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interviu Cawerilia 24 Tebervals.<br />
_ qalbatono lela, minda interviu<br />
arapolitikuri TemiT daviwyo. rogorc<br />
cnobili gaxda, CeliabinskSi meteoriti<br />
Camovarda, romelmac miliardobiT rublis<br />
zarali miayena qalaqs. Tavad Celiabinskis<br />
mosaxleoba (da ara mxolod)<br />
ratomRac Camovardnili sxeulis kosmosur<br />
warmomavlobas eWvqveS ayenebs. amaze<br />
isini bevrs msjeloben sxvadasxva internet-forumebze.<br />
_ verafriT davarqmev am sxeuls meteorits,<br />
radgan xedvaSi mas amis aranairi niSani<br />
ar aqvs. vxedav, eZeben da ver pouloben.<br />
verc ipovian. es ufro samxedro iaraRia,<br />
`SemTxveviT~ gavardnili da sxva araferi.<br />
mova dro da amasac ityvian, vin, saidan da<br />
ra gaisrola.<br />
_ gamodis, rom politikas mainc<br />
ver avcdiT?<br />
_ vera.<br />
_ qalbatono lela, ukrainam uari<br />
ganacxada `gazpromis~ mier dakisrebuli<br />
7 miliardi dolaris jarimis gadaxdaze.<br />
gaamwvavebs Tu ara es uari am<br />
or qveyenas Soris warmoebul `gazis<br />
oms~, Tu romelime maTgani ukan daixevs<br />
da problema am gziT aRmoifxvreba?<br />
_ gazTan dakavSirebiT ruseTsa da ukrainas<br />
Soris iyo problemebi da kvalavac iqneba.<br />
saqme isaa, rom rogorc ki ruseTi ukmayofilo<br />
rCeba ukrainis politikiT, gazi maSin<br />
axsendeba. es xom maTi iaraRia?! ase iqneba<br />
mudam. magram aqve unda aRvniSno, rom ukraina<br />
arafersac ar gadauxdis ruseTs. da ras<br />
izams ruseTi, romelic sxva qveynebSi mcxovreb<br />
Tavis moqalaqeebs agrerigad `Tavdauzogavad<br />
icavs?~ gawiravs ukrainaSi mcxovreb<br />
milionobiT russ da bunebrivi airis gareSe<br />
datovebs Tu ra? mokled, ase gagrZeldeba<br />
maT Soris dava.<br />
_ qalbatono lela, qalaq moskovis<br />
mTavrobam miiRo gadawyvetileba, Camoayalibos<br />
saxalxo razmebi _ `migraciuli<br />
patruli~ _ romlebic aralegal<br />
gasterbaiterebs gamoavlenen. aris Tu<br />
ara es dasawyisi im winaswarmetyvelebis<br />
asrulebisa, sadac Tqven brZanebT,<br />
rom rusebi sxva erovnebis adamianebis<br />
masStabur gasaxlebas daiwyeben?<br />
_ diax, sworedac asea. oRond es gadawyvetileba<br />
realurad qalaqis mTavrobam ki<br />
ar miiRo, brZaneba uSualod kremlidan modis.<br />
sxvaTa Soris, es `migraciuli patruli~,<br />
kargi iqneboda, cota adre CamoeyalibebinaT.<br />
_ ratom?<br />
_ imitom, rom aseT SemTxvevaSi `skinhedebs~<br />
danaSaulebrivi moqmedebis areals<br />
Seumcirebdnen da gamovlenil aralegal Tu<br />
legal gasterbaiterebs cocxlebs mainc<br />
daabrunebdnen TavianT qveynebSi. Zalian bevri<br />
adamiani gamoasalmes sicocxles am fa-<br />
Sisturi moZraobis wevrebma. amis srulad<br />
aRkveTa Tu ara, xelis SeSla mainc SeiZleboda.<br />
amaze jer kidev maSin unda ezrunaT,<br />
roca uamravma muslimma morwmunem moskovis<br />
quCebi gadaketa da cxvrebis dakvla iqve<br />
daiwyo. ai maSin xom xiluli iyo da Tval-<br />
Si sacemi, ra raodenobis ucxoqveyneli<br />
cxovrobda qalaqSi? xom TvalnaTliv Canda,<br />
rom sxva qveynebidan wamosulma nakadma slavebi,<br />
faqtobrivad, gadafares? skinhedebis gaaqtiurebis<br />
faqtebic xom cnobili iyo da raRas<br />
elodebodnen?<br />
sxvaTa Soris, vxedav, mag `migraciul patrul-<br />
Si~ bevri moxalise gaerTiandeba.<br />
ise, iumori rom gavurioT, putinis saocnebo<br />
sabWoTa kavSiri mas ukve aqvs moskovSi<br />
_ iq xom yvela postsabWoTa qveynis warmoadgenlebi<br />
cxovroben.<br />
_ es procesi mSvidobiani iqneba Tu<br />
garTulebebi mohyveba?<br />
_ aralegalebis gamovlena-gasaxlebas<br />
arcerT qveyanaSi ar Cauvlia mSvidad da<br />
ruseTSi ormagad mZimed Caivlis. es imitom,<br />
rom Tavad mkvidri mosaxleoba ukve Zalian<br />
uaryofiTadaa migrantebis mimarT ganwyobili.<br />
ai, amitom vambob, aqamde unda momx-<br />
da me getyviT Tqven...<br />
mkiTxvels yovel nomerSi vTavazobT intervius<br />
qarTvel winaswarmetyvelTan. igi isaubrebs<br />
mocemuli momentisTvis yvelaze metad<br />
aqtualur Temebze, Tumca qalbatoni lelas<br />
pasuxebi yovelTvis efuZneba ramdenime wlis<br />
win Caweril winaswarmetyvelebebs.<br />
dariyo es yvelaferi-meTqi, anu manam, sanam<br />
xalxi Zalian gaRiziandeboda.<br />
_ mxolod aralegalebs gaasaxleben<br />
Tu legalurad mosaxleebsac miayoleben?<br />
_ erTianad mousvamen yvelas niCabs.<br />
_ mohyvebian Tu ara am procesSi<br />
qarTvelebi?<br />
_ ki, qarTvelebic mohyvebian. kidev gimeoreb,<br />
es brZaneba modis kremlidan, romlis<br />
binadarTac aranairad ar awyobT qveyanaSi<br />
macxovrebeli milionobiT ucxoqveyneli. amitomac<br />
yvelas miadgebian. rusebi am axal<br />
samsaxurs kulturulad arqmeven `migraciul<br />
saxalxo patruls~, Torem sinamdvileSi<br />
omisTvisac ki mzad arian araslavebis<br />
gasayrelad.<br />
_ qalbatono lela, droulia Tu<br />
ara saqarTvelos mTavrobis mier wamoWrili<br />
iniciativa ruseTTan urTierTobis<br />
gamosworebis Taobaze? anu, mohyveba<br />
ki Sedegi mcdelobas, arafris daTmobis<br />
fasad aRvadginoT am saxelmwifosTan<br />
urTierTobebi mokle periodSi?<br />
_ ruseTTan urTierTobis didad gamosworebas<br />
jer ar vxedav! rusebi dRes imaze<br />
uares moTxovnebs ayeneben, vidre SevardnaZis<br />
dros. kremli saerTod arc fiqrobs jerjerobiT<br />
raimes Semsubuqebas da ultimatumebs<br />
gviyenebs, me `derJava~ var da Tqven<br />
unda damemorCiloTo! saqarTvelom aucileblad<br />
kvlav imgvari politika unda gaataros<br />
maTTan mimarTebaSi, rogoric tardeboda<br />
dRemde. anu xmamaRla, msoflios gasagonad<br />
ilaparakos yvela im arakanonierebasa da<br />
usamarTlobaze, rasac isini Cvens mimarT<br />
axorcieleben da ganaxorcieleben. rusebs<br />
Cveni aseTi qmedebebiT xelfexi, ase Tu ise,<br />
daborkili hqondaT. mokled, jerjerobiT<br />
nurafer sikeTes nu eliT maTgan.<br />
axla iqiT davsvam kiTxvas: romeli saxelmwifos<br />
mimarT ginaxavT ruseTi damTmobis<br />
rolSi? Tavadve gipasuxebT: arcerTis! sanam<br />
ruseTSi mTavroba ar gamoicvleba da masTan<br />
erTad qveynis politikac sxva saxelmwifoebis<br />
mimarT, es `derJavuli~ damokidebuleba<br />
da toni ar Seicvleba.<br />
_ magram es moxdeba...<br />
_ ki, moxdeba aucileblad. amaze bevri<br />
ram maqvs naTqvami.<br />
_ qalbatono lela, warsulSi, roca<br />
ruseTi, ase vTqvaT, antiqarTul dietaze<br />
dajda, anu akrZala qarTuli<br />
produqciis Setana sakuTar saxelmwifoSi,<br />
Tqven brZaneT, rom ekonomikuri<br />
kavSirebi Cvens Soris mainc aRdgeboda.<br />
es dro mainc Tu dadga?<br />
_ ekonomikuri kavSirebis aRdgenis dro<br />
dadga. saqme isaa, rom rusebi zogadad<br />
mxolod im SeTanxmebebze midian, romlebic<br />
Tavad awyobT da sWirdebaT. asea am SemTxvevaSic.<br />
Tumca, gamaRizianebelia maTi poza,<br />
aqeT rom cdiloben zemodan gadmogvxedon,<br />
ai, xom mainc dagWirdiTo! da es maSin,<br />
roca realurad piriqiTaa.<br />
_ anu, maT vWirdebiT?<br />
_ diaxac! da amas momavali Riad dagvanaxebs<br />
yvelas. ar mainteresebs, dRes vis<br />
sjera es da vis _ ara. me politikur<br />
analizebs ar vakeTeb. me momavals pirdapir<br />
vxedav da vwinaswarmetyveleb. winaswarmetyveleba<br />
ki yovelTvis sruldeba!<br />
_ qalbatono lela, saqarTvelos<br />
mTavrobam ganacxada, rom Cveni sportsmenebi<br />
monawileobas miiReben soWis 2014<br />
wlis olimpiadaSi, rasac azrTa sxvadasxvaoba<br />
mohyva. vin momxrea am gadawyvetilebisa<br />
da vin kidev _ mowinaaRmdege.<br />
Tqveni xedva mainteresebs am sakiTxze:<br />
ramdenad gamarTlebulia saqarTvelos<br />
monawileoba okupanti qveynis teritoriaze<br />
gamarTul sportul RonisZiebaSi?<br />
_ Sensave SekiTxvaSi JRers pasuxi: `okupanti<br />
saxelmwifos teritoriaze gamarTuli<br />
sportuli RoniZieba!~ aba, riT gamarTldeba<br />
es nabiji?! yvelafers Tavi davaneboT, soWi<br />
aqvea, ramdenime saaTis savalze da Cvenma<br />
sportulma delegaciam, vTqvaT, afxazeTis<br />
gavliT moiwadina iq Casvla, gagikvirdebaT,<br />
afxazeTSi Sesvlaze vizebi rom mogvTxovon?<br />
da mere ras vizamT? aviRebT vizebs Cvens<br />
kuTvnil, Zaladobrivad warTmeul teritoriebze<br />
usamarTlod gavlebul sazRvarze gadasasvlelad<br />
Tu ra?..<br />
ise ki, jer saerTod Catardes es olimpiada<br />
da danarCenze mere vilaparakoT!!!<br />
_ Cveni mkiTxvelisTvis cnobilia<br />
Tqveni winaswarmetyvelebebi soWis olimpiadasTan<br />
dakavSirebiT...<br />
_ hoda, gadaxedon da gaixsenon, ras<br />
vwer am Temaze.<br />
_ qalbatono lela, gavrcelda informacia,<br />
rom Tbilisis zRvaze didi<br />
Cinuri dasaxleba unda aSendes. Tqven<br />
warsulSi, jer kidev maSin, rodesac<br />
saqarTveloSi CineTis saelCos Tanam-<br />
Sromlebis garda, sxva Cinels ver naxavdiT,<br />
iwinaswarmetyveleT am Temaze<br />
da es Canaweri kidec gamoqveynda Cvens<br />
gazeTSi, magram iqneb SevaxsenoT aRelvebuls<br />
sazogadoebas igi?<br />
_ mokled vityvi imas, rac warsulSi<br />
mravaljer miTqvams: Cinelebi fexs mainc ver<br />
moikideben saqarTveloSi! saerTod, erTi ram<br />
axsovdes yvelas: rasac ucxoqveynelebi aaSeneben<br />
da gaakeTeben Cvens qveyanaSi, yvelaferi aq<br />
da Cven dagvrCeba! ai, Tundac 2004 wlis 5<br />
agvistos winaswarmetyveleba: `ucxo biznesmeni<br />
xelSi ver Caigdebs qarTul simdidres,<br />
yvelaferi saqarTveloSi rCeba!~ da kidev<br />
erTic: 2008 wlis 30 martisa: `ucxo<br />
tomi fexs ver moikidebs qarTul miwaze!<br />
yvelaferi qarTvelebs rCebaT! ase vxedav da<br />
asec iqneba!~<br />
_ da kidev erTi mSeneblobis Sesaxeb.<br />
saqarTveloSi xudonhesis mSenebloba<br />
droebiT, ramdenime TviT SeCerda. Seikriba<br />
samuSao jgufi, romelSic arasamTavrobo<br />
organizaciebi, damoukidebeli<br />
eqspertebi, energetikosebi da garemos<br />
damcvelebi Sedian. am jgufma unda miiRos<br />
gadawyvetileba, gagrZeldes Tu<br />
ara mSenebloba. anu maT unda dadon<br />
daskvna, ra saxis ekologiuri ziani<br />
SeiZleba miadges amiT garemos da saer-<br />
Tod, Rirs Tu ara am hesis aSeneba. me<br />
Tqveni xedva mainteresebs am sakiTxze:<br />
unda aSendes Tu ara xudonhesi? anu,<br />
ramdenad saWiroa igi saqarTvelosTvis<br />
da miadgeba Tu ara raime gamousworebeli<br />
ziani bunebas misi aSenebiT?<br />
_ saerTod, roca aseTi didi proeqtiT<br />
iWrebi bunebis mowyobaSi, ra Tqma unda,<br />
darRvevebi xdeba. mTavaria, es darRvevebi<br />
iseTi masStabisa ar iyos, rom wagvlekos.<br />
ai es unda gansazRvros saxelmwifom, anu<br />
dargis specialistebma, Torem, magaliTisTvis<br />
rom vTqvaT, cudia, Jinvalhesi rom gvaqvs?<br />
misma agebamac gamoiwvia garkveuli cvlilebebi<br />
da rRvevebi bunebaSi, magram gana ar<br />
gvWirdeboda es hesi? gvWirdeboda da Tanac,<br />
rogor?! mokled, 20 welia, sul am xudonzea<br />
laparaki da daadgeba saSveli bolosdabolos.<br />
miTxariT, gana cudia, sakuTari<br />
energia gamovimuSavoT da mere, garda imisa,<br />
rom Tavadac movixmaroT, kidec gavyidoT<br />
sxva qveynebze?<br />
_ aqve minda am Temaze #60-Si<br />
gamoqveynebuli Tqveni interviudan nawyvetic<br />
moviyvano: `vxedav, sxva gza ar<br />
arsebobs, xudonhesi unda aigos! es<br />
saqarTvelos aucileblad sWirdeba. mesmis<br />
xaiSelTa gancdebisa, magram qveynis<br />
interesebidan gamomdinare, mouwevT sxva<br />
adgilze sacxovreblad gadasvla. ase<br />
iyo Jinvalhesis SemTxvevaSic. atomuri<br />
eleqtrosadguris agebas, hidrosadguris<br />
aSeneba da misTvis erTi soflis Sewirva<br />
sjobs. es usafrTxo da uwyveti eleqtromomaragebis<br />
wyaroa, riTac qveyana bevrnairad<br />
isargeblebs~.<br />
_ meti raRa vTqva?<br />
_ kargiT, sxva Temaze gadavideT.<br />
rogor SeafasebT ganaTlebis saministros<br />
iniciativas, saxelmwifom srulad<br />
daafinansos fizikis, maTematikis, qimiis,<br />
filologiis, istoriis, arqeologiis,<br />
manqanaTmSeneblobis, soflis meurneobisa<br />
da a.S fakultetebi? ramdenad<br />
sworad aris SerCeuli dargebi, romlebic<br />
am CamonaTvalSia?<br />
_ mokled getyvi: mag gadawyvetilebebs<br />
kidev ramdenjerme Secvlian.<br />
_ qalbatono lela, Tqvens arqivSi<br />
oriode dRis win CemTvis manamde ucnobi<br />
uamravi saintereso werili da<br />
calkeul furclebze Canaweri aRmova-<br />
Cine. erT-erTi aseTi CanawerTagani ase<br />
gamoiyureba: `muslimebi TeTr saxls<br />
bombs esvrian. 2002 weli. 4 marti~.<br />
_ Cems arqivSi aseTi Canawerebi mravladaa.<br />
Tu rveulTan axlos ar var, mowo-<br />
(GAGgagrZeleba gv.6)<br />
mTavari redaqtori: irma gelaSvili<br />
gazeTi registrirebulia vake-saburTalos raionul sagadasaxado inspeqciaSi.<br />
gazeTSi da vebgverdze gamoyenebuli masalebis da fotoebis gadabeWdva-gamoqveyneba<br />
redaqciis Tanxmobis gareSe akrZalulia. saavtoro uflebebi daculia.<br />
www.lelakakulia.ge / el-fosta: lelakakuliapost@yahoo.com<br />
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