26.07.2019 Views

qronika+286

Create successful ePaper yourself

Turn your PDF publications into a flip-book with our unique Google optimized e-Paper software.

294 69 77; qronikaqronika@gmail.com<br />

dasusteba sWirdeba!~<br />

_ rasakvirvelia. sxvaTa Soris,<br />

pirveli kiTxvebi, romelic me<br />

davsvi, aseTi iyo: jer erTi, brZaneba<br />

vin gasca, _ es sazogadoebas<br />

gansakuTrebiT aintersebs da, meore,<br />

_ apirebs Tu ara gaxaria<br />

gadadgomas? orive kiTxvaze lakoniuri<br />

pasuxi iyo da Tqva, rom br-<br />

Zaneba man gasca da gadadgomas ar<br />

apirebs.<br />

_ am pasuxebma dagakmayofi-<br />

laT?<br />

_ ara. sxvaTa Soris, gansaxvavebuli<br />

politikuri gemovnebis miuxedavad,<br />

am Sexvedraze Ss ministris<br />

imave dRes an xval gadadgomis<br />

moTxovna erT eqspertsac ar<br />

dauyenebia da es am Sexvedris<br />

Zalian saintereso epizodia.<br />

_ ratom?<br />

_ es moTxovna im eqspertebsac<br />

ar dauyenebiaT, romlebsac „nacionaluri<br />

moZraobis” mimarT,<br />

rbilad rom vTqva, simpaTia aqvT,<br />

Tumca imis Taobaze, Tu ra nabijebis<br />

gadadgmas apirebs ministri,<br />

kiTxvebi daisva. gaxariam Tqva, rom<br />

misi gadadgoma-argadadgoma problema<br />

ar aris, magram unda, rom im<br />

kiTxvebze, romelic sazogadoebas<br />

damnaSaveebsa da SemsruleblebTan<br />

dakavSirebiT, aseve Zalis gadametebasa<br />

Tu orive mxridan provokaciebis<br />

monawileebis gamovlenaze<br />

aqvs, pasuxi gaeces da im<br />

dRes momxdari saerTo suraTis<br />

aRdgena moxdes. amis Semdeg sazogadoebis<br />

gadasawyvetia, Tu Cems<br />

wasvlas isev moiTxovs, me wavalo,<br />

_ gviTxra ministrma.<br />

_ am Sexvedraze gaxariam Tu dauSva<br />

albaToba, rom mitingis da-<br />

Slisas damiznebiT srola cal-<br />

keuli Zalovnebis provokacia iyo?<br />

_ rasakvirvelia, laparaki<br />

amazec iyo, anu Zalis gadacdoma<br />

namdvilad moxda da gamoZiebis<br />

procesSi nel-nela vavlenT, yvelaferi<br />

es rogor viTardebodao.<br />

_ anu calkeuli specrazmelebi<br />

ase imitom iqceodnen, rom is Se-<br />

degi damdgariyo, romelic dadga?<br />

_ am versias arsebobis ufleba<br />

aqvs da amis Taobaze manamdec vlaparakobdi.<br />

amdagvari araerTi RonisZieba<br />

maqvs nanaxi, zogierTSi ki<br />

monawileobac mimiRia da amitom<br />

Zalian kargad vici, analogiuri<br />

RonisZiebebis organizeba rogor<br />

xdeba. „nacionaluri moZraoba” mudmivad<br />

ambobs, rom iq aRelvebuli<br />

da araorganizebuli axalgazrdebis<br />

masa iyo, romelmac protesti<br />

Tavisi nebiT gamoTqva. nawilobriv,<br />

rasakvirvelia, marTlac ase iyo _<br />

parlamentTan, sanam Setakeba daiwyeboda,<br />

uamravi xalxi imyofeboda,<br />

maT Soris, Cemi Svilic, magram<br />

saqme isaa, rom am xalxis garda organizebuli<br />

Zalac iyo.<br />

_ amas ris safuZvelze ambobT?<br />

_ iseTi gaazrebuli qmedeba,<br />

rogoric policiis kordonze Setevaa,<br />

martivad ar xdeba. policielebi<br />

ga-oyavdaT da fizikur dapirispirebas<br />

aridebdnen _ yvelaferi<br />

es ki organizebuli jgufebis<br />

mier iyo gakeTebuli da amaSi<br />

darwmunebuli var. am jgufs, albaT,<br />

treningic hqonda gavlili.<br />

_ sad?<br />

_ treningi imas ar niSnavs, rom<br />

sadme banakSi waiyvano da ori kvira<br />

avarjiSo. magaliTad, SegiZlia,<br />

aT adamians sam saaTSi auxsna, ras<br />

niSnavs mitingSi monawileoba da am<br />

dros rogor unda moiqces.<br />

_ batono mamuka, simarTle<br />

`me erT rameSi davrwmundi: parlamentis SenobaSi Zalismieri SeWra<br />

igegmeboda, magram ara egzaltirebuli axalgazrdebis, rogorc<br />

`nacionaluri moZraoba~ da aseve zogierTi opoziciuri partia cdilobs,<br />

rom SemogvTavazos, aramed organizebuli jgufebis mier~<br />

giTxraT, cota davibeni, anu Tu<br />

garkveuli jgufi datreningebu-<br />

li iyo, policielebis gamoyvana,<br />

rom maTze fizikuri Zaladoba ar<br />

momxdariyo, ras emsaxureboda?<br />

_ jer erTi, es policielebisTvis<br />

demonstrireba iyo, Tqveni<br />

sawinaaRmdego araferi gvaqvs da<br />

xelisuflebas verCiTo. meore mizani<br />

ki kordonis moSoreba iyo.<br />

_ ramdenjerme „nacionaluri<br />

moZraoba” axseneT, arada, 20 iv-<br />

niss aqciaze yvela opoziciuri<br />

partia imyofeboda. amas garda,<br />

„nacmoZraoba”<br />

gaerTianebuli<br />

opoziciis wevria. mokled, ma-<br />

incdamainc yofil mmarTvel gun-<br />

dze ratom svamT maxvils?<br />

_ Zalian kargi kiTxvaa! „nacionalur<br />

moZraobaze” aqcents imitom<br />

vakeTeb, rom es saqarTveloSi<br />

yvelaze kargad organizebuli<br />

partiaa, romelic analogiuri<br />

moqmedebebisTvis mzad aris, miT<br />

umetes, rom Sesabamisi gamocdileba<br />

aqvs. am partias aqtiuri jgufebic<br />

hyavs, romelsac analogiur<br />

situaciaSi iyenebs.<br />

_ davuSvaT, asea, magram ar<br />

dagaviwydeT, rom gavrilovis<br />

winaaRmdeg Tavdapirvelad „evro-<br />

pulma saqarTvelom” aimaRla xma<br />

da am mxriv gansakuTrebiT elene<br />

xoStaria aqtiurobda.<br />

_ SeiZleba, „evropuli saqar-<br />

Tvelo” Canda, magram „nacionaluri<br />

moZraoba” moqmedebda.<br />

_ isini SeTanxmebulebi iyvnen?<br />

_ amas ver getyviT, magram piradad<br />

me aseTi STabeWdileba Semeqmna,<br />

rom „evropuli saqarTvelo”<br />

Canda, „nacionaluri moZraoba”<br />

ki moqmedebda. sxvaTa Soris, miaqcieT<br />

yuradReba, Tu vin mouwoda<br />

xalxs parlamentSi Sesvlisken.<br />

_ vin?<br />

_ nika meliam. sxvebic iyvnen,<br />

magram roca melias mowodeba movismine,<br />

anu is ki ara, roca jgufurad<br />

laparakobdnen, SevideT-ar-<br />

SevideTo, aramed roca calke iyo,<br />

Semeqmna STabeWdileba, rom is Tavisi<br />

jgufis wevrebs mimarTavda,<br />

aba, wavediTo, anu is im xalxs mimarTavda,<br />

romelzec icoda, rom<br />

gahyveboda.<br />

_ Tu aseTi detalebi Tqven<br />

SeamCnieT, wesiT, es Sss-sac unda<br />

SeemCnia, amitom sainteresoa, man<br />

SeWris mcdeloba Tavidanve ra-<br />

tom ar aRkveTa da viTareba kul-<br />

minaciamde ratom miiyvana?<br />

_ rogorc Cans, am situaciis<br />

mosagerieblad mzad ar iyo. sxva-<br />

Ta Soris, ministrmac Tqva, maqsimalurad<br />

vcdilobdiT, winamorbedebs<br />

ar davmsgavsebodiTo.<br />

_ opoziciis liderebTan mo-<br />

laparakebas amitomac cdilobda?<br />

_ molaparakebasTan dakavSirebiT<br />

cota ucnauri suraTi Seiqmna<br />

da es is Temaa, romelic bolomde<br />

ver CamovayalibeT. amasTan, am Sexvedris<br />

erT-erTma monawilem<br />

ikiTxa, ise ratom moxda, rom premierma<br />

Tqva, araferi iqnebao da uceb<br />

cremlsadeni yumbarebi isroleso?<br />

amaze ministrma gvipasuxa, molaparakebis<br />

procesis dros Seteva<br />

gverdidan daiwyoo, magram es<br />

videokadrebi ar gvinaxavs da aqedan<br />

gamomdinare, SemiZlia, mxolod<br />

ministris sityvebs daveyrdno.<br />

_ ise, batono mamuka, 2012 wl-<br />

idan moyolebuli, saxelmwifo<br />

gadatrialebis sababiT sisxlis<br />

samarTlis arTlis saqme araerTxel aRi-<br />

Zra, magram gamoZieba bolomde ar<br />

misula da igive „saburavebis saq-<br />

me” Tarozea Semodebuli. aqedan<br />

gamomdinare, ratom unda gvje-<br />

rodes, rom 20 ivniss saxelmwifo<br />

gadatrialeba realurad igegme-<br />

boda an is, rac moxda swored<br />

gamouZiebeli saqmeebis Sedegia?<br />

_ rasakvirvelia, mec zustad<br />

mand var. sxvaTa Soris, im dRes,<br />

roca gavrilovi gamoCnda, erT-er-<br />

Ti pirveli viyavi, romelmac vTqvi,<br />

irakli kobaxiZe baqoSive unda<br />

gadadges-meTqi. ise, naxevari saaTiT<br />

adre am asambleis dRis wesrigi<br />

nanaxi mqonda da vicodi, rom gavrilovis<br />

ki ara, generaluri mdivnis<br />

gamosvla igegmeboda. saRamos<br />

ki, roca yvelaferi es moxda, anu<br />

mitingis darbevis mere, vTqvi, me<br />

rom gaxarias adgilas viyo, gadavdgebodi-meTqi.<br />

mas mere ki, rac<br />

gaxaria Junalistebs Sexvda, pozicia<br />

Sevicvale da amis ar mrcxvenia,<br />

anu mimaCnia, rom gaxariam, romelmac<br />

pasuxismgebloba yvelaferze<br />

Tavad aiRo, gamoZiebis saqme<br />

bolomde unda miiyvanos, sazogadoebis<br />

winaSe SedegebiT wardges<br />

da sazogadoeba Tavad gadawyvets,<br />

is gadadgomis Rirsia Tu ara. sxvaTa<br />

Soris, amis Sesaxeb gaxariasac<br />

vuTxari.<br />

mokled, saqarTveloSi uamravi<br />

rezonansuli saqmea, romelic<br />

xmauriT dawyebula da bolos, pasuxismgebeli<br />

an mTavroba yofila,<br />

an _ viRac Zalovnebi, romlebsac<br />

ver gaigebT, vin arian. Sesabamisad,<br />

ar viciT, am saqmeebze pasuxi vis<br />

movTxovoT. am SemTxvevaSi ki, piradad<br />

me, rogorc moqalaqem, vici,<br />

rom pasuxi giorgi gaxarias unda<br />

movTxovo!<br />

Tu gainteresebT, am Sexvedraze<br />

raze vidaveT, getyviT _ es vadebi<br />

iyo, anu erT-erTma Cvenganma gaxarias<br />

kategoriulad mosTxova, es<br />

gamoZieba daus-uleblad ar unda<br />

gagrZeldes da uaxloes momaval-<br />

Si unda damTavrdeso, magram ministrma,<br />

ar moeswrebao. amitom Cven,<br />

yvelam Zalian kategoriulad mov-<br />

TxoveT, CvenTan Sexvedras azri ma-<br />

Sin eqneba, Tu saboloo vada gvecodineba,<br />

rodesac gamoZiebas wertili<br />

Tu ar daesmeva, logikuri<br />

konturebi mainc gamoCndebao. da<br />

kidev erTi: sazogadoeba mudmivad<br />

unda iyos informirebuli, gamo-<br />

ZiebasTan dakavSirebiT ra xdeba _<br />

SeiZleba, yvelaferi ver Tqvan,<br />

magram aucileblad unda Candes,<br />

procesi rogor midis. es gaiTvaliswines<br />

da imis fragmentebi, gamo-<br />

Zieba rogor mimdinareobs, Cndeba<br />

xolme.<br />

_ batono mamuka, sityva gagvi-<br />

grZelda, magram erT Temasac<br />

Sevexebi, miT umetes, rom specsam-<br />

saxurebis muSaobaSi, ase Tu ise,<br />

erkveviT: „gavrilovis Rames”,<br />

rogorc 20-21 ivnisis movlenebi<br />

moinaTla, giorgi gabunias skan-<br />

daluri eTeri moyva. SeiZleba,<br />

esec im scenaris nawili iyos,<br />

razec zemoT visaubreT?<br />

_ CemTvis Zalian seriozuli<br />

avtoritetia rusi politologi<br />

ilarionovi da am Temaze swored<br />

mis daskvnas daveyrdnobi. ilarionovma<br />

„amerikis xmas” Zalian mwvave<br />

inteviu misca, sadac xelisuflebac<br />

gaakritika da opoziciac.<br />

gansakuTrebiT ki gabunia gaakritika,<br />

Tumca am SemTxvevaSi, „gabunia”<br />

krebiTi terminia, anu ilarionovma<br />

Tqva, gavrilovi am savar-<br />

ZelSi, SesaZloa, SemTxveviT moxvda,<br />

magram „gabunia” specoperacia<br />

iyo, romelSic didi fuli daixarja<br />

da gabunia WanWiki iyoo. ilarionovma<br />

isic Tqva, ar vici, fuli<br />

vin aiRo, magram es specoperaciis<br />

klasikaa da usafrTxoebis Temaze<br />

Seqmnil saxelmZRvaneloebSi unda<br />

Sevideso. ilarionovma rusuli<br />

politikuri samzareulo Cemze<br />

ukeT icis da miniSneba iqiTken gaakeTa,<br />

rom gabunias ambavSi viRac<br />

iyo Careuli da amiT raRac TamaSi<br />

iTamaSes. es TamaSi ki ruseTis prezidents<br />

garkveuli demarSisTvis<br />

sWirdeboda. amiT putinma ramdenime<br />

kurdReli erTad mokla da<br />

marto keTili biZias roli ki ar<br />

iTamaSa, aramed, dumas Tavze daamxo,<br />

Seni azri aravis ainteresebso.<br />

zogadad, saqarTvelos sazogadoebis<br />

azri aravis ainteresebs da<br />

man „keTili biZias” roli dasavle-<br />

Tis winaSe iTamaSa, romelic SeSfoTebuli<br />

iyo, rom ruseTi saqar-<br />

Tvelos mimarT uaRresad negatiur<br />

nabijebs gadadgamda. amas aq<br />

myofi diplomatebi arc malavdnen<br />

da TavianTi qveynebidan Sesabamisi<br />

instruqciebic hqondaT miRebuli.<br />

_ bolos, batono mamuka, Tqve-<br />

ni azriT, qveyanaSi arsebuli po-<br />

litikuri krizisi rogor unda<br />

ganimuxtos?<br />

_ es politikuri krizisi jer<br />

ar ganimuxteba da gagrZeldeba,<br />

yovel SemTxvevaSi, Semodgomamde<br />

sxvadasxva tipisa da xarisxis daZabuloba<br />

iqneba, radgan Zalian seriozuli<br />

Zalebi arian dainteresebulni,<br />

rom samxreT kavkasiaSi, Sida<br />

politikis TvalsazrisiT, seriozuli<br />

sirTuleebi arsebobdes.<br />

amasTan, dRes ruseTs saqarTveloSi<br />

Tavisi gaZliereba ki ara,<br />

saqarTvelos dasusteba iseve sWirdeba,<br />

rogorc _ Cveni mezoblebis,<br />

raTa Tavi komfortulad igrZnos.<br />

N25 (286) 23.07-5.08.2019 w.<br />

9

Hooray! Your file is uploaded and ready to be published.

Saved successfully!

Ooh no, something went wrong!