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interview with muhammad shahrur 513the seventh century. We want to move around and see the frescoin a dialectic between text and context. Our interpretation of thefresco as we move around is subjective. With the kit§b we can useinterpretation, and interpret how a verse complies with objectivetruth. The qur"§n involves prophecy, which is objective truth.I was perplexed when I looked at the qur"anic verses containingthese two terms, kit§b and qur"§n. I looked at their meanings interactivelyand then understood them.SS: With whom did you first discuss your ideas?MS: Primarily with the linguist Ja#far DÊk al-B§b. 7 In the 1980s, wehad long discussions on the meaning of kit§b.DFE: In the early 1980s political events and economic conditions in Syriaobliged some people to leave the country, and your business was reorganized.You also found yourself more free to focus on writing . . .MS: Yes, and in May 1982 I discovered the difference between kit§band qur"§n. It was very surprising to me. I told my family aboutit. My father was the first to understand the distinction. Hebecame interested, asked me difficult questions, and forced me toanswer them.DFE: After 1982, you began to discuss your ideas with others, especially Ja#farDÊk al-B§b when he returned during summer from his teaching post inAlgeria.MS: I showed him what I had written. I kept the manuscript in myhouse. I gave it to my son for safekeeping, saying: ‘Look, this ismy first book. The manuscript is in this envelope. Now I willprepare a second book.’After discovering the difference between kit§b and qur"§n, I discoveredthe meaning of tartÊl, a term usually referring to the slow,elegant recitation of the Qur"an: ‘Or add to it; and recite theQur"an in slow, measured rhythmic tones’ (aw zid #alayhi wa-rattilal-qur"§n tartÊl an ) ( Al-Muzzammil 73:4). 8 I discovered the distinction7A prominent Syrian linguist who has worked in Algeria and the Sultanate ofOman, DÊk al-B§b first met Shahrur when they were students together in Moscow.His Asr§r al-lis§n al-#arabÊ (Secrets of the Arabic Language) is included as an appendixto Shahrur’s al-Kit§b.8As ‘§diq J. Sulaim§n explains, rattil also means to place in a logical sequence,although this is a somewhat rare use of the term. Yusuf #Ali, one of the translators of