month.
Share the caring – The theme “Share the Caring” asks everyone to join together to find ways to help out family
caregivers with support and services.
NFCA offers suggestions for programs, a community media action kit, educational materials, buttons, posters, tip
sheets and background information for National Family Caregivers Month as well as education and support for family
caregivers. NFCA has also developed model services recognizing caregivers for congregations of all faiths.
NAELA Binders!
The perfect way to store your issues of the NAELA News
and NAELA Quarterly for easy reference.
These new binders–blue for
the NAELA News and maroon
for the NAELA Quarterly –
feature elegant, pre-printed
covers and spines, providing
you with a convenient way to
display your past and future
issues of NAELA
publications.Order your
binders today and you won’t
Yes! I would like to order NAELA News and NAELA Quarterly binders.
Name ____________________________________________________________________________________________
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Return this form to: NAELA, 1604 N. Country Club Road, Tucson, AZ 85716-3102 or
Fax: (520) 325-7925
17

NAELA News ● August 1999
When the Con Artist
Comes: An Attorney’s
Guide to Assisting Elderly
Victims of Interstate Fraud
by Seth Hopkins
Introduction
Each year, over 14,000 illegal
telemarketing schemes rob thousands of
Americans out of $40 billion. Sadly, more
than half of those victims are elderly–the
over 50 group who have often struggled
to accumulate resources necessary to get
them through their retirement years. The
fraudulent operators recognize that the
combination of years of saving and feelings
of vulnerability and isolation creates
easy marks. They may also realize that
many elders are reluctant to contact anyone
about what they perceive as an embarrassing
or misunderstood situation.
This allows the fraud to become more
brazen, since the chances of being reported
and caught
may be relatively
low.
The situation
is not likely to improve.
A quick
glance at demographics
explains
why this type of
crime is lucrative
and how much
more appealing it is
likely to become.
By 2020, aging
baby-boomers will
account for a 71
percent increase in
the elderly population.
By then, one
in six Americans
will be over age 65.
As the number of
older Americans
increases, this problem will grow.
In March, 1999, at a Senate hearing
on “Sweepstakes Fraud,” several witnesses
told heart-wrenching stories of
how their parents and other elderly
Americans were spending thousands of
“Unfamiliar with the
sophistication of
modern advertising,
the victims felt that
they were singled out
to win and gladly
dipped into their
savings for what they
believed was an
inevitable prize.”
dollars per month trying to win sweepstakes
contests which required “entry
fees” and offered ridiculous, if not impossible
odds. One witness complained
that the elderly were convinced of the
legitimacy of the sweepstakes by the
gimmicky brochures and the form letters
with authentic looking personalized
“post-it” notes attached. The witnesses
theorized that the technique was effective
because these victims had grown
up before computers allowed mass production
of “personalized” letters promising
money or prizes. Unfamiliar with
the sophistication of modern advertising,
the victims felt that they were singled
out to win and gladly dipped into their
savings for what
they believed was
an inevitable prize.
The witnesses
speculated that
another reason for
the vulnerability,
was that many of
these Americans
grew accustomed
to doing business
in a world when it
was not important
to read the fine
print. Many elderly
Americans assume
that a
person’s word is
his/her bond.
Congress has
taken the first
steps toward
cracking down on
these types of activities.
One of the legal community’s first
problems in addressing this type of crime
is to make victims feel comfortable coming
forward with their stories. As with
any social challenge, public awareness
is one of the most important tools available.
Local media can expose fraud rings
and common scams. Once a person
comes forward, there are two legal remedies
available: a criminal prosecution
and a civil lawsuit. This article will focus
on the tools available to prosecutors.
The Prosecution:
Statutes Available
Under Federal Law
Because many organizations are
fairly large and cross state borders, federal
law is a particularly appealing forum
in which to prosecute. Since the complexity
of elder fraud is likely to increase
over the years, the vast resources and
expertise of the FBI is well suited to
handle this type of case.
The nature of federal law also makes
it an appropriate tool. Several white collar
statutes overlap, providing multiple
laws to cover similar offenses. If there is
not enough evidence to find a defendant
guilty of one crime, he or she may not be
able to escape another. Furthermore, the
Sentencing Guidelines, which mandate a
punishment range for each type of crime,
provide tougher penalties for those who
victimize a vulnerable person or engage
in telemarketing fraud.
The new Telemarketing Fraud law
strengthens other laws by enhancing
some penalties. It defines “telemarketing”
as requiring at least one interstate telephone
call designed to promote a plan,
program, promotion, or campaign to induce
the purchase of goods or services
or participation in a contest or sweepstakes.
This statute does not apply to
people or companies who solicit sales by
mailing a catalog that:
1. Contains a written description or
illustration of the goods or
services offered for sale.
2. Includes the business address of
the seller;
3. Includes multiple pages of written
material or illustration; and
4. Has been issued at least once a
year.
Congress provided severe penalties
for those who commit telemarketing
(continued on page 19)
18

NAELA News ● August 1999
When the Con Artist Comes:
An Attorney’s Guide to
Assisting Elderly Victims of
Interstate Fraud
(continued from page 18)
fraud, especially when older Americans
are victimized. 18 U.S.C. 2326 lists several
crimes provides that a violation of
shall result in imprisonment of up to five
additional years if the offense was in
connection with telemarketing activities,
and provides that the offender shall receive
up to an additional ten years if he
or she victimized 10 or more persons
over the age of 55 or targeted specifically
persons over the age of 55.
Mail fraud is one of the most significant
underlying crimes listed in 18
U.S.C. 2326. Mail and wire fraud punish
those who use the mails or wires to
further any scheme to defraud. The mail
fraud statute fails to define fraud, opening
the floodgates to prosecution of anything
that violates society’s concept of
fair play in business dealings. A recent
amendment defines a “scheme or artifice
to defraud” as a scheme to “deprive
another of the intangible right of honest
service.” This may suggest that the deprivation
of property is no longer required
under the statute. Of course, a defendant
may claim that he or she was merely
“puffing,” a common advertising practice
of promoting a product or service.
Even if your client loses money to
what is generally believed to be a legitimate
enterprise, such as a sweepstakes,
it never hurts to ask the prosecutor to
evaluate the sweepstakes advertisement
against the standards for mail and wire
fraud.
Rights of Victims
Several federal statutes provide for
victims rights. For example, 42 U.S.C.
§ 10607 specifically requires federal
prosecutors to notify victims at different
stages of an investigation and prosecution.
Each U.S. Attorney’s Office
has a victims’ rights coordinator to assure
compliance with the statutes and
to help victims and their families understand
the criminal judicial process.
It is important that your client be aware
of this service and inform the proper
official that he or she would like to take
advantage of this resource.
By law, a victim must be notified at
the earliest possible time of
1. the status of the investigation of
the crime, to the extent it is
appropriate to inform the victim
and to the extent that it will not
interfere with the investigation;
2. the arrest of a suspected offender;
3. the filing of charges against a
suspected offender;
4. the scheduling of each court
proceeding that the witness is
either required to attend or, under
section 10606(b)(4) of this title, is
entitled to attend;
5. the release or detention status of
an offender or suspected offender;
6. the acceptance of a plea of guilty
or nolo contendere or the rendering
of a verdict after trial; and
7. the sentence imposed on an
offender, including the date on
which the offender will be eligible
for parole.
During court proceedings, the U.S.
Attorney’s Office must provide a victim
with a waiting area removed from and out
of sight and hearing of the defendant and
defense witnesses. After trial, the office
must provide the earliest possible
notice of any scheduled parole hearing
the escape, work release, furlough, or
other form of release from custody, and
the offender’s death, if he or she dies in
custody.
Restitution
Federal law provides an opportunity
for victims to obtain restitution in conjunction
with a criminal prosecution, the
government world exerts. As resources
to collect the money and the victim usually
would be entitled to at least the
amount that he/she lost.
The United States Code’s Restitution
Statute (18 U.S.C.§ 3663) provides
that victims of enumerated crimes (or
their estates) may, by court order, receive
restitution from the defendant.
The order is given during the sentencing
phase, and is determined based on a
number of factors, including: the loss
sustained by each victim as a result of
the offense, the financial resources, financial
needs and earning ability of the
defendant and the defendant’s dependents
and such other factors as the court
deems appropriate. The statute suggests
that the court may order a defendant to
return any lost property or pay the value
of the property on the date of loss or
sentencing. The statute also allows restitution
by a plea agreement, which is
another important opportunity for a
victim’s attorney to become involved in
the process.
A special statute applicable to
telemarketing fraud makes restitution for
certain crimes mandatory. The amount
of restitution shall be the “full amount of
the victim’s losses” which includes all
losses proximately caused by the crime.
The court is not required to consider the
defendant’s economic circumstances or
any other compensation that the victim
will receive.
Special Considerations
Helping older clients who have been
victimized by fraud can be difficult. Loss
of pride, chronic illness, mistrust of the
legal system, and a feeling of fault may
arise due to the fraud. Furthermore, if
the case is prosecuted, the civil attorney
is often unfamiliar with the federal criminal
process. As this type of fraud continues
to grow, it is important to keep in
mind that several federal statutes are
designed to help. As an attorney is civil
practice, you can urge the district attorney
or U.S. Attorney to press for the
maximum restitution available. More importantly,
you can explain to your client
what his or her rights may be and the
potential consequences of the prosecution.
By knowing what resources are
available, you can better advise older
clients who come to you seeking justice.
Seth Hopkins is a judicial law clerk in Lake
Charles, LA,. and a recent graduate of the
Louisiana State University Law Center. He
has worked in the United States Attorney’s
Office, Louisiana Attorney General’s Office,
United States Congress, and the White
House. Additionally, he is a private pilot
and former college newspaper editor who
enjoys travel, writing, and working to form
a business to help trial attorneys prepare
their opening statements.
19

NAELA News ● August 1999
PERIPATETIC
ESSAYIST
“Living Art”
by Clifton B. Kruse, Jr., Esq.
A small
adobe home,
dirty white with
blue accents surrounding
two
small windows,
old and enduring
stood picturesque
at the top
of a steep incline,
100 yards north Clifton B. Kruse, Jr.
of the one-lane
dirt road where I’d parked my car. It was
precisely 3:00 o’clock and my client, a
tiny 92-year-old widow, was standing in
its doorway, leaning on a walker, the kind
that has wheels on its front pedestals. A
cell phone was laying in a basket-carrier
strapped onto the front brace. She
was waiting for me, and had her phone
with her in the event I called to cancel.
“You could have driven up,” she said
as I approached, but that was not the
instruction she had given to me by phone
earlier that day. “Park on the dirt road,”
she’d said, “and walk up the hill to the
adobe. Don’t go to the big house to the
west,” she’d instructed. The great house
was used only for storage these days. It
held her large art collection–one numerous
charities in the city knew about and
coveted.
Her two homes were hidden on 37
acres of hilly, rocky soil north of the
state university, a homestead she’d
purchased after leaving Indiana soon
after her graduation from college
there. She’d built the adobe in which
she now lived. But that was long ago,
near three quarters of a century, and
now the tiny hovel, suffering from
both age and inattention looked
humble, and appeared unsafe.
“Take the interstate until you
reach High Bluffs Parkway, turn right,
east, until you see Vulture Haven
Road; it’s gravel. Go three-quarters of
a mile north until you come to the
© Clifton B. Kruse, Jr.
three branches in the road. Take the
left branch. It’s a dirt road; go a few
hundred yards until you see my place.”
At that point she’d told me to park on
the single lane in front of her home–
the adobe - and walk up the hill. I
obeyed. She’d given clear instructions
confidently, and had obviously described
this same route to others. She
has it down pat. The “branches” she
described, however, were not like a
three-hole candelabra. The first branch,
wandering northward was a full block
from the second, a roadway to the right
which headed back in the direction of
the city. I didn’t continue forward to
find the third, but rather headed back to
the first turn, branch one, I assumed.
Why hadn’t she said, “Take the first
left?” It had been more than awhile
since she’d been on the road, I imagined,
and she’d compressed the
distance among these options in her
memory. It’s time again for her to
revisit the long dirt road entrance to
her home and recompose the
instructions. But I’d left the
office early knowing of
my own navigational
deficiencies, so I
wasn’t late.
Inside the
adobe was one
large room. It
held a stained
hardwood table, her
desk, where she read and
took her meals. Condiments and a rather
new deck of playing cards and piles of
mail, her filing arrangement for letters
she couldn’t discard, took up most of the
table’s surface, but she’d cleared a space
for me, room enough for my yellow legal
pad.
My client’s bed was three feet to the
right of the table-desk and was being
used today, at least, as an extension of
the hardwood. Small piles of papers that
I might ask to see were laid neatly on
the blanket that served also as the
spread.
The home’s single room contained
a small refrigerator and an apartmentsize
stove. Two baskets of canned goods
were on the floor; stove, refrigerator
and the larder were all in a windowless
nook that jutted out from what was otherwise
a small, rectangular house, behind
and to the right of the desk, her
kitchen space. A closed door near the
bed I surmised was the home’s bath. An
overstuffed chair was to the right of the
door. But that’s all there was. From
where I was seated I could see everything
in the home, and it looked to me
like a child’s perfect playhouse. There
were a few pictures nailed onto the
walls, but nothing I would call art, and
certainly nothing that mirrored the photographs
of the art collection that decorated
the main house. The photos had
been recently taken by the appraiser.
His report, a thick volume, perhaps two
inches in an 8˚ x 11 notebook, was on
the bed. We looked at the photographs
and I enjoyed her collection vicariously,
as did she. It is now impossible for her
to make her way down the hill to the
dirt drive, and up another stony grade
to the home where she and her husband
had lived–the hideaway for her precious
collection. The photographs
and her memories
were enough now. I saved
for another visit the
story she must have
about the art. She
made no offer to
discuss it. Her
existing will
provided for its
next home–a provision
that was to be reaffirmed
in the draft of what may, in
truth, really be her Last Will, the one I
am now to create. Lifetime gifts of the
paintings to her charities which would
result in income tax benefits to her now
were not broached; her paintings,
hoarded in the big house were her stillinfant
children. For undiscussed and
not disclosed reasons it was obvious to
me that her great prizes, notwithstand-
(continued on page 21)
20

NAELA News ● August 1999
“Living Art”
(continued from page 20)
ing their vulnerability to loss if kept in
the now abandoned two-story–were not
to be disturbed. “Insured?” I asked. But
she didn’t answer, and changed the subject;
I resolved to put this in a letter to
her, perhaps the one that will accompany
the will draft. I suspect that it’s
the expense; she knows the cost of insuring
valuable art, but the option to gift
the paintings now is unpalatable, forcing
as it would, a recognition of her own
mortality because the art is not to be
disturbed before she dies, and the discomfort
that follows one’s own children
leaving home that she would experience.
Her brood is not yet mature–
not ready to be separated from her.
Given now, their susurration would be
gone and her life would be different. In
her simple little hovel-house the
knowledge that her art is nearby, not
gone, still needing her protection, is
comforting, and gives her life purpose.
Her children require her vicarious
attention, her patronage, the protection
that she gives them in her large, private
safe-box, the big house, close to her, near
her watchful eye.
Her importance is identified with her
possessions, her prizeful art, and childless,
she sees her paintings as though
they are animate, requiring her attention,
valuable to her, not solely because of
their intrinsic worth, but because they
are hers, and as time has passed, others
have become attracted to them and want
them, but that moment, the time when
they leave her home - is hers to control
and will be measured by the date
of her death.
Her children are like jewels in her
private safe, unworn, unseen–sightlessly
retained, and the knowledge that
they are hers is sustaining. They belong
to her alone and only she can hear their
quiet whispers. Intimacy with them,
touching, fondling, and caressing them
is unnecessary. Possession alone,
knowing they are hers is enough.
We finished viewing the art book,
the photographs of her great collection
of magnificent paintings. She closed
the notebook’s cover, in which the image
of each painting was protected with
clear cellophane, and she closed the
cover with great pride. She is putting her
children to bed–an obvious metaphor. The
book had been open when I arrived.
I smiled at the tiny one. Perhaps 70
pounds, my client is thin. She’s wearing
a clean house dress and Reeboks TM . Her
white hair is braided into two pigtails,
tied with rubber bands about an inch
above the stubs. These ends are rounded
like inverted Japanese fans, not straight
cut, but in semi-circles, laying on each
side of her neck and accenting her pretty
face. “You are a picture,” I said. “Living,
art,” she replied smiling, and she
was not alone referring to herself–a
bright one, she.
Meet the NAELA
Communications
Department!
Putting a face to NAELA is a job well-suited for NAELA’s Communication
Director Jihane Rohrbacker and her sidekick Carolyn Smith. Together they
tackle challenges which include putting together the NAELA News and NAELA
Quarterly, (it’s not as easy as you think!) creating all NAELA brochures and
promotional materials, writing press releases, handling media relations and planning
for National Elder Law Month! Whether it’s a publications meeting or a
public relations extravaganza–this dynamic duo is ready to launch NAELA into
the next millennium!
Jihane K. Rohrbacker
If NAELA needed an international correspondent,
Jihane would be the best candidate. Born in Beirut, Lebanon,
Jihane speaks more languages than the NAELA
staff put together and has a wealth of knowledge and
appreciation for different cultures and ways of life. Before
coming to NAELA six years ago, she worked for
the National Speakers Association in Phoenix, after attending
Arizona State University, where she obtained
her journalism degree with an emphasis in public relations.
More recently, she and husband Dave welcomed
their first child, Daniel Allen Rohrbacker–the delight of their lives. When Jihane
retires she says she wants to travel the world. If she’s fueled with a steady provision
of sushi and chocolate and has baby Daniel in his traveling gear, we
think she’ll succeed.
Carolyn A. Smith
Our resident photographer, Carolyn’s interests
range from working on stained glass pieces, taking
fabulous photographs on her travels, dancing, caring
for her colorful collection of fish, and following the
ever-interesting political scene in the United States and
abroad. Carolyn is a graduate of the University of Arizona,
where she obtained her bachelor’s degree in journalism
and political science, and attended the School
for International Training in Geneva for a semester.
Her eclectic fashion awareness and sharp sense of humor liven up our days! An
avid reader and prolific writer, she hopes to someday travel the world, set up
camp on a deserted beach and write short stories.
21

NAELA News ● August 1999
Members in the News
NAELA was mentioned in the following
publications:
● The Hartford Courant, in the May
9, 1999 issue, in the article “Find
Out What Those ’84 Shares Are
Worth.”
● Journal Star, in the May 24, 1999
issue, in the article “Older &
Wiser.”
● Kiplinger’s Retirement Report, in
the June, 1999 issue, in the article
“Why Medicaid Should Be a Last
Resort.”
● The Sante Fe New Mexican, in the
June 4, 1999 issue, in the article
“Discuss Elder Care Before It’s
Needed.”
● Sun Journal, in the June 6, 1999
issue, in the article “Good Care of
Elderly Is in the Planning.”
● Daily Southtown, in the June 13,
1999 issue, in the article “Planning
Another’s Finances.”
● Standard Observer, in the June 14,
1999 issue, in the article “People’s
Longer Life Expectancies Increase
Need for Assisted Living.”
● Winthrop News, in the June 16,
1999 issue, in the article “Longer
Life Expectancies, Assisted
Living.”
● The Progress, in the June 16, 1999
issue, in the article “Newly
Published Directory Lists Elder
Law Attorneys.”
● North Penn Life, in the June 17,
1999 issue, in “News Briefs.”
● The Herald, in the July 4, 1999
issue, in the article “Options for
Finding an Elder Law Attorney.”
Donna Bashaw, CELA, was quoted
in the June, 1999 issue of Parent Care
Advisor, in the article “When Should an
Elder Law Attorney Be Consulted?”
which also mentioned NAELA. She was
also quoted in the June 4, 1999 issue of
the Broward Daily Business Review, in
the article “Lawyers for Elderly, and Their
Caregivers, Find Increasing Reasons to
Cooperate,” which also mentioned Stuart
Zimring. The same article appeared in
the June 4, 1999 issue of the Palm Beach
Daily Business Review and the June 4,
1999 issue of the Miami Daily Business
Review. It also appeared on the Cal Law
website on May 24, 1999.
William J. Browning, CELA, was
mentioned in the June 21, 1999 issue of
The Columbus Dispatch, as the new secretary
of NAELA.
Nancy Busch was mentioned in the
May 29, 1999 issue of The Times News,
in the article “Elderly In the
Dark About Financial
Issues.”
R o b e r t
Clofine was
quoted in the Summer
1999 issue of Fortune
Magazine’s Technology
Buyer’s Guide in an article
dealing with estate planning information
on the internet.
Michael H. Erde was recently appointed
to serve as the chair of the Asset
Protection Committee of the Chicago
Bar Association for 1999-2000.
Ronald Fatoullah, CELA, was
quoted in the May 22, 1999 issue of
Newsday, in the article “Elderly Fear Liens
May Hang Overhead.”
Paul F. Fortunato was mentioned in
the May 26, 1999 issue of the Wilmington
Town Crier as a new NAELA member.
Laurence S. Graham, A. Frank
Johns, CELA, Bailey Liipfert, III, CELA,
Christine Sylvester and Jan Warner
were quoted in the June 2, 1999 issue of
The Chicago Tribune, in the article “A
New Breed of Lawyer for the Elderly.”
The article also referenced NAELA and
NELF for resources and has appeared in
various publications since it first appeared
in late April.
Harold L. Grodberg, CELA, was
mentioned in the May 25, 1999 issue of
The Jersey Journal, as a Certified Elder
Law Attorney by the National Elder Law
Foundation.
Sharon Kovacs Gruer, CELA, was
mentioned in the June 3, 1999 issue of
the Great Neck Record, as a Certified
Elder Law Attorney by the National Elder
Law Foundation.
A. Frank Johns, CELA, was
quoted in the June 13, 1999 issue of News
& Record, in the article “Attorneys Specialize
in Needs of Elderly,” which also
used NAELA as a resource.
John F. Kearns, III, CELA, was mentioned
in the
June 21, 1999
issue of The
Connecticut
Law Tribune,
as a board member
of NAELA. The same
article also mentioned
Judith A. Stein as presidentelect
of NAELA.
Michael A. Kirtland was mentioned
in the May 30, 1999 issue of the Montgomery
Adviser as a new NAELA member.
Marilyn Kressel wrote “All It Takes
is Planning: Averting the Crisis of Incompetence
in an Elderly Family Member,”
for the May 26, 1999 issue of The Montgomery
Journal.
Bernard A. Krooks, CELA, was
mentioned in the May 30, 1999 issue of
The New York Times, in “The Elderly and
the Law,” which publicized his seminar
for National Elder Law Month.
Harry Margolis was quoted in the
May 7, 1999 issue of The Columbus Dispatch,
in the article “Man Suing Nursing
Home Over Bill For His Mother’s Care.”
Julia Merkt was quoted in the June
4, 1999 issue of USA Today, in the article
“Caring for Another’s Finances,” which
also mentioned NAELA. The same article
appeared in the June 6, 1999 issue of the
Detroit News. She was also mentioned
in the June 20, 1999 issue of the El Paso
Times, as a NAELA Board Member.
(continued on page 23)
22

NAELA News ● August 1999
Members in the News
(continued from page 22)
Rebecca Morgan was featured in
the Spring, 1999 issue of the ABA’s
Bifocal newsletter, which also contained
the article “Survey of State Emergency
Medical Services Do-Not-Resuscitate
Laws,” by Charles P.
Sabatino and “Bar Profile: Connecticut
Bar Association’s Elder Law Attorneys
Enter 21 st Year,” by Lea
Nordlicht Shedd.
Gerald J. Mullaney, Sr. was mentioned
in the May 13, 1999 issue of the
Hearthstone Town and Country, for
providing free consultations on estate
planning as part of National Elder Law
Month.
Kerry R. Peck was featured in the
June, 1999 issue of the Chicago Lawyer,
as the new president of The Chicago Bar
Association and in the June 21, 1999 issue
of the Chicago Daily Law Bulletin.
Steven C. Perlis was mentioned in
the June 17, 1999 issue of Hanover Park
Daily Herald, Barrington Daily Herald
and the Mount Prospect/Prospect
Heights Daily Herald as a 1999-2000
board member of NAELA. The same article
appeared in eight other publications
that day.
Dana Rozansky was mentioned in
the June 16, 1999 issue of The South
Bergenite, in the article “NJSBF Offers
Financial Seminar.”
Peter Strauss wrote “Peter Strauss
Makes the Complexities of Home Health
Care Very Simple,” for the July, 1999 issue
of Bottom Line Tomorrow.
Jake Thomas Townsend was mentioned
in the May 21, 1999 issue of The
Union Democrat as a new NAELA member.
Daniel O. Tully was quoted in the
April 18, 1999 issue of The Hartford
Courant, in the business column titled
“Matt’s Money Talk.”
John Wargo, CELA, was mentioned
in the June 13, 1999 issue of The Journal
Times, as a 1999-2000 board member of
NAELA.
SOCIAL SECURITY RETIREMENT
AND SURVIVORS BENEFITS
1999 FIGURES*
Many figures used to calculate Social Security Retirement and Survivors
Benefits are revised annually, as are the figures used to determine the
insured status of the worker and how much a retired worker may earn.
Tax Rate for employee and employer
7.65 percent each
Tax rate for self-employed
15.30 percent
Maximum annual income subject to Social Security Tax $72,600
Quarter of coverage
$740 equals one quarter of coverage
Retirement earnings test exempt earnings limit: age 65 to 69
$15,500 per year
Retirement earnings test exempt earnings limit: under age 65
$9,600 per year
Maximum benefit at 65 with maximum earning history
$1,373 per month
Maximum benefit at 65 with average earning history
$953 per month
Maximum benefit at 65 with low earning history
$577 per month
*from the AARP’s foundation 1999 annual update
23

NAELA News ● August 1999
Dealing With the Media —
the NAELA Way!
by Jihane K. Rohrbacker
NAELA COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR
A local reporter has just called you
to discuss elder law in your community.
You give her some information on your
practice, the growth of the field in your
locale and some typical cases you deal
with. Or she may be interested in your
comments on a new law affecting seniors.
In either case, you should also
introduce the reporter to NAELA and
integrate what NAELA has to offer into
the story. We’re here to help you do
just that! Whenever you are contacted
by a reporter, be sure to call me at (520)
881-4005, ext. 115 or by e-mail at:
jrohrbacker@naela.com, so that I may follow
up with the reporter and send her a
NAELA Media Kit, which includes a variety
of materials on NAELA and elder
law in general.
Following are some tips
to help you make the
most out of an interview
with a reporter.
Speaking About NAELA
Use of Name
In an effort to be consistent in how
we refer to the National Academy of Elder
Law Attorneys, we suggest you use
the full name the first time it is referred to
and then “NAELA” or “The Academy”
thereafter.
Materials Available to Consumers
NAELA offers consumers a free brochure
entitled “Questions and Answers
When Looking for An Elder Law Attorney.”
We ask consumers to send their
requests with a self-addressed stamped
envelope. Don’t forget that the NAELA
Website, at www.naela.org, is a great
source of information as well.
Referrals
NAELA does not run a referral service
for elder law attorneys. NAELA
does not give out names of attorneys
over the telephone, but consumers may
purchase the NAELA Consumer Directories
at $15 each. They are printed by
the following regions: West, Midwest,
East and Southeast. NAELA members
are listed by state within each region.
Dealing with the Media
What are some of the things you
should be aware of if you are called by
the media for an interview?
Phone Interviews
● If you are not prepared to be
interviewed on the spot, ask the
reporter if his or her deadline
allows you to set up a call the next
day, thus giving you time to
gather materials and information
you may need during the interview.
Be aware that in most cases,
reporters are on tight deadlines
and may not be responsive to
such a request; if that is the case,
be amicable and do your best!
● If you have the chance to schedule
another call, you should:
●
●
●
●
Ask the reporter what the
general direction of the interview
will be. How long can you expect
the interview to take? If it is a
radio interview, is it live or edited?
Call the NAELA office to request
a media kit if one has not already
been sent to the reporter.
Determine what kind of questions
you are likely to be asked:
general, about industry trends,
about your business, about
specific cases, etc. Focus your
preparation.
Be clear and concise: Place your
most important points at the
beginning of each response,
where they will be clear and
isolated; i.e. Don’t say “there are
several reasons why elder law
attorneys are in demand.” Start
with, “The aging of the baby
boomers and need for legal
services are two of the reasons
why elder law attorneys are in
demand.”
Television Interviews
● Research the interviewer’s
approach. Watch him or her and
notice the reporter’s style of
questioning.
● Practice expressing ideas in
simple, everyday terms.
● Tape yourself making key points.
It could come as a shock that you
talk much faster or slower than
you think you do!
● Arrive at the television station in
plenty of time to relax and prepare
for your interview.
● Forget the camera once you are
in the television studio and
seated. Talk as if you’re speaking
to a friend who needs to hear
your message.
● Look the reporter in the eye
while you are speaking. This will
help you develop a conversational
rapport with him or her.
● Think in sound bites. If you’re
being interviewed for a regular
news story your comments will
be edited. Only about 15 or 20
seconds worth of your words will
actually make it on the air.
Therefore, think about the
essence of your remarks and get
to the bottom line quickly.
● Let the focus be on you, not your
clothing: wear solid colors;
pastel shades or off-white for
shirts and blouses; avoid large
prints or patterns; avoid black
and white or shiny fabrics, noisy
or shiny jewelry or overwhelming
scarves or ties.
Radio Call-In Show Interviews
Unlike television, where the viewer
is influenced by sight and sound as well
as your message, radio depends only
(continued on page 25)
24

NAELA News ● August 1999
Dealing With the Media —
the NAELA Way!
(continued from page 24)
on audio to create mental images for its
listeners. Delivery is extremely important;
you must rely totally on your tone of voice
to emphasize key points in answering the
host’s questions.
● Always be on your toes. It is often
difficult to determine whether a
caller has finished his questions or
if he is simply pausing and intends
to continue. You must not allow
too much time to lapse before
answering, but neither should you
be hasty and possibly interrupt a
complete question or thought.
● Do not let the caller “bully” you
into giving specific comments on
the telephone. Often a reporter
needs confirmation of a particular
viewpoint or position–take time to
think about what response you feel
comfortable giving and respond
confidently.
● At some time, you may be asked to
do a “beeper” interview. This is a
very brief one or two-minute tape
that will be broadcast at an undetermined
time or date. The interview
usually consists of only one
question and answer. These are
valuable to the radio station
because they can be used as
“filler.” They are valuable to you
because they are often re-used,
keeping you in the media arena for
a long time.
Follow up
It is very important that you send the
reporter a letter or note within a week after
your interview. In your note, you
should not only express your gratitude
for the opportunity to be interviewed, but
also offer yourself as a future source.
If you have some ideas for future
stories, include them in the letter. Also
report on any reaction you received from
those who read, saw or heard the piece.
Dealing With A Hostile Reporter
● Never say “no comment.” It
implies guilt or coverup.
● Don’t let the reporter put words in
your mouth. If you don’t like the
●
●
●
way a question is stated, don’t
repeat the question in your
response — even to deny it.
Example: If a reporter asks if your
services are overpriced, don’t say
“I wouldn’t use the term overpriced.”
You just did! Instead, say:
“I believe our services provide high
value for the price.”
Don’t answer hypothetical questions.
If you absolutely have to,
make sure you label your answer as
hypothetical by saying something
like, “that is a very interesting
hypothetical question. Though I’ve
never been in such a situation,
hypothetically I would say that the
best way to handle that situation
would be to...”
Don’t become defensive. Even if
an interviewer is rude or hostile,
never sink to his or her level. You
can never win by getting into an
argument, especially if the
interviewer can edit the tape.
Be wary of statistics. Don’t
assume that the interviewer is
using the correct statistics. If you
have doubts, ask about the source
of the statistics and express your
interest in seeing a copy of them.
●
●
●
●
●
●
●
●
If a reporter fires a number of
questions at you without letting
you answer any of them completely,
politely say that you
would like to answer them in an
orderly fashion. Then choose
whichever question you feel most
comfortable with and start with
that one.
Your Participation is
Crucial to Our Success
Exposure in the local or national media
not only has a trigger effect in that it
often results in further exposure but it
also has an effect on requests for membership
and referrals as was most visible
with the Family Circle article earlier this
year, which generated more than 8,000
inquiries!
Remember, NAELA does not have
access to all media outlets that publish
stories related to elder law. Although reporters
are asked to send a copy of the
article to national, it does not always
happen. We therefore rely heavily on
members’ sending copies of articles or
alerting us of upcoming pieces being
published. So, be sure to send us a copy
of any articles that mention you or
NAELA.
Interviewing Dont’s
Don’t start answering before the host has finished his or her
question.
Don’t try to include everything in one answer.
Don’t say anything you wouldn’t want to see in print or hear
played back. If you have the slightest doubt, do not say what you are
thinking of saying!
Don’t get distracted by the cameras, lights and people during the
interview.
Don’t gesture wildly. Keep your movements natural, but controlled.
Keep your hands away from your face and mouth. Don’t run your
fingers through your hair or rub them together.
Don’t bluff. If you are not prepared to answer or don’t know the
answer to a question, say so.
When you are speaking on behalf of NAELA, remember that you
are representing the Academy, so do not fall into the trap of giving
your personal opinion unless it is NAELA’s viewpoint.
25

NAELA News ● August 1999
Noncitizen Eligibility For
Social Security and
Supplemental Security
Income Benefits
by Ethel Zelenske, Esq.
NATIONAL SENIOR CITIZENS LAW CENTER
The Balanced Budget Act of 1997
(BBA) 1 included several significant fixes
that undo some of the more serious restrictions
imposed by the Personal Responsibility
and Work Opportunity Reconciliation
Act of 1996 (PRWORA), 2
which affected noncitizen eligibility for
Supplemental Security Income (SSI) and,
to a lesser extent, for Social Security benefits.
This article provides a brief summary
of the current eligibility rules governing
noncitizen eligibility for Social
Security and SSI benefits after BBA ‘97.
I. Social Security Eligibility
Title II Social Security benefits are
payable only to an “alien who is lawfully
present in the United States as determined
by the Attorney General” or to
noncitizens receiving payment pursuant
P A I D
to a treaty or totalization agreement. The
provision limiting payment applies only
to benefits payable based on applications
filed on or after December 1, 1996. 3 The
limitation applies to dependents as well
as to wage earners filing for Title II benefits.
The Attorney General issued regulations
defining the “lawfully present”
provision for Title II purposes. 4 The definition
is much broader than the categories
of noncitizens eligible for SSI (discussed
below) and includes: “qualified
aliens” as defined in 8 U.S.C. § 1641; persons
who have been inspected and admitted
into the United States and have
not violated the terms of their status; persons
who have been paroled into the
United States pursuant to section
212(d)(5) of the Immigration and
A D V E R T I S E M E N T
Technology & Practice
Management Consulting
Wondering how to use technology
to better manage your elder law practice?
GET ADVICE FROM PRACTICING ELDER LAW ATTORNEYS!
Services include on-site evaluation of your technology needs,
management structure, and recommendations that will
result in a more productive practice. See results instantly.
Don’t delay – contact us today!
Robert B. Fleming, CELA ● 520/622-0400
fleming@elder-law.com
Timothy L. Takacs, CELA ● 615/824-2571
ttakacs@tn-elderlaw.com
Naturalization Act for less than one year;
noncitizens admitted for humanitarian or
other public policy reasons (seven categories
are listed); and noncitizens who
have applied for asylum or withholding
of deportation and who have been granted
employment authorization.
II. Similar to the payment restrictions
for Title II benefits, the BBA limits
eligibility for Medicare and Railroad
Retirement Act benefits to persons
“lawfully present” in the United
States. 5
Supplemental Security Income
Eligibility
For SSI, an individual must be a
citizen 6 of the United States or a
noncitizen in certain, restricted
immigrant categories. Since the
recent statutory changes have
significantly complicated SSI
eligibility for noncitizens, the
process should be considered in two
steps:
1. Step One: The “Qualified Alien”
Requirement
Since the enactment of PRWORA, all
noncitizens are divided into two
general categories: (1) “qualified
aliens” and (2) everyone else, known
as “nonqualified aliens.” As a
threshold requirement, a noncitizen
must fall into a “qualified alien” (QA)
category to be eligible for most
federal benefits, including SSI. This
requirement must be met before
considering any further eligibility
requirements. The former SSI
category of “persons residing under
color of law” (PRUCOL) was
eliminated in PRWORA.
The “qualified alien” categories are
set by statute 7 and include only
those noncitizens: (1) lawfully
admitted for permanent residence
(LAPR); (2) admitted to the U.S. as
refugees; (3) granted asylum
(asylees); (4) “paroled” into the U.S.
for at least one year; (5) granted
withholding of deportation; (6)
granted “conditional entry”; (7) who
are “Cuban/Haitian Entrants”; or (8)
who meet the “battered spouse or
(continued on page 27)
26

NAELA News ● August 1999
Noncitizen Eligibility For
Social Security and
Supplemental Security
Income Benefits
(continued from page 26)
child” definition under Department
of Justice guidelines.
The only nonqualified aliens who
continue to be eligible for SSI are
those who were “receiving” SSI as
PRUCOLs on August 22, 1996. 8
2. Step Two: Which Qualified Aliens
Are Eligible for SSI?
Being a “qualified alien” alone does
not meet SSI eligibility criteria for
noncitizens. The immigrant must be
a qualified alien and meet one of the
five categories as set forth in the
PRWORA and the BBA:
● Time-limited exception for refugees,
etc. Persons who enter the U.S. as
refugees, who are granted asylum,
and whose deportation has been
withheld under § 243(h) of the
Immigration and Nationality Act
(INA) are eligible, but only for the
first seven (7) years after the date
that status is granted. 9
● Veterans’ exception. An individual
“lawfully present” in the U.S. is
eligible if he or she is a U.S. veteran
with an honorable discharge or who
is on active duty. Also eligible are
the veteran’s spouse, unremarried
surviving spouse, or unmarried
dependent child. 10
● 40 quarters exception. A lawfully
admitted permanent resident (LAPR)
who entered the U.S. before August
22, 1996 is eligible if he or she (i) has
worked 40 “qualifying quarters”
(QQ) 11 or can be credited with such
quarters and (ii) did not receive any
federal means-tested public benefit
during any quarter which begins
after December 31, 1996. 12 If the
LAPR entered the U.S. on or after
August 22, 1996, the 40 QQ exception
is available only after he or she
has resided in the U.S. for 5 years. 13
● Grandfatherees. Noncitizens
lawfully residing in the U.S. and who
were “receiving” SSI on August 22,
1996 are eligible indefinitely. 14 The
Social Security Administration (SSA)
considers this group eligible under
the more liberal pre-August 22, 1996
law and rules. Thus, these individuals
retain “grandfathering” rights
even if benefits terminate for other
reasons. 15 SSA uses the same
regulation for determining “lawfully
residing” as used in establishing
Title II eligibility. 16
● In the U.S. on August 22, 1996 and
blind or disabled. Noncitizens
“lawfully residing” in the U.S. on
August 22, 1996 and who are blind
or disabled are eligible. 17 SSA uses
the same “lawfully residing” rules
described above for Title II benefits.
18 Once the “lawfully residing”
requirement is met, the noncitizen is
eligible if determined by SSA to be
blind or disabled, regardless of
onset, age, or date of application.
This category can be used for aged
noncitizens (65 or over) who were in
the United States on August 22,
1996, but were not receiving SSI on
that date.
The chart below indicates possible
categories of SSI eligibility depending
on the date of entry into the United
States:
Conclusion
Recent legislation has restricted noncitizen
eligibility for Social Security and
SSI benefits. While some of the more severe
restrictions in the 1996 law were
rectified by the 1997 BBA, many immigrants
continue to be barred from receiving
SSI. To represent noncitizen clients
adequately, advocates should be familiar
with the current eligibility categories.
The National Senior Citizens Law Center is
a public-interest law firm that specializes in
the legal problems of older people. Their
Washington, DC office can be reached at:
(202) 289-6976; Fax: (202) 289-7224,
and the Los Angeles office at (310) 204-
6015, Fax: (310) 204-0891; e-mail:
nsclc@nsclc.org.
Endnotes
1. Balanced Budget Act of 1997 (BBA), Pub. L.
No. 105-33, 111 Stat. 251.
2. Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity
Reconciliation Act of 1996 (PRWORA), Pub. L.
No. 104-193, 110 Stat. 2105.
3. PRWORA, § 401(b)(2). The PRWORA made
this provision effective with applications filed on
or after September 1, 1996. However, Pub. L.
No. 104-208 extended the date to December 1,
1996.
4. 8 C.F.R. § 103.12.
5. Pub. L. No. 105-33, § 5561, 111 Stat. 251, 638,
codified at 8 U.S.C. § 1611(b)(3) (Medicare)
and 1611(b)(4) (Railroad Retirement benefits).
6. A “citizen” of the United States is a person born
in the U.S., Puerto Rico, Guam or the Virgin
Islands. Citizenship also may be obtained
through naturalization. Persons born in
American Samoa, Swains Island, and the
Northern Marianas Islands are U.S. Nationals
but considered “U.S. citizens” for SSI
purposes. 20 C.F.R. § 416.1603.
7. 8 U.S.C. § 1641.
8. Pub. L. No. 105-306, the “Noncitizens Benefit
Clarification and Other Technical Amendments
Act of 1998.”
9. 8 U.S.C. § 1612(a)(2)(A).
10. 8 U.S.C. § 1612(a)(2)(C).
11. For SSI purposes, earnings from work which
are not creditable for Title II purposes may be
used. POMS SI 00502.135.
12. 8 U.S.C. § 1612(a)(2)(B).
13. 8 U.S.C. § 1613(a).
14. 8 U.S.C. § 1612(a)(2)(E).
15. POMS SI 00502.100B.1.
16. POMS SI 00502.100A.
17. 8 U.S.C. § 1612(a)(2)(F).
18. POMS SI 00502.142.
ELIGIBLE CATEGORIES IF ENTERED BEFORE AUGUST 22, 1996
Time-limited exception for refugees, asylees, etc.
Veterans exception
40 quarters exception for LAPRs
Receiving SSI on August 22, 1996, i.e., grandfatherees
Lawfully residing in U.S. on August 22, 1996 and disabled
ELIGIBLE CATEGORIES IF ENTERED ON OR AFTER AUGUST 22, 1996
Time-limited exception for refugees, asylees, etc.
Veterans exception
40 quarters exception for LAPRs (after 5 years)
27

NAELA News ● August 1999
OPPORTUNITIES
AVAILABLE
Join the team that’s shaping the
future of your profession
A CALL FOR NAELA BOARD OF DIRECTORS NOMINATIONS
Are you tired of sitting on the sidelines?
Are you ready to share your experience and expertise?
Here’s your chance to help lead the association dedicated
to furthering the profession of elder law.
NAELA is currently seeking members to serve in the
following leadership positions on its board of directors:
● President-Elect
● Vice President
● Treasurer
● Secretary
● Six directors...
And YOU can make a difference.
THE BENEFIT PACKAGE
● A role in advancing your profession
● Exposure to a wealth of personal and professional contacts
● Access to up-to-date information about the challenges facing your practice in the future
● The chance to exchange ideas and perspectives with other volunteer leaders
QUALIFICATIONS
● Demonstrated commitment to NAELA and the profession of elder law
● Strong background in committee and volunteer work
● A proven track record on affecting change
● Ability and commitment to dedicate the time to attend three Board Meetings per year.
WE WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU
If you are interested in serving or know of potential candidates, please write to Rebecca Morgan,
Nominating Committee Chair, NAELA, 1604 N. Country Club Road, Tucson, AZ 85716-3102; Fax (520) 325-7925.
NOMINATIONS (INCLUDING SELF NOMINATIONS) MUST BE RECEIVED NO LATER THAN DECEMBER 10, 1999.
28

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NAELA News ● August 1999
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29

NAELA News ● August 1999
CONTINUING LEGAL EDUCATION CASSETTES
Pre-Conference AThe Basics of Elder Law Day
1. ❑ WELCOME AND A REVIEW OF THE BASICS OF MEDICAID ...................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
2. ❑ HEALTH CARE DIRECTIVES, DURABLE POWER OF ATTORNEY, CAPACITY AND GUARDIANSHIP .................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
3. ❑ HOUSING OPTIONS AND NURSING HOME ISSUES .................................................................................................................................. (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
4. ❑ SPECIAL PRESENTATION: OFFICE PRACTICE AND CLIENT DEVELOPMENT ....................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
5. ❑ WILLS, LIVING TRUSTS, BASIC TAXATION ................................................................................................................................................ (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
6. ❑ MEDICARE ..................................................................................................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
7 . ❑ ETHICS FOR THE ELDER LAW ATTORNEY ................................................................................................................................................ (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
8 . ❑ IMPORTANT CALIFORNIA DIFFERENCES; QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS ............................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
11th Annual Symposium Sessions
9. ❑ WELCOME AND PRESIDENTS’ ADDRESS ................................................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
10. ❑ GENERAL SESSION: OFFICE TO COURT PANEL DISCUSSION ............................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
11. ❑ GENERAL SESSION: ETHICS AND LITIGATION - A DISCUSSION OF THE ACTEC COMMENTARIES .................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
12. ❑ MEDICARE+CHOICE UPDATE ..................................................................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
13. ❑ STATE COURT AND ADMINISTRATIVE MEDICAID LITIGATION - A CASE STUDY ................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
14. ❑ ASSET OR LIABILITY? HOW WILL YOUR ELDER LAW PRACTICE BE VIEWED BY YOUR EXECUTOR? ............................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
15. ❑ OVERVIEW OF THE PRUDENT INVESTOR RULE ...................................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
16. ❑ HANDLING CONTESTED GUARDIANSHIPS AND CONSERVATORSHIP .................................................................................................. (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
17ab. ❑ GENERAL SESSIONS: ELDER ABUSE & DOMESTIC VIOLENCE: WHAT IS THE ELDER LAW ATTORNEY’S
ROLE IN RECOGNITION & PREVENTION? and PROSECUTING ELDER LAW ABUSE CASES ................................................................ (2 Tapes) ............... $18.00
18. ❑ OFFICE PRACTICE, CLIENT DEVELOPMENT ............................................................................................................................................ (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
19. ❑ SUPPLEMENTAL NEEDS TRUSTS FROM THE ATTORNEY’S STANDPOINT ........................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
20. ❑ THE NUTS AND BOLTS OF PROBATE & TRUST LITIGATION ................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
21. ❑ COUNSELING THE CLIENT WITH HIDDEN OR UNDIAGNOSED ILLNESSES .......................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
22. ❑ ANTIPSYCHOTROPIC MEDICATION - HEALTH CARE DECISION MAKING COMPLIANCE & MONITORING ISSUES ........................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
23. ❑ IN SEARCH OF HUMANE LONG-TERM CARE: IS ASSISTED LIVING AN OASIS OR A MIRAGE? ........................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
24. ❑ NURSING HOME RIGHTS ............................................................................................................................................................................. (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
25. ❑ SPECIAL PRESENTATION: PUTTING YOURSELF IN YOUR CLIENT’S SHOES ....................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
26. ❑ ESTATE PLANNING WITH IRAs - ELDER LAW ISSUES .............................................................................................................................. (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
27. ❑ SUPPLEMENTAL SECURITY INCOME FROM A TO Z: WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW & HOW
NEW CHANGES WILL AFFECT CLIENTS .................................................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
28. ❑ HANDLING MEDICARE ADMINISTRATIVE HEARINGS ............................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
29. ❑ NURSING HOME LITIGATION ...................................................................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
30. ❑ USING THE FAMILY BUSINESS AS AN EXEMPT RESOURCE ................................................................................................................... (1 Tape ) ............... $ 9.00
31ab. ❑ RECENT DEVELOPMENTS PANEL AND CLOSING REMARKS .................................................................................................................. (2 Tapes) ............... $18.00
❑ SPECIAL — SELECT ANY 10 TAPES — FOR ONLY $85.00
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NAELA News ● August 1999
31

NAELA News ● August 1999
National Academy of
Elder Law Attorneys, Inc. TM
1604 NORTH COUNTRY CLUB ROAD
TUCSON, ARIZONA 85716-3102
BULK RATE
U.S. POSTAGE
PAID
Tucson, Arizona
Permit No. 3178
Who’s Who
on the
NAELA Staff ?
There are often questions as to who
is who on the NAELA staff. As you
know, we have a staff of 15 people
working for us, and everyone is responsible
for very specific things. Our
offices are located at 1604 North
Country Club Road, Tucson, Arizona
85716 and are open from 8:00am. to
5:00pm., Mountain Time, Monday
through Friday, except holidays. The
telephone number is (520) 881-4005.
The fax number is (520) 325-7925.
We also have voice mail and therefore,
you may leave messages 24
hours a day, seven days a week! To
help you in your endeavor to get
through the maze, we are listing who
you should contact for what things:
Name/Telephone Extension
E Mail Address
Address Changes ................................................. Jenifer Mowery, ext. 114 ...................................... jmowery@naela.com
Advertising ............................................................ Carolyn Smith, ext. 106 ....................................... csmith@naela.com
Billing Questions ................................................... Janet Tite, ext. 119 .............................................. jtite@naela.com
Board Action ......................................................... Laury Adsit, ext. 113 ............................................ ladsit@naela.com
Brochures ............................................................. Becky Notestine, ext. 107 .................................... info@naela.com
Certification ........................................................... Brittany Betz, ext. 116 .......................................... bbetz@naela.com
Chapters ............................................................... Janice Phillips, ext. 121 ....................................... jphillips@naela.com
Committee Placement .......................................... Janice Phillips, ext. 121 ....................................... jphillips@naela.com
Executive Director ................................................. Laury Adsit, ext. 113 ............................................ ladsit@naela.com
Experience Registry .............................................. Jenifer Mowery, ext. 114 ...................................... jmowery@naela.com
Fellows ................................................................. Debbie Barnett. ext. 117 ...................................... dbarnett@naela.com
Finances ............................................................... Debbie Barnett, ext. 117 ...................................... dbarnett@naela.com
Mailing Questions ................................................. Jami Morris, ext. 118
or Becky Notestine, ext. 107 ................................ info@naela.com
Media Relations .................................................... Jihane Rohrbacker, ext. 115 ................................ jrohrbacker@naela.com
Membership .......................................................... Jenifer Mowery, ext. 114 ...................................... jmowery@naela.com
Membership Directory ........................................... Jenifer Mowery, ext. 114 ...................................... jmowery@naela.com
NAELA News/Quarterly
Articles ............................ Jihane Rohrbacker, ext. 115 ................................ jrohrbacker@naela.com
Public Policy ......................................................... Laury Adsit, ext. 113 ............................................ ladsit@naela.com
Special Interest Groups ........................................ Janice Phillips, ext. 121 ....................................... jphillips@naela.com
State Coordinators ................................................ Jenifer Mowery, ext. 114 ...................................... jmowery@naela.com
Symposium/Institute Information
CLE ............................................................ Brittany Betz, ext. 116 .......................................... bbetz@naela.com
Exhibitors .................................................... Karen Miller, ext. 108 ........................................... kmiller@naela.com
Publicity ...................................................... Jihane Rohrbacker, ext. 115 ................................ jrohrbacker@naela.com
Registration ................................................ Jenifer Mowery, ext. 114 ...................................... jmowery@naela.com
Speakers .................................................... Karen Miller, ext. 108 ........................................... kmiller@naela.com
Tapes/Manuals ..................................................... Jami Morris, ext. 118 ............................................ info@naela.com
32 32