commonwealth of pennsyl,vania - The Pennsylvania General ...

Session of 1978 162nd of the G 

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES 

TheHouse convened at 10:OO a.m., e.d.t. 

THE SPEAKER (K. LEROY IRVIS) IN THE CHAIR 

PRAYER 

REV. DR. DAVID R. HOOVER, chaplain of the House of 

Representatives and pastor of St. Paul's Lutheran Church, 

McConnellshurg, Pennsylvania, offered the following prayer: 

Eternal God and Father of all mankind, we stand in awe of 

the ingenuity which man has brought to the problems and dif- 

ficulties of life; we pay tribute to all of his resourcefulness 

which has brought forth the many new ideas, inventions, and 

practical ways beneficial to all; and we bow before the unique 

ness which he has shown to characterize his competency. But, 

0 God, we know full well that Thou art over all, and Thou dost 

grant to mankind the ability as well as theideology to fulfill his 

fondest dreams. We humbly pray that Thou wilt continue to 

inspire each of us with the truth of this knowledge and use the 

talents of each one to bring about the continuity of Thy way in 

our world. Amen. 

JOURNAL APPROVAL POSTPONED 

The SPEAKER. Without objection, approval of the Journal 

for Tuesday, September 12, 1978, will be postponed until 

priuted. 

MASTER ROLL CALL RECORDED 

The SPEAKER. The Speaker urges all members to report 

promptly on the floor of the House as the Speaker is about to 

take the master roll for the day and then will begin almost im- 

mediately the active calendar for the day. The master roll is 

now being taken. Members will please report on the floor of the 

House promptly. 

The following roll call was recorded: 

Anderson 

Armstrong 

Arthurs 

Barber 

Beloff 

Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

Bittlnger 

Bittle 

Borski 

YEAS-189 

Gamble Madigan 

Garzia Manderino 

Gatski Manmiller 

Geesey McCall 

Geisler McClatchy 

George. C. McIntyre 

George. M. McLane 

Giammarco Mebus 

Gillette Meluskey 

Gleeson Milanovich 

Goebel Miller 

COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYL,VANIA 

WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 13,1978 

Salvatore 

Scanlon 

Scheaffer 

Schmitt 

Schweder 

Sciriea 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

Slrianni 

Smith. E. 

Smith. L. 

!nerd Assembly Vol. 1, No. 40 

Brandt Goodman Milliron Spencer 

Brown Greenfield Moehlmann Stairs 

Brunner Greenleaf Morris Stapleton 

Burd Grieco Mower? Stewart 

Burns Halverson Mrkonic Stuban 

Caltagirone Hamilton Mullen, M. P. Sweet 

Caputo Harper Musta Taddanio 

Cassidy Hasay Novak Taylor. E. 

Cessar Hayes,D. S. Noye Taylor, F. 

Cianciulli Hayes,S. E. O'Brien. B. Thomas 

Cimini Helfrick O'Brien, D. Trella 

Cohen Hoeffel O'ConneU Vdieenti 

Cole Honaman O'Donnell Wagner 

CoweU Hutchinson. A. O'Keefe Wansacz 

Davies Hutchinsan, W. Oliver Warga 

DeMedio Itkin Pancoast Wass 

DeVerter Johnson Parker Weidner 

DeWeese Jones Peterson Wenger 

DiCarlo Katz Petrarca White 

Dietz Kelly Piccola Wiggins 

Dininni Kernick Pievsky Williams 

Dombrowski Klingaman Pitts Wilson 

Darr Knepper Polite Wilt 

Doyle Kalter Pott Wise 

Duffy Kawalyshyn Pratt Wright. D. 

Dumas Kukovich Prendergast Wright. J. L. 

Englehart Lashinger Pyles Yahner 

Fee Laughhn Quest Yohn 

Fischer, R. R. Lehr Rappaport Zearfass 

Fisher, D. M. Letterman Ravenstahl Zeller 

Flaherty Levi Renwick Zitterman 

Foster. A Levin Rhodes Zord 

Foster. W. Lincoln Richardson Zwikl 

Frrinrl Livengood Rieger 

Fryer Logue Ritter Irvis. 

Gallagher Lynch Ruggiero Speaker 

Gallen Mackowsh Ryan 

NOT VOTING-9 

Donatucci McGinnis Reed Tenaglia 

Gray Miscevich Spitz Vroon 

HaskeU 

The SPEAKER. One hundred eighty-nine members having 

indicated their presence, a master roll is established. 

HOUSE BILLS INTRODUCED AND 

REFERRED TO COMMITTEES 

No. 2744 By Messrs. GREENLEAF. POLITE and 

LASHINGER 

An Act amending the art of August 5. 19:?2 (1'. I,. 45. No. 45). 

rntitl~d. 21s nmrnrlrd. "An act mmpowrring ritirs of the first

2822 LEGISLATIVE JOURNAL-HOUSE September 13, 

,I:,.;-: rc, I~~v?' " tor gtncr31 rt,vt.nur purl,

STATEMENT ON LEGISLATION 

LEGISLATIVE JC 

The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the gentleman from 

Montgomery, Mr. McClatchy. For what purpose does the gen- 

tleman rise? 

Mr. McCLATCHY. Mr. Speaker, just a short statement. 

I have in preparation in the Legisla~ive Reference Bureau a 

hill that is drafted along the lines of Proposition 12, which we 

all know about. That will he coming down shortly, and I would 

like to hold it open for a little while for asmany people as possi- 

ble to sponsor it. If you would like to sponsor the bill, please call 

my secretary at her office and she will he glad to add your 

name. 

There have been some slight changes, and I think it makes it 

a little hit more powerful. But it is Proposition 12 and it is 

being put in at the request of Kulp and Graham. So if anyone 

wants to sponsor it, again, please call my office. Thank you. Mr. 

Speaker. 

CALENDAR BILLS ON SECOND CONSIDERATION 

The House considered for the second time and agreed to the 

following hills, which were then ordered transcribed for third 

consideration: 

HB 2565, PN 3578; SB 1053, PN 1237; SB 1481, PN 

2106; HB 1022, PN 3560; SB 679, PN 2101; SB 691, PN 

735; HB 2559, PN 3575; SB 1416, PN 1787; SB 1008, PN 

2103; HB 2505, PN 3570; HB 2675, PN 3601; and HB 2740, 

PN 3676. 

CALENDAR BILL ON FINAL PASSAGE POSTPONED 

Agreeable to order, 

The bill having been called up from the postponed calendar 

by Mr. MANDERINO, the House resumed consideration on 

final passage of HB 2095, PN 3490, entitled: 

An Act relating to criminal history record information; pro- 

viding for the protection of individual right to privacy ' " and 

providing penalties for violations of this act. 

The SPEAKER. This hill has been considered on three differ- 

ent days and agreed to and is now on final passage. 

The question is, shall the hill pass finally? 

HB 2095 RETURNED TO THIRD CONSIDERATION 

The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the majority leader. 

Mr. MANDERINO. Mr. Speaker, I move that HB 2095 be re- 

turned to third consideration. 

On the question, 

Will the House agree to the motion? 

Motion was agreed to. 

On the question recurring, 

Will the House agree to the hill as amended on third con- 

sideration? 

Mr. HELFRICK offered the following amendments: 

Amend Table of Contents, page 2, by inserting between lines 

6 and 7 Section 304. Juvenile records. 

Amend Sec. 105, page 7, line 1, by inserting after "juveniles" 

, except as provided in section 304, 

~ 

Amend Bill, page 15,.hy inserting between lines 24 and25 

Section 304. Juvenile records. 

(a) Notwithstanding the provisions of section 105 and except 

upon cause shown, expungement of records of luvenile delin- 

quency cases wherever kept or retained shall occur when the 

court uvon its motion or uoon the motion of a child or the par- 

ent> r;'uilrdlarl fllld.. 

11, ;, t.onlpl;l~nt 1-. fllrrl u hlch I, no: cutrstanll.~lrl~ 

tlon wh~h 

c8r tht. p1.11- 

I f11t.d s,., rcwlt uf ., c ~lll~pl~fi~nt I> ~llsnnhsrd hy rhc 

court; 

(2) three years have elapsed since the final discharge of the 

person from commitment, placement, rohation or any other 

disposition and referral and since such !ma1 discharge, the person 

has not been convicted of a felony, misdenleanor or adjudicated 

delinquent and no proceeding is pendmg seeking such 

conviction or adjudication; or 

13) the ~ ~ individual - - is 21 vears of aee or older and a court 

~ ~ 

ordprs the exnunpement. 

..-... ..~. 

. ~ - r - ~ - m ~ ~ ~ ~ - ~ - ~ 

(h) The court shall give notice of the applications for the ex- 

pungement of juvenile records to the prosecuting attorney. 

(c) All records of children alleged to he or adjudicated de- 

r en dent, may he expunged upon court order after the child is 

21 years of age or older 


Will the House agree to the amendments? 


Northumberland, Mr. Helfrick. 

Mr. HELFRICK. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

What my amendment does is to Sve a young person the op 

portunity to wipe the slate clean of his criminal record for a 

crime or crimes that he has committed as a juvenile. 

I believe to carry a criminal record for the rest of one's life for 

a mistake made as a youth is a much harsher penalty than is 

necessary. I believe that the lack of opportunities that are 

caused to a young person because of a criminal record can force 

him hack into a life of crime. Rehabilitation is certainly more 

important than punishment. I would ask all of you to support 

my amendment. Thank you very much. 




Anderson 

Amstrang 

Arthurs 

Barber 


Bennett 

Berh 

Berson 

Bittinger 

Brandt 

Brown 

Bmnner 

Burd 

Burns 

Caltagirane 

Caputo 

Cassidy 

Cessar 

Cianciulli 

Cimini 

Coh~n 

Cole 

Gallen 

Gamble 

Garzia 

Gatski 

Geisler 

George, C. 

George, M. 

Giammarco 

Gillette 

Gaebel 

Goodman 

Greenfield 

Greenleaf 

Grieco 

Harper 

Hasay 

Hayes, D. S. 

Hayes, S. E. 

Helfrick 

Hoeffel 

Honaman 

Hutchinson, A. 

Manderino 

Manmiller 

McCaU 

McClatchy 

McIntyre 

McLane 

Mebus 

Meluskey 

Milanovich 

Miller 

Milliron 

Moehlmann 

Morris 

Mowery 

Mrkonic 

Mullen, M. P. 

Musto 

Novak 

Noye 

O'Brien, B. 

O'ConneU 

O'Keefe 

Scheaffer 

Schmitt 

Schweder 

Scirica 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

Sirianni 

Smith, E. 

Smith. L. 

Spencer 

Spitz 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Taylor, E. 

Thomas 

Trello 

Vdicenti 

Wagner


Cowell Hutehksan. W. Oliver Wansaez 

DeMedio Itkin Panmast Wargo 

DeVerter Johnson Parker Wass 

DeWeese Jones Peterson Weidner 

DiCarlo Katz Petrarca Wenger 

Dietz Kelly Piccola White 

Dininni Kernick Pievsky Wiggins 

Dombrowski Knepper Pitts Wllson 

Danatucci Kolter Polite Wilt 

Dorr Kowalyshyn Putt Wise 

Dovle Kukovich Prendereast Wrieht. D. 

~ujfy Lashinger 

Dumas Laughtin 

Englehart Lehr 

Fee Letterman 

Fisher. D M. Levi 

FLaherty Lincoln 

Foster, A. Livengmd 

Foster, W. Logue 

Freind Lynch 

Fryer Mackowski 

Gallagher Madigan 

" 

Pyles right. J. L. 

Quest Yahner 

Ravenstahl Yohn 

Renw~ck Zearfoss 

Richardson Zeller 

Rieger Zitterman 

Ritter Zord 

Ruggiero Zwikl 

Ryan 

Salvatore Irvis, 

Scanlon Speaker 

NAYS--5 

Davies Geese? Ktingaman O'DonneU 

Fischer. R. R. 

NOT VOTING-19 

Bittle Hamilton O'Brien, D. Taylor, F. 

Borski Haskell Pratt Tenaglia 

Gleesan Levin Rappapart Vraon 

Gray McGinnis Reed Williams 

Halverson Miseevich Rhodes 

The question was determined in the affirmative, and the 

amendments were agreed to. 

REMARKS ON VOTE 

The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the from 

Philadelphia, Mr. O'Brien. For what purpose does the gentle- 

man rise? 

Mr. D. M. O'BRIEN. Mr. Speaker, I was out of my seat when 

the last vote was taken on the Helfrick amendment numbered 

A6233 to HB 2095 and I would like to be recorded in the af- 

firmative. 

The SPEAKER. The gentleman's remarks will be spread upon 

the record. 


Will the House agree to the bill as amended on third con, 

sideration? 

Mr. BENNETT offered the following amendment: 

Amend Sec. 302, age 14, by inserting between lines 7 and 8 

(12) ~~~l~~~~~ the purpose of determining the 

ment suitability of any pros ctive employee; provided such 

R" 

employer pays a fee establis ed hy the Commissioner of the 

Pennsylvania State Police and provided that access shall not be 

iven to any employer unless the prospective employee shall 

gave given written consent to the inquiry. 


Will the House agree to the amendment? 

AMENDMENT WITHDRAWN TEMPORARILY 

The SPEAKER. On the amendment, the Chair recognizes the 

gentleman from Mercer. Mr. Bennett. The amendment must be 

briefly explained on the floor. 

The Chair has been informed that the Englehart amendment 

has not yet been distributed and has not yet been printed. The 

' Chair regrets the fact that the gentleman, Mr. Englehart, did 

not inform the gentleman. Mr. Bennett, of that, and it is not 

Mr. Bennett's fault. We will withdraw the Englehart amend- 

ment temporarily until it has been printed and circulated. 

On the question recurring. 

Will the House agree to the bill as amended on third consider- 

ation? 

Mr. MILLER offered the followingamendments: 

Amend Sec. 302, page 11, line 23. by striking out "Access" 

andinserting Except as provided in section 302(c), access 

Amend Sec. 302, page 14, by inserting between lines 23 and 

24 

(c) Any member of the workin press shall, upon written re quest, have access to conviction f ata contained in criminal history 

record information from the central repository. Each request 

for the criminal history record information of an individual 

shall be a separate inquiry. The central re ository may impose 

a fee to cover the cost of complying wit1 the request for 

information from noncriminal agencies upon approval of the 

fee by the Privacy and Security Council. 



w 

The SPEAKER. On the amendment, the Chair recognizes the 

gentleman from Lancaster, Mr. Miller. 

Mr. MILLER. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My apologies for d e '1I1 

laying the House. I inadvertently carried this amendment 

downstairs and had to retrieve it from my office. Thank you, 

Mr. Speaker. 

I am offering amendment A5914 to HB 2095, PN 3490. As 

the House is familiar with the bill, it would establish a central 

repository for maintaining criminal history records throughout 

the Commonwealth. My amendment addresses the topic of ac- 

cess to that information. The amendment would add an addi- 

tional subsection (c) under section 302, page 14, of the bill. That 

amendment would propose to read: .,Any member of the 

working press shall, upon written request, have access to con- 

viction data contained in criminal history record information 

from the central repository,n The amendment also goes on to 

say that the repository may establish a fee for providing that 

service. The purpose of the amendment is very straightfor- 

ward, Mr. Speaker. If an investigative police reporter is able to 

have access to the local blotters in police stations and also local 

court history information, it also follows that he should have 

access to the central recordkeeping system maintained by the 

state. I have discussed this amendment with Mr. Berson who 

has agreed to it, as well as Mr. Rhodes, also sponsors of the leg- 

islation, and I would earnestly seek the House's support for this 

amendment. Thank yous Mr. Speaker. 

The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes on the Miller amend- 

ment the gentleman from Philadelphia, Mr. Berson. w 

Mr. BERSON. For purposes of clarification, Mr. Speaker, and 

for purposes of the record, would you define for us what a mem- 

ber of the working press is as used in your amendment and as 

that language appears there?

LEGISLATIVE JOURNAL-HOUSE 

Mr. MILLER. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. While the definition 

I 

anteed that this would he taken from the record and that it 

of "working press" is not now encompassed in the bill, in using would be a correct record or as close as humanly possihle to cor- 

this language I have envisioned the traditional definition of 

working press, which would take in an individual employed by 

a newspaper as a reporter or a radio or tv. station as a working 

reporter. The traditional definition is the one I am inferring. 

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 


Philadelphia. Mr. White, on the Miller amendment. 

Mr. WHITE. Mr. Speaker, my good friend, Mr. Miller, indi. 

cated that the sponsors of the legislation were in favor of the 

amendment. As one of the sponsors of the legislation, I rise to 

oppose the amendment. I think that one of the things that we 

must keep in consideration is that though the press may be 

doing us a valuable service at times, we have noted where the 

press has been able to kind of take things somewhat out of pro- 

portion, and it bothers me that an individual who may have 

been convicted of a crime some years ago. 10 years ago, 12 

years ago and the like, who happens to find himself or herself 

in some bit of trouble at a future date, would have all of that 

history exposed because the newspapers would have access to 

that, and on that very premise alone, I would have to oppose 

the amendment and urge that my colleagues do the same. 

Mr. MILLER. Mr. Speaker, may I respond to the gentleman? 


The access section that I am amending by adding the addi- 

tional section (c) you have in front of you, in response to Mr. 

White's point, does not change the normal expungement rules 

that are in the existing bill. Those statutes, the dates on which 

normal information may be deleted under certain instances, 

still remain the same. I do not change that section. 

The real thrust of the amendment, if I might just add one 

final thought, is this: If anoffense is committed in your county, 

your local media has access, under the hill as it is now written, 

to the local police blotter information and to the local court in- 

formation. However, if that offense is committed by someone 

rect? Are there any provisions that address themselves to this 

in this amendment, or does this occur anywhere in heing tied in 

with a bill that we have that guarantee? 

The reason I ask this is because there are even problems, we 

found out in the deliberation of one of our committees, in just 

simple employment records, and I would begin to wonder, with 

the mass of appeals, and so forth and so on, what guarantee the 

individual would have that this were the case in the involved 

process of criminal appeal and final determination by, let us 

say, an appellate court. 

Mr. MILLER. In response to the gentleman's inquiry, he is 

speaking to the recordkeeping process as outlined in the hill. I 

am providing in the amendment access to those records. How- 

ever, the amendment is only intended to apply to conviction 

data, not arrest records, so that if a conviction is a matter of 

record in the central repository as the bill now stands, with or 

without this amendment, the central repository would bear the 

responsibility of having that information correct. With this 

amendment it would only provide access to the working press 

to the conviction data that has already been filed in that central 

repository. 

Mr. DAVIES. Mr. Speaker, at the same time would it be 

noted that, let us say, it was heing appealed to a higher court, 

or would there he some notation or guarantee of those nota- 

tions that it was still under the deliberation of the courts? 

Mr. MILLER. Mr. Speaker, I am not a sponsor of the legisla- 

tion and I would have to defer to Mr. Berson or perhaps Mr. 

Rhodes or Mr. White, who have designed the bill and would be 

better able to address those questions. My amendment merely 

goes to the access question of making the information available 

to the public via responsible media personnel. 

Mr. DAVIES. Mr. Speaker, I would also defer to the sponsor 

and maker of the hill for a reply to that so I could get some 

clarification. 

who is not from your county, if that accused criminal is not The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the gentleman from 

from your county, there is no way the working press would Lancaster, Mr. Miller. 

have access to crimes he committed in other parts of the Com- Mr. MILLER. Mr. Speaker, the gentleman, Mr. Davies, was 

monwealth. I think that is part of the normal course of investi- on a line of questioning that dealt with the substance of the bill 

gative police reporting, to have access to that information in and has agreed to wait until the hill is called up to finish that 

writing the article and I would again urge support. Thank you, line of questioning. 

Mr. Speaker. 


The SPEAKER. The Chair recomizes the . gentleman from / Will the House agree to theamendments? 

Berks, Mr. Davies, on the Miller amendment. 


Mr. DAVIES. Mr. S~eaker. would the maker of the amendment 

stand for a question or two on the amendment? 

YEAS-176 

Mr. MILLER. Certainly, Mr. Speaker. 

Mr. DAVIES. Mr. Speaker, who would assume a responsibility 

in this central recordkeeping process for guaranteeing or 

providing for the fact that the records were as close to humanly 

possible accurate, where appeals go on or are put off and become 

involved and go on for years and years and years at a 

time; that if, for example, in final determination someone's decision 

was reversed by, let us say, the top appellate court, that 

the record would then show or he updated or in some way guar- 

Anderson 

Armstrong 

Arthurs 

Barber 

Bennett 

Berhn 

Berson 

Bittiger 

Bittle 

Brandt 

Brown 

Gallen 

Gamble 

Garzia 

Gatski 

Geesey 

Geisler 

George. C. 

George. M. 

Giammarco 

Gillette 

Gleeson 

Madigan 

Mandervlo 

Manmiller 

MeCaU 

McClatchy 

McIntyre 

McLane 

Mebus 

Meluskey 

Milanovich 

Miller 

Salvatore 

Scheaffer 

Schmitt 

Schweder 

Scirica 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

Sirianni 

Smith, E. 

Smith. L. 

Spencer

Brunner Goebel Milliran Spitz 

Burd Goodman Moehlmann Stairs 

Burns Greenfield Morris Stapleton 

Caltngirone Greenleaf Mawery Stewart 

LEGISLATIVE JOURNAL-HOUSE September 13, 

The SPEAKER. The Chair at this time is pleased to turn over 

the gavel to the gentleman. Mr. Wansacz, to preside tempo- 

rarily. 

Caputo Grieeo Mrkonic Stuban 

Cassidy Halverson Mullen. M. P. Sweet I THE SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE (JOHN WANSAU) 

Cessar Hamilton Musto Taddonio IN THE CHAIR 

Cimini Hasay Novak Taylor. E. 

Cohen Hayes, D. S. Noye Taylor. F. 

Cole Hayes, S. E. O'Brien. B. Tenaglio 

Cowell Helfrick O'Brien, D. Trello 

Davies Hwffel O'ConneU Valicentl 

DeMedio Honaman O'DonneU Wagner 

DeVerter Hutchinson. A. O'Keefe Wansacz 

DeWeese Hutchinson. W. Pancoast Wargo 

DiCarlo ltkin Parker Wass 

Dietz Katz Peterson Weidner 

Dininni Kelly Petrarea Wenger 

Dombrowski Kernick Piccola Wiggins 

Donatucci Klingaman Pievsky Wilson 

Dorr Knepper Pitts Wilt 

Doyle Kolter Polite Wise 

Duffy Kowalyshyn Pott Wright. D. 

Dumas Kukovich Pratt Wright, J. L, 

Enelehart Lashinger Prendersast Yahner 

~ e e Laughlin 

Fischer. R. R. Lehr 

Fisher. D. M. Letterrnan 

Flaherty Levi 

Faster. A. Lincoln 

Foster, W. Livengood 

Freind Logue 

Fryer Lynch 

Gallagher Mackowski 

Pyles Yohn 

Quest Zeller 

Rappaport Zitterman 

Ravenstahl Zord 

Renwick Zwikl 

Ritter 

Ruggiero Irvis, 

Ryan Speaker 

Beloff Harper Levin White 

Borski Johnson Oliver Zearfoss 

Cianciulli Jones Richardson 

NOT VOTING-11 

Gray Miscevich Rieger Vmon 

HaskeU Reed Scanlon Williams 

MeGinnis Rhodes Thomas 


amendments were agreed to. 

MR. WANSACZ REQUESTED TO PRESIDE 

The SPEAKER. The Chair, at this time, invites the gentle- 

man from Lackawanna, Mr. John Wansacz, to preside tempo- 

rarily as the Speaker of the House. Will the gentleman please 

come to the podium? 


Will the House agree to the bill as amended on third con- 

sideration? 

Mr. BENNETT offered the following amendment: 

iven to any employer unless the prospective employee shall 

ave given written consent to the inquiry. 



The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentleman 

from Mercer, Mr. Bennett, on the amendment. 

Mr. BENNETT. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

The amendment offered by Mr. Englehart very simply states 

that a prospective employer may ask the prospective employe 

to check on his background, and the amendment says that the 

employe must sign in writing that he authorizes the investigation 

of his background, 

Apparently the amendment is agreed to, and I ask for its ac. 

ceptance. 



The follou ring roll call was recorded: 

Anderson 

Armstrong 

Arthurs 

Barber 


Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

Bittinger 

Bittle 

Brsndt 

Brown 

Brunner 

Burd 

Burns 

Caltagirone 

Caputo 

Cassidy 

Cessar 

Cianciulli 

Cimini 

Cohen 

Cole 

Cowell 

Davies 

DeMedio 

DeVerter 

DeWeese 

DiCarlo 

Dietz 

Dininni 

Dombrowski 

Donatucci 

Dorr 

Doyle 

Duffy 

Dumas 

Englehart 

Fee 

Fischer. R. R. 

Fisher, D. M. 

Flaherty 

Foster, A. 

Foster. W. 

Freind 

Fryer 

Gallagher 

YEAS-186 

Gallen Manderina 

Gamble Manmiller 

Garria McCall 

Gatski McClatchy 

Geesey Mclntyre 

Geisler McLane 

George, C. Mebus 

George, M. Meluskey 

Gismmarco Milanovieh 

Gillette Miller 

Gleeson Milliron 

Goadman Moehlmann 

Greenfield Morris 

Greenleaf Mowery 

Grieco Mrkonic 

Halverson Mullen. M. P. 

Hamilton Mush 

Harper Novak 

Hasay Noye 

Hayes, D. S. O'Brien, B. 

Hayes, S. E. O'Brien. D. 

Helfrick O'CanneU 

Hoeffel O'DonneU 

Hanaman O'Keefe 

Hutchinson, A. Oliver 

Hutchinsan. W. Pancoast 

Itkin Parker 

Katz Peterson 

Kelly Petrarea 

Kernick Piecola 

Klingaman Pievsky 

Knepper Pitts 

Kolter Polite 

Kowalyshyn ~ott 

Kukovich Pratt 

Lashinger Prendergast 

Laughlin Pyles 

Lehr Quest 

Letterma. Rappaport 

Levi Ravenstahl 

Levin Renwick 

Lincoln Rhodes 

Livengood Richardson 

Loye Rieger 

Lynch Ritter 

Mackowski Ruggier0 

Madigan Ryan 

w 

Salvatore 

Scanlon 

Scheaffer 

Schmitt 

Schweder 

Scirica 

Seltzer 

Shupnik * 

Sirianni 

Smith, E. 

Smith, L. 

Spencer 

Spitz 

Stnirs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Taylor. E. 

Taylor. F. 

Tenaglio 

Thomas 

TreUo 

Valicenti 

Wagner 

Wansacz 

Wargo 

Wass 

Weidner 

Wenger 

Wiggins 

Wilson 

Wilt 

Wise 

Wright, D. 

Wrieht. J. L. 

Irvis, 

Speaker

NAYS--3 

Goebel Jones White 

NOT VOTING-9 

Borski Johnson Miscevich Vroon 


Haskell 


amendment was agreed to. 



Will the House agree to the bill as amended on thud con- 

sideration? 

Bill as amended was agreed to. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. This hill has been considered on 

three different days and agreed to and is now on final passage. 

The question is, shall the bill pass finally? 

The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Berks, Mr. Davies. 

Mr. DAVIES. Mr. Speaker, again I would address the maker 

or sponsor of the hill on the question that I was trying to pnr- 

sue with Mr. Miller and his amendment and I would address it 

thus: Does this in any way guarantee that in the process there 

will be a notation in the records that if there is a conviction, 

and this depository has that, that there are guarantees that if it 

is under appeal to an appellate court or it is under appeal from 

the state courts into the Federal courts, where there is a ques- 

tion still to he resolved on the matter, that there will he this no- 

tation placed therein and that a guarantee, of course, that the 

information will he updated and made readily available when 

and if there are reversals by those courts in these particular 

cases? 

Mr. BERSON. If I understand your question correctly, this 

bill does attempt to insure the completeness and the accuracy 

of records to be kept by criminal justice agencies in this state 

and it is part of the completeness and accuracy of criminaljus- 

tice records. Obviously, the status of convictions, appeals, de- 

terminations of appeals are parts of a criminal justice record, 

and if this bill functions properly, all of that kind of informa- 

tion should be properly recorded in the record. This hill is de- 

signed todo that. 

We have no present law now that deals with that subject, un- 

fortunately. 

Mr. DAVIES. All right. Now let us say it supposedly goes to 

the Supreme Court of the United States, as an example, will the 

matter of the record then, when they find in reversal and the 

conviction is reversed, will the prior conviction then disappear 

or will there be a notation as to why a reversal was made for 

some, let us say, technical point of evidence or violation in the 

proceeding of arrest, or will the entire record then he com- 

pletely or simply wiped clean as far as the Commonwealth's 

system of records will reflect? What is the disposition then of 

the record if this would occur? 

Mr. BERSON. It would be my understanding that if a convic- 

tion is appealed, in the example that you gave, to the United 

States Supreme Court, and the conviction is reversed, the rec- 

ord should reflect the fact that the conviction is no longer a 

1 conviction but that it has been reversed. However, under this 

bill, the record remains. The record is not obliterated. The origi- 

nal arrest is still in the record. It is still there, and the dis- 

position of the arrest, to wit, a conviction reversed on ap- 

peal, will still be there. The man may then want to petition the 

court and ask that the record be expunged because he has, in ef- 

fect, been acquitted, hut that is up to the court to decide 

! whether they willexpunge that record. As the hill stands, there 

is no expungement in such a situation; the arrest record is 

there, the conviction record and the record on appeal. But it 

probably will not go into the technical details of why the con- 

viction was reversed on appeal. You have got to manage the 

paperwork in some fashion. 

Mr. DAVIES. All right, thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentle- 

man from Philadelphia, Mr. O'Donnell. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. I would like to interrogate the sponsor, 

please. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. Will Mr. Berson consent to in- 

terrogation? 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Mr. Speaker, I want to make sure that I am 

reading this bill right. In section 702, under the duties of the 

privacy in the security council, that appears to he a very, very 

broad mandate especially in subsections 1 and 10, wherein the 

council has a mandate to establish rules and regulations for 

criminal history, record information, security completeness, ac- 

curacy, etcetera, and then, in subsection 10, carry out all other 

powers, duties, responsibilities given to it by this act. That is a 

fairly broad mandate, is it not? 

Mr. BERSON. There are powers and duties conferred upon it 

by the act. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. In subsection 201, the first duty of crimi- 

nal justice agencies, as outlined there, is that every criminal 

justice agency will be required to maintain, in effect, such in- 

formation as is required by the privacy and security council 

under the mandate in chapter 7. Is that correct? 

Mr. BERSON. That is correct. We are trying to insure a uni- 

form system and a complete and accurate system. Records that 

are incomplete or inaccurate are just absolutely worthless. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. One effect of this bill would be to create 

the privacy and security council and to place in their hands con- 

trol over criminal history record information, except for the 

limits in this bill. 

Mr. BERSON. "Control over" are the maec words. I do not 

know what you mean by that. There are certain delineated r e 

sponsihilities in the act that the privacy and security council 

has, one of which is to insure that records are kept in a uniform 

way and that they are complete and that they areaccurate. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Let me ask you another question. 

Mr. BERSON. Sure. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Does the public have access to criminal his- 

tory record information under this bill? 

Mr. BERSON. The public at large? No. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. So under the amendments that have been 

adopted by the House-- 

Mr. BERSON. Let me say this: The public has the traditional 

access that it has now,.


Mr. WONNELL. Only todockets. 

Mr. BERSON. To dockets and compilations kept in the nor- 

ma1 course of business. They would not have access that they 

have today. They do not have access today to the central state 

police repository of criminal justice records and they do not 

have it under this bill. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Is there not a distinction between criminal 

history record information and docket information? 

Mr. BERSON. Yes, there is. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Under this bill the public would not have 

access to criminal history record information. Is that correct? 

Mr. BERSON. That is correct. 

Mr. O'DONNE1,L. Rut reporters would, under that amend- 

ment? 

Mr. BERSON. As I read the Miller amendment, yes. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. So the posture of this hill now to be passed 

by the House would be that the public would not have access 

but that private employers, with permission, would, and re- 

porters would? 

Mr. BERSON. If I read the Miller amendment, it would give 

the working press accessM the centralrepository. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Let me give you two hypotheticals which I 

would like to respond to in terms of this bill: My secretary, as I 

understand it, is an employe of a Commonwealth agency. Sheis 

our employe, right? 

Mr. BERSON. Yes. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. All right. 

Suppose somebody decides to run against me for public of- 

fice, and I strongly suspect they have a long history of criminal 

activities. If I ask my secretary, who is an employe of a Cam- 

monwealth agency, to contact a court to find out the back- 

ground would she he guilty of a misdemeanor or felony under 

this bill? 

Mr. BERSON. Contact thecourt? 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Or whoever is holding that information, 

clerkor court of sessions. 

Mr. BERSON. No. Those records are specifically exempt 

from the confidentiality provisions of this act. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. The criminal record information? 

Mr. BERSON. The traditional court records of police blotters, 

docket entries, and things like that are exempt from this bill. 

What we are talking about are state police central repository 

records and police repository records. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Yes, but the problem is that what consti- 

tutes the records in the central repository will be determined 

under this act by the privacy and security council. Also the dis- 

tinction between docket information and the criminal history 

record information is such that if my secretary went for the 

record information, she would be guilty of a misdemeanor 

under rule 902? 

Mr. BERSON. I do not think so. I do not read the bill that 

way. Your secretary is certainly entitled to go to any tradi- 

tional source of criminal justice information such as the police 

blotters, docket entries, any sort of chronologically kept rec- 1 

ords kept them as they are today and have access to them, as 

the puhlic in general has access to them without any violation 

of the statutes. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. You made reference to what is tradition- 

ally available to the puhlic. Is it what is traditionally available j 

to the public which presently vary from county to county, from 

court to court, and in the discretion of the court administration 

in each case? 

Mr. BERSON. Yes, that is true, but we do try to spell out 

what those traditionally available records are in here. It says, 

preserve the access of the public to those records. They are not 

that widely different. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Is tradition not defined by practice? 

Mr. BERSON. Well, I suppose. But we do spell out in this bill 

that those records do remain and we make specific reference to 

chronologically kept criminal justice records, which are the 

usual docket entries, police blotters, et cetera. Then we say 

those arenot covered; they are available. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Suppose the Philadelphia court system 

made a tradition of never releasing the sentencing practices of 

their judges. That is traditionally unavailable and that would 

remain unavailable under the bill? 

Mr. BERSON. Sentencing records of judges are not, I sup- 

pose, and would be a criminal justice record. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. They sure would. 

Mr. BERSON. I suppose as to that, since they have never 

existed, that I am aware of, I suppose they are covered by that. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. Thank you. Mr. Speaker. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. For what purpose does the gen- 

tleman rise? 

Mr. O'DONNELL. On the bill. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The gentleman is in order and 

may proceed. 

Mr. O'DONNELL. I would urge the House to vote against this 

hill. I think that we are doing the worst possible thing in this 

bill, and that is that we are making a vast amount of information 

available to a central depository. The amount and the nature 

of that information is not specifically defined. This bill is a 

broad empowerment of a privacy and security council, which, 

although it goes under the name of privacy and security, its 

real identity will remain to be seen. 

Criminal justice planners have an avid appetite for information, 

and there is no guarantee that merely giving them the 

name privacy and security will in any way guarantee that they 

will not be collecting vast information. I think that under the 

wording of this bill that is a very definite possibility. 

I think such information in the hands of a central depository 

is a very, very dangerous threat to civil liberties. On the other 

hand, the public does not have access, unless you are a reporter. 

If you have a crime problem in your community and if you are 

very anxious to find out the nature of that crime problem and 

the record background of the individuals, then you cannot get 

that information unless you happen to be a reporter. 

I do not think we can tolerate that kind of innominate. 1 do 

not think that we can permit central repositories to have vast 

amounts of information and at the same time shut those 

sources of information off to the public except inasmuch as the 

press decides that it is relevant. We all have our own views on 

that subject, hut, in my opinion, if you live in a place like Philadelphia, 

the only thing that is relevant to the press in terms of 

w


crime is not what is happening in your community, hut rather 

that axe murder or that very dramatic kind of a slaying. The 

public needs access to a lot more information than that. 

I think that the terms that we are dealing with are somewhat 

vague here. Information that is traditionally available, infor- 

mation that is docket information and information that is 

broader than that and goes into the criminal history record, I 

do not think that that is a sufficient structure to prevent 

against the dangers that are involved here. I urge you to vote 

against the bill. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentle. 

man from Philadelphia, Mr. Berson. 

Mr. BERSON. I would urge the House to support the bill. 

We have been told by the Law Enforcement Assistance 

Agency that Pennsylvania is one of the remaining three states 

in the United States which has not enacted some privacy and 

security legislation with respect to criminal justice records. It is 

a requirement of the Law Enforcement Assistance Agency that 

the states do enact such legislation as a condition of continuing 

to receive Law Enforcement Assistance Agency grants of 

which this state gets many millions of dollars. 

We held extensive public hearings. We proposed to the public 

two different versions of this hill; one much more expensive 

than this one in terms of foreclosing access to criminal justice 

records. We had hearings in Harrisburg. We had hearings in 

Philadelphia. He heard 50-odd witnesses concerning this bill. 

We have amended this bill on a couple of occasions to try to sat- 

isfy the various competing interests of those who are primarily 

interested in privacy, those who are primarily interested in 

open access, and we have tried to balance those interests in as 

fair a way as we think wecan. 

We think this hill is as good an adjustment of those two very 

real competing interests as possihle. I think Mr. O'Donnell 

speaks on behalf of the open-access point of view, hut we have 

had, and we will have, prohahly, speakers on behalf of the pri- 

vacy point of view, and that was the point that Mr. White 

raised in his debate with Mr. Miller on Mr. Miller's amendment. 

There are competing interests at work here. We do think, 

however, that this bill is a good effort, not perfect-no hill is- 

but it is a good effort to try to balance those competing inter- 

ests by keeping the usual records, that are available to the pub 

lic and the press today, open to them and yet granting a degree 

of privacy and security as to those other records that are com- 

piled by the state police and local police departments, hut insur- 

ing their accuracy, their availability to the individual involved, 

and to the press under Mr. Miller's amendment. I think it is as 

good as we can get, and it is important that we pass it if we are 

going to continue to receive LEAA funds. 


man from Berks, Mr. Davies. 

Mr. DAVIES. Again may I place several questions of interro- 

gation to the maker or the sponsor of the bill, Mr. Berson? 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. Does the gentleman, Mr. 

Berson, consent to interrogation? 

The gentleman, Mr. Davies, is in order and may proceed. 

Mr. DAVIES. Mr. Speaker, under the Helfrick amendment 

with its provisions, does this go beyond the hasic confines of 

the hill and now actually removes all records, the docket record 

and everything else, as far as any juvenile convictions regard- 

less of whether it would he for arson, rape or, let us say, the 

most serious felonies under the current statutes of the Cam- 

monwealth? 

Mr. BERSON. Mr. Ilavies, you have got me at a disadvau- 

tage. 1 do not have a copy of Mr. Helfrick's amendment. 

Juvenile records are controlled by a separate piece of legisla- 

tion that was passed by the General Assembly a year or so ago. 

There was specifically exempted originally from this statute-- 

just indulge me for a minute while I review it-and it would ap- 

pear to me that under the Helfrick amendment juvenile records 

can be expunged only upon, and it does not contemplate auto- 

matic expungement. It can only be expunged upon-a petition 

to the court, and where the court finds one of the three condi- 

tions is present. 

I think that that even today, without any legislation, a court 

has the power to expunge criminal records. So in doing this, in 

a sense, I suppose, Mr. Helfrick is limiting the court's power to 

expunge juvenile records because today they can expunge them 

practically at will without any legislative guidelines or stand- 

ards to measure whether a record ought to he expunged or not. 

It would he my judgment that if the juvenile was guilty of a 

serious offense, such as arson, such as you mentioned, which is 

a felony and a serious one, the court would he extremely reluc- 

tant to expunge such a record. 

Mr. DAVIES. Mr. Speaker, after listening at some length to 

the testimony that was in front of the Special Committee on In- 

vestigating the Admittance of Individuals to Classes at the 

State Police Academy, would it he possible that under-things 

similar to this, that if the juvenile record was removed that it 

would he even more difficult or, for example, a placement body 

or the state police themselves or any security agency, including 

the military or, let us say, others, to make a determination as to 

the actual records of this individual, regardless of age? I am 

saying, let us say, they were committed at 16 and 17 years of 

age, where again a person by his own action today can become a 

liberated individual and does have some knowledge of their ac- 

tions and is responsible for their actions under segments of 

Pennsylvania law now? In other words, the question is, how 

could these agencies or how could even the State Police make 

these determinations with directness and some kind of as- 

surances that they do have the factual records, if this does be 

come a fact? 

Mr. BERSON. My response is twofold, Mr. Speaker. Number 

one, you have to draw a distinction between arrest records and 

conviction records or nonconviction records. The arrest records 

remain. There is no expungement of those. They are there. 

They are still there. Now, the second thing is, that under the 

Helfrick amendment, if I understand it-and Mr. Helfrick can 

correct me if I am wrong-any time a petition to expunge a rec- 

ord is brought, the local prosecutor has to he given notice of the 

bringing of such a petition, and he, of course, if he is a responsi- 

ble fellow, and I am sure that he is, if he thinks that it is a seri- 

ous matter, he is going to go in and oppose it, and I think if he 

opposes it, a court is going to be extremely reluctant to give it.


Now, you have only got three situations here where you can get 

it. One of them is if the complaint is dismissed. I do not think 

you want to preserve records in that case and I would think you 

would want to give the juvenile a break by allowing it to he ex- 

punged, but even there, under the Helfrick amendment, it can- 

not he done except on a petition presented to a judge with n* 

tice to the district attorney that he can come in and oppose it. 

Mr. DAVIES. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If I might speak on 

the hill itself, it seems to me that the key again is a matter of 

the frailty or the possibility of some failure in the system. Now 

when Mr. Berson made the comment, if he is a good fellow, I 

have no guarantees how diligent district attorneys are in pur- 

suing their efforts with those records and. if I take the track 

record of some district attorneys, even let us say in my portion 

of the State, I would begin to question the dihaence and the 

forthrightness and, let us say, even some of the outstanding 

performance of those individuals. I then come to the question 

of whether or not, again, this is not going to be fraught with 

human failures and problems that again bring about the ques- 

tion of what is going to be a diligent action, what is going to be 

good, where the records are going to be updated and main- 

tained, and not that I question the intent of the sponsors or the 

directness of it; it is a question of what kind of guarantees do 

we have to that end, and I would be willing to listen, even if it 

took all day, to have that kind of guarantee. When you are 

- 

talking about for those where it should he taken care of and 

was ignored or was not and that the record clearly states that 

the man was finally. of course, found innocent and what techni- 

cality was involved, or in the pursuance by the attorney or the 

district attorney in the keeping of those records for each and 

every one of those 67 counties of the Commonwealth. Thank 

you, Mr. Speaker. 


man from Lehigh, Mr. Zeller. 

Mr. ZELLER. Mr. Speaker, there are a few warning signs 

that should be brought to the attention of the members, which I 

concur with Mr. O'Donnell in regard to, to be very, I should say, 

doubtful as to what this will do. For example, I will give you 

some of the warning signs. 

First of all, the sponsors did not include the reporters and 

they have not included the public, and if you notice the votes on 

the hoard, when the reporter issue came up, and take a look at 

the sponsors, you will kind of get a little idea what is going on. 

The juvenile end of it I do not have a problem with because I 

have always been a strong supporter-as former mayor I have 

been a strong supporter-of covering and trying to leave the 

files of juveniles, or even the information, to the press out of 

their hands. The simple reason is, as a rule, as far as juveniles 

are concerned, the first offender is branded for life, and for the 

habitual, it only boosts his ego when he sees his name in the 

paper. So you do not really get anywhere by publicizing the 

names of juveniles or even the crimes. I do not have a problem 

in that area. My problem is one of public records. For example, 

those bleeding hearts and the Civil Liberties Union, and a few 

more of these people who cry for the public to pay for all these 

crimes, adjudication-they are paying for the lawyers now, 

they are paying for incarceration-so if the public is paying for 

all this, why should they not have access to the records to know 

who they are paying for and what they are paying for? So as far 

as I am concerned. I think that is a bunch of gobbledygook. 

Also, when I see the follow up by Mr. Berson, with all respect 

to him, to give us a scare tactic, a financial scare tactic called 

LEAA - Law Enforcement Assistance Agency. Now if anyone 

knows anything about LEAA, which we have been associated 

with since 1968, this is only seeding money. So do not give 

them any ideas. Yon will be losing a lot of money. So if you give 

that idea to LEAA, they will say, oh, we are going to lose 

money. My goodness, federal money, they have to have that. It 

is only seeding money to get a program started. There is noth- 

ing ongoing about it. so therefore do not let them walk you into 

these so-called real liberal traps. 

So I say there are some real scare tactics here, especially 

when your public, whom you represent, are paying for all the 

lawyers, incarcerations, you arepayingfor everything, andstill 

you do not have access to a record. I cannot believe it. As a mat- 

ter of fact, I think it is about time we start turning this thing 

around, and just watch the board and the votes and you will get 

a little idea who is all for the so-called freezing everything. The 

recent State Police instance is a fine example. So do not be 

walked into something that you might think, oh, this sounds 

good back home. I got to vote for this because my public will 

like it. It will not take you long to explain it to them that the 

oublic is losincout to the criminals and all the hleedine hearts. 

- 

* 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentleman 

from Berks, Mr. Davies. 

w 

Mr. DAVIES. Mr. Speaker, I just have one other question on 

the bill itself. I just got this note and I would like-- 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. It is the understanding of the 

Chair. Mr. Davies. that vou have alreadv . s~oken . twice on the 

bill. 

Mr. DAVIES. No, it is a matter of interrogation, not speaking 

on the bill. I would like to address it, if I might, not to the sponsor 

but one of the cosponsors, Mr. Scirica. If he could give me 

some guarantee, I might better address myself as to how I am 

going to vote on the hill, and I just received this. 

Mr. Speaker, is there some way or other that I can be given a 

guarantee that someone is going to pursue the upkeeping of 

these records in reference to juveniles other than the matter of 

the district attorney, or there is going to be some sort of implementation 

or system of implementation that these records 

are going to be as, let us say, perfect as is humanly possible to 

maintain? I am spealung now because of the volume of proceedings 

that we have in the courts today and the matter of all 

of these involved records, that there is some sort of system in 

this that we are going to have-I am going to call it for want of 

a better term-a fairly accurate record as to what we have in 

this system. 

Mr. SCIRICA. Mr. Speaker, in the bill there is a section that 

provides that the privacy and security council shall provide for 

the accuracy and completeness of all criminal history informa- W 

tion. Now there is no specific reference to the juvenile records, 

but I think the overall intent of the bill is that the juvenile records 

are to be included in this. The mandate that we are giving 

not only to the privacy and security council hut also to the en-


tire criminal justice system is to maintain the accuracy of these I NAYS-81 

records. 

Mr. DAVIES. All right. Now one final question. Mr. Speaker: 

What is the track record in the other 49 states? What has been 

the track record in the other 49 states in total and particularly, 

let us say, in reference to the juvenile records? 

Mr. SCIRICA. The only specific reference to the juvenile rec- 

ords included in this particular bill is contained within the Hel- 

frick amendment. Otherwise. Mr. Speaker, they are not par- 

ticularly covered by the entire bill, so I cannot give you that 

guarantee that you seek. 

Mr. DAVIES. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 


man from Lehigh, Mr. ZeUer, for the second time. 

Mr. ZELLER. Mr. Speaker, I forgot to bring to the attention 

of the members, just to read, if you only read, that part of it, it 

should give you a message, the explanation right below the bill 

on your calendar. It creates a privacy and security council. Now 

I have been with this Law Enforcement Administration Agency 

as far as region 2 is concerned for 10 years. We have been 

trying to get a central storage, a central operation of informa- 

tion where you could hit a computer, get the information out 

real quick. That is different. That is police information of every 

criminal act or violation in the state. That is not the problem. 

The problem here is another security council creates a privacy 

and security council. You try to get some information. That 

outfit will he set up there and that will be gung ho. You try to 

get information. That is what I am telling you. It is altogether 

different what they are trying to feed you here. 

I 

I 

Anderson 

Armstrong 

Barber 

Bittle 

Brandt 

Brown 

Cassidy 

CianeiuUl 

Cimini 

Cohen 

Cole 

Cowell 

Davies 

DeWeese 

Dietz 

Dininni 

Donatueci 

Dorr 

Dumas 

Foster, A. 

Foster, W. 

Gallen 

George, C. 

Giammarco 

Gillette 

Halverson 

Hamilton 

Harper 

Hasay 

Hayes. S. E. 

Honaman 

Hutchinson, 

Johnson 

Jones 

Klt, ---.- 

Kelly 

Kernick 

Klingaman 

Kukovich 

Lashineer 

Lehr 

Letterman 

Levi 

Lincoln 

Maekowski 

Madigan 

Manmiller 

MeCall 

McClatchy 

McIntyre 

Milanovich 

A. Miller 

Milliron 

Mwhlmann 

Mowery 

Noye 

O'Brien, D. 

O'Donnell 

Oliver 

Pancoast 

Peterson 

NOT VOTING-13 

Piccola 

Pitts 

Polite 

Pott 

Richardson 

Rieger 

Salvatore 

Scanlon 

Scheaffer 

Seltzer 

Sirianni 

Smith. E 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Wagner 

Wass 

Wenger 

White 

Wiggins 

ZeUer 

Beloff Laughlin Mebus Tenaglio 

Borski Levin Miscevich Vroon 


Haskell 

The majority required by the Constitution having voted in 

the affirmative, the question was determined in the affirma- 

tive. 

Ordered, That the clerk present the same to the Senate for 

concurrence. 

On the question recurring. 

Shall the bill pass finally? 

REMARKS ON VOTES 

I The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentle- 

Agreeable to the provision of the Constil xtion, the yeas and 

nays will now be taken. 

man from Beaver, Mr. Laughlin. For what purpose does the 

gentleman rise? 

Mr. LAUGHLW. Mr. Speaker, I was called to the phone 

Arthurs 

Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

Bittinger 

Brunner 

Bud 

Burns 

Caltagirone 

Caputo 

Cessar 

DeMedio 

DeVerter 

DiCarlo 

Dombrowski 

Doyle 

Duffv 

Englehart 

FM . .. 

Fiseher. R. R. 

Fisher, D. M. 

Flaherty 

Freind 

Fryer 

Gallagher 

Gamble 

YEAS104 

Gatski Musto 

Geesey Novak 

Geisler O'Brien, B. 

George, M. O'ConneU 

Gleeson O'Keefe 

Goebel Parker 

Goodman Petrarca 

Greenfield Pievsky 

Greenleaf Pratt 

Grieco Prendergast 

Hayes. D. S. Pyles 

Helfriek Quest 

Hoeffel Rappaport 

Hutchinson. W. Ravenstahl 

Itkin Renwick 

Knepper Rhodes 

Kolter Ritter 

Kowalyshyn Ruggiero 

Livengood Ryan 

1,opue Schmitt 

Lynch Schweder 

Manderino Scirica 

McLane Shupnik 

Meluskey Smith. L. 

Morris Spencer 

Mrkonic Spitz 

Mullen. M. P. 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Taylor, E. 

Taylor. F. 

Thomas 

Trello 

Valicenti 

Wansacz 

Wargo 

Weidner 

Wilson 

Wilt 

Wise 

Wright. D. 

Wright, J. L. 

Yahner 

Yohn 

Zearfass 

Zitterman 

Zord 

Zwikl 

Irvis. 

Speaker 

while HB 2095 was being voted. I would like to he recorded in 

the affirmative. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The gentleman's remarks will be 

spread upon the record. 

The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Philadelphia, Mr. 

Rappaport. For what purpose does the gentleman rise? 

Mr. RAPPAPORT. Mr. Speaker, I would like to be recorded 

as voting "aye" on HB 2095. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The gentleman's remarks will he 


The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Philadelphia, Mr. 

Borski. For what purpose does the gentleman rise? 

Mr. BORSKI. Mr. Speaker, when the vote on HB 2095 was 

taken, my switch was inoperative. I would like the record to 

show that I would have voted in the affirmative. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The gentleman's remarks will be 



/ 

The SPEAKER. The Chair wishes to thank the gentleman. 

Mr. Wansacz, for so ably presiding over the floor of the House.


He has presided with the same cool demeanor and incisive intel- Degty Sheriffs Association in counties of the second class, and 

ligence which he has shown in all of his years on the floor of the ma "g edltorlalcorrections. 

House. The Speaker is particularly unhappy that the gentleman Rereported from Appropriations. 

has decided not to run again for office. The people of the Com- 

monwealth will miss him as shall we. 1 SB 706, PN I077 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

Good luck to you, John. 

BILLS REREPORTED FROM COMMITTEES 

HB 1186, PN 2568 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act amending the "Adoption Act," approved July 24. 

1970 (P. L. 620, No. 208), incorporating additional provisions 

relating to due process, noticeand best interest of the adoptee 

further providing for relinqulshment of parental rights and 

providing for certain options. 

Rereported from Appropriations. 

HB 1333, PN 3704 (Amended) By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act amending "The Fiscal Code," approved April 9,1929 

(P. L. 343, No. 176), further providing for compromise of debts 

by certain corporations. 

Rereported from Appropriations 

HB2444, PN 3706 (Amended) By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Art creatlng a Falr Pd~t~c.al I'ralthv> ;\(I. grdrltlng th? 

Hureau of Electlun.. additional iruwers aud durles and impuslng 

penalties 



An Act amending the act of May 12, 1943 (P. L. 259. No. 

120), entitled, as amended, "An act providing for the payment 

by the State Treasurer, of the amount of the tax on premiums 

naid hv foreien rasualtv insuranr~ ~ ~ comnanies."". . ~~~ 

for rrr- 

An Act amending the act of June 1, 1945 (P. L. 1242. No. 

428), entitled "State Highway Law" providing for removal by 

the secretary of routes on the State highway system. 


BILLS REPORTED FROM COMMITTEES 

~~2531, ~ ~ 3 3 4 0 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act amending the "General Appropriations Act of 1977," 

approved Au st 20,1977 (No. 11A), increasing the appropria- 

tion for pub% school special education and decreasing the 

appropriation for private school special education in the De- 

partment of Education. 

An Act establishing the Pennsylvania Commission on Crimes Appropriations. 

and Delinquency, providing for its powers and duties establish. 

ing several advisory committees within the commission and HB 2556, PN 3386 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

providing for their powers and duties. 

A Joint Rt,solu:ion proposing an rmtrgency Constituuonnl 


amendment to tlir Constitution of the Commonwralth of Peons.vl!,ania 

grantlng the General Assemhly the power to enact 

HB 1846, PN 2254 

By Mr. PIEVSKY special, laws to aid certain individuals, corporations, associatlons, 

lnstltutions or nonpubllc schools adversely affected by 

An Act amending "The Pennsylvania Occupational Disease conditions caused by the storm and flood of July 20,1977. 

Act," approved June 21,1939 (P. L. 566, No. 284), further providing 

for the running of certain statutes of limitation apph- Appropriations. 

cable to certain benefits. 


HB 2586, PN3442 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

I A Supplement to the act of (P. L. ,No. )?en- 

HB2029, PN 2541 By Mr. PIEVSKY I titled "An Act providing for the capital budget for the fiscal 

year 1978.1979,'' itemizing trans ortation assistance projects 

An Act amending the "Neighborhood Assistance Act," ap to be acquired or constructed by tie Pennsylvania Transportaproved 

November 29, 1967 (P. L. 636, No. 292), further defin- tion Assistance Authority together with their estimated finaning 

neighborhood organization and making editorial changes. cial cost; authoriiing the incurring of debt without the ap- 

Rereported from Appropriations. proval of the electors for the purpose of financing the projects, 

I stating the estimated useful life of the projects, and making an 

HB2178, PN 3705 (Amended) By Mr. PIEVSKY 1 appropriation. 

An Act estahliihln~. 3 un~forrn mile:ige fee ior all uifirlala. 

officers and rmploy~ri of the Comm~mw~alth. 11s pol~t~rnl sub 

div~sions, lnwrmedldtt uruts. and auttn,rltles 

Appropriations. 


Rereported from Appropriations 

An Act making an appropriation to the Governor for the Erie 

Philharmonic Orchestra. 

HB 2404, PN 3097 By Mr. PIEVSKY Appropriations. 

, . ~ 

HB2701, PN 3631 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act making an appropriation to the Governor for the 

Lansdowne Philharmonic Orchestra. 



An Act making an appropriation to the Schuylkill County 

Council for the Arts. 


tain p;rpo~es,3' providi& for payments ;nto the sheriff And ( Appropriations. 


An Act making an appropriation to the Department of Envi- 

ronmental Resources for the Pennsylvania Conservation 

Leadership School at Stone Valley Recreation Area. 

r*'

1978. LEGISLATIVE JOURNAL-HOUSE 2833 

HB 2704, PN 3634 By Mr. PIEVSKY i HB2715, PN 3645 By Mr. PlEVSKY 

An Act making an appropriation to the Central Penn On- An Act making an appropriation to the Lancaster Cleft 

colog~ Group. Palate. 

Appropriations. I Appropriations. 

HB 2705, PN 3635 By Mr. PIEVSKY I HB 2716, PN 3646 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act making an a propriation to the Fox Chase Institute An Act making an appropriation to the Trustees of the Jeffor 

Cancer Research, ~iiladelphia, for the operat~on and maln- ferson Medical College and Hosp~tal of Philadelphia for a comtenance 

of the cancer research program. prehensive program relating to Tay-Sachs disease. 

Appropriations. Appropriations. 


An Act making an appropriation to the Wistar Institute-Re- 

search, Philadelphia, for the operation and maintenance of the 

institute. 


HB2717, PN3647 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act making an appropriation to the Allentown Museum 

of Art at Allentown. 

HB2707. PN 3637 Bv Mr. PIEVSKY 1 2718, PN 3648 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act making an appropriation to Inglis House of Philadel- An Act making an appropriation to the Delaware County 

phia. Center for theBlnd. 



An Act making an appropriation to Lankenau Hospital Phila- 

delphia for research. 



An Act making an appropriation to the Trustees of the Uni- 

versity of Pennsylvania for cardio-vascular studies. 



An Act making an appropriation to St. Francis Hospital, 

Pittsburgh. 


An Act making an appropriation to the Beacon Lodge Camp. 



An Act making an appropriation to the Philadelphia Center 

for the Blind. 




An Act making an appropriation to the Pittsburgh Associa- 

tion for the Blind. 

HB 2712, PN 3642 By Mr. PIEVSKY I HB 2722, PN 3652 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act making an a propriation to the Children's Hospital, An Act making an appropriation to the Rndolphy Residence 

Pittsburgh for ~erebraf~ysfunction. / for'the Blnd. 


HB2711,PN3641 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act malun an appropriation to St. Christopher's Hospi- 

tal of ~hiladelpiia;. Pennsylvania for treatment of Cerebral 

Palsy. 



An Act making an appropriation to the Arsenal Family and 

Children's Center. 

HB 2713, PN 3643 By Mr. PIEVSKY I HB2724, PN 3654 By Mr. PIEVSKY 

An Act making an appropriation to the Pittsburgh Cleft Pal- An Act making an appropriation to the Blair County Society 

ate. 1 for Crippled Children and Adults. 



An Act making an appropriation to the Burn Foundation of 

Greater Delaware Valley. 



An Act making an appropriation to the United Cerebral 

Palsy of Lackawanna County, Scranton. 

Appropriations.



SENATE MESSAGE 

An Act making an appropriation to the United Cerebral Palsy 

of Pittsburgh and vicinity, Pittsburgh. 


GOVERNOR'S VETO OFSH 12;3:1 OVEKRILIDEN 

The clerk of the Senate, being introduced, presented Senate 

Bill numbered and entitled as follows, together with the ohjec- 

4 

HB2727. PN 3657 B~ M,., pmv~~y tiunsof the Governor. 

An Act making an ap ropriation to the United Cerebral Pal- 

sy of Lehigh Valley. BetRlehem. 



An Act making an appropriation to the united cerebral pal. 

sy of Northwest Pennsylvania, Erie. 



An Act making an appropriation to the Association of Re- 

tarded Citizens, Reading. 



An Act makin an appropriation to the United Cerebral Pal- 

sy of Schuylkill &unty, Pottsville. 



making an ap ropriation to the ~~~~~~h~~~ united 

Cerebral Palsy of South 8entral Pennsylvania. 

SB 1233, PN 2034 

An Act amending Title 18 (Crimes and 0ffenses)of the Pennsylvania 

Consolidated Statutes further arovidine for the imposition 

of sentences for murder. 

With the information that said bill had been passed by both 

Houses and vetoed by His Excellency, the Governor, and has 

since been reconsidered in the Senate and passed by the neces- 

sary two-thirds vote. the ohjectinns of the Governor to the con- 

trary notwithstanding. 

COMMUNICATION FROM GOVERNOR 

VETO OF SB 1233. PN 2034 

The Secretary to the Governor presented the followine corn. 

munications from the Governor: 

Commonwealth of Pennsylvania 

Governor's Office, Harrisburg 

July 1,1978. 

To the Honorable, the Senate of the Commonwealth of 

Pennsylvania: 


I return herewith, without my a proval. Senate Bill No. 

1233, Printer's No. 2034, entitled, ''ln Act amending Title 18 

(Crimes and Offenses) of the Pennsylvania Consolidated Stat- 

SB 906, PN 2 134 (Amended) Mr. PIEVSKY utes, further providing for the imposition of sentences for mur- 

An Act amending the act of July 1, 1978 (No. 56A), entitled der." 

act a propriating the Federal augmentation to the The citizens of this Commonwealth are expressing growing 

tive and judicial ~~~~~t~~~~ of the commonwealth es. frustration with the criminal justice system and its failure to 

tahlishing restricted receipts accounts for the fiscal period July deal adequately and swiftly with those who have taken a hu- 

1978 to June 30, 1979 and for the payment of bills man life. We emphatically demand an end to violent crimes and 

and remaining unpaid at the close of the fiscal period ending the debilitating fear that permeates an environment of vi- 

June 30.1978," changing and adding appropriations. 

olence. 

The General Assembly has addressed itself to this legitimate 


frustration and demand. It has approved constitutional amendments 

aimed at easing the overburdened criminal justice sys- 

SB 1493, PN 1895 B~ M ~. PIEVSKY tem through more efficient prosecntorial procedures and 

through the appointment of additional appellate judicial man- 

An Act making an appropriation to the Greater Pittsburgh power. Allowing prosecutors to dispense with the cumbersome 

Guild for the Blind Pittsburgh Pennsylvania for the provision grand jury system of indictment in favor of the more expedient 

of services to the blind. 

manner of filing criminal information will do much to conform 

that system to today's realities. The addition of Judges to the 


Su erior Court, the court charged wth oversight on the criminafjustice 

system. will help restore to the system the ability to 

ANNOUNCEMENT ON VOTING 

dispense swift and certain punishment to criminal offenders. 

I commend the General Assembly for these and related re- 

The SPEAKER. For the information of the members, the formsof our criminal Justicesystem. 

I have before me now Senate Bill No. 1233. an amendment to 

Chair is about to have read the veto message on the death pen- thecrimes code. 

alty bill. All members who intend to vote on this measure must This bill would reinstate imposition of the death penalty in 

be in their seats. ~h~ request has already been made that only Pennsylvania. An individual found guilty of first-degree murder 

could he subject to death or life imprisonment dependingon 

those members actually physically present be recorded. The relevantaggravatingandmitigatingcj,.cumstances, 

Chair would strongly suggest that on such a volatile subject as I cannot approve this hill. 

this, each do his or her own voting and no one I understand the demand that society has an obligation to 

permanently protect its members from those who have crimi- 

You assume that an absent be nally taken the life of another. No one can minimize the legitivoted 

in a special way and you may assume incorrectly and you macy of this demand. But I do not believe that our society is 

may do harm to that member. So the Chair would respectively better protected by allowing the State to violate the very values 

rt is delegated to preserve. 

suggest that only those members who are physically present he I have seen no convincing evidence supporting the proposi. 

recorded on this vote. Let there be no problem about it. tion that the death penalty deters the commission of serious


crime. And Senate Bill No. 1233 goes well beyond those limited 

areas of crime deterence I described in my veto message of 

March 22,1974 in respect to H. B. 1060. 

The reintroduction of capital punishment could lull us into 

the false belief that we have effectively responded to the need 

for an end to violence when-in fact-we have not. 

The urgent task of making the criminal justice system oper- 

ate to our benefit and for our protection must he addressed. 

The General Assembly has begun the task of strengthening ev- 

ery facet of the law enforcement and criminal justice systems. 

To the extent that the reinstitution of the death penalty turns 

us away from this more difficult but more important task, I 

must oppose it. 

Ultimately, I do not believe that the State should take thelife 

of one who has taken the life of another. I do not believe that 

the barbarous behavior of an individual necessitates the har- 

barous response of the Commonwealth in the name of protect- 

ing its citizens. I do not believe that the death penalty will 

makeour lives and our environment any safer. 

For these reasons the hill is not approved. 

MILTON J. SHAPP. 

GOVERNOR 

The SPEAKER. The question is; Shall SB 1233, PN 2034, 

become the law of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, the ob 

jections of the Governor to the contrary notwithstanding? 

Those in favor of the hill becoming law, the objections of the 

Governor to the contrary notwithstanding, will vote "aye"; 

those in favor of sustaining the Governor's veto will vote "no." 

MR. FRYER REQUESTED To PRESIDE 1 too long ago. 

The SPEAKER. The Chair at this time, because the Chair 

must speak at a special meeting in the Governor's reception of- 

fice, relinquishes the gavel to the Speaker pro tempore, the 

gentleman, Mr. Fryer. The Speaker will return as rapidly as 

possible to the floor of the House. 

THE SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE (LESTER K. FRYER) 

IN THE CHAIR 


man from Delaware, Mr. Doyle. 

Mr. DOYLE. Mr. Speaker, in my opinion it will not be neces- 

sary to belabor this issue. I think the legislation is very precise 

and clearcut and the Senate House Conference Committee 

worked diligently to produce a hill that would withstand consti- 

tutional muster. 

The Senate overrode the Governor's veto by 44 to 6. I note 

that in the Governor's message for the very first time the Gov- 

ernor does not make any pretense that this legislation is uncon- 

stitutional, hut rather he puts his objections on philosophical 

grounds. 

The best I could do to urge adoption of the measure would he 

to cite the Governor's own language when he said: "The citizens 

of this Commonwealth are expressing growing frustration with 

the criminal justice system and its failure to deal adequately 

and swiftly with those who have taken a human life. We em- 

phatically demand an end to violent crimes and the debilitating 

fear that permeates an environment of violence." 

I agree with him that it is not a deterrent so much as it is a 

protective matter when the very case out of which this leg is la^ 

tion arose allowed a criminal inmate in a prison to not only take 

another's life hut torture him, and that individual was to testi- 

fy at another murder case. 

I think we do need the protection of this legislation. Simply I 

would urge its adoption. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 


man from Allegheny, Mr. Fisher. 

Mr. D. M. FISHER. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

I likewise rise in support of the override of the Governor's ve- 

to on SB 1233, which seeks to reinstate the death penalty here 

in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. 

As Mr. Doyle has aptly stated, the Governor does not find 

fault with the legislative provisions themselves in the bill 

which is before the House today, but rather it is his opinion in 

vetoing SB 1233 that the death penalty is not a deterrent and 

that the Commonwealth should not he involved in taking the 

life of another no matter what the circumstance should be. 

I respectfully disagree. I believe that there are those circum- 

stances in which the death penalty can he a deterrent. It is a 

statute on which we, obviously, in reflecting the will of the 

people whom we represent, have to make that decision as to 

whether or not this Commonwealth should have that type of 

penalty on the books. 

It is oftentimes difficult. We talk about, is it a deterrent or is 

it not a deterrent? It is difficult to find out with any degree of 

proof the answer to this question, but let me relate just briefly, 

factually, something that happened in our end of the state not 

. - 

Over the last year or year and a half, there has been a wave of 

murders in western Pennsylvania - Washington County, 

Beaver County, Allegheny County. One individual was appre- 

hended as a prime suspect in many of those down in the State 

of Florida. Florida has a death penalty bill on the books. It was 

not a capital offense for which he was apprehended in Florida. 

He was also charged with two homicides in the State of South 

Carolina, which has a death penalty statute on their hooks. It 

got hack through the Pittsburgh media and through the inves- 

tigators who were interviewing this gentleman that one of the 

reasons perhaps that he may have pleaded guilty in Florida and 

not opposed extradition into the Commonwealth of Pennsyl- 

vania was because at this time, at the time those offenses were 

committed, there was no death penalty in Pennsylvania but 

there was a death penalty in South Carolina. 

I say that this is an indication, if in fact these allegations 

were true, if in fact this gentleman was involved in these cases. 

that people do consider the laws in the states where crimes are 

committed, and this is a sorry state if the fact that we had no 

death penalty had anything to do at all with those many cases. 

and I think not only from that case hut from other cases that 

people have been involved with in the law-enforcement system, 

we can show that the death penalty dealing with a premedi- 

tated-murder situation with the killing of a police officer and 

other heinous crimes as outlined in this hill is, in fact. a deter- 

rent. 

I think we owe a responsibility to the people of Pennsylvania 

to put this law back on the books and put it on the hooks today. 

Thank you. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the lady 

from Philadelphia. Mrs. Harper.

Mrs. HARPER. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

I rise to support the Governor's veto. I have never seen, read, 

or heard of a wealthy person being electrocuted. If you have 

money, you can buy your freedom, and until the laws are fair, I 

shall continue to vote against electrocution because it is only a 

law against the poor. 

A good example is Dr. Sam Sheppard. He was convicted of 

murdering his pregnant wife; he went free from the electric 

chair simply because he had the money to buy his freedom. 

That is why I shall continue to support the Governor's veto, 

Thsnk . .. -.. . > vm~ LEGISLATIVE JOURNAL-HOUSE September 13, 

I would like to have you consider that, and certainly I am in 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentle- favor of overriding the Governor,s veto, 

man from Philadelphia. Mr. White. 

Mr. WHITE. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

I, too, rise to support the vetoof the Governor with respect tc 

the death penalty here in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. 

I think my colleague. Mrs. Harper, is absolutely correct when 

she states that justice really in this Commonwealth and, in 

fact, in this country is not justice. Being a member of the Judi- 

ciary Committee, we have heard testimony over and over again 

with regard to the disparity in sentencing as it relates to poor 

people, as it relates to women, as it relates to black people in 

the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. 

My colleague from Allegheny County cited an instance of a 

horrendous crime in which an individual, he claimed, was not 

subjected to the death penalty and, therefore, proper punish- 

ment, I believe in his mind, was not meted out. 

There is a case in Philadelphia that I am certain all of us are 

aware of, which relates to the case of Mr. Red Wilkinson, an in- 

dividual who was convicted in our courts of a likewise heinous 

crime, and it was found some time later that Mr. Wilkinson was 

innocent. I would hate to think that any member of this House, 

regardless of our views on criminal justice, would condone the 

killing of innocent men and women. and until such time that 

the justice system in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, until 

such time that the members of this House of Representatives 

deal with the root causes of crime, deal with the frustration of 

people in this Commonwealth who feel that there is no justice. I 

would certainly hope that we would reronsider our artions with 

respect to the death penalty, and with that. Mr. Speaker. I 

would hope that the members would join with me in sustaining 

the Governor's veto on this measure. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 


man from Lehigh, Mr. Zeller. 

Mr. ZELLER. Mr. Speaker, I would like to call to the atten- 

tion of the members of the House the report from the Ameri- 

cans for Effective Law Enforcement out of Evanston, Illinois, 

an organization that has been in business for some time in re- 

gard to crime victims' problems. I would like to get this into the 

record, but I want to mention just a portion of it: 

Our Victim's Rights Center has represented crlmr 

victims in the laws courts and has consulted with at- 

torneys across the country who are working to vindi- 

cate the rights of crime victims. (. . . "Do Victims 

Have Rights?") 

B~~~~~~ of this orientation we make our policy de. 

cisions about important criminal justice issues based, 

in large measure, on how the resolution of those issues 

affect the victims of crime. 

To us, the impact of capital punishment is clear. In 

1967 we stopped executing murderers in the united 

States; in that year we had just over 10,000 homi- 

ii:? :z ~,"~~~~~o'~l,"~&',"~~sfio~,"',"~$~~ 

murder ~ victims ~ had doubled. 

we do not say that our failure to execute any 

murders at all was the only reason that homicide rates 

skyrocketed like they did-we do believe that it was a 

major factor that if we had heen enacting the su. 

preme penalty a large number of innocent victims 

would have been saved. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentle 

man from Philadelphia, Mr. Giammarco. 

Mr. GIAMMARCO. I rise to support theoverride. Let us take 

into consideration all of these children who do not have their 

parents anymore because of the criminals who are living in 

these prisons, getting their three square meals a day, watching 

their TV shows, watching the movies there while the other 

ones are 6 feet under. I feel that we should take a lot in com- 

pass, namely, what I have just said. 

Let us look over the picture. How many are in there for three 

murders? They laugh. When will there he their fourth murder 

or their fifth? If we continue to let them get away with it, this 

is what is going to happen. So I feel that we all should take into 

consideration all of these broken families because of the indi- 

viduals who are sitting in there living high off the hog and 

laughing at us because they are living a good life and the other 

individual is 6 feet under. Thank you. 


man from Allegheny, Mr. Trello. 

Mr. TRELLO. Mr. Speaker, I rise to support the override of 

the Governor's veto. My two colleagues from Philadelphia-al- 

though I respect what they have to say and I will defend to the 

end their right to say it, and also my other colleague from 

Philadelphia who supports the veto, I defend his right-talked 

about children not having their parents around. What about 

the parents who do not have their children around? 

As a police commissioner for 6 years in the borough of 

Coraopolis. I have had occasion to see victims - children who 

were raped, strangled, stabbed with ice picks, and beaten to 

death. I pray to God that I die before my children, because I 

think that is the worst thing that could ever happen to a par- 

ent. And what about these parents who have had their children 

raped and victimized? 

I, too, am a Christian and believe in the 10 Commandments. 

although I am not a born-again Christian, but I am a good 

Christian who goes to church. 

I urge everybody to support the override of the Governor's 

veto. It is something that Pennsylvania has lacked for many, 

w 

r* 

many years and something that we should have starting today. 

~ h ~ ~ k 

you, w 


man fromphiladelphia. Mr. Richardson. 

Mr. RICHARDSON. Thank you very much. Mr. Speaker.


Today I rise to support the sustaining of the Governor's veto 

concerning SB 1233. It seems to me that many memhersof this 

House are not clear on the fact that certainly although SB 1233 

is new, the concern that has arisen out of capital punishment is 

old. On April 12. 1973, this House-and I was at that time a 

very young legislator-had a HB 700, which is very similar to 

SB 1233 essentially. In its potential dealings for action, if 

passed-and I believe that in the dealings of what we are in- 

volved in in this present day and time, specifically as it relates 

to the death penalty-blacks will suffer tremendously because 

of this. 

I would like to just quote for you for just a moment from the 

eminent American citizen, Dr. Louis Knowles, who is now in 

the doctorate of ministry program at the University of Chi- 

cage, and also professor tienneth prew,tt, also an associate 

professor of political science at the University of Chicago, who 

in their hook. "Institutional Racism In America," said on page 

58: 

is often that law is the foundation ofour soci. 

ety. Law sets forth commonly accepted standards of 

behavior in written form so that social controls may 

be applied in an orderly and consistent way. For most 

Americans, the legal system works fairly well. The 

written standards of conduct and the police and judicial 

apparatus set up to enforce them are established 

and administered by persons with interesh and perspectives 

similar to those of the majority of white 

Americans. But for those who differ substantially in 

economic status or culture from the white middleclass 

norm, the apparatus breaks down. Not only are 

these people arrested and prosecuted under laws they 

had no hand in making, but they are also tried by judicial 

institutions which exclude them both from structural 

mechanisms and from personnel rolls. 

The situation is most acute for those who are both 

poor and culturally different-blacks, Indians, and 

Mexican-Americans. To these citizens the law symholizes 

white oppression. Those who represent the legal 

system are almost exclusively white and reflect the 

prejudices and ignorance of white society. Yet the 

prohlem is much deeper than one of participation in 

judicial functions. The very structures of the system, 

because they were created by whites, invariably operate 

to disadvantage the culturally different, regardless 

of who is in control. The unequal dispensation of 

justice is a result both of the origin of legal institutions 

and their present operation by white citizens 

who do not recognize the worth of non-white cultures. 

The effects of these two factors are impossible to disentangle. 

We emphasize the racism of the legal structures 

themselves because it is more basic than the personal 

racism of administrators and thus has more profound 

implications as an obstacle to change. 

Then on page 77 of the same book, they end their analysis of 

racism in the administration of justice in America with these 

words: "The cultural myopia of white society permeates our judicial 

system, making it inherently incapable of delivering justice 

to people of color." 

Mr. Speaker, the hard, cold, end product of the depth of racism 

has produced the statistics as quoted on page 132 of the International 

Library of Negro Life and History 1969 Year Book, 

that out of the 3,859 prisoners executed since 1930, 53.5 

percent were black. According to the United States Census of 

1970, blacks constitute 12 percent of the population and are 

convicted of one-sixth of the crimes punishable by death as out- 

lined in this horrendous hill. Then even assuming that those 

convictions were arrived at equitahly, fairly, without racial 

hias, the hias of execution weighs 570 percent greater prohahil- 

ity for execution of hlacks than for whites. 

White slavery hy the force of the gun invaded our country 

where an overwhelming majority of hlack people living in 

America came from. Blacks were living in Africa where no jails 

were necessary, hecause we knew how to live with our hrothers 

and our sisters. To quote an eminent white authority on Afri- 

can study, Basil Davidson, in his book, "The African Past": 

In Songhai, travelers were as safe in the loneliest cor- 

ner of the Empire as he would be in the King's Court 

surrounded by his army. Black people came here with 

their skills and knowledge of medicine and surgery 

with the abilities to transplant limbs and immunize 

their children against bacterial infections. Their spiri- 

tual values were high. We were virtually free from 

The question arises, "What is the problem?" The problem, as 

YOU heard pointed out earlier by the past two speakers, Mr. 

White and Mrs. Harper, is that we must pinpoint the fact that 

the prohlem, as pointed out in the report of the National Ad- 

visory Commission on Civil Disorders, by the hooks that they 

wrote in March of 1968, is white racism, individualized and 

institutionalized. White racism is responsible for those con- 

ditions which lead to the crimes by hlack people which you are 

anxious to punish. You heard earlier one individual, Mr. Zeller, 

indicate that these crimes are growing outrageously in our com- 

munities. When your unemployment rises, so does crime rise. 

People will do whatever is necessary, whatever race of people 

they are, to survive. The report states that white institutions 

also created this, and it seems that a searchlight of inquiry by 

this House of Representatives should he directed toward the 

cause of white racism and the immediate cause of the problem 

as opposed to looking for an easy way out. Today is the easy 

way out. 

White racism, not just its manifestation, keeps blacks in con- 

stant turmoil, but white racism is basically an attitude fostered 

in the belief that most, if not all, blacks are nothing, a little less 

than human and make no contribution to world progress, free- 

loaders, and should be relegated to a low status. This attitude is 

what breeds the contempt that almost all individuals who sup- 

port racism have against blacks and those who are there with 

the problem, and that is where the problem lies. 

First of all, the question is, is it genetic or is it enculturated? 

If it is the former, then there is little that a powerless minority 

can do, except to struggle vainly on our way to the gas chamber 

or perhaps link up with the 2.4 billions of nonwhites and make 

a very hard and heroic stand. The bloody history of whites 

stands as mute testimony to their 300-year reign of terror 

against non-Europeans; against South American Indians, with 

Europeans murdering 10 million of them in savage orgies; 

against North American Indians as their lands were stolen, 

with Europeans murdering 12 million and driving the re 

mainder onto barren pieces of parched land; against the people 

of the Songhai Empire of Western Africa, starting in 1591, and 

over three centuries of blood, wiped out 30 million of our 

mothers and fathers. The Europeans' lust for blood extended

even to their own kind. with the barbarous Aryans in the 

World Wars, murdering, pillaging and destroying millions. 

then marching 12 million into gas chambers, using pretexts. 

The National Institute of Mental Health has, in a recent study, 

determined that probably the Europeans' prefrontal cortex is 

out of synchronization with the part of the brain that controls 

love and compassion for fellow human beings. The world 

watched with the pretext of the Korean War with more 

murders of nonwhites and the Vietnam War with the blood of 

millions shed by European-Americans. 

The pretext of this bill is thinly veiled. It is not to stopcrime, 

because history shows, as we all know, that capital punishment 

is not a deterrent but a pretext to satisfy the bloodlust of 

Europeans in America against blacks and poor people in this 

country. We who stand in mute horror hope that white violent 

racism is merely enculturated. That is our only hope, our one 

hope, that various forms of psychiatric treatment can follow a 

clinical analysis of the psychic roots of that virulent poison. 

Mr. Speaker, today I rise and ask that the members of this 

House move to support . . the Governor's veto and to sustain his 

message. In closing, I would like to go back to our own history 

for just a moment, which you all know about, and talk ahout a 

queen of England who had pickpockets hung in the market 

square so that people could watch, hut as you know, this only 

increased the pickpocketing and also increased the crowds that 

came around to see this type . . of horror. In fact, those who came 

to watch would set it up for pickpockets to pick their pockets st ) 

they could observe more brutal, inhumane hangings. 

Let us he clear: This bill is against poor people, against black 

people, against nonwhite people, and I will vote today to sustain 

the Governor's veto. Thank you very much. 



Montour, Mr. Wagner. 

Mr. WAGNER. Thank you. Mr. Speaker. 

Will the gentleman, Mr. Richardson, answer a few questions, 

please? 

The SPEAKER. The gentleman, Mr. Richardson, indicates 

that he will stand for interrogation. The gentleman, Mr. 

Wagner, is in order and may proceed. 

Mr. WAGNER. I tried to listen to your argument. Did you 

state that you were reading from an article, that most of that 

was from an article written by an individual? 

Mr. RICHARDSON. I stated that I took my contents from 

two texts. 

Mr. WAGNER. Who wrote those texts? 

Mr. RICHARDSON. One was Dr. Louis Knowles, a professor. 

Mr. WAGNER. A professor where? 

Mr. RICHARDSON. The University of Chicago, the doctorate 

of ministry program. And also Professor Kenneth Prewitt, also 

an associate professor of political science at the University of 

Chicago. 

Mr. WAGNER. Thank you. 

The SPEAKER. On the question, the Chair recognizes the 

gentleman from Philadelphia, Mr. Wiggins. 


Mr. WIGGINS. Mr. Speaker. I believe in capital punishment. 

However, I will vote to sustain the Governor's veto on SB 1233. 

As a citizen of these United States, as a citizen of the Com- 

monwealth of Pennsylvania, I believe in justice also. As a mem- 

ber of the Judiciary Committee, it has been confirmed, in my 

opinion, that disparity in sentencing throughout the Common- 

wealth of Pennsylvania truly exists. 

The 14th amendment of the United States Constitution 

guarantees fair and equal protection of the law, and until such 

time as execution is administered fairly and impartially with- 

out regard to economic or ethnic background, I will maintain 

my position against an unjust law. 

I therefore ask for support of the Governor's veto. 

The SPEAKER. The question recurs, shall SB 1233. PN 

2034, become the law of the Commonwealth, the objections of 

the Governor to the contrary notwithstanding? 

Those who favor SB 1233 becoming the law of the Common- 

wealth will vote "aye"; those in favor of sustaining the Gov- 

ernor's veto will vote "no." Only those members physically pres- 

ent may vote. 

Agreeable to the provisions of the Constitution, the following 

roll call was recorded: 

Anderson 

Armstrong 

Bennett 

Berhn 

Bittinger 

Bittle 

Brandt 

Brown 

Brunner 

Burd 

Burns 

Caltngirone 

Caputo 

Cassidy 

Cessar 

Cianciulli 

Cimini 

Cahen 

Cole 

Cow ell 

Davies 

DeMedio 

DeVerter 

DeWeese 

Dietz 

Dininni 

Dombrowski 

Donatucci 

Dorr 

Doyle 

Duffy 

Englehart 

Fee 

Fischer, R. R 

Fisher, D. M. 

Flaherty 

Foster, A. 

Foster. W. 

Freind 

Fryer 

Gallagher 

Gallen 

Gamble 

Garzia 

Gatski 

Geesey 

George. C. 

George, M. 

Giammarco 

Gillette 

Gleeson 

Goebel 

Greenfield 

Greenleaf 

Grieeo 

Halverson 

Hamilton 

Hasay 

Hayes, D. 6. 

Hayes, S. E. 

Hoeffel 

Honaman 


Hutchinson, W. 

Jones 

Kerniek 

Klingaman 

Knepper 

Kolter 

Kowalyshyn 

Laughlin 

Lehr 

Letterman 

Lincoln 

Livengmd 

Logue 

Lynch 

Mackowski 

Madigan 

Manderino 

YEAS--159 - -- - 

Manmiller 

McCall 

McClatchy 

McIntyre 

McLane 

Mebus 

Meluskey 

Miller 

Milliron 

Mwhlmann 

Morris 

Mowery 

Mrkonic 

Mullen, M. P. 

Musto 

Novak 

OConnell 

OllonneU 

OXeefe 

Parker 

Peterson 

Petrarca 

Piccola 

Pievsky 

Pitts 

Polite 

Pott 

Pratt 

Prendergast 

Pyles 

Quest 

Ravenstahl 

Renwick 

Ritter 

Ruggiero 

Ryan 

Salvatore 

Scanlon 

Scheaffer 

Schhitt 

sch&der 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

Sirianni 

Smith, E. 

Smith, L. 

Spencer 

Spitz 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Taylor, E. 

Taylor, F. 

Thomas 

Trella 

Valieenti 

Wagner 

Wansacz 

Wargo 

Wass 

Weidner 

Wenger 

Wilson 

Wilt 

Wright, D. 

Wright. J. L. 

Yahner 

Yohn 

Zearfoss 

Zeller 

Zitterman 

Zord 

Zwikl 

V 

J 

.

- - 


NAY S--2 1 STATEMENT ON LEGISLATION BEING 

Barber 

Berson 

DiCarlo 

Dumas 

Geisler 

Goodman 

Harper 

~efrick 

Johnson 

KeUv 

~ukovich 

Levin 

Ollvrr 

Rappaport 

Rhodes 

Richardson 

Scirica 

White 

WEPS 

Wise 

Irvis, 

Speaker 

INTRODUCED 


Mercer, Mr. Bennett. 

Will the gentleman first address himself to the new legislation. 

I understand the gentleman has a privileged resolution. 

NOT VOTING-18 

Mr. BENNETT. I do, Mr. Speaker, and I rise for two reasons. 

First I ask ~~~ ~~ unanimous consent to make a brief statement. 

Arthurs 


Borski 

cnv -.-, 

Haskell 

ltkin 

Katz 

Lashinger 

T.PV~ . 

McCinnis 

Milanovich 

Miscevich 

Pancoast 

Reed 

Rieper 

Tenaglio 

Vrwn 

Williams 

~~~~~ ~~ 

The SPEAKER. Without objection, the gentleman is in order 

and may proceed. 

Mr. BENNETT. Mr. Speaker, for several years the members 

of this House of Representatives, and I am sure the other body, 

have concerned themselves with the funding of The Pennsyl- 

A two.thirds of the elected having voted 

in the affirmative, the question was determined in the affirms. 

tive, that the bill become a law, the of His Excellency, 

the Governor, to the contrary notwithstanding. 

vania Industrial Development Authority. The members of the 

Business and Commerce Committee and I have labored for 

many months in trying to find some way to fund the Pennsylvania 

Industrial Development Authority. We had a meeting re cently with Secretary of Commerce Norval Reece, who indi- 

TheSPEAKER. On the question of the hill becoming law, the 

objections of the Governor to the contrary notwithstanding, 

the "yeas" are 159, the "nays" 21. Two-thirds of all the memhers 

elected having voted in the affirmative, the bill is passed, 

and the clerk will inform the Senate accordingly. 

cated to my committee that a board meeting that is being held 

today of the Pennsylvania Industrial Development Authority 

requires $26 million to bring new industry into common. 

wealth, 

Mr. Speaker, there is presently some $4 million to $6 million 

left in the PIDA fund, not nearly enough to fund those needed 

REMARKS ON VOTES 

programs. If we could fund PIDA with just the programs that 


Beaver, Mr. Milanovich. 

Mr. MILANOVICH. Mr. Speaker, on the vote to override the 

Governor's veto of SB 1223, I wish to be recorded in the affirmative. 


the record. 

are being asked for today, we could take in excess of 3,000 families 

off the welfare and the unemployment rolls in this Commonwealth 

by creating new jobs for them. 

Mr. Speaker, I realize the realities of the legislative process, 

and it has been proven in this session and unfortunately in 

some previous sessions that there just are not enough votes on 

the floor of this House or in the Senate to provide the needed 

tax dollars to fund PIDA Therefore, Mr. Speaker, I am propos- 

The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Philadelphia, Mr. ing legislation today that will create a new, and I emphasize the 

Katz. For what purpose does the gentleman rise? 

words "create a new" Pennsylvania lottery. 

Mr. KATZ. Mr. Speaker, I would like to be recorded in the af- This program, and I have discussed it with the Department of 

firmative on SB 1233, which I believe is the override of the Revenue, in their opinion will not detract, and again I repeat, 

Governor's veto on the death penalty hill. 

will not detract from the present lottery system. It should not 

Unfortunately, and I would like this to he on the record, I was detract at all from those senior citizens' programs that I have 

on the train on my way to Harrisburg. I had a debate last night. voted for in the past 14 years that I have been here and that I 

The train was late and I want the record to show that I would continue and will continue to support. 

have voted "yes." 

Mr. Speaker, I am going to introduce these hills. I am happy 

The SPEAKER. The gentleman's full remarks will be spread to say that the Speaker of the House has joined me in the sponwon 

the record. 

sorshiu of these bills. I will lay them on the table and ask anyone 

in this House of Representatives who is as concerned about 

PIDA as I am, and I know there are many, to join me in sponsorship. 


The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Montgomery, Mr. 

Lashinger. For what purpose does the gentleman rise? 

Mr. LASHINGER. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

I apologize but I was called away from my desk to an impor- 

tant meeting over in the Justice building when the House took 

a vote to override the Governor's veto on the death penalty bill. 

SB 1233. I would like to be recorded as having voted "yes" to 

override the Governor's veto on the death penalty. 


the record. 

Mr. LASHINGER. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. 

INTERROGATION 

Mr. RYAN, under unanimous consent, interrogated Mr. 

BENNETT. 

Mr. RYAN. Mr. Speaker, I would like to preface my ques- 

tions. The PIDA program is one, I think. that we are all very 

much in favor of. I am particularly in favor of it. The problem 

that I see, however, and what prompts my rising to the micro-


phone is. what assurances does the chairman have that putting I thank you, Mr. Speaker. The bills will lie on the table for 

in a hill like this, assuming it becomes law, will not have a detri- I anyone else who cares to cosponsor them. 

mental effect on the lottery system which is designed to help 

senior citizens? 

My own suggestion would be, Mr. Speaker, that a companion 

bill be introduced, or, if possible--and I do not know this with- 

out looking at this bill-a provision be made in his bill that the 

needs of the senior citizens he taken care of from general appro- 

priations and that we do away with the restriction that their 

needs he met from the lottery system. 

I think at that point your hill would do a number of things. 

First, it should gain wide support in the legislature. Secondly, 

it would take away any concern, real or imagined, that the lot- 

tery system can stand a double-dip, so to speak, one for senior 

citizens and one for industrial development. I think this is a 

concern that all of us share. We all want to expand the PIDA in- 

volvement in the economy of Pennsylvania. I do not think there 

is anyone here who does not want to do that. The real question, 

though, that is raised in my mind is that if there is a chance 

that that would jeopardize the funding of the senior citizen programs, 

there are probably many people here who would be reluctant 

to support it. and 1 for one am recommending to you, 

Mr. Chairman, that a companion bill be introduced that would 

provide that the funding of the senior citizens' programs be 

met from general appropriations, that that lottery program go 

into the general revenues, and general revenues fund all senior 

citizens' needs under the programs we presently have, and that 

a separate lottery, if you will, designed for PIDA, to go along 

CONDOLENCE RESOLUTION ON 

HON. WILLIAM SHUMAN ADOPTED 

The SPEAKER. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman to 

introduce a privileged resolution of condolence. 

The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Mercer, Mr. Ben- 

nett. 

Mr. BENNETT. Mr. Speaker, it is my intention at this point 

to introduce a privileged resolution on a friend of mine who I 

believe will be sadly missed. 

Following the introduction, Mr. Speaker, I would like to be 

recognized for a statement. 

The SPEAKER. The Chair shall do that. 

Mr. BENNETT presented the following resolution, which 

was read, considered and adopted: 

Commonwealth of Pennsvlvania 

Citation by The House of Representatives 

WHEREAS William 0. Shuman a member of the House of 

Representati;es representing the ninetieth Legislative District, 

passedaway on August 30,1978; and 

WHEREAS, William 0. Shuman was elected to the House of 

Representatives in and every consecutive term thereafter. 

Mr. Shnman served with distinction during World War I1 

with the E~~~~~~~ l-heatre and received the B~~~~~ star and 

five battle stirs. Prior to being elected to public office, he 

served as editor and business manager of Greencastle's Echo- 

Pilot a weekly newspaper. He was a member of numerous orwith 

your hill, be created. anizations including the Lions Club International, the Boy 

I think it is a real concern and it is somethine that a great couts of America, the Cumberland Valley Fireman's Associadeal 

of thought should be given to. I do not know 

tion, the Red Cross Bloodmobile and the Salvation Army, to 

name a few. He received several awards including the Silver 

ances you have that this will not affect the B~~~~~ ~~~~d and the &tinmished ~~~~d from the sons of 

tery, but I would be interested in your thoughts, and even after the~merican Revolution: now'therefore be it 

you give them, I probably would be skeptical of the results that 

RESOLVED. That the House of Representatives of the Commonwealth 

of Pennsylvania pauses in its deliberations to 

you advise us of. 

mourn the passing of this dedicated man and extends its heart- 

Mr. BENNETT. Thank you, Matthew, for your admitted felt condolences to his brother, Myron Josiah, and three sisters, 

skenticism. -~~. 

Isabelle . . . Dorer, Anita Cunningham and Suzanne Hartman; and 

~ ~ ~~~ 

! belt turther 

In an attempt, however. Mr. Speaker, to answer the gentle- RESOLVED, That a copy of this resolution be delivered to 

man's questions, I can only say that in consultation with the the family of The Honorable William 0. Shuman, 162 East 

Department of Revenue, it is the feeling of the Department of Madison Street. Greencastle. Pennsylvania 17225. 

Revenue that for the creation of a new game-and we are leav- On thequestion. 

ine - it up . to the deoartment. in the leeislation, to create that Will theHouseadout theresolution? 

game. It is their feeling-that there are sufficient numbers of 

players out there for the type of game that they have in mind. 

so that it would not affect the present senior citizens' programs. 

For me or anyone to rise to the floor of this House and 

give a blanket guarantee that it is not going to affect it would 

be foolhardy. I would not attempt todo that. 

Secondly, Mr. Speaker, I thank Mr. Ryan for his concerns and 

would say to him and to any member of this body that I will 

meet with anyone either to amend these present bills after 

their introduction or to introduce companion hills, if that 


Mercer, Mr. Bennett. 

Mr. BENNETT. Mr. Speaker, I had the privilege of sitting 

next to Bill Shuman for many years. I feel sad at this point that 

Bill is gone. There were times when I made fun of Bill Shuman 

and when I made sport of him, and there are many people in 

this House who have done the same thing. I can only say at this 

point, Bill Shuman, for all of the times that I made sport of you 

and made fun of you, I honor yon now and I apologize for it. 

C 

would be the wish of this body. My main concern, Mr. Ryanand 

you share that, and I know you do-is with the funding of 

The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Lehigh, 

Mr. Zeller. w 

the Pennsylvania Industrial Development Authority. This may Mr. ZELLER. Mr. Speaker. I believe it is proper at this time 

not be the complete answer. I think it is a beginning step. to infonn the members of the House that I had someone close to 

-

1978. WGISLATIVE JOURNAL-HOUSE 2841 

me in Florida, my own sister, who did have the information 

that was placed, and not from the big press hut from the little 

press down there-I am sure the big press would not stoop that 

Amend Sec. 3, page 2, line 12, hy striking out "or county 

~ $ o $ ~ ~ ,,or ~ ~ ~ g 

lr,r;,l th,:,r" i n [in,. 15, ,)flint: 16, and inserting off.,. 

low as they did down there-some allegations that were made, rials 

and we found that they have no value. They had absolutely no inserting, 

Amend Sec. 

prison 

3, page 

or regionalcenter, 

2,line20, by striking out "or prison." and 

substance. There was nothing to it, hut strictly a political deal ~~~~d set. 4. .- 2. . line 2.5, . hv " inserting -. a Deriod after "ofin 

their own area and I want the members to know that we had ficials" 

it checked into in the hotel and we had it checked into in the so- .,&Y!&"~ 4, page 2, line 259 striking Out "and their 

called place where he was, and this particular place is used by / Amend Sec 4, page :3. lines :l through 9. by striking out all of 

everybody. 

said lines 

It is just a mess to have someone get involved in a political AmeodSec. 4, page 3, line 10, by striking out "(3)" and insert- 

~ - 

ing (2) 

deal as they did on this man who, as far as I am concerned and 

". Amend . . .. Sec. 5, page 3, line 19, by inserting a period after "ofthe 

members of this House, was held high as to good moral flclals" 

character. 

Amend Sec. 5, page 3, line 19, by striking out "or their staff 

assistants." 

I want it known here by the memhers that I will meet with Amend Sec. 5, page 3, lines 21 and 22, by striking out "Mail 

anyone and will challenge any of the reports. We intend to go to these persons shall not he opened or censored.'' 

down in his areas and let them know down there just exactly 

Amend Sec. 5, pare 3, line 23, by striking out "subject to 

censoring or he" and rnserting opened or 

what a terrible thing they did to a fine man like Bill Shnman. Amend Sec. 5, page 3, lines 27 through 29, by striking out 

Thank you. 

"and in line 27, all of lines 28 and 29, and inserting if there is 

TheSPEAKER. The Chair thanks the gentleman. 

any reasonable suspicion that it contains contraband. 

Amend Sec 6, page 4, line 1, by inserting after "mail" where 

The question recurs on the adoption of the privileged resolu- it appears the second time including correspondence to puhtion. 

Those in favor of the adoption will rise and stand in place. lishers and communications media 

(Members stood.) 

Amend Sec. 6, page 4, line 4, by striking out "facility" and inserting 

institution 

The SPEAKER. The members will he seated. The resolution Amend Sec. 6, page 4, line 10, by inserting after "is" where it 

is unanimously adopted. 

appears the second time reasonably 

AmendSec. 7, page 4, line 16, by insertingafter "institution" 

personnel 

HOUSE SCHEDULE 

Amend Sec 7, page 4, line 18, by striking out "reason to helieve" 

and inserting any reasonable suspicion 

The SPEAKER. The members have asked the Chair whether ~~~~d set, 7, paFe 4, line 19, by striking out -threatening, 

or not the Chair would declare a recess for lunch and the Chair abusive. libelous, or' 

has said that it would. But it now appears that the recess will Amend Sec. 7. .. Daze - 4. . line 24. . bv . strikine out "mav" and insertine 

shall 

not he necessary. If you will indulge the Chair, we now think 

that we will he ahle to run through the rest of the calendar in 

very quick order and release you for the week. 

Those members who have amendments to offer to HB 198 

have found out that some of the amendments cannot he produced 

today, at least in time for us to act upon them. Some of 

them wish to consult with each other to see if they can consoliof 

the correspondence is contrary to the provisions of this act. 



date amendments. And, as I understand it, they have agreed The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the gentleman from 

not to offer any amendments to HB 198 today. If that is a mis- Schuylkill, Mr. Hutchinson. 

statement of fact, let me know now. If it is an accurate state- Mr. W. D. HUTCHINSON. Mr. Speaker, this bill is a bill dement. 

then there is no need for us to delay on HB 198 today. signed to meet a problem in the Bureau of Corrections in con- 

We will go on through the calendar rather than breaking for nection with inmate mail. 

lunch and try to finish the entire calendar in the next few mo- Some months ago, the bureau promulgated regulations, and 

ments of work. 

we on the Subcommittee on Crime and Corrections in the Judiciary 

Committee spoke to the commissioner about it, because 

CALENDAR BILLS ON THIRD CONSIDERATION many of us have felt that those regulations would run afoul of 

The House proceeded to third consideration of HB 1982, PN the Federal law regarding the rights of inmates with respect to 

3324, entitled: 

mail. 

An Act relating to the rights of inmates and officials as to inmate 

mail in correctional institutions. 


Will the House agree to the hill on third consideration? 

Mr. W. D. HUTCHINSON offered the following amendments: 

Unfortunately, we were not ahle to reach a solution, and a 

few months ago there was a court decree entered that required 

the commissioner to make sweeping changes. This bill addresses 

those problems. 

The amendments that I offer today to the hill are really 

basically technical in nature. The bill, with the amendments, 

would do two things: It would set up a category of privileged 

Amend Sec. 2, page 1, lines 14 and 15, by striking "and mail to insure the prisoner's rights to communicate with us and 

prisons." and inserting, and regional centers. 

other state officials. It would prevent any interference with 

SLall.


NAYS-2 

Caltaglrone 

Caputo 

Hasay Schwedrr 

Cassidy 

Cessar 

CianciuUi 

NOT VOTWG-11 

Cimini 

Cahen 

Arthurs Haskell Miscevich Vroon 

Cole 

Belaff Johnson Heed Williams Cowell 

Gray McGinnis Tenaglio 

Davies 

DeMedio 

The majority required by the Constitution having voted in DeVerter 

DeWeese 

the affirmative, the question was determined in the affirma- i-,icarlo 

tive. 

Dietz 

Dininni 

Ordered, That the clerk present the same to the Senate for ~ ~ ~ 

concurrence. 

Donatueci 

Dorr 

Doyle 

MR. KATZ REQUESTED TO PRESIDE Duffy 

Dumas 

The SPEAKER. The Chair at this time invites to the podium ~ ~ ~ l 

the gentleman from Philadelphia, Mr. Katz. The gentleman, Fee 

Mr. Katz, will put his jacket on and come to the podium. 

Fischer, R. R. 

Fisher. D. M. 

F~aherty 

GAVEL TURNED OVER TO MR. KATZ 

Foster, A. 

Foster, W. 

The SPEAKER. The Chair at this time is delighted to turn prehd 

over the - eavel to the gentleman from Philadel~hia. Mr. Alvin Frver 

Katz. who has electednot to run for reelectionio the House of I Gallagher 

Representatives. I 

THE SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE (ALVIN KATZ) 

IN THE CHAIR I 

Halverson Mullen, M. P. 

Hamilton Must0 

Harper Novak 

Hasay Noye 

Hayes, D. S. O'Brien,B. 

Hayes, S. E. O'Brien, D. 

Helfrick OConneU 

Hoeffel O'DonneU 

Honaman O'Keefe 

Hutchinsan. A. Oliver 

Hutchinson, W. Pancoast 

Itkin 

Parker 

Johnson Peterson 

Jones Petrarca 

Katz 

Piccola 

Kelly Pievsky 

Kernick b ~ ~ Pitts ~ ~ k 

Klingaman Polite 

Knepper Pott 

Kolter Pratt 

Kowalyshyn Prendergast 

Kukovich Pyles 

Lashinger ~ h ~ ~ Quest t 

Laughlin Rappaport 

I-ehr 

Ravenstahl 

Letterman Renwiek 

Levi Rhodes 

Levin Richardson 

Lincoln Rieger 

Livengood Ritter 

Logue Rugaiero 

Lynch R y; 

NAYSO 

NOT VOTWG-9 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Taylor. E. 

Taylor. F. 

Thomas 

TreUo 

Valicenti 

Wagner 

Wansacz 

Wargo 

Wass 

Weidner 

Wenger 

White 

Wiggins 

Wilson i 

Wilt 

Wise 

Wright, D. 

Wright. J. L. 

Yahner 

Yohn 

Zearfoss 

Zeller 

Zitterman 

Zord 

Zwikl 

Irvis. 

S~eaker 

The House proceeded to third consideration of HB 1927, PN Gray 

2371, entitled: HaskeU 

Manderino 

An Act amending the act of September 18, 1961 (P. L. 1389, 

McGinnis 

Miscevich 

Reed 

Tenaglio 

Vroon 

Williams 

No. 615), referred to as the County and Municipal State Highway 

Law deleting a route in the City of Greensburg Westmoreland 

County. 

~ h majority , required by the ~ ~ having voted ~ in 

the affirmative, the question was determined in the affirmative. 

~ 


Will the Houseagree to the hill on third consideration? 

Bill was agreed to. 


concurrence. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. This hill has been considered on The House proceeded to third consideration of HB 1948, PN 

three different days and agreed to and is now on final passage. 3387, entitled: 


Agreeahle to the provision of the Constitution, the yeas and 


An Act amending the act of June 22, 1931 (P. L. 594. No. 

2031, referred to as the Rural State Highway Law deleting a 

route in Beccaria Township Clearfield County. 


YEAS--189 

Will the House agree to the bill on third consideration? 

Anderson 

Armstrong 

Arthurs 

GaUen 

Gamble 

Garzia 

Mackowsh 

Madigan 

Manmiller 

Salvatore 

Scanlon 

Scheaffer 



Barber 


Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

Bittinger 

Bittle 

Borski 

Brandt 

Brown 

Brunner 

Burd 

Burns 

Gatski 

Geesev 

Geisle; 

Grorre. . . C. 

George. M. 

Giammarco 

Gillette 

Gleeson 

Goebel 

Gwdman 

Greenfield 

Greenleaf 

Griero 

McCall 

McClatchv 

McIntyre 

Mrl.nn~ ~ 

Mebus 

Meluskey 

Milanovich 

Miller 

Milliron 

Moehlmann 

Morris 

Mowery 

Mrkonic 

Sehmitt 

Schweder 

~~~~ ~ 

Scirica 

Seltwr - -. . . 

Shupnlk 

Slrianni 

Smith. E. 

Smith. L. 

Spencer 

Spitz 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 


I The question is, shall the hill pass finally? 

Agreeable to the provision of the Constitution, the yeas and 


Anderson Gallen Mackowskl Salvatore 

Armstrong Gambl~ Madlg-an Sranlon 

Arthurs Garz~a Manmtller Srhenffer


Barber 


Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

Bittinger 

Bittle 

Borski 

Brandt 

Brown 

Brunner 

Burd 

Burns 

Caltagirone 

Caputo 

Cassidy 

Cessar 

Cianciulli 

Cimini 

Cohen 

Cole 

Cowell 

Davies 

DeMedio 

DeVerter 

DeWeese 

DiCarlo 

Dietz 

Dininni 

Dambrowski 

Donatucci 

Dorr 

Doyle 

Duffy 

Dumas 

Englehart 

Fee 

Fischer, R. R 

Fisher, D. M. 

Flaherty 

Foster. A. 

Faster. W. 

Freind 

Fryer 

Gallagher 

Gatski 

Geesey 

Geisler 

George. C. 

George. M. 

Giammarco 

Gillette 

Gleesan 

Gwbel 

Goodman 

Greenfield 

Greenleaf 

Gneco 

Halverson 

Harper 

Hasay 

Hayes, D. S. 

Hayes, S. E. 

Helfrick 

Hwffel 

Honaman 


Hutchinson. W. 

Itkin 

Johnson 

Jones 

Katz 

Kelly 

Kernick 

Ktingaman 

Knepper 

Kolter 

Kowalyshyn 

Kukavich 

Lashinger 

Laughlin 

Lehr 

Letterman 

Levi 

Levin 

Lincoln 

Livengood 

Logue 

Lynch 

NAYS-0 

McCall 

McClatchy 

MeIntyre 

McLane 

Mebus 

Meluskey 

Milanavich 

Miller 

Milliron 

Moehlmann 

Morris 

Mowery 

Mrkanic 

Mullen. M. P. 

Musto 

Novak 

Noye 

O'Brien. B. 

O'ConneU 

O'Donnell 

O'Keefe 

Oliver 

Pancaast 

Parker 

Peterson 

Petrarca 

Piccola 

Pievsky 

Pitts 

Polite 

Pott 

Pratt 

Prendergast 

Pyles 

Quest 

Rappaport 

Ravenstahl 

Renwick 

Rhodes 

Richardson 

Rieger 

Ritter 

Ruggiero 

Ryan 

NOT VOTWG-11 

Schmitt 

Schweder 

Scirica 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

Sirianni 

Smith. E. 

Smith. L. 

Spencer 

Spitz 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonia 

Taylor. E. 

Taylor, F. 

Thomas 

Trello 

Valicenti 

Wagner 

Wansacz 

Wargo 

Wass 

Weidner 

Wenger 

White 

Wiggins 

Wilson 

Wilt 

Wise 

Wright. D. 

Wright. J. L. 

Yahner 

Yohn 

Zearfoss 

Zeller 

Zitterman 

Zord 

Zwikl 

Irvis, Speaker 

Gray R.l;lndt.rnno O'Brien, 1) Vraon 

Hamilton McGlnni; Rwd Williams 

Haskell Mlsn,\-lr.h Tenaglir, 



tive. 

Ordered. That the clerk present the same to the Senate for 

concurrence. 

The House proceeded to third consideration of HB 2057, PN 


An Act amending the act of June 22, 1931 (P. L. 594, No. 

203). referred to as the Township State Highway Law changing 

a route in Millcreek Township Erie County. 

On thequestion, 


Bill wasagreed to. 






Anderson 

Armstrong 

Arthurs 

Barber 


Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

Bittinger 

Bittle 

Borski 

Brandt 

Brown 

Brunner 

Burd 

Burns 

Caltagirone 

Ca~uto 

Cassidy 

Cessar 

Cianciulli 

Cimini 

Cohen 

Cole 

Cowell 

Davies 

DeMedio 

DeVerter 

DeWeese 

DiCarlo 

Dietz 

Dininni 

Domibrowski 

Donatucci 

Dorr 

Doyle 

Duffy 

Dumas 

Englehart 

PPP 

Fischer, R. R 

Fisher, D. M. 

Flaherty 

Foster, A. 

Foster, W. 

Freind 

Fryer 

Gallagher 

Gallen Mackowski 

Gamble Madigan 

Garzia Manderino 

Gatski Manmiller 

Geesey McCall 

Geisler MeClatchy 

George, C. McIntyre 

George, M. MeLane 

Giammarco Mebus 

Gillette Meluskey 

Gleesan Milanovich 

Goebel Miller 

Goodman Milliron 

Greenfield Moehlmann 

Greenleaf Morris 

Grieco Mowery 

Halverson Mrkonic 

Hamilton Mullen, M. P. 

Harper Musto 

Hasay Novak 

Hayes. D. S. Noye 

Hayes. S. E. O'Brien, B. 

Helfrick O'Brien, D. 

Hoeffel O'Connell 

Honaman O'Donnell 

Hutchinsan, A. O'Keefe 

Hutchinson, W. Oliver 

Itkin Pancoast 

Johnson Parker 

Jones Peterson 

Katz Petrarca 

Kelly Piccola 

Kernick Pievsky 

Klingaman Pitts 

Knepper Polite 

Kolter Pott 

Kowalyshyn Pratt 

Kukovich Prendergast 

Lashinger Pyles 

Laughlin Quest 

Lehr Rappaport 

Letterman Ravenstahl 

Levi Renwick 

Levin Rhodes 

Lincoln Richardson 

Livengood Rieger 

Logue Ritter 

Lynch Ruggiero 

NAYS-0 

NOT VOTWG-9 

Ryan 

Salvatore 

Scanlon 

Schmitt 

Schweder 

Scirica 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

Sirlanni 

Smith, E. 

Smith. L. 

Spencer 

Spitz 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Tavlor. E 

Taylor. F. 

Thomas 

Trello 

Valicenti 

Wagner 

Wansacz 

Wargo 

Wass 

Weidner 

Wenger 

White 

Wiggins 

Wilson 

Wilt 

Wise 

Wright, D. 

Wright, J. L 

Yahner 

Yohn 

Zearfoss 

Zeller 

Zitterman 

Zord 

Zwikl 

Irvis, Speaker 

Gray Miscevich Scheaffer Vroon 

HaskeU Reed Tenaglio Williams 

McGinnis 



tive. 

Ordered. That the clerk present the same to the Senate for 

concurrence. 

..*' 

J 

C 

w


HB 2110 PASSED OVER 

Flaherty 1,rvi Krrrwick Zitterman 

Foster, A. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recongizes the gentle- Foster, W. 

man from Berks, Mr. Fryer. 

Freind 

Fryer 

Mr. FRYER. Mr. Speaker, there were questions on this bill. 

as I recall, from our caucus, and I further assumed that the hill 

would be held. 

TheSPEAKER pro tempore. The bill will be held over. ! 

Mr. FRYER. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I Hutchinson, A. 

Levm 

Lincoln 

Livengood 

Lopur 

Lynch 

Mebus 

Rhodrs 

Richardson 

Hieper 

Rittrr 

Rugpiero 

Wagner 

Zord 

Zwikl 

Irvis, 

Speaker 

The House proceeded to third consideration of HB 2140, PN 

2720, entitled: NOT VOTWG-9 

An Act amending "The Administrative Code of 1929 ap- Arthurs MeGmnis Reed Vroon 

proved April 9,1929 (P. L. 177, No. 175). imposing additional Gray Miscevich Tenaglio Williams 

duties on the Secretarv of Transoortation nrior to entering cer- HaskeU 

tain contracts for consiltant services. I I 



Will the House agree to the bill on thud consideration? the affirmative, the quest~on was determined in the affirmative. 

Bill was agreed - to. 


The SPEAKER pro tempore. This bill has been considered on 

concurrence, 


The question is, shall the hill pass finally? 

REMARKS ON VOTE 

Agreeable to the provision of the Constitution. the yeas and 

The SPEAKER pro tempore, ~h~ chair recognizes the gentle. 

nays will now he taken. 

man from Westmoreland, Mr. Hutchinson. For what purpose 

does the gentleman rise? 

Mr. A. K. HUTCHINSON. Mr. Speaker, I would like to vote 

Anderson Gallen Mackowski Ryan 

"yes" instead of "no' on that last hill, HB 2140. 

Armstrong Gamble Madigan Salvatore 

Barber Garda Manderino Scanlon 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The gentleman's remarks will he 

Beloff Gatski Manmiller Scheaffer spread upon the record. 

Bennett Geesey MeCall Schmitt 

Berlin Geisler McClatchy Schweder The House proceeded to thud consideration of HB 2487, PN Berson George. C. McIntyre Scirica 


Bittinger George. M. McLane Seltzer 

Bittle Giammarco Meluskey Shupnik 

An Act requiring the licensing of certain nonresident produc- 

Borski Gillette Milanovich Sirianni 

ers of unprocessed fruits and vegetables. 

Brandt Gleeson Miller Smith, E. 

Brown Goebel Milliron Smith, L. On the question, 

Brunner Goodman Moehlmann Spencer 


Burd 

Greenfield Morris Spitr 

Burns Greenleaf Mowery Stairs 


Caltapirone Grieco Mrkonic Stapleton 

Ca~uto Halverson Mullen, M. P. Stewart 


Cassidy Hamilton Musk Stuban three different days and agreed to and is now on final passage. 

Cessar Harper Novak Sweet 


Cianciulli Hasay Noye 

Taddonio 

Cimini Hayes, D. S. O'Brien,B. Taylor. E. 

Cohen Hayes. S. E. O'Brien. D. Taylor, F. 


Cole 

Helfrick O'Cannell Thomas nays will now be taken. 

Cowell Hoeffel O'Donnell Trello 

Davies Honaman O'Keefe Valicenti 

DeMedio Hutchinson, W. Oliver Wansacz 

DeVerter Itkin Pancoast Wargo 

DeWeese Johnson Parker Wass 

Anderson Gallen Mackowski Ryan 

DiCarlo Jones Peterson Weidner Armstrong Gamble Madigan Salvatore 

Dietz 

Katz Petrarca Wenger Arthurs Garzia Manderino Scanlon 

Dinrnni Kelly Piccola White 

Barber Gatski Manmiller Scheaffer 

Dombrowski Kernlck Pievsky Wiggins Beloff Geesey McCall Schmitt 

Danatucci Klingaman Pitts 

Wilson 

Bennett Geisler McClatchy Schweder 

Dorr 

Knepper Polite Wilt 

Berlin George. C. McIntyre Scirica 

Doyle Kolter Pott 

Wise 

Berson George. M. McLane Seltzer 

Duffy Kowalyshyn Pratt 

Wright, D. Bittinger Giammarco Mebus Shupnik 

Dumas Kukovich Prrndergast Wright. J. L Bittle Gillette Meluskey Sirianni 

Englehart Lashin~er Pyles Yahner Barski Gleesan Milanovich Smith, E. 

Fee 

Laughlin Quest Yohn 

Brandt Goebel Miller Sm1th.L. 

Fischer, R. R. Lehr Rappaport 

Brown Goodman Milliron Spencer 

Fisher. D. M. Lettprman Ravenstahl 

Brunner Greenfield Moehlmann Spltz


Rurd 

Burns 

Caltapironr 

Caputo 

Cassidy 

Crssar 

Cianciulli 

Cimini 

Cahm 

Cole 

Cawell 

Davies 

DeMedio 

DeVerter 

DeWeese 

DiCarh 

Dietz 

Dlninni 

Dombrowski 

Donatucci 

Dorr 

Doyle 

Duffy 

Dumas 

Englehart 

Fei 

Fiseher. R. R 

Fisher, D. M. 

Flahertv 

~0ster.k. 

Foster, W. 

Freind 

Fryer 

Gallagher 

Greenleaf Morris 

Grieco Mowery 

Halverson Mrkonic 

FIamilton Mullen. M. P. 

Harper Musto 

Hasay Novak 

Haves. D. S. Noye 

Hayes. S. E. O'Brien. B. 

Helfrick O'Brien. D. 

Hoeffel O'ConneU 

:ionaman O'DanneU 

Hutchinson. A. O'Keefe 

Hutchinson, W. Oliver 

Itkin Pancoast 

Johnson Parker 

Jones Peterson 

Katz Petrarca 

KeUy Piccola 

Kerniek Pievsky 

Klingaman Pitts 

Knepper Polite 

Kolter Patt 

Kowalyshyn Pratt 

Kukovich Prendergast 

Lashinger Pyles 

Laughlin Quest 

Lehr Rappaport 

Letterman Ravenstahl 

Levi Renwick 

Levin Rhodes 

Lincoln Richardson 

Livengood Rieger 

Lague Ritter 

Lynch Ruggiero 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Taylor. E. 

Taylor, F. 

Thomas 

TreUo 

Valicenti 

Wagner 

Wansacz 

Warpo 

Wass 

Weidner 

Wenper 

White 

Wiggms 

Wilson 

Wilt 

Wise 

Wright. D. 

Wright. J. L. 

Yahner 

Yohn 

Zearfoss 

Zeller 

Zitterman 

Zord 

Zwikl 

Irvis. Speaker 

The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Lehigh, Mr. Zeller. 

Mr. ZELLER. Mr. Speaker, if I am not correct-maybe Mr. 

Hayes can help us on this-does this not do the same thing as v' 

Mr. Klingaman's hill? If we run one in the House and run one in 

the Senate-Oh, it does not? I thought it did. I stand corrected. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The bill is temporarily held 

over. 

The Chair wishes to thank the Speaker of the House for let- 

ting me temporarily preside over the House. 

I wish to remind the House, unforunately , I have chosen the 

course to run for the Senate and I will not be back here. But 

when I was sworn into this House on June 15. 1970. and Mr. 

Irvis was the majority leader, again let me reflect on the words 

that he had said to me when I first took my seat. He had said to 

me, "At no time in your life, Mr. Katz, will you ever associate 

yourself with a finer group of men than those in the House of 

Representatives." 

I would like you to all know that the 9 years in this House 

have been very good to me, and I believe that no matter what I 

am reading in the papers today, there is a 'ne group of people 

who sit in the House and Senate. 

I also would like to say to you that it has been a pleasure 

being here. I am sorry I am leaving this House, and I am sure 

and I am going to remember each and every one of you, no mat- 

ter how far I go in politics. Thank you very much for letting me 

preside. 

NAYS-0 I THE SPEAKER (K. LEROY IRVIS) IN THE CHAIR * 

NOT VOTING-8 

The SPEAKER. The Chair thanks the gentleman from 

Gray 

HaskeU 

McGinnis 

Miscevich 

Reed 

Tenaglio 

Vrwn 

Williams 

Philadelphia. He is a man of great sensitivity and a man of 

great and penetrating intellect, and we shall miss him on the 

floor of the House. I am pleased to hear him reiterate what I 

believed 8 years ago, 20 years ago, and still believe. I believe in 

The majority required by the Constitution having voted in the people of this ~ ~ ~ and the ~ people of ~ this united ~ 

the affirmative, the question was determined in the affirma- states, I believe in a form of aovernment, . I believe in a 

tlve. 

democracy as a philosophy of government, and I believe with 

~ ~ 

Ordered, That the clerk present the same to the Senate for Carl Sandburg, who wrote in his poem. "The People, Yes," that 

concurrence. 

no matter how often the people may he cajoled or fooled, they 

SB 1430 PASSED OVER TEMPORARILY 

are never fooled or cajoled forever. And that eventually they do 

succeed, and those people whom they select and elect to repre 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The Chair recognizes the gentle- sent them are the ones who they most trust and the ones who 

man from Centre, Mr. Letterman. 

bear the heaviest burden. No other group, whether it he elected 

Mr. LETTERMAN. Mr. Speaker, I would like to establish or self-appointed as the guardian of public morals, reaches 

with someone who might know something about this bill, quite the high standards of those who have to stand for elecwhether 

this is nonresidents or residents, the people who would 

have to have this license? I think it should he established here. 

The way I read it, even a man selling sweet corn along the road 

tion, especially those who have to stand before the public each 

and every two years. 

I congratulate the gentleman, Mr. Katz, on his ambition to . 

would have to have a license. 

further serve the people of this Commonwealth. We shall miss 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. Is there anyone in the House him here on the floor of the House. 

who wishes to answer the question of Mr. Letterman? 

The Chair recognizes the gentleman from Centre, Mr. Letter- 

The gentleman. - Mr. Yahner, is he on the floor? I do not beman. 

lieve that the hill should be rolled until the question is 

Mr. LETTERMAN. Mr. Speaker, you could return to SB 1430 

answered. 

Mr. LETTERMAN. May I ask that this hill be held over until 

on page 13. I have been satisfied, after reading the bill now, 

we have a chance to caucus on it? 

that it does not affect the people whom I was concerned about. 

The SPEAKER pro tempore. The hill may be temporarily The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the gentleman from 

passed over. 1 Philadelphia. Mr. Rappaport. 

'r, 

.


Mr. RAPPAPORT. Mr. Speaker, if I might for a moment, I 

would like to echo the Speaker's words about our friend from 

Philadelphia. Representative Katz. 

The SPEAKER. The gentleman is in order andmay proceed. 

Mr. RAPPAPORT. It is really quite a tragedy, Mr. Speaker, 

that the General Assembly will lose his talents, and we in the 

General Assembly in Harrisburg, in the legislature, will surely 

miss him mext session. It is unfortunate that some members 

choose not to run for reelection to this H~~~~ and therefore 

costing the General Assembly their talents. Thank You, Mr. 

Speaker. 

FILMING PERMISSION GRANTED 

The SPEAKER. Before we be@n, Jim Murtha, WPV1-TV has 

asked for 10 minutes to film silent shots from the floor of the 

House and that has been granted. He will be now filming. 

~h~ SPEAKER, ~h~ chair to the gentleman from 

Allegheny County. I did not know he had risen. The Chair 

recognizes the gentleman from Allegheny, Mr. Itkin. 

Mr. ITKIN. Mr. speaker, I have a question on the bill. 1s there 

anyone3 perhaps Mrs Yahner3 who can respond to my inquiry? 

The SPEAKER. The gentleman' Yahner' is the Only One 

who I suspect might be and no One is On 

the floor. Does the gentleman, Mr. Wagner, desire to do so? 

Mr. WAGNER. No, I do not, Mr. Speaker. 

SR 1430 PASSED OVER 


Allegheny, Mr. Itkins. 

Mr. ITKIN. I am going to ask that the bill he held over. Some 

of us still have questions. We have not caucaused on that. 

The SPEAKER. Very we that right 

Senate bill 1430, PN 1808, will go over. 

REPORT OF COMMITTEE OF CONFERENCE 

CONSIDERED 

Mr. LEITERMAN called UP for consideration the following 

Report of the Committee of Conference on HB 1841, PN 3554: 

Prior Printer's Nos. 2246,2687,3133,3418 

Printer's No. 3554 

Report of the Committee of Conference 

on House Bill No. 1841 

To the Members of the House of Representatives and Senate: 

the Committee of Conference on the part of 

the House of Representatives and Senate for the purpose of 

considering House Bill No. 1841, entitled: 

"An act amending the act of June 3, 1937 (P. L. 1225, No. 316), 

entitled 'An act concerning game and other wild birds and ?ild 

animals; and amending, revising, consolidating, and changlng 

the law relatlng thereto,' further providing for nonresident 

license and license fees, and increasing certain penalties AND 

THE AND 

TERM OF OFFICE OF THE AND 

MAKING AN EDITORIAL CHANGE." 

respectfully submit the following bill as our report: 

RUSSELL P. LETTERMAN 

WILLIAM F. RENWICK 

EUGENE R. GEESEY 

(Committee on the part of the House of Representatives.) 

PATRICK J. STAPLETON 

R. BUDD DWYER 

(Committee on the part of the Senate.) 

An Act 

entitle% "An act concerning game and other w~ld 

amen,+n the act of june 3, 1937, (P. L. 1225, No. 316). 

blrds and 

wild animals; and amending, revising, consolldatlng, and 

changing the law relating thereto," further providing for 

nonresident license and license fees and increasing certaln 

penalties. 

The General Assembly of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania 

hereby enacts as follows: 

Section 1. Sections 303 and 610, act of June,?, 1937 (P. L. 

1225, No. 316), known as "The Game Law, section 303 

amended October 21,1975 (P. L. 431, No. 122). are amended to 

read: 

Section 303. Nonresident Hunting License Fees.-Every nonresident 

of this Commonwealth, upon ap lication made, in 

writing, to any agent authorized to issue sucg licenses, or to the 

commission, unless any such person has been disqualified for a 

license in the manner hereinafter specified, or is a resident of a 

state which does not issue like licenses to residents of this 

commonwealth. and upon payment to said agent or commission 

of [forty dollars and thirty-five cents ($40.35)] fifty dollars 

and fifty cents ($50.50) for the license year beginning in 1979 

and sixty dollars and fifty cents ($60.50) for the license year 

beginning in 1980 and each year thereafter shall be entitled to 

the license herein designated as a Nonresident Hunter's License 

and a tag with the number of the license thereon, which shall 

entitle the holder to hunt for all wild birds and wild animals 

which may legally be hunted in this Commonwealth, until the 

close of the license year. Other licenses valid for use by nonresidents 

shall be as follows: 

Nonresident trapper's license which shall be issued only upon 

application to the Commission in Harrisburg and which shall be 

effective for the same period as hunters' licenses shall entitle 

the holder to take through the use of traps or deadfalls only 

wild birds and wild animals which may legally he trap ed in 

this Commonwealth, except beavers, [forty dollars ($40)fthree 

hundred fifty dollars ($350). Nothing in this clause shall be construed 

to prohibit the holder of a nonresident trapper's license 

from using a sidearm or a rifle not larger than a .22 rimfire caliber 

to kill legally caught birds and animals. 

sction 610, penalties,-~ny killing or or 

possessing, or attempting to kill or capture, any heaver or 

otter, or destroying or disturbing or interferingwith beaver or 

otter dams or houses or dens, or lulling, captur~ng, possessing 

or disposing of any beaver, contrary to the provisions of this 

article or the regulations of the commission, shall, upon conviction, 

be sentenced to pay a fine of [fifty] two hundred dollars 

and costs of prosecution for each offense. 

Any person violating any rule or regulation of the commission 

relative to the taking of fur-bearing animals not covered in 

the preceding paragraph, or stealing the traps of another, or 

- ~ 

disturbing the traps of another, or removing a fur-bearing 

animal, or raccoon or predator from the tra s of another. 

without specific authority from the owner, sha P I, upon convst~on. 

be sentenced to pay a f~ne of [twenty-five] two hundred 

dollars for each offense. 

any of the provisions of article, ex. 

cept as otherwise provided for. shall. upon conviction, he sentenced 

to pay a fine of ten dollars and costs of prosecution for 

each offense. 

Upon failure of any person convicted of a first offense to immediately 

pay the fine imposed and rosts of prosecution. he 

shall be imprisoned one day for each dollar of fine imposed aud 

costs of prosecution. 

Any person convicted of a second or suhsequrnt offense shall


he liable to the fines above provided and costs of prosecution. 

and, in addition thereto, shall, in the discretion of the court, 

suffer imprisonment one day for each dollar of fine imposed. 

Section 2. This act shall take effect September 1,1979. 

On the question. 

Will the House adopt the Report of the Committee of Confer. 

ence? 


Centre, Mr. Letterman, for a brief explanation of the commit- 

tee of conference report. 

Mr. LETTERMAN. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Whst we did in 

the conference committee was completely strip the hill of all 

amendments that Senator Mellow had inserted in the Senate. 

We also, because of the time delay, had to change the dates. We 

had to advance them 1 year. The bill now stands the same way 

it was when it was voted on in the House of Representatives ex- 

cept for the change in those two dates. I would ask for an af- 

firmative vote. 


Will the House adopt the Report of the Committee of Confer- 

ence? 

Agreeable to the provisions of the Constitution, the following 


Anderson 

Amstrang 

Barber 

Belaff 

Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

Bittinger 

Bittle 

Borski 

Brandt 

Brown 

Brunner 

Burd 

Burns 

Caltagirone 

Caputo 

Cassidy 

Cessar 

Cianciulli 

Cimini 

Cohen 

Cole 

Cowell 

Davies 

DeMedio 

DeVerter 

DeWeese 

DiCarlo 

Dietz 

Dininni 

Dombrowski 

Donatucci 

Dorr 

Doyle 

Duffy 

Dumas 

Englehart 

Fpe 

Fischer. R. R 

Fisher. D M. 

Gamble 

Garzia 

Gatski 

Geesey 

Geisler 

George. C. 

George. M. 

Glammarco 

Gillette 

Gleeson 

Goebel 

Goodman 

Greenfield 

Greenleaf 

Grieco 

Halversan 

Hamilton 

Harper 

Hasay 

Hayes,D. S. 

Haye8.S. E. 

Helfrick 

Hoeffel 

Honaman 

Hutchinson. A. 

Hutchinson, W. 

Itkin 

Johnson 

Jones 

Katz 

Kelly 

Kernick 

Klingaman 

Knepper 

Kolter 

Kowalyshyn 

Kukovich 

Lashlnger 

Lauphlin 

Lehr 

l~ttprrnan 

Madigan 

Manderino 

Manmiller 

McCall 

McClatchy 

McIntyre 

McLane 

Mebus 

Meluskey 

Milanovich 

Miller 

Milliran 

Moehlmann 

Morris 

Mowery 

Mrkonic 

Mullen. M. P 

Musto 

Novak 

Noye 

O'Brien. B. 

O'Brien. D. 

O'Connell 

O'Donnell 

O'Keefe 

Oliver 

Pancoast 

Parker 

Peterson 

Petrarca 

Pircola 

Pirvsky 

Pitts 

Polite 

Pott 

Pratt 

Prendergast 

Pyles 

Quest 

Rappaport 

Ravenstahl 

Ryan 

Salvatore 

Scanlon 

Scheaffer 

Sehmitt 

Schweder 

Scirica 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

Sirianni 

Smith, E. 

Smith. L. 

Spencer 

Spitz 

Stairs 

Stapleton 

Stewart 

Stuban 

Sweet 

Taddonio 

Taylor. E. 

Taylor. F. 

Thomas 

Trello 

Valicenti 

Wagner 

Wansacz 

Wass 

Weidner 

Wenper 

White 

Wiggins 

Wilson 

Wilt 

Wise 

Wright. D. 

Wright, J . L. 

Yahner 

Yohn 

Zearfnss 

ZeUer 

Flaherty 

Foster. A. 

Foster. W 

Freind 

Fryer 

Gallagher 

Gallen 

Wargo 

Arthurs 

Gray 

Haskell 

Levi Renwick Zitterman 

Levin Rhodes Zord 

Lincoln Richardson Zwikl 

Livengood Rieger w 

Logue Ritter Irvis, 

Lynch Ruggiero Speaker 

Mackowski 

NAYS--1 

NOT VOTING-9 

McGinnis Reed Vrmn 

Miscevich Tenaglio Williams 


the affirmative. the question was determined in the affirma- 

tive and the Report of the Committee of Conference was 

adopted. 

Ordered, That the clerk inform the Senate accordingly. 

HB 198 PASSED OVER 


Delaware, Mr. Garzia. 

Mr. GARZIA. Mr. Speaker, I do not think I have too much 

objection-which I really do-to holding this over until next 

week, hut I would like to say, if I may, that I would ask the 

membership today, not having any amendments to this bill, let 

us nonconcur in it and let us put it to a conference committee 

because of what the Senate did yesterday on your "goody" hills 

that everybody on this side is worried about for election 

day. They disregarded, they threw all the ethics bills out, even 

the ones for the scholarships. So whatever you put in this HB 

198, believe me, it will die not on the Senate President pro 

tempore's desk it will die in the wastepaper basket in the 

library. So I was hoping today that someone from the Repuhlican 

side, at least, would get up and say, let us nonconcur in this 

hill today and let us bring it to a conference committee. I will 

hope somebody will come up and ask that. If not. I would ask 

that, that we nonconcur in this today and have everybody apree 

to it, to have no amendments on this hill today. 

I SENATE MESSAGE 

AMENDED HOUSE BILL RETURNED FOR 

CONCURRENCE CONSIDERED 

The Senate returned the following HOUSE BILL NO. 263. 

with the information that the Senate has passed the same with 

amendments in which concurrence of the House of Representatives 

is requested: 

SENATE AMENDED 

Prior Printer's No. 283 Printer's No. 3413 

THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF PENNSYLVANIA 

-- 

& 

House Bill No. 263 * 

Session of 1977 

INTRODUCED BY MESSRS. ZEARFOSS. RYAN. CAPUTO. 

MORRIS, STAPLETON AND BURNS. FEBRUARY 9,1977. 

t


SENATOR LEWIS. 1,OCALGOVERNMENT. IN SENATE, RE- 

REPORTEL) AS AMENDED. JUNE 1:1,1978. 

An Art 

I'roc,.c,ling5-"' 

(4) The filing of an appeal in court under this section, shall 

amending the act of July 31. 1968 (P. L. 8O.5. NO. 247). en- not stay the action appealed from hut the appellants may pet]titled, 

as amended, "An act to empower cities of the second tion the court having jurisdiction of zoning appeals for a stay. 

class A, and third class, boroughs, incorporated towns: town- If the appellants are persons who are seeking to prevent a use 

ships of the first and second classes ~ncludlng those wlthln a or development of the landof another-whethher or notfifa stay 

county of the serond class and counties of the second class A 

IS 

through eighth classes, individually or jointly, to plan therr 

sought the landowner 

development and to govern the same by zonlng, suhdiv~slon whose use or development is in question may petition the court 

and land development ordinances, planned residential dr- to order the appellants to post hond as a condition to 

velopment and other ordinances, by official maps, hy the res- proceeding with the appeal. AFTER THE PETITION IS PREervation 

of certain land for future public purpose and by the SENTED THE CoURT SHALL HOLD A I~EARING TO 

acquisition of such land; providing for the establishment of 

planning commissions, planning departments, planning com- DETERMINE IF THE FILING OF THE APPEAL IS FRIVOmittees 

and zoning hearing boards, authorizing them to LOUS AND IS FOR THE PURPOSE OF DELAY. AT THE 

charge fees, make inspections and hold public hearings; 

providing for appropriations, appeals to courts and penalties HEARING - EVIDENCE MAY BE PRESENTED ON THE 

for violations; and repealing acts and parts of acts," further MERITS OF THE CASE. AFTER CONSIDERATION OF ALL 

providing for a stay of proceedings. 

EVIDENCE PRESENTED, IF THE COURT DETERMINES 


hereby enacts as follows: 

THAT THE APPEAL IS FRIVOLOUS AND IS FOR THE PUR- 

SECTION 1. SECTION 916. ACT OF JULY 31, 1968 (P. L. POSE OF DELAY IT SHALL GRANT THE PETITION. THE 

805. NO. 2471, KNOWN AS THE "PENNSYLVANIA MUNICI- 

PALITIES PLANNING CODE," IS AMENDED TO READ: 

RIGHT TO PETITION THE COURT TO ORDER THE APPEL. 

SECTION 916. STAY OF PROCEEDINGS.-UPON FILING LANTS TO POST BOND MAY BE WAIVED BY THE 

OF ANY PROCEEDING REFERRED TO IN SECTION 914 APPELLEE BUT SUCH WAIVER MAY BE REVOKED BY 

AND DURING ITS PENDENCY BEFORE THE BOARD ALL 

LAND DEVELOPMENT PURSUANT TO ANY CHAL. HIM IF AN APPEAL IS TAKEN FROM A FINAL DECISION 

LENGED ORDINANCE, ORDER OR APPROVAL OF THE OF THE COURT. The question [whether or not such petition 

ZONING OFFICER OR OF ANY AGENCY OR BODY, AND 

ALL OFFICIAL ACTION THEREUNDER SHALL BE 

should he granted and] -- OF the amount of the bnd shall he 

STAYED UNLESS THE ZONING OFFICER OR ANY OTHER within the sounddiscretion of the court. 

APPROPRIATE AGENCY OR BODY CERTIFIES TO THE Section% 3. This act shall takeeffect immediately. 

BOARD FACTS INDICATING THAT SUCH STAY WOULD 

CAUSE IMMINENT PERIL TO LIFE OR PROPERTY, IN thequestion, 

WHICH CASE THE DEVELOPMENT OR OFFICIAL ACTION 

SHALL NOT BE STAYED OTHERWISE THAN BY A RE. Will the House concur in Senate amendments? 

STRAINING ORDER WHICH MAY BE GRANTED BY THE 

BOARD OR BY THE COURT HAVING JURISDICTION OF The SPEAKER. On page 14, HB 263, PN 3413. on con- 

ZONING APPEALS ON PETITION AFTER NOTICE TO THE currence in Senate amendments, the Chair recognizes the 

~~~~G$$~~C~~O!~~{~~&~~R",~~l$$~$~~~$~f~ 

gentleman, Mr. Zearfoss, for a brief explanation. 

PRELIMINARY OR FINAL, HAS BEEN DULY APPROVED Mr. ZEARFOSS. Mr. Speaker, under present law, in a zoning 

AND PROCEEDINGS DESIGNED TO REVERSE OR LIMIT appeal case, a bond may be required by the court of common 

THE APPROVAL ARE FILED WITH THE BOARD BY 

pleas in any event, and the only hearing that is held on that 

PERSONS OTHER THAN THE APPLICANT, THE AP- 

PLICANT MAY PETITION THE COURT HAVING JURIS. petition for the bond is as to how much is it going to cost for the 

DICTION OF ZONING APPEALS TO ORDER SUCH PER- delay occasioned by the appeal. The bill that the House passed 

'ONS 'OST AS A CONDIT1ON 

provided that there would he no bond required except in the 

THE PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE BOARD. AFTER THE 

cases where the appellant non-landowner had requested and re- 

PETITION IS PRESENTED THE COURT SHALL HOLD A 

ceived a stay of construction by the court of common pleas, 

IF THE OF THE 

which was another step. The builders and the developers of the 

PEAL IS FRIVOLOUS AND IS THE OF DE- 

Commonwealth pointed out that that was a pretty harsh posi- 

LAY' AT THE MAY BE PRESENTED 

tion in that in every event where there is an appeal taken, it 

ON THE OF THE CASE. AFTER CONSIDERAT1ON 

amounts to a stay, whether one is requested of the court or not, 

OF ALL IF THE DETER- because the builder cannot go ahead with his project as long as 

THAT THE APPEAL IS FRIVOLOUS AND IS the project is in litigation. The hill was brought up in the Sen- 

THE OF DELAY IT SHALL GRANT THE PEE ate as passed in the House and defeated because of the objec- 

TION. THE RIGHT TO PETITION THE COURT TO ORDER tions by developers, 

THE APPELLANTS TO POST BOND MAY BE WAIVED BY We then considered what kinds of amendments would he a 

THE APPELLEE BUT SUCH WAIVER MAY BE REVOKED good compromise, and the bill that we have before us today is a 

BY HIM IF AN APPEAL IS TAKEN FROM A FINAL DECI- result of that compromise. What the Senate amendments do is 

SION OF THE COURT. THE QUESTION WHETHER OR NOT say that a bond may he required by the court in any event 

SUCH PETITION SHOULD BE GRANTED AND THE where, after a hearing, it is determined that the appeal is frivo- 

OF THE SHALL BE THE lous and for purposes of delay, but that is the only situation 

DISCRETION OF THE COURT. 

section+- 2, subsection (4) of 108--' . . where the court may order the appellant to post the hond, and 

lllCV 

. . , . . 

the amendments go further and require that the court consider 

. .


the merits of the case in that hearing to determine whether the 

appeal is in fact frivolous or for purposes of delay. I would urge 

the members to concur in the amendments as inserted in this 

hill by thesenate. I think it is a good compromise. It may not he 

as far as we would like to go, but it is probably the best we are 

ever ping to get. and I would suggest that we concur. 

The SPEAKER. The Chair rpcognizes the gentl~mnn from 

Lehigh. Mr. Zeller. 

Mr. ZELLER. Mr. Speaker, would Mr. Zearfoss consent to a 

brief interrogation? 

The SPEAKER. The gentleman, Mr. Zearfoss, indicates he 

will so consent. The gentleman, Mr. Zeller, is in order and may 

proceed. 

Mr. ZELLER. Mr. Speaker, to give you a case we had in 

Lehigh County, we have an individual with a large turkey- 

raising operation and the orders became quite heavy in the 

area, and there was another construction site going to start. 

The people living in that area challenged the extension on 

account of zoning and so forth and flood plain. They challenged 

the construction of this area. The court then asked them to put 

up a $50.000 bond. Would this still prevail. because to me it 

was frivolous? 

Mr. ZEARFOSS. Well, it could. We really cannot say. I do not 

know the basis for the appeal by the neighbors. If the neighbors 

have a good case, if they go into court when the bond is re- 

quested, see, the bond has to be on the basis of the landowner's 

petition. He goes in and petitions the court to require a bond. 

At that point there would have to be a hearing, under this hill 

as amended. There would he a hearing at that point that would 

consider the merits of the case. If the neighbors had a good 

appeal, had a good basis for their appeal or a reasonable basis 

for their appeal, if it was not strictly frivolous and only to delay 

the development, the court would not order a bond. 

Mr. ZELLER In other words, this would give us a break? 

Mr. ZEARFOSS. Yes. It is better than the law is now. It may 

not be as good as we would like, hut at least now if a neighbor 

has a reasonable appeal, he is not going to be out of court be- 

cause he cannot come up with a bond. 

Mr. ZELLER. Thank you very much. 

Bittinrer Giammarco McLane Sirlannl 

Gillette Mebus Smith. E. 

Horski Gleesan Meluskev Smith. I.. 

~~~~d~ Gwbal Milanovirh Spmcer w 

Brawn Goodman Miller Spitz 

Brunner Greenfield Milliron Stairs 

Burd Greenleaf Moehlmann Stapleton 

Burns Grieco Morris Stewart 

Caltagirone Halverson Mowery Stuban 

Caputo Hamilton Mrkonic Sweet . 

Cassidy Harper Mullen. M. P. Taddonio 

c , Hasay Musto Taylor. E. 

Cimini Hayes. D. S. Novak Taylor, F. 

HaymS. E. Noye Thomas 

,!?'p Helfriek O'Brien, B. Trella 

cowell Hoeffel O'Brien, D. Valicenti 

Davies Honaman O'ConnelJ Wagner 

DeMedio Hutchinson. A. O'Donnell Wansacz 

DeVerter Hutchinson, W. O'Keefe Wargu 

D ~ w Itkin ~ ~ ~ Pancoast ~ Wass 

DiCarlo Johnson Parker Weidner 

Dietz Jones Peterson Wenger 

Dininni Katz Petrarca White 

~ ~ ~ K b ~ ~ U ~ ~ piccola ~ ~ k Wiggins i 

Donatucci Kernick Pievsky Wilson 

Klingaman Pitts Wilt 

::ze Knepper Polite Wise 

Kolter Pott Wright, D. 

Dumas Kawalyshyn Pratt Wright. J. L. 

Englehart Kukovich Prendergast Yahner 

Fee 

Lashinger Pyles Yohn 

Fischer. R. R. Laughlin Quest Zearfoss 

F"hers D Id Lehr Rappaport Zeller 

Flaherty Letterman Ravenstahl Zitterman 

Faster, A, Levi Renwick Zord 

Foster,W. Levin Rhodes Zwikl 

Freind Lincoln Richardson 

Fryer Livengood Ritter Irvis. 

Gallagher Logue Ryan Speaker 

Gallen Lynch Salvatore 

NAYS--0 

NOT VOTING-13 

Artburs McGinnis Reed Tenaglio 

Cianciulli Miscevich Rieger Vroon 

Gray Oliver Ruggiero Williams 

~askeu 


the affirmative, the question was determined in the affirm- 

ative and the amendments were concurred in. 

Ordered, That the clerk inform the Senate accordingly. 


Delaware. Mr. Zearfoss. 

Mr. ZEARFOSS. Mr. Speaker, I move that the House do 

concur in amendments inserted by the Senate to HB 263, PN 

341.3. 

APPROPRIATIONS COMMITTEE MEETING 


Philadelphia, Mr. Pievsky, for the purposes of making an 


announcement. 

Will the House concur in Senate amendments? 

Mr. PIEVSKY. Mr. Speaker. the House AppropriationsCommittee 

is presently in recess and it will reconvene at the ad- 

Agreeable to the provisionsof the Constitution, the following . 

journment motion in the committee room. Thank you, Mr. 


Speaker. 

Anderson 

Amstrang 

Barber 


Bennett 

Berlin 

Berson 

YEAS--185 

Gamble Mackowski 

Garzia Madigan 

Gatski Manderino 

Geesev Manmiller 

~eislei ~c~all 

Gwrge, C. McClatchy 

George, M. Mclntyre 

Scanion 

Scheaffer 

Schmitt 

Schweder 

Scirica 

Seltzer 

Shupnik 

The SPEAKER. Does the gentleman desire to have the Chair 

remain open? 

Mr. PIEVSKY. Yes, Mr. Speaker. 

The SPEAKER. Very well. 

FINANCE COMMITTEE MEETING 

The SPEAKER. The Chair recognizes the gentleman from


Washington. Mr. Brunner. Does the gentleman have an an- 

nouncement? Is he on the floor of the House? The gentleman, 

Mr. Brunner. wishes to have announced a committee meeting 

of the Finance Committee immediately on the adjournment mo- 

tion. That will be the recess statement. At the rear of the hall of 

the House. Finance Committee meeting, immediately on the 

declaration of the recess. The reason the Chair says recess, we 

will wait until after the meetings and take the reports of com- 

mittees before we actual!y adjourn, hut the House will he in ad- 

journment until Monday. 

There will br one other vote before the members leave. Do 

not yet leave the floor; there isone other vote. 

SUBCOMMITTEE ON CRIME AND CORRECTIONS 

PUBLIC HEARING 


Allegheny County, Mr. Rhodes. 

Mr. RHODES. Mr. Speaker, I would like to remind the memhers 

of the Suhcomrnittee on Crime and Corrections that there 

will be a public hearing at 3 o'clock this afternoon in the House 


AMENDED SENATE BILLS 

CONCURRED IN BY SENATE 

The Senate ~nformed that the Senate has concurred in the 

amendments made by the House of Representatives to SB 

1200, PN 1917, and SB 3126, PN 2065. 

RECESS 

The SPEAKER. The House will now stand in recess until 2 

p.m. At 2 p.m. the Speaker will return to the podium to take re- 

ports of committees. The House will then stand adjourned until 

1 p.m., Monday, September 18.1978. The House now stands in 

recess until 2 p.m. 

AFTER RECESS 

The time of recess having expired, the House was called to 

order. 

BILL REPORTED FROM COMMITTEE 

maioritv caucus room. Our main witness will be His exrellmcv. HB Z4063 PN 3717 (Amended) By Mr. PIEVSKY 

~ ~~~-~~~ 

I 

the Governor, to discuss the Farview State Hospital problem. An Act making an appropriation to the Department of 


Justice for payment of costs incurred in the Farview State Hos- 

' pita! trials. 

BILLS PASSED OVER 


, . ~~ 

The SPEAKER. All the other bills on pages 5.6, and 7 which 

were passed over temporarily will go over for the week, and 

also all remaining bills. 

Mr. MANDERINO moved that the House insist upon Senate 

concurrence in House amendments to SB 984, PN 2064, and 

that a committee of conference he appointed. 

BILLS REREPORTED FROM COMMITTEE 



OF 'ONFERENCE 

The Senate informed that the Senate insists on nonconcur- 

An Act amending the act of June 28, 1935 (P. L. 477, No. 

193). referred to as the Enforcement Officer Disability Benefits 

Law, extending the act to include drug enforcement officers 

and investigators employed by the Bureau of Drug Control of 

the Department of Justice. 

rence in House amendments to SB 984, PN 2064. Rereported from Committee on Appropriations. 

And has appointed Messrs. ROMANELLI, ROSS and 

DOUGHERTY a committee of conference to confer with a simi- 


lar committee of the House of Representatives (if the House of 

Representatives shall appoint such committee)on the subject of 

the differences existing between the two houses in relation to 

said bill. 

An Act amending the "Senior Citizens Property Tax or Rent 

Rebate Act," March ll. lg71 (P. lo43 No. 3), further 

providing for the income schedule for eligible cla~mants. 

Rereported from Committee on Appropriations. 


An Act providing for the regulation of natural or man-made 

caverns which are used for the storage of crude oil or its deriva- 

tives.**'.providing for the regulation of the construction of 

such facilities by the Department of Environmental Resources, 

requiring the posting of a bond and providing penalties. 


Rereported from Committee on Appropriations. 

Will thr House agree to the motion? 

Motion was agreed to. 

/ HOUSE BILLS INTRODUCED AND REFERRED 

APPOINTMENT OF COMMITTEE OF CONFERENCE ON 

SENATE BILL NO. 984 

No. 2756 

TO COMMITTEES 

Bv Mr. GAKZIA 

The SPEAKER. The Chair appoints as a committee of conference 

on the part of the House: 

An Act ;~ni


No. 2757 By Mr. CALTAGIRONE 

An Act amending the act of May 16, 1921 (P. L. 579. No. 

262). entitled, as amended, "An act providing for the better 

management of the jails or county prisons in the several 

counties of this commonwealth of the third, fourth, fifth 

classes and in certain counties of the sixth, seventh and eighth 

classes by in such counties, a board to be known by 

the name and style of inspectors of the jail or county 

prison." * and employment of prisoners and the government 

and management of said jails or county prisons." providing for 

expenses for members of hoards of inspectors in counties of the 

third. fourth and fifth rlasses. 

Referred to Committee on Judiciary. 

No. 2758 By Messrs. MELUSKEY, KOWALYSHYN, 

BROWN. ZWIKL, TRELLO, QUEST, 

YAHNER, Mrs. HONAMAN. Messrs. 

CALTAGIRONE, FREIND. PICCOLA, 

BRANDT. ZEARFOSS and POTT 

An Act amending the "Public Schools Code of 1949," 

approved March 10. 1949 (P. L. 30, No. 14), further providing 

for the term of certain school directors. 

Referred to Committee on Education 

No. 2759 By Messrs. ARMSTRONG, WENGER, WILT 

and DeVERTER 

An Act amending "The Pennsylvania Workmen's Compensa- 

tion Act," approved June 2, 1915 (P. L. 736, No. 338), provid- 

ing an exemption from coverage under certain circumstances. 

Referred to Committee on Labor Relations 

No. 2760 By Messrs. O'KEEFE and STAPLETON 

An Act requiring members of the standing committees of 

both Houses of the General Assembly to elect their respective 

chairmen. 

Referred to Committee on State Government. 

No. 2761 By Messrs. SCIRICA, BERSON, SPENCER. 

MANDERINO. KUKOVICH, D. M. 

FISHER. YOHN, RHODES, O'DONNELL. 

GREENLEAF, REED, QUEST, HASKELL, 

HELFRICK, CALTAGIRONE, CASSIDY. 

FREIND and KNEPPER 

An Act relating to the Issuance of search warrants, imposing 

limitations on the issuance of search warrants in certain cases. 

establishing procedures for the issuance of and challenge to an 

investigative suhpopn:~ dures 1eCun1. 2nd providing for the 

promulgation of rulvs, 

Referred to Committee on Judiciary. I 

No. 2762 By Messrs. DeVERTER. LETTERMAN, 

DORR, A. C. FOSTER. WILSOK, E. H. 

SMITH, NOYE, Mrs. HONAMAN. Messrs. 

BRANDT. WAGNER and MACKOWSKI 

An Act amending the act of May 1, 1919 (P. L. 103. No. 79), 

referred to as the State Art Commission Law, providing that 

the State Art Commission shall he an advisory body in the 

Department of General Services and abolishing the commis- 

sion's jurisdirtion over political suhdivisions and repealing 

inconsistent laws. 

Referred to Committee on State Governm~nt 

No. 2763 By Messrs. BENNETT, PRATT, IRVIS, 

TAYLOR, MILANOVICH, COLE, COHEN 

and ZITTERMAN 

An Act amending the "Pennsylvania Industrial Development 

Act," May 17, 1956 (P. 1609, 537), 

providing for a further appropriation to the Industrial Develop- 

.rl 

~ ~ to committee f on ~ nusiness ~ commerce, ~ ~ d > 

No, 2764 ny M ~ BENNETT, ~ ~ PRA~, ~ IRVIS, ~ , 

TAYLOR, MILANOVICH, COLE. COHEN 

and ZITTERMAN 

An Act providing for the Pennsylvania Industrial Develop- 

ment Authority Lottery Fund and administration thereof; 

providing for the disposition of funds; violations and penalties 

therefore; exemption of prizes from local taxation; and allocat- 

ing money in said fund for industrial development projects in 

critical economic areas. 

Referred to Committee on Business and Commerce. 

No, 2765 By p Y ~ E ~ 

An Act amending the "Goods and Services Installment Sales 

Act,"approved October 28, 1966 (Sp. Sess. No. 1, P. L. 55, No. 

7). further providing for service charges on retail installment 

accounts 

Referred to Committee on Consumer Affairs 

No. 2766 By Messrs. PYLES and GREENLEAF 

An Act amending the act of August 5, 1932 (Sp. Sess. P. L. 

45, No. 45). referred to as the Sterling Act, providing for a 

credit against certain taxes. 

Referred to Committee on Urban Affairs. 

No. 2767 (By Request) By Messrs. McCLATCHY, 

LASHINGER, Mrs. KERNICK. Mr. PYLES. 

Mrs. GILLETTE, Messrs. NOVAK, 

CESSAR, TRELLO. GOEBEL, 

GREENLEAF, POLITE. PANCOAST. 

MEBUS, ZELLER, LYNCH, YOHN, 

McGINNIS, GARZIA, TENAGLIO, Mrs. 

TAYLOR, Messrs. E. H. SMITH, O'KEEFE, 

STAPLETON. S. E. HAYES, FREIND, 

BROWN. HALVERSON, SPITZ, 

KLINGAMAN, D. S. HAYES, R. R. 

FISCHER, LEHR. POTT, ARMSTRONG, 

D. M. FISHER, WEIDNER. J. L. WRIGHT. 

WILSON, GALLEN, MILLER, 

MOEHLMANN, Mrs. HONAMAN, Messrs. 

STAIRS, NOYE, W. D. HUTCHINSON and 

PETERSON 

1 

A Joint Resolution proposing an amendment to the Constitution 

of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, further providing 

for real propertytaxes. 

Referred to Committee on Rules. 

No. 2768 By Messrs. POTT, KOLTER, PETRARCA, * 

TRELLO. DININNI. CESSAR, GOEBEL. 

TADDONIO, BRUNNER. BURD. MEBUS. 

NOYE. E. H. SMITH. GREENLEAF and 

PYLES


An Act amending Title 75 (Vehicles) of the Pennsylvania 

Consolidated Statutes, further providing for the sale and use of 

studded tires and prescribing penalties. 

Referred to Committee on Transportation. I HB 2175, PN 3859 (Amended) By Mr. PIEVSKY 

HOUSE RESOLUTIONS INTRODUCED 

AND REFERRED 

No. 246 By Messrs. WILSON, WEIDNER, BURNS 

and J. L. WRIGHT 

The House of Representatives directs the House Rules 

Committee review the recommendations of the Legislative 

Audit Advisory Commission and the certified public account- 

ants contained in their most recently suhmitted report. 

Referred to Committee on Rules. 

No. 247 

(Concurrent) By Messrs. CASSIDY, MILLIRON, DAVIES, 

S. E. HAYES, McLANE and DIETZ 

Referred to Committee on Education. 

BILLS SIGNED BY SPEAKER 

levy an occupational assessment tax, utilize the valuation of the 

county having the lowest rate for each occupation, 

An Act amending "The Fourth to Eighth Class County 

Assessment Law,"approved May 21,1943 (P. L. 571, No. 2541, 

authorizing certain political subdivisions to choose certain 

valuations. 

Rereported from Committee on Appropriations, September 

26, 1978. 

This bill amends the Fourth to Eight Class County Assess- 

ment Law by providing that political subdivisions lying in more 

than one county, that levy an occupational assessment tax, 

utilize the valuation of the county having the lowest rate for 

each occupation. 




memorializes the congress of the united states to enact 

House Bill No. 2720 Senate Bill No. 467. 

An Act amending "The Local Tax Enabling Act," approved 

December 31, 1965 (P. L. 1257, No. 5111, authorizing certain 

political subdivisions to choose certain valuations. 

Referred to Committee on Federal-State Relations. 

Rereported from Committee on Appropriations. September 

26. 1978. 


This bill amends the Local Tax Enabling Act by providing 

that political subdivisions lying in more than one county, that 

SENATE BILL FOR CONCURRENCE 

levy an occupational assessment tax, utilize the valuation of the 

The Senate presented the following hill for concurrence: county having the lowest rate for each occupation. 

SB 1177, PN 1419. 

The following bills, having been prepared for presentation to 

the Governor, were signed by the Speaker: 

An Act amending the act of July 31, 1968 (P. L. 805, No. 

247), entitled as amended "Pennsylvania Municipalities Plan- 

ning Code" further providing for a stay of proceedings. 

SB 1200, PN 1917 

An Act establishing certain procedures relating to the 

termination of insurance agency contracts or accounts and pro- 

viding penalties. 

An Act relating to compensation of municipal officers. 



An Act amending "The Local Tax Enabling Act," approved 

December 31, 1965 (P. L. 1257, No. 511). authorizing certain 

political subdivisions to choose certain valuations. 


26,1978. 

This bill amends the Local Tax Enabling Act by providing 

that political subdivisions lying in more than one county, that 

l 


An Act amending "The Fourth to Eighth Class County 

Assessment Law," approved May 21,1943 (P. L. 571, No. 2541, 

authorizing certain political subdivisions to choose certain 

valuations. 


26, 1978. 

This bill amends the Fourth to Eighth Class County 

Assessment Law by providing that political subdivisions lying 

in more than one county, that levy an occupational assessment 

tax, utilize the valuation of the county having the lowest rate 

for each occupation. 

WELCOME 

The SPEAKER. The Chair at this time is pleased to welcome 

to the hall of the House the guests of the gentleman from 

Lehigh County, Mr. Meluskey: Mr. and Mrs. Andrew Molchany 

and Mr. and Mrs. Richard Udicious of Coplay. 

ADJOURNMENT 

Mr. PETERSON moved that this House of Representatives 

do now adjourn until Monday, September 18. 1978, at 1 p.m., 

e.d.t. 


Will the House agree to the motion? 

Motion was agreed to, and at 2:10 p.m., e.d.t., the House 

adjourned.

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