Théâtre <strong>du</strong> <strong>Soleil</strong> in AfghanistanA discussion with Ariane Mnouchkine,Robert Kluyver, and Anthony RichterThe following remarks are edited and con<strong>de</strong>nsedfrom a panel discussion held on July 28, 2005,at the Open Society Institute in New York. Theparticipants inclu<strong>de</strong>d Ariane Mnouchkine,director of the Théâtre <strong>du</strong> <strong>Soleil</strong>; AnthonyRichter, OSI associate director and director of theCentral Eurasia Project; and Robert Kluyver,executive director of the Foundation for Cultureand Civil Society, OSI’s principal partner andrepresentative in Afghanistan. Mnouchkine’scompany had recently completed a three-weekacting workshop in Kabul in col<strong>la</strong>boration withthe Foundation for Culture and Civil Society.anthony richter I am familiar with therole culture p<strong>la</strong>ys in shaping public space, infostering intellectual exchange, and in <strong>de</strong>velopingfreedom of expression. But in Afghanistanour engagement is focused, as the nameof the Foundation for Culture and CivilSociety suggests, on the over<strong>la</strong>p between cultureand social engagement — the essence ofAriane Mnouchkine’s work. When we werefirst approached by Elizabeth Hayes and theFrench American Cultural Exchange, withoutwhom none of this would have been possible,Elizabeth and I thought it might be interestingto intro<strong>du</strong>ce the Théâtre <strong>du</strong> <strong>Soleil</strong> to colleaguesin Afghanistan who are also trying tobring together culture and social engagement.That’s how we got here today, as our friendscan tell you.robert kluyver One day <strong>la</strong>st November,Elizabeth and Anthony suggested I go toParis to see the Théâtre <strong>du</strong> <strong>Soleil</strong>’s pro<strong>du</strong>ctionof <strong>Le</strong> <strong>de</strong>rnier caravansérail and talk with Arianeabout any possible cooperation. It seemedlike a won<strong>de</strong>rful i<strong>de</strong>a — maybe not somethingthat would happen right away, but it was agood i<strong>de</strong>a in any case to take a day to see thecompany’s work and meet with Ariane. I livein France, and as you know the Théâtre <strong>du</strong><strong>Soleil</strong> is the foremost French theater group,which in its forty years has put on incrediblepro<strong>du</strong>ctions. I went to the theater piece, withoutknowing anything about it beforehand,and I was extremely surprised to see that therewas so much focus on Afghanistan, where Ihad been working and living for the <strong>la</strong>st fiveyears — so much emphasis, in fact, that manyof the actors had learned their lines in Farsi.Of course it’s a very multinational troupe, andsome of its members are native Farsi speakers.But I thought it was an incredible effort — notonly to un<strong>de</strong>rstand the <strong>la</strong>nguage, but alsoto un<strong>de</strong>rstand the culture, and the p<strong>la</strong>ce inAfghanistan. I thought, why and how did shefind all these Afghan actors? They were evenspeaking with Afghan accents, not even Iranianaccents. We had this won<strong>de</strong>rful discussionand found out that the basis of Ariane’swork on the pro<strong>du</strong>ction was a true passion forAfghanistan — which, as Ariane will tell us, isalso shared by many actors in the group. AndAriane Mnouchkineat Théâtre <strong>du</strong><strong>Soleil</strong>’s workshop inAfghanistan, 2005.Courtesy of DuccioBellugi-Vannuccini67
théâtre <strong>du</strong> soleil in afghanistanbeth suggested that Robert see the p<strong>la</strong>y, andit started from that good luck — it’s good to beremin<strong>de</strong>d of that.When Robert came and saw the p<strong>la</strong>y hewas astonished at how strong the re<strong>la</strong>tionshipwas between this work and Afghanistan. Sowe won<strong>de</strong>red what we could do. Of course, wecould not go and perform <strong>Le</strong> <strong>de</strong>rnier caravansérailthere. The pro<strong>du</strong>ction was too big, tooexpensive, and also, probably, not exactly theright thing to do anyway. It was too soon tobring such a piece there. But then we had thei<strong>de</strong>a of doing a workshop. I remember Robertasked, “How many people will come — three,four?” And I said, “Forty.” He said, “Forty?”And I said it would be important for all theactors to come, and the others too. I felt thatwe nee<strong>de</strong>d a <strong>la</strong>rge show of strength to be there,to show what we’re doing. After all, we weren’tgoing to Afghanistan to show what theater is;we’re going to show what our theater is. Andthat’s already a lot to do. So I nee<strong>de</strong>d all thecompany to be there, to share, to receive fromthe Afghan people, and to give whatever theyhave to give.So the word money came up again.How do you pay for these p<strong>la</strong>ne tickets toAfghanistan? And I must say that the Ministryof Foreign Affairs in France paid. Robert’sfoundation is located in a big, beautiful,strange house, and they had room for us tosleep and eat there. There was a beautiful gar<strong>de</strong>nin which we could work, and there wasa small stage, which we ma<strong>de</strong> a little bit biggerwhen we arrived, and so sud<strong>de</strong>nly therewe were. Forty-three of us went and stayedfor three weeks, with all sorts of i<strong>de</strong>as fromthings people told us: “It’s very dangerous,don’t go, there’s a p<strong>la</strong>gue, there’s cholera,there’s the Taliban, you’ll be shot, you’ll becut into pieces, you’ll be kidnapped.” Mostof the actors’ parents hated me for doing this.It meant assuming a <strong>la</strong>rge responsibility fortaking my friends there; we had a discussionabout it before leaving, of course, and peoplesaid, very honestly, “I think I’m afraid.”Nobody was obliged to come, but many ofthem chose to come all the same.And then the most incredible thingshappened. We felt that we were very, veryprotected. We would not go out without anAfghan friend. On all the excursions Robertarranged for us, there was a man with aKa<strong>la</strong>shnikov — a Ka<strong>la</strong>shnikov — on both endsof our little caravan. (We did not have interactionwith American troops there, becausewe did not see a single American in Kabul. Idon’t think they’re in Kabul; they’re in Bagh<strong>la</strong>n,and they were fighting in the southeast,first of all.)But nonetheless we sud<strong>de</strong>nly beganmeeting normal people: competent people,curious people, emotional people, gratefulpeople, and very, very interesting people.Among them of course were stu<strong>de</strong>nts, abouta hundred people every day, most of themfrom the fine arts <strong>de</strong>partment at the university.However, that didn’t mean that theywere all fine arts stu<strong>de</strong>nts by choice. Some ofthem, it turns out, were in that <strong>de</strong>partmentbecause they couldn’t get into another <strong>de</strong>partment— that was strange to us. They wantedto do medicine or chemistry or something,and they were not accepted. You can imaginewhat the University of Kabul is today,still, in spite of the efforts and achievementsin recovery. This has to be said sometimesabout Afghanistan — in the newspapers, weonly read about the catastrophes. But thereare achievements, too; there is a lot of workgoing on. Many people are trying to buildthings there and are trying to improve the situation.They come from within Afghanistanfirst, but they also come from Europe, fromAmerica, from everywhere. Little by littlewe came to un<strong>de</strong>rstand that. For instance,69
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