Minutes of Evidence p.1401-1509 - Parliament of Victoria

1427
48283. What prevented you from trying, was it a foregone conclusion that they could not be made?-­
If we could not get them except out of the country, we would not go out of our own shops, because if we
sent to a man outside to make for us, he would make for our opponents. much cheaper than for us, having
made the patterns at our cost.
48284. Do I understand you that you cannot get sufficient pollard in Melbourne of Melbourne
manufacture ?-I mean that pollard is much cheaper in New Zealand than in Melbourne.
48285. Is there sufficient here for your supply ?-Yes, there is, and if there were ten times as much,
it would be all used one way or other, for it is used for all sorts of purposes, feeding and so on.
48286. Then you want the duty off so as to lower the price ?-Yes, I want to buy my raw material
in the cheapest market.
48287. And you consider that your industry, employing such an immense number of hands, is very
heavily handicapped by these duties ?-Yes, as we get no advantage.
this chair said he got an advantage from the tariff ; we do not.
The witness withdrew.
Now the last gentleman who sat in
J oseph Henry Walker sworn and examined.
48288. By the ChaiTrnan.-What are you ?-Biscuit manufacturer.
48289. Where is your factory ?-Bourke-street west.
48290. How many hands have you got employed ?-Forty-five in the biscuits, and fifty in jam.
48291. We will take the biscuits now alone. How long have you been established ?-Seven years.
48292. You have heard the evidence of Mr. Swallow~do you agree with it ?-Entirely. The only
point I wish to mention is about the pollard. Our general goods being superior to the other colonies, we are
doing a large trade with the other colonies, excepting in ship bread, for this very reason that we cannot
turn out the ship bread anything near the price the Sydney factories can, and I do not think.Mr. Swallow
laid suffieient stress upon that fact about the supply. We cannot get the sharps here. The mills do
their work better here and there are fewer sharps. There are harclly any sharps here. vVe have to take
fine flour to make common ship bread or we cannot make it at all. I am very often in Sydney and I cannot
get orders there on account of the price.
48293. Then if sharps were admitted free you would be satisfied ?-We should be upon a level then
and could compete with any colony.
48294. You do not want flour free, there is plenty of flour here?-Yes.
48295. You entirely agree with Mr. Swallow that the removal of the 2d. a pound duty upon biscuits
would not interfere with your industry ?-Not in the slightest.
48296. By 11fr. Zox.-If the sharps were to be admitted free into the country, would it increase
your business ?-Yes. . .
48297. Have you any idea to what extent it would increase the trade of the whole colony ?-It is
such a growing business, we could not answer the question. \V e should double and treble and so on.
48298. Would it enable you to employ more hands in your factory ?-Yes.
48299. To what extent do you think ?-I suppose a sixth of our whole time is taken up with ship
bread. I think the ship bread trade might easily be trebled.
48300. You are satisfied that if that article were imported here without duty you could successfully
compete with Great Britain and also the other Australian colonies?-Yes.
The witness withdTew.
Thomas Bibby Guest sworn and examined.
48301. By the Chairman.-What are you ?-Biscuit baker.
48302. Where is your factory ?-William-street.
48303. How many years has it been. established ?-Twenty-seven.
48304. How many hands are you employing ?-About ninety.
48305. All at biscuit making ?-Yes.
48306. How many hands had you when you commenced ?-About half-a-dozen.
48307. Do you do an export trade ?-Very little.
48308. Do you agree with the evidence of Mr, Swallow in relation to the article of sharps ?-I do
thoroughly.
48309. You wish to supplement what he said in regard to another matter-what is it ?-In regard
to machinery, there are manufacturers of biscuit machinery at home who make this business a speciality,
and as the machinists here cannot make that machinery, I do not think we ought to pay the large duty
levied upon it,
48310. When you say they cannot make them here, what do you mean by "cannot," that they have
not the appliances, or that the machinery is patent and they must not touch it ?-Perhaps both. They begin
by being a patent at home, but the patent runs out. As an instance, I have a machine in my place that cost
in Liverpool £290. I asked an engineer one day what he would make one for. " Well,'' he said, " I would
not make the patterns for £500." ''Well," I said, "what would the machine come to?" "Oh ! goodness
knows, I do not," was his reply ; but I can easily · 1mderstand that the first machine would cost
a manufacturer perhaps a couple of thousand poimds, but having a number selling all over the world he
could afford to sell his first machine for £300. A man could not make them here. I have got one of the
maimfacturer's lists in my works if you would like to see it-[producing and handing in a papeT ].
Those are cutting machines and other machines. There are machines there running up to £7 50 a piece.
48311. Patent travelling ovens, are those the sort of ovens you use ?-Those are the sort I use.
48312. Then we understand you to endorse the evidence o£ previous witnesses, that special machinery
used in your trade, and for which there is very little demand in the, colony, and that ·could not be made
here at a reasonable price, should be admitted free ?-Yes, it would not possibly be worth the while of any
machinist here to make them.
48313. How long would a machine last you ?-Possibly five or six years, ancl then it would be cheaper
to have a new one than to have it renovated.
48314. What would be the total duty upon this machine ?-27! per cent. re the tariff as at
present.
T, Swallow,
contimted,
lat Ma.y 1888,
J. EL Walker,
lst May 1883.
T.B. Guest,
lst May 188i.f,