The Knowledge - Velocette Owners Club

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service from them. L # 4995 I need some information and this group seems a good place to get it. On my way to a VMCC meet on Sunday 23rd Jan, VMT652 suddenly changed from an exciting, living thing into a static roadside exhibit, that was it, no pops , no bangs and no crunches. Roadside inspection showed no spark, the plug fine, very good colour in fact, but no spark on the lead, cap or plug electrodes. The bike is a recent acquisition and I knew that the mag had been changed to electronic ignition, but have no idea which type. Investigation some 4 hours later after collection and return home revealed a black box, some 5"*1"*3" with PPPD 000014 stamped on it. This box is connected to a fairly small ignition coil. The black box has a 4 wire (only 3 appear used) connection via the mag breather pipe and fitting to an optical trigger unit which can be advanced/retarded by the normal handlebar lever. The PCB has PD Electronics and a phone number on it, the phone no. no longer works. My questions are: a)Does anyone know who made this stuff? b)Do they still exist? c) Has anyone any details, installation notes, or setup info for it? d) Would I be better to forget it and get the K1FC rebuilt properly? however the engine has always started very well (2 kicks max) hot or cold aand can be relied on with just a whiff of throttle (on a GP) for traffic lights aand first gear selection so I would like to get the same from a mag. My memories of LAP123E, my first Thuxton in 1967 are of much more erratic behaviour, even for those days. e) If the mag is to be rebuilt, who by? Sorry about the mega mailing. # 5008 The fault in my system is the trigger unit mounted in the mag, has anyone any old wiring diagrams, installation notes, specs etc. for PD Electronic Ignition, from which I can identify the sensor component? I have been recommended to go to FTW in Sheffield for the mag rebuild, has anyone any knowledge/experience of this company? # 5012 What makes you sure it's the trigger? There are three basic sorts.. opto - an infra red emitter and detector looking through a slot or similar. A hall-effect device - Sprague were the main makers of these, now called Allegro - UGSxxxx typical part numbers - in a TO92 package - with either a spinning magnet or steel occludor with a slot and a fixed magnet. MZ used this system. Or a coil with spinning magnet or occludor/fixed as above. All are intrinsically very reliable if used properly. # 5049 There is only one opto switch, it is larger than mouse switches and is embedded in araldite so numbers are hidden. Thanks for your offer, I have decided to junk the electronic ignition and have now removed the mag to go away for a checkover and have the missing parts replaced, I will report back on completion of this exercise. # 5034 The PD stuff consists of the black resin encapsulation box with 6 wires exiting. 3 are fairly heavy gauge and are the Pos and Neg from the battery supply and the connection to the Coil. The other 3 are fine wires wrapped in a shielding sleeve and protective outer which go via the points cover breather on the mag to a slotted optical switch, 2 go to the infra-red transmitter LED and 1 returns from the phototransistor. I suspect, but cannot be certain, that the cold side of the phototransistor is connected to the cold side of the LED. The sensor is soldered to a pcb which is in turn araldited to an aluminium ring which replaces the cam ring and is rotated partialy by the hand advance/retard lever-cable-sliding connector to enable retard for starting and advance for running. The points have been removed from the armature shaft and an occluder fitted which has a deep trigger slot and a cutout to give TDC (I think). When the occluder triggers the coil an LED embedded in the black box flashes. Diagnostics completed so far, The coil has a resistance compatible with a large winding and when the return side is flashed on the battery, a spark is generated at the plug - so far coil passed as OK The black box when powered by battery voltage, responds with a high voltage short dwell pulse on the coil feed wire when the switch LED feed wire is grounded. - Hmmm!! The LED on the PCB in the sensor is open circuit on all connections in all directions as is the phototransistor and the track on the PCB appears to be missing between the receptor output pin and connecting wire. Here I am at a loss, should there be a reading across the LED in any direction? is the phototransistor linked to a common with the LED?, there is battery voltage on the feed to the LED (ie 12.5-13.8) looking at RS Components sites most slotted optical switches run on only 5v. seems rather high, only 5 wire logic switches seem to run at 12 - 14 volts, this kit is far earlier than that and only 3 wire anyway. Anything you can suggest, throw 172
light on, etc would be very useful, the bike ran so well on this kit I am very loathe to just throw it away. John PS I don't know if you read your off-group mail so if you do receive this please respond simply to confirm, if i hear nothing within a day i will re-post on the group and risk boring everyone. # 5013 I have used FTW for some years and find them OK. You can also try Tony Cooper 021 559 2405 # 5030 I have been talking to FTW and Tony Cooper, Tony is nearest to me and he seems to be just the man should I go the rebuild route. I have a lead to follow up yet on the repair/rectify of electronics route yet before deciding. Once again many thanks, this group is a real asset to Velo ownership isn't it? # 5032 Surprised no-one has suggested Dave Lindsley to do your mag overhaul - definitely one of the main players in the magneto game, he did my mag a few years ago and I've had no trouble since. Based in Heywood, Lancs, you'll get him on 01706 365838. 173
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1 The Knowledge Being a compendium
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A Diagnosing Troubles A.1 Hard Star
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automatic mag fitted at sometime in
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10celsius and only oil I could get
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enough to slide the left hand in ab
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think I could expect better? I reme
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L #3777 My 1938 MSS has an old AMAL
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Monoblock carburetors, which replac
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L # 4946 I'm having difficulties wi
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in. With the cam timing right, thes
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clear fuel line. Fill the float cha
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coming from (top end, barrel, botto
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A.2. Poor Gear Change - L #3 I have
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use gets shimmed as tightly as I ca
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A.3. Faulty Electrics - L #1 I have
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never have the problem. #3909 First
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the zeners as heat - and using 1/4
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#523 I can't remember where I learn
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L #1042 Was hoping someone could re
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www.croesus-consultants.co.uk/v-tec
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has mentioned the probable cause an
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#2445 The way to set the shimming f
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last as long as tapers. I also went
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and pinned and the preload set up c
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know, - this is no help with a Veno
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L #458 I've just got a +60 piston f
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pistons. #747 If you've melted meta
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have is 2.677 inches. However this
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my home, I started to push it a lit
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B.3. Cylinder Head and Valves - L #
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#509 I cant agree about oiling the
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even more difficult due to the "wav
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wanting to measure everything up be
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and the wells underneath were full
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way. The seats I can get recut, and
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L #3922 I have recently purchased m
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arrangements around the rocker pivo
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you had the minute difference betwe
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chance that the lapping in will be
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# 5973 Originally it would have had
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B.4. Timing Gear and Pushrods - L #
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#1217 Basically the intake valve cl
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end of the rocker. You can then lev
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L #2596 Im rebuilding my '58 Venom
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.052" clearance Exhaust closes 41
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to the housing, either the magneto
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Paul Zell recommended Gary Robinson
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gear must be more than the wattage
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sparkplug hole before storage. I ju
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#604 My good, and lamentably late f
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shop #770 On the oil filters, I wou
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all the oil out straight onto the f
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It's a long story but aircraft engi
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even fully synthetic Formula RS and
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L #3034 A mate of mine has the foll
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how much? Not critical, maybe 0.5"
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skimmed and oversize linings fitted
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the bores in 20 crankcases. Measuri
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# 6249 There was an interesting art
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# VOCNA 217 I'm curious if you're g
Page 121 and 122: the pump circumference, I put one b
Page 123 and 124: of preservative. A fellow VOC membe
Page 125 and 126: has no pipe leading from it. It see
Page 127 and 128: amount which drops out onto the wal
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Page 131 and 132: B.7. Racing and High Performance -
Page 133 and 134: it, fit a 86mm cam steady plate wit
Page 135 and 136: trouble with them seizing but never
Page 137 and 138: C. The Electrics C.1. Ignition and
Page 139 and 140: centerline, so a dial indicator tha
Page 141 and 142: ut when you use the dti like I do,
Page 143 and 144: and shaft problem. The pointless ma
Page 145 and 146: #819 Accessory Mart has KLG FE 220
Page 147 and 148: log/TOOLS.html&CatalogBody Just scr
Page 149 and 150: #712 if you are such a heathen (lik
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Page 153 and 154: to the fibre drive gear as there is
Page 155 and 156: end of the field connected to the D
Page 157 and 158: C.4. Lights and Horn - L #381 My re
Page 159 and 160: Venom/Thruxton is the culprit. I've
Page 161 and 162: C.5. Electric Conversions - L #23 I
Page 163 and 164: atteries are black already, if a bi
Page 165 and 166: een suggested that I go back to Mag
Page 167 and 168: problems - it is one of the current
Page 169 and 170: have been caused by the motor kicki
Page 171: handlebar switches off a 1960's Hon
Page 175 and 176: 180 from the stock 200, which at th
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Page 179 and 180: new. Is there any reason to switch
Page 181 and 182: emoving rust stains even on cloth,
Page 183 and 184: #3332 I fitted a new concentric and
Page 185 and 186: #4432 Be sure to use a .106" needle
Page 187 and 188: smallish Triumph twin style K&N wil
Page 189 and 190: D.2. Fuels - L #180 I have not used
Page 191 and 192: wouldn't add 20% as this might brin
Page 193 and 194: E. The Drive Train E.1. Primary Dri
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Page 197 and 198: with the double plates at the drive
Page 199 and 200: L #1331 My clutch ballrace is bit w
Page 201 and 202: However the reasoning (?) behind it
Page 203 and 204: alls. He Loctited the bearing into
Page 205 and 206: # 5273 Unless I am mistaken turning
Page 207 and 208: the O.D. not much, just enough for
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Page 215 and 216: L #650 Please tell me the parts num
Page 217 and 218: #2613 There are three types of kick
Page 219 and 220: didn't slide back through the seal
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made a partial improvement by movin
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and my friend use Castrol GTX many
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many of us use. Drag Specialties, P
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machines absolutely pristine, it is
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L #239 Has anyone tried to use a 52
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#285 felt seal case-bulging is norm
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need them. #2781 Call me a Doubting
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Reynolds, since I never have spent
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Japan" on the box, or Regina from I
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# 6310 If you own a Velocette, or a
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was racing Velos way back, and repo
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F. Running Gear F.1. Steering Head,
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L #879 Here's a question for the gr
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ush and then reverse the fork membe
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diameter . I bought a pair of clip
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have been produced around the same
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Rebound damping also feels insuffic
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eprint from Geof Steele the clues a
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holes with bronze weld & re- drilli
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has very crude looking dimples, so
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locates on the extension of the bea
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Dunlop 3.50 x 19" (rear) Admittedly
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less than 90 degrees. This should c
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hand thread. My brother who owns a
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frames. Also saddle top and pillion
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colour was called Oxford blue when
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seat shell and this will help if I
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#2181 If you use a roll pin in plac
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works. #2710 When I installed mine
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#2857 Paint the iron brake drum sec
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don't think any models left the fac
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strap, a LARGE diameter flat washer
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L # 5492 I am starting a Venom/Vipe
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position of the # 5725 My tank pain
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# 6011 Here is the part reference f
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G.2. Cables, Controls and Instrumen
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# 5228 Hi, Vehicle Wiring products
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can get the casting welded / streng
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levers and preferably ball-end type
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fishtail was rotten and not being t
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Jiggo effected a temporary fix with
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H. Manuals & Spares L #31 By the wa
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01949 836734 they have Mikuni alter
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#3958 My old float is a cylindrical
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# 6287 Price Productions do an exch
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machine, not for starting. Definite
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data to hand, mine is a tele/rigid)
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obtained it in 1975 and was even le
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#2951 When assembling my VMT 334, w
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odd one mixed in when I rebuilt my
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port through the Winter, only occas
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