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294 69 77; qronikaqronika@gmail.com
seriozulad ar aRiqvamen~
iT. daanonsda 15 maisi. cota xom
ar agvianebT?
_ Cemze rom yofiliyo damokidebuli
am sakiTxis gadawyveta,
aseTi xangrZlivi droiT ar gadavdebdi
aqciis gamarTvas. davniSnavdi
aqcias da aRar davSlidi,
arc komendantis saaTs gaviTvaliswinebdi.
Tu brZolas viwyebT,
maSin bolomde unda gavideT.
am xelisuflebis wamalia,
SigniT aqciebi da garedan sanqciebi.
_ es leiboristebis slogania?
yvela leiboristi amas am-
bobs.
_ ki, Cveni slogani gaxda. gamarjveba
Tu gvinda, SigniT aqciebi
unda gvqondes da garedan _
sanqciebi. naxevrad enis moCleqiT
saubrisa da politkoreqtulobis
dro aRar aris. yvelam
unda SevignoT isic, rom saqme
politikosebTan ar gvaqvs. Cven
veomebiT oligarqsa da uzurpators,
romelsac mitacebuli
aqvs xelisufleba da Cveulebrivi
yaCaRia. politikur processa
da molaparakebebs mxolod
maSin aqvs azri, rodesac meore
mxaresac politikosebi dganan.
raze unda davelaparakoT oligarqis
msaxur umwifar gogo-bi-
Webs, romlebic parlamentSi
sxedan.
_ umwifrebs vis eZaxiT?
_ Tundac, irakli kobaxiZes.
_ bavSvuri garegnoba ki aqvs,
magram 43 wlisaa ukve eg ymawvili.
mis asakSi Jvania ukve orjer
iyo parlamentis Tavmj-
domare.
_ Jvaniasa da kobaxiZis erTmaneTTan
Sedareba warmoudgenlad
mimaCnia. misi gadawyvetilebebi
ar momwonda, magram is iyo
didi politikosi. ukve 18 weli
gavida, rac leiboristuli
partiis wevri var.
_ ramdeni wlis xarT?
_ 38-is. 20 wlis viyavi, politikaSi
rom Cavebi.
_ 38 wlis Tu xarT, biZisto-
la kobaxiZes umwifars rogor
eZaxiT?
_ kobaxiZeze asakiT patara ki
var, magram magaze meti politikuri
gamocdileba maqvs. 18 welia,
politikaSi var da sami xelisuflebis
opoziciaSi momiwia yofna:
SevardnaZis, saakaSvilisa da
amaTi. xSirad erTmaneTs vadareb,
magram isini sxva donis politikosebi
iyvnen. dRes vin arian qveynis
pirveli pirebi? irakli
RaribaSvili saerTod vin aris?
arsaidan mosuli kacia. mas begraundic
ki ar aqvs. ivaniSvilis
Cveulebrivi klerki iyo, romelic
beras davalebebsac asrulebda
_ antonobda. kobaxiZeze saer-
Tod ra vTqva? ar SeiZleba massa
da Jvanias Soris paralelis gavleba.
_ arc vavleb, mxolod asakis
gamo vaxsene kobaxiZis gverdiT
Jvania.
_ asakis gamoc ar unda davayenoT.
viRacam gaacno kobaxiZe
ivaniSvils. iman ar vici, ra
`mas Zalian bevrma adamianma dauWira mxari, radgan didi fuli hqonda.
qeTi doliZe da nineli WankvetaZe rom sofel-sofel dadiodnen da xalxs
hpirdebodnen, TiTo sofels 5 milioni miecemao, amitom misca xalxma xma
oligarqs, Torem ivaniSvilis sxva ra unda moswonebodaT? - oratori is ar
yofila da politikuri gamocdilebac ar hqonia~
TvaliT Sexeda da arsaidan mosuli
kaci parlamentis spikerad
dagvisva. kobaxiZes saerTod ar
gaaCnia Tavmoyvareoba. is gavrilovis
sisxliani Ramis Semdeg
gadaayenes parlamentis Tavmjdomaris
Tanamdebobidan. xazs
vusvam: gadaayenes! sakuTari nebiT
am Tanamdebobis datovebas
ar apirebda. amis gamo nebismieri
Tavmoyvare adamiani datovebda
deputatis mandats da saerTod
wavidoda politikidan. iseTi
uTavmoyvareoa, deputatis mandatsac
ver Seelia. Camovida
spikeratidan da rigiTi deputatis
savarZelSi Cajda.
_ miwyenT, magram 2001 wels
zurab Jvaniac gadadga spiker-
obidan da uproblemod Cajda
rigiTi deputatis savarZelSi.
_ Jvanias gadadgoma Zalian
drouli iyo. man gadaiyola
mTavroba. maSin gadadga „rkinis
kacad“ Seracxuli kaxa TargamaZec,
romelic narkobaroni da
aTasi saSinelebis Semoqmedi iyo.
_ kobaxiZes daufasda, Camo-
laboranteba rom aitana _ axla
partiaSi pirveli kacia.
_ ver dageTanxmebiT, rom
pirveli kacia.
_ ratom ver dameTanxmebiT,
partiis Tavmjdomare xom aris?
_ partiis Tavmjdomareoba ar
niSnavs, rom partiaSi pirveli
kacia. „qarTuli ocnebis” Sida
samzareuloSi didad Caxeduli
ar var, magram Cemamdec ki movida
xmebi imis Sesaxeb, rom irakli
kobaxiZe gadawyvetilebebis
mimRebi piri ar aris.
_ gindaT TqvaT, rom „ocne-
ba” kobaxiZes ar emorCileba?
_ ra Tqma unda, ar emorCileba.
Zalian bevri mis personas
araseriozulad uyurebs. es adamianebi
mis gadawyvetilebas
rogor daemorCilebian? saRad
moazrovne xalxi „ocnebaSic”
aris. isini am umwifari ymawvilis
azrebs araviTar SemTxvevaSi ar
`dRes vin arian qveynis pirveli pirebi?
irakli RaribaSvili saerTod vin aris?
arsaidan mosuli kacia. mas begraundic ki ar
aqvs. ivaniSvilis Cveulebrivi klerki iyo,
romelic beras davalebebsac asrulebda -
antonobda~
gaiziareben. mas yuradRebasac ki
ar miaqcevdnen, magram ician, rom
kobaxiZe ivaniSvilis mosazrebebs
aJRerebs da amitom arian
Cumad. yvelam kargad icis partiaSi,
rom am umwifars piradi
iniciativebi ar gaaCnia.
_ samagierod, kargi demago-
gia.
_ demagogia xelmocaruli politikosebis
TavSesafaria. Sei-
Zleba miTxraT, xelmocaruli
rogoraa, roca pirveli kacia
partiaSio. es ivaniSvilis nebaa.
rodesac „qarTuli ocneba” xelisuflebas
CamoSordeba, es
kobaxiZe Tavis sadarbazoSic ki
ver iqneba pirveli kaci. is saer-
Tod aorTqldeba politikidan.
ise ar ifiqroT, rom amas mxolod
opoziciaSi yofnis gamo
vambob. Jvanias mowinaaRmdegec
viyavi, magram yovelTvis vaRiarebdi
da axlac vaRiareb, rom
is didi politikosi iyo. adre
xelisuflebaSi ufro Rirseuli
pirebi iyvnen.
_ „ocnebaSi” Rirseuli aravin
gaxlavT?
_ romel Rirseul politikosze
vsaubrobT, roca „qarTul
ocnebaSi” damoukidebeli moTamaSeebi
saerTod ar arseboben?
ramdenimes SeiZleba, hqonda amis
mcdeloba, magram ar gamouvida.
rodesac oligarqze xar mibmuli,
iq damoukidebeli ver iqnebi.
axla aqtiurad ganixileba,
aris Tu ara gaxaria damoukidebeli.
mgonia, rom ar aris, Tumca
amas dro gamoaCens. es kaci
politikuri partiis Seqmnas apirebs.
Tu susi misi partiis Seviwroebas
daiwyebs da masac daibareben
prokuraturaSi, maSin davijereb,
rom damoukidebeli figuraa.
ratomRac, mgonia, rom mas
ivaniSvili sasaTbure pirobebs
Seuqmnis da is gaxdeba „qarTuli
ocneba 2".
_ isev namdvili opoziciis
ambebs davubrundeT: 15 maisidan
iwyebT aqciebs. Tqveni azriT,
SeZlebT ramis miRwevas?
_ kargi iqneba, Tu dasavleTidan
sanqciebic dawesdeba, magram
marto Cveni aqciebiTac Sei-
Zleba Sedegis miRweva. aqciebs
rom Sedegi moaqvs, amaSi Cveni
sazogadoeba 31 martsac darwmunda.
am dRes saqarTveloSi
Camovida rusuli delegacia,
romelsac pozneris dabadebis
dRe unda ezeima. es pozneri gaxlavT
putinis ideologi. is acxadebs,
rom afxazeTi da cxinvalis
regioni arasdros iqneba
saqarTvelo. sazogadoeba maT
Camosvlas protestiT Sexvda. es
aqcia rom ara, okupantebi aq
Tavisuflad gaagrZelebdnen
qeifs. protests yovelTvis mosdevs
Sedegi. pozneris Camosvlas
SevexeT da am Temaze zogierTi
qarTvelis gakeTebul gancxadebas
minda gamovexmauro: viRacebma
Tqves, „stumar-maspinZlis”
damweri eri stumars ase rogor
daxvdao? maT gasagonad vambob:
stumarTmoyvareoba siStereSi
ar unda gadagvezardos. am stumarTmoyvareobis
gamo yvelaze
mets rusebi dagvcinodnen. Cvens
ufross Taobas emaxsovreba er-
Ti ambavi: viRac rusi Jurnalisti
Camovida aq. mas arnaxuli maspinZloba
gauwies. ukan dabrunebulma
ki dawera, rom qarTvelebi
arian Rorebi, bevrs Wamen, hyavT
msuqani Svilebi da a. S. saqarTvelo
rusebisTvis asocirdeba kai
saqeifo adgilad. aseTi damokidebuleba
nervebs miSlis. arc
is momwons, roca Cemi mSobliuri
kuTxe asocirdeba xaSlamasTan.
_ ratom gaRizianebT?
_ roca igeben, Telaveli var,
xaSlamao, gaiZaxian. Telavi aris
Zveli sataxto qalaqi, romlis
saxelsac uamravi istoria ukav-
Sirdeba. raRac xaSlama gaxsendeba?
sxva araferi gagigia kaxeTze?
ase ar SeiZleba! rusebisTvis
saqarTvelo gaxda yurZeni, karalioki,
xaSlama da xinkali. maT-
Tvis sufrebis gaSla da tingici
unda damTavrdes.
sul cota xnis win davkrZaleT
daTa papa, romelic saokupacio
zols iqiT aRmoCnda. am
kacma saxli ar datova da imis
uflebac ki ar mogvces, rom sam-
Zimarze gadavsuliyaviT. qelexis
lobio da sxva produqtebi
mavTulxlarTebis aqedan gadavawodeT,
rom es didebuli kaci
Rirseulad daekrZalaT. micvalebuli
ar gvatires da amis Semoqmed
rusebs TbilisSi dros vatarebinebT?
Cveulebrivi turistebi
rom yofiliyvnen, kidev
ar amoviRebdiT xmas. es pozneri
ki aris putinis ideologi, romelic
afxazeTsa da cxinvalis regions
ar aRiqvams saqarTvelod.
mas da misnairebs saqarTveloSi
araferi esaqmebaT. xalxis protestis
Sedegad isini saqarTvelodan
gaiqcnen. protests yovel-
Tvis moaqvs Sedegi. mjera, rom
opoziciis dawyebuli saprotesto
aqciebic moitans Sedegs. ima-
Sic darwmunebuli var, rom garedanac
iqneba sanqciebi da ivaniSvili
saerTod gadaixveweba.
N5 (337) 5.04-18.04 .2021 w.
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