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arCevnebs, romelic am kviris

bolos unda Catardes, bevri gadamwyvet arCevnebad miiCnevs.

bevrs sjera, rom 31 oqtombers xelisufleba Seicvleba. msgavsi

molodinebi ar aqvs politolog petre mamraZes. misi azriT,

qarTul politikur velze ar Cans Zala, romelic „qarTul

ocnebasa” da biZina ivaniSvils Caanacvlebs. amasTan, polito-

logi aRniSnavs, rom „qarTuli ocnebis” lideri bevr Secdomas

uSvebs. am Secdomebs mamraZe imas miawers, rom ivaniSvili poli-

tikosi araa. politologi miiCnevs, rom saqarTveloSi sistema

kidev didxans ar Seicvleba. misi azriT, xelisufleba Tu mainc

Seicvala, aq gavlenebis gadanawilebisTvis brZolebi daiwyeba.

ratom ar daisajnen cixis

mwameblebi? ratom gamouSva

cixidan kbilaSvilma lado

bedukaZe? ras saqmianobda laSa

nacvliSvili? vin da ra ufuWebs

saqmes biZina ivaniSvils? rogor

lagdeboda biznesebi? _ am Te-

mebis Sesaxeb „qronika+”-s petre

mamraZe esaubreba:

_ batono petre, bevri ambobs,

rom arCevnebi, romelic am

kviris bolos Catardeba, saqar-

Tvelos istoriaSi gadamwyveti

iqneba. Tqven ras fiqrobT?

_ sruli pasuxismgeblobiT

vacxadeb, rom es ar aris gadamwyveti

arCevnebi. gadamwyveti arCevnebis

dros xalxis SemarTeba

sul sxvanairia xolme. dRes gansxvavebuli

viTarebaa. amomrCevels

ar aqvs ganwyoba, rom

arsebobs Zala, romelic xelisuflebaSi

Tu mova, gveSveleba, _

amaTi mosvliT qveyanas patroni

eyoleba da Rirs arCevnebze wasvlao.

am dros lamis saxalxo

moZraoba iwyeba xolme.

saqarTvelo postsabWoTa qveynebisgan

amiT gamoirCeva. Cvenc

ar SegviZlia xelisuflebis yoveldRiuri

monitoringi, magram

drodadro aseTi saxalxo moZraobebis

Sedegad vcvliT xelisuflebebs.

ase moxda 2003 wels. maSin

arCevnebi „vardebis revoluciiT”

dasrulda. ase moxda 2012

wels _ xelisuflebis Secvla ma-

Sin gadawyvita xalxma, roca cixis

sadisturi kadrebi vnaxeT. manamdec

vicodiT, Tu ra xdeboda

cixeebSi, magram kadrebma xalxze

saSinlad imoqmeda.

dRes politikur asparezze ar

Cans iseTi Zala, romelsac xelisuflebis

Secvla SeuZlia.

arCevnebSi 47 subieqti monawileobs,

magram bevri maTgani partia

araa, ufro feodalur dajgufebebs

warmoadgens.

erTaderi arsebobs saakaSvili,

romlis momxreebic 13-dan

17%-mde meryeobs. es aris saakaSvilis

erTguli eleqtorati. es

is xalxia, romelic arCevnebze

nebismier amindSi midis. maTTvis

arc politikur aminds aqvs mniSvneloba.

arCevnebze midian da

miSas aZleven xmas. maTTvis mTavaria,

lideri iyos miSa da sulerTia,

vin iqneba „nacionalebis”

saxeliT parlamentSi. am

eleqtoratis xmebs verc vaSaZis

partia waiRebs da verc _ ugulava-bokerias

frTa. es, ubralod,

gamoricxulia.

2016 wlis saparlamento arCevnebSi

„nacionalurma moZraobam”

27% aiRo. Tu am arCevnebze dabali

daswreba iqna da arCevnebi

ar gayalbda, opoziciidan isev

saakaSvilis partia aiRebs yvelaze

maRal procentebs. sxva araferi

moxdeba. „qarTuli ocneba”

isev bevr adgils moipovebs

parlamentSi da maT axali mTav-

10

Sorena marsagiSvili

599 92 16 22

294 69 77; qronikaqronika@gmail.com

robis dasakompleqteblad SesaZloa,

romelime ZalasTan koaliciis

Seqmnac ki ar dasWirdeT

_ ratom ggoniaT, rom „ocneba”

bevr adgils miiRebs parlamentSi?

am partiam xalxs seri-

ozulad gaucrua imedebi.

_ „qarTulma ocnebam” xalxs

imedebi gaucrua, magram mainc es

Zala moipovebs umravlesobas.

imis gamo, rom opoziciaSi saakaSvilze

popularuli aravin aris,

„ocneba” parlamentSi bevr mandats

miiRebs.

_ opozciaSi yvelaze popu-

laruli saakaSvili rom iyos, es,

SemTxveviT, ivaniSvils xom ar

awyobs?

_ ar vici, magram faqtia, rom

es asea. xalxSi arc moTxovnaa

xelisuflebis cvlilebaze. es

mafiqrebinebs, rom arCevnebze

xelisufleba ar Seicvleba.

2003 wlis gazafxulze ukve

Canda, rom xelisufleba Seicvleboda.

ucxoelebi kvlevebs

atarebdnen. am kvlevebis mixedviT

pirvel adgilze iyo Salva

naTelaSvili, meoreze _ mixeil

saakaSvili. es Sedegi moitana

qveyanaSi arsebulma totalurma

korufciam. xalxi veRar itanda

amas, rac maSin xdeboda. visac ki

SeeZlo fulis aReba, yvela iRebda.

am fonze saakaSvili brwyinvale

sityvebiT gamodioda da

amis gamo xalxs is qarizmatul

liderad moeCvena.

2012 wels „nacionaluri

moZraoba” cixis sadisturma kadrebma

daamTavra. aRsaniSnavia

isic, rom im dros miSa iseTi

popularuli aRar iyo, rogorc

wina wlebSi, magram administraciuli

resursi mas emxroboda. cixis

kadrebis gasvlis Semdeg 20%

mowyda „nacionalur moZraobas”

da „qarTul ocnebasTan” gadavida.

ase moigo arCevnebi maSin

ivaniSvilis partiam.

_ am cixis kadrebs seriozuli

skandali mohyva. bevri maSinve

amtkicebda, rom es yve-

laferi dadgmuli iyo. saubaria

gaupatiurebis kadrebze. axla

gavrcelda saubaris Canaweri,

saidanac Cans, rom am speqtaklis

dadgmaSi bedukaZes vano Cxar-

tiSvilma fuli gadauxada. imaze

aravin daobs, rom patimrebs

marTla awamebdnen, magram cocx-

ebis kadrebi dadgmulia.

_ aranairi safuZveli ar maqvs

imis gamosaricxad, rom gaupatiurebis

kadrebi dadgmuli iyo. es

rom gamovricxo, saamisod sa-

Tanado mtkicebulebebi unda

mqondes. karantinis daSla ki namdvilia.

es rom ase xdeboda, amis

Sesaxeb manamdec vicodi, sanam

kadrebi gavrceldeboda.

2008 wels parlamentis wevri

rom gavxdi, adamianis uflebaTa

dacvis komitetis Tavmjdomaris

moadgile viyavi. cixeebSi arsebul

situaciaze zRva masala wa-

`am arCevnebze

petre mamraZe:

`qarTulma

ocnebam~ xalxs

imedebi gaucrua,

magram mainc es

Zala moipovebs

umravlesobas~

movida. maxsovs, CemTan 50 wlamde

inteligenti qalbatoni Semovida.

Tavs ikavebda, magram mere

tiriliT momiyva, Tu ras uSvrebian

mis vaJiSvils cixeSi. es zustad

daemTxva im monaTxrobebs,

rasac manamde sxva adamianebisgan

vismendi.

karantinis daSlis kadrebSi

Canda lagodexis policiis maSindeli

ufrosi, romelic fexebs

urtyamda patimars. am scenas vi-

Racebi videokameriT iRebdnen. es

aris uxeSi kanondarRveva. policiis

ufross ra undoda gldanis

cixeSi?! vin SeuSva?! axlave

getyviT, rac xdeboda: es iyo

danaSaulebrivi jaWvi. Cinosnebs

eubnebodnen, Sen Tu erTguli

xar, amaSi monawileobas miiReb,

Cven amas videoze gadaviRebTo.

vici SemTxvevebi, roca ramdenime

policielma amaze uari

Tqva. erTma saerTod gaixada

forma da ruseTSi wavida, meorem

avadmyofoba moimizeza da sistema

datova, magram sxvebi darCnen,

romlebic am ukanonobas sCadiodnen

da viRacas erTgulebas

umtkicebdnen.

saqarTveloSi yvelam icoda,

rom cixeebSi ubedureba trialebda.

amitom piradad Cemze

naklebad moqmedebs, Tuki am kadrebis

sanacvlod lado beduka-

Zes fuli gadauxades. arc is

mainteresebs, Tu vin gadauxada

fuli. amis Semdeg cixeebSi adamianebis

wameba Sewyda.

_ arc is moqmedebs Tqvenze,

cixis cnobili jalaTebi rom ar

dasaja „qarTuli ocnebis” xe-

lisuflebam?

_ rogor ar moqmedebs. isic

mikvirs, ratom gaisusa Semdeg am

Temaze „ocneba”. am kadrebis gavrcelebamde

bedukaZem saqarTvelo

datova. saqarTveloSi xelisuflebis

Secvlis Semdeg dabrunda

da is daakaves. cixidan

skandaluri kadrebis avtori

arCil kbilaSvilma gamoiyvana,

romelsac mTavari prokuroris

posti ekava. man amisTvis gamoiyena

mTavari prokurorisTvis miniWebuli

ufleba, romlis Tanaxmadac

mTavar prokurors aqvs

ufleba, gaaTavisuflos esa Tu

is patimari. ase gauSva bedukaZe.

amaze atyda ambavi, magram ra

atyda. Tina xidaSeli bolo xmaze

wioda da kioda. arc sxvebi aklebdnen.

yvela gaiZaxoda, rom

bedukaZem Tavis namoqmedarze

pasuxi unda agoso. am isterikis

sapasuxod kbilaSvilma preskonferencia

moawyo da Tqva, beduka-

Zis SemTxvevaSi kanoni ar damir-

`gaxsovT, biZina ivaniSvilis gancxadeba

kbilaSvilTan dakavSirebiT? man aseTi rame

Tqva, - laSa nacvliSvili prokuraturaSi

akeTebs imas, rasac ver akeTebs kbilaSvilio.

nacvliSvili maSin mTavari prokuroris

moadgile iyo~

Rvevia, Cemi ufleba gamoviyeneo.

misive ganmartebiT, is adamianebi,

romlebic wlebis ganmavloba-

Si sadisturad epyrobodnen patimrebs

cixeebSi, umravlesoba

sistemaSi darCa da sakmaod bevric

dawinaurda. kbilaSvilis

TqmiT, aseT viTarebaSi bedukaZis

datoveba cixeSi ar SeiZleboda,

mas samagieros gadauxdidnen.

_ kbilaSvilma mwameblebis

dawinaurebas ratom ar SeuSala

xeli? cixidan bedukaZis gamoy-

vanis magivrad es gaekeTebina.

_ rogor unda SeeSala

amisTvis xeli? sasjelaRsruleba

mis daqvemdebarebaSi myofi

sistema ar iyo.

_ magram kbilaSvili iyo

prokurori da SeeZlo saqmis

aRZvra.

_ rogor ar SeeZlo, magram...

gaxsovT, biZina ivaniSvilis gancxadeba

kbilaSvilTan dakavSirebiT?

man aseTi rame Tqva, _ laSa

nacvliSvili prokuraturaSi akeTebs

imas, rasac ver akeTebs kbilaSvilio.

nacvliSvili maSin mTavari

prokuroris moadgile iyo.

_ nacvliSvilis nakeTeb saqm-

eebze legendebi dadioda da

Tqveni azriT, ras gulisxmobda

ivaniSvili?

_ nacvliSvili akeTebda imas,

razedac gia xuxaSvilma erT-erT

Tavis interviuSi isaubra. ker-

Zod, xuxaSvili ambobda, rom xelisuflebaSi

„ocnebis” mosvlis

Semdeg is da uCa mamacaSvili

alagebdnen xelisuflebis urTierTobas

biznesTan. misi ganmartebiT,

erTi wlis Semdeg is

saqmidan gamovida, biZinas deidaSvilma

ki saqmianoba gaagrZela.

isini „piqselis” SenobaSi, daviT

kezeraSvilis yofil ofisSi

isxdnen. imis Wkuac ki ar eyoT,

rom sxvagan damsxdariyvnen. aq

dalagdeboda raRac da mere midiodnen

prokuraturaSi. maSin

saqarTveloSi modaSi iyo aseTi

kiTxva, _ Caxsnili xar? amas biznesmenebs

ekiTxebonen xolme.

_ ras niSnavda es kiTxva?

saidan unda CaexsnaT?

_ es kiTxva niSnavda imas, rom

wilebis xelaxali gadaformeba

mimdinareobda. es sasamarTlosa

da prokuraturis gareSe gvardeboda.

erTmaneTs aravin erCoda.

amas Taviseburi plusi hqonda.

10 N26 (328) 27.10-.2.11.2020 w.

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