SENATE

Friday, 21 October 2016 Senate Page 37
Mr Matthews: No. It did note that the NT has accepted the recommendations and put in place the oversight
body.
Senator McALLISTER: I will come to the Children's Commissioner report. You were briefed about that. I
think you have acknowledged that. That appears in this question time brief.
Senator Scullion: Yes.
Senator McALLISTER: Have you read the report?
Senator Scullion: Indeed.
Senator McALLISTER: When did you read it?
Senator Scullion: I would have read it in the week following the Four Corners report.
Senator McALLISTER: It is pretty graphic isn't it? I have read it.
Senator Scullion: It is nowhere near as graphic as the Four Corners report. It only had two still photos,
neither of which included human beings. It is a complete contrast to the Four Corners report.
Senator McALLISTER: It talks about the use of tear gas doesn't it? It quotes the commissioner as saying,
'Use as much chemical as you want,' or words to that effect doesn't it?
Senator Scullion: No. The report did not say that at all. The Four Corners footage showed that, yes. That
makes my point that there seemed to be this culture of, 'She'll be right, mate. Ha-ha. Bit more chemicals; don't
worry about the budget.' That certainly wasn't met in the Vita report. Have you read the report, Senator?
Senator McALLISTER: I have read both of the reports. I am speaking now about the Children's
Commissioner report.
Senator Scullion: It was not in either report but it was in the footage.
Senator McALLISTER: Page 19 of the Children's Commissioner's report, which I will remind you was
released in August 2015, said:
The dog handler—
because, of course, they were preparing to use dogs on these children—
can be heard to ask:
'You going to gas the lot of them?'
It goes on to say:
The Commissioner is then heard to say to someone:
'…Mate, I don't mind how much chemical you use, we gotta get him out …'
It then goes on to say:
CCTV footage … shows 'A' and 'B' running to the back of their cell and hiding behind a mattress and sheet.
I think these were the prisoners who were playing cards at the time of the incident. The report goes on:
'A' later informed his case worker that ''he thought they were going to die'' and that he and 'B' ''said their good-byes''.
CCTV footage in BMU cell 1 shows 'C' covering his face with his shirt and running to the back of his cell and spitting, and
possibly vomiting into the toilet.
The report goes on to describe what happened to the officers working in the facility who entered the cells
without protective equipment and were themselves affected by the CS gas. This is on page 20 of the report that
was released in August. Then it talks about the Handycam footage captured on the basketball court that shows the
young people coughing and spitting on the ground.
That information was in the public domain, and I suppose it may be in writing rather than in pictures, but I
would say that it is still pretty graphic. Would you accept that?
Senator Scullion: Well, what are you saying? Is a giraffe a giraffe? Are you asking a question? You have just
told me a bunch of things, but if you ask me a question I will be able to be of assistance.
Senator McALLISTER: In your earlier remarks, you said that the cavalier approach to the use of force was
not evident in the reports published prior to the Four Corners program. The report I have read you extracts from
was published almost a year before the Four Corners program. Why then did you say to the committee that those
comments about the gas were not included in the report published in August 2015, when they plainly are included
on page 21 and page 22?
Senator Scullion: I would appreciate it if you did not verbal me. I read it from a process, but what I said was
that it was not evident from any of the reports that there was a culture of brutality or cover-up and that it was not
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