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interviu<br />

putini stalini ar aris. ruseTis mmarTvelebs surT, dasavlel liderebs<br />

daemsgavson. maT undaT, rom dasavleTma pativi sces, Tanac isini Zalian cinikurebi<br />

arian da ician, rom dasavleTi maT bevr rames apatiebs. SemTxveviT xom ar<br />

uswavliaT enebi? mmarTveli elitis Svilebic dasavleTSi swavloben, da maTi<br />

fulic dasavleTSia da ara CineTSi.<br />

rogorc ganaCeni. Zalian cud xasiaTze davdeqi, imis<br />

gamo ki ara, rom rusebma moiges es omi, warmoudgeneli<br />

agitacia-propagandis gamo, da imis gamoc, rom aranairi<br />

sociologiuri kvleva ar damWirvebia, iqve, saavadmyofoSi,<br />

Cem palataSi vnaxe, rogor kargad miiRo da rogor<br />

gaixara ubralo xalxma am yvelafriT. maSin kidev<br />

erTxel davinaxe cxadad, ramdenad Sors varT xalxisgan.<br />

saSineli gancda mqonda Cemi tankebis gamo sxvis miwaze.<br />

saSineli. magram esec, maSin, 2008 wlis agvistoSi ar yofila<br />

pirveli. daaxloebiT aseTive gancda mqonda meore<br />

CeCnuri omis dros. me arc evropel mSvidobismyofelebs<br />

vendobi, isinic raRac Tavis TamaSs TamaSoben. maxsovs,<br />

1999 wels, roca vesaubrebodi Cem megobar germanelebs<br />

da vlaparakobdiT imaze, rom miloSeviCi faSistia, vki-<br />

Txe, _ esTetikurad rogor warmogidgeniaT germanuli<br />

TviTmfrinavi belgradis Tavze-meTqi?<br />

uflebadamcvelebi „memorialidan“ maleve gamoemgzavrnen<br />

saqarTveloSi. me vende Cem kolegebsa da megobrebs,<br />

romlebmac Semdeg Tqves, rom pirveli gasrola<br />

saqarTvelos mxridan iyo. magram amas, mgoni, didi mniSvneloba<br />

ar aqvs. warmoidgineT ori adamiani, erTma meores<br />

mxari gakra, meorem ki sapasuxod _ uro Cakra TavSi.<br />

aseTi Tanafardobaa. saakaSvili rusul propagandaSi<br />

Zalian uaryofiTi figuraa da faSists eZaxian, da miuxedavad<br />

amisa, is CemSi simpaTias ar iwvevs. Tavidanve cxadi<br />

iyo, rom is populistia, populisti xelisuflebis<br />

saTaveSi ki yovelTvis upasuxismgebloa. meCveneba, rom<br />

am omma veranairi roli ver iTamaSa rusuli politikis<br />

ganviTarebaSi, roli iTamaSa xelisuflebis namdvilma<br />

sigiJem _ samxreT oseTisa da afxazeTis aRiarebam, rac<br />

cxadia, omze mniSvnelovania. im fenisTvis, romelsac me<br />

vekuTvni, es omi kidev erTi mizezi iyo imedgacruebisa,<br />

Semdeg daiwyo krizisi da gamarjvebis ganwyoba Zalian<br />

male gauqra xalxs.<br />

Cveni mTavari monapovari postsabWoTa sivrceSi rusuli<br />

enaa da amas unda gavufrTxildeT. putins, rogorc<br />

Cans, hgonia, rom es patara sacodavi oseTi ufro mniSvnelovania,<br />

vidre is, rom saqarTvelom SeiZleba uari<br />

Tqvas rusul enaze. es imdenad sxvadasxva wonis ambebia,<br />

rom amis axsna sasacilocaa. magram dRevandeli ruseTis<br />

mmarTvelebs es ar esmiT.<br />

Tqven sabWoTa teroris mkvlevari xarT. SeiZleba Tu ara<br />

ruseTSi gaxSirebuli politikuri mkvlelobebis terorad<br />

aRqma?<br />

42 cxeli Sokoladi<br />

ara, es stalinuri terori namdvilad ar aris. yvela<br />

mkvlelobas sxvadasxva mizezi aqvs. ruseTis mosaxleobaSi<br />

urapatriotuli ganwyobebi izrdeba. gaCnda neonacisturi<br />

dajgufebebi. isini sakmaod bevrni arian, Tanac<br />

amgvari ganwyobebi yvela asakis mosaxleobaSia. neonacistebi<br />

fiqroben, rom xelisufleba maT mxars uWers, da<br />

garkveulwilad, arc cdebian. samarTaldamcavebi maT<br />

mimarT ufro simpaTiiT arian ganwyobilebi, vidre antipaTiiT.<br />

me mainc mgonia, rom xelisuflebis zeda eSelonebSi<br />

ukve xvdebian am saSiSroebis Sesaxeb. xvdebian,<br />

rom es ara sayrdeni, aramed saSiSroebaa ruseTisTvis.<br />

magram am neonacistur dajgufebebs Zlieri dasayrdeni<br />

aqvT armiasa da samarTaldamcavebSi. vfiqrob, rom<br />

stanislav markelovis mkvleloba marTlac neonacistebis<br />

xeliTaa gakeTebuli, radganac is Zalian aqtiurad<br />

ibrZoda maT winaaRmdeg. SeiZleba, swored maT mierac<br />

iyos mokluli, vinc am saqmezea dapatimrebuli. natalia<br />

estemirovas mkvlelobas sxva mizezi aqvs da pirdapir<br />

ukavSirdeba kadirovis reJims. natalia saocari adamiani<br />

iyo, mas hqonda gansakuTrebuli pasuxismgeblobis grZnoba.<br />

aseTi adamianebi axla Zalian cotani arian. roca<br />

groznoSi putinis saxeli daarqves prospeqts, is ubralod,<br />

aRar dadioda am quCaze. arsebobs aseTi Janri qalaquri<br />

winaaRmdegobisa _ magaliTad, faSisturi reJimis<br />

dros germaniaSi, miunxenSi faSisturi simbolo dadges<br />

da Zalian bevri germaneli gverds uvlida am adgils,<br />

specialuri, SemovliTi marSrutebi SeimuSaves. natalias<br />

ar esmoda miniSnebebisa, ara mxolod CeCneTSi, mTel ruseTSi<br />

saerTod, gavrcelebulia urTierTobis es forma.<br />

arsebobs raRac zRurbli, romelsac ar unda gadaabijo,<br />

aris raRac dauwereli kanonebi, rogor unda moiqce ama<br />

Tu im SemTxvevaSi. cxadia, am wesebs araferi aqvs saerTo<br />

kanonebTan. mas ar esmoda es ena. kadirovi yvelanairad<br />

ecdeba, rom misi sikvdili boevikebs daabralos. eseni,<br />

samiveni _ politkovskaia, markelovi da natalia Cemi<br />

axloblebi iyvnen. politkovskaia da markelovi xSirad<br />

dadiodnen „memorialSi“, ar iyvnen „memorialis“ wevrebi,<br />

magram axlos iyvnen CvenTan. natalia ki Cveni TanamSromeli<br />

iyo da es yvelaferi Zalian mtkivneulia. politkovskaia,<br />

markelovi, estemirova _ es rigi, ra Tqma unda,<br />

arsebobs. maTi mkvlelobebis mizezebi SeiZleba gansxvavebulia,<br />

magram erTi ram namdvilad aerTianebT: ramdenad<br />

saSiSia ruseTSi cxovreba, roca gakveul Temebs ikvlev<br />

da rusul nacionalistur cnobierebas exebi. sqema,<br />

romliTac ruseTis xelisufleba moqmedebs, namdvilad

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