3 4 CHAIRMAN: Good morning, Mr. Murphy. 5 - The Tribunal of ...

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13615:59:101 CHAIRMAN: Is it almost certain that you would have had, having taken the2 trouble to fill up this documentation which you -- not what's on screen but3 what we saw a few moments ago with your name on it and address on it, you would4 as a matter of virtual certainty, that it would have been you who would have15:59:325 conducted the transaction or transactions in the bank?6 A. Yes, Judge.78 Q. 739 MR. O'NEILL: You have also given evidence, Ms. Carruth, to the effect that or9 directly that the instructions that you received in every instance in relation15:59:5210 to these banking matters were given to you by Mr. Ahern, isn't that right?11 A. Yes.12 Q. 740 There is no intermediary through whom you dealt with in connection with these13 banking affairs, isn't that so?14 A. No.16:00:0715 Q. 741 So if it is the case that you got 6,000 pounds Sterling on the 9th of March or16 5,450 pounds Sterling on the 9th of May or 4,000 pounds Sterling on the 28th of17 October, these were all sums which came to you directly from Mr. Ahern?18 A. It must be.19 Q. 742 It must be. There's no other explanation as to where these monies would have16:00:4520 come from, is that right?21 A. I don't know where the monies came from but anything that I was asked to do22 was, in banking terms, was from Bertie.23 Q. 743 Yes. And when you first gave your evidence to the Tribunal, that was limited,24 as you say, to receiving a pay cheque every month which you would cash and you16:01:0725 would bring the proceeds of that back to him, alternatively, on some occasions26 you would take some of the cash from your encashment of the cheque at the AIB27 and you would go down to the Irish Permanent, which was very close to it, and28 lodge amounts to the accounts of his daughters, isn't that right?29 A. Yes.16:01:2830 Q. 744 That was your evidence initially?Premier Captioning & Realtime Limitedwww.pcr.ie Day 839
13716:01:321 A. Yes.2 Q. 745 Yes. Your recollection obviously of events has been improved somewhat by the3 documents which have now been produced to you, isn't that so?4 A. Yes.16:01:455 Q. 746 Because that establishes that you were incorrect in believing that you never6 lodged money to an account of Mr. Ahern's, isn't that so?7 A. Yes.8 Q. 747 You are incorrect in your belief that you never lodged cash to Mr. Ahern's9 accounts, isn't that so?16:02:0210 A. Yes.11 Q. 748 Could I suggest that you are also incorrect in your belief that you were not12 dealing with large sums of Sterling?13 A. I have no recollections in Sterling whatsoever.14 Q. 749 But you have no recollection of anything, Ms. Carruth, have you?16:02:2015 A. I know.16 Q. 750 Well what possible explanation can there be for you having no recollection of17 transactions involving over 15,500 pounds in Sterling I suggest, conducted18 through you in this one branch in an eight month period in a year 1994? How19 could you possibly have no recollection of those events?16:02:5220 A. I just have no memories whatsoever of this, none. I remember lodging to his21 daughter's accounts, I've always said that but I have no memories of this.22 Q. 751 Well if you remember lodging to his daughters accounts that was the very same23 day that you lodged to his account, and that was the first of those lodgements24 in sequence which we saw where you lodged the product of 1,000 pounds Sterling16:03:1625 to each of the girls accounts and you lodged 4,000 pounds Sterling Irish26 equivalent to Mr. Ahern's account?27 A. It appears that way.28 Q. 752 It's four o'clock, Mr. Chairman.2916:03:3730 CHAIRMAN: How long more do you think you will be?Premier Captioning & Realtime Limitedwww.pcr.ie Day 839
Page 1 and 2:
110:16:171 THE TRIBUNAL RESUMED AS
Page 3:
310:38:111 withdrawal" -- I am not
Page 6 and 7:
610:43:441 was the 17th transaction
Page 8 and 9:
810:48:051 It would not have been u
Page 10 and 11:
1010:52:061 through this document f
Page 12 and 13:
1210:55:061 Q. 48 I believe the fig
Page 14 and 15:
1410:58:361 A. Yep.2 Q. 65 And ther
Page 16 and 17:
1611:01:561 of May 1994 of 3,518.99
Page 18 and 19:
1811:06:101 the 17th transaction on
Page 20 and 21:
2011:10:121 Q. 99 Yes.2 A. And then
Page 22 and 23:
2211:13:361 A. No, no.23 CHAIRMAN:
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2411:17:011 is that right?2 A. No.3
Page 26 and 27:
2611:20:4612 THE TRIBUNAL THEN ADJO
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2811:44:301 gave the person the sel
Page 31 and 32:
3111:51:131 JUDGE FAHERTY: It's 99
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3311:55:531 A. And that was 11:07,
Page 35 and 36:
3512:00:101 A. It's on 02 machine.2
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3712:05:161 A. Correct.2 Q. 245 Do
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3912:10:141 to him on one or two oc
Page 41 and 42:
4112:14:011 A. "Cash lodgement tran
Page 43 and 44:
4312:17:561 is C87.2 Q. 286 All rig
Page 45 and 46:
4512:22:071 THE WITNESS WAS QUESTIO
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4712:24:231 Q. 318 Okay. So if I co
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4912:27:091 A. Correct.2 Q. 330 And
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5112:30:331 A. And that was based o
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5312:33:231 A. I would say so.2 Q.
Page 55 and 56:
5512:36:241 A. Sorry correct yes.2
Page 57 and 58:
5712:39:241 and you can't offer any
Page 59 and 60:
5912:42:091 CHAIRMAN: Yes.2 A. And
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6112:45:231 or 15:49. It was comple
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6312:49:411 the 27th. Sorry on its
Page 65 and 66:
6512:54:3212 CHAIRMAN: Well I think
Page 67 and 68:
6712:58:181 concerned that this wit
Page 69 and 70:
6913:00:101 THE TRIBUNAL RESUMED AS
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7114:08:131 Q. 466 If I was a telle
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7314:11:291 A. Each one was an indi
Page 75 and 76:
7514:14:421 A. Yeah.2 Q. 498 Have y
Page 77 and 78:
7714:17:071 MR. HOLLAND: So if tran
Page 79 and 80:
7914:19:351 Can I just make one poi
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8114:22:231 Q. 516 Would you tell m
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8314:26:551 regard.23 If you turn t
Page 85 and 86: 8514:30:461 A. Occasionally I did.
Page 87 and 88: 8714:33:201 you got the figure that
Page 89 and 90: 8914:36:231 JUDGE FAHERTY: And then
Page 91 and 92: 9114:39:211 documents that are ther
Page 93 and 94: 9314:43:161 of this year and the Tr
Page 95 and 96: 9514:45:011 MR. KEN McDONALD, HAVIN
Page 97 and 98: 9714:48:131 Q. 561 There were a num
Page 99 and 100: 9914:51:221 A. That's my understand
Page 101 and 102: 10114:54:291 A. Yeah, yeah.2 Q. 603
Page 103 and 104: 10314:57:171 CHAIRMAN: All right. T
Page 105 and 106: 10514:59:331 branch of the IPBS, de
Page 107 and 108: 10715:04:041 Foreign exchange trans
Page 109 and 110: 10915:09:001 recollections of deali
Page 111 and 112: 11115:11:591 CHAIRMAN: Do we have o
Page 113 and 114: 11315:14:571 A. Because I have no r
Page 115 and 116: 11515:18:281 that that is transacti
Page 117 and 118: 11715:22:121 JUDGE FAHERTY: Fine.23
Page 119 and 120: 11915:25:361 JUDGE FAHERTY: So if y
Page 121 and 122: 12115:28:531 CHAIRMAN: It's not a s
Page 123 and 124: 12315:32:521 "Q: And in relation to
Page 125 and 126: 12515:36:541 of Mr. Ahern's was the
Page 127 and 128: 12715:41:071 lodge cash to any acco
Page 129 and 130: 12915:44:491 we were given no oppor
Page 131 and 132: 13115:47:0212 CHAIRMAN: Okay.34 Q.
Page 133 and 134: 13315:52:511 A. It's 14 years ago.2
Page 135: 13515:56:441 pounds to the account
Page 139: 13916:05:2012 So we will sit at hal
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3 4 CHAIRMAN: Good morning, Mr. Murphy. 5 - The Tribunal of ...

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