Non-Normative Gender and Sexual Identities in Schools: - Schools Out

SS: Um so there’s all that stuff to unpick and to help them through. How do you deal with
this. You know, there are skills in tackling racism that you can move straight over to
homophobia and transphobia but there are others that you can’t.
AM: Yes.
SS: Um, very interesting working with a woman that I’ve taught, that I’ve worked with
for probably something like twenty odd years ago and she’s now a deputy head in a
school and she had me in to do some training the other day. And she told me this amazing
story which really sort of woke up the other staff cos it was something I frequently say
but she had this story to to to to you know from her own live experience. There was a
young woman who for six months, maybe three, maybe I’m exaggerating, but
considerable long time consistently said homophobic stuff…
AM: {right}
SS: …in front of her, at her, in her lessons etc.
AM: A kid?
SS: A kid yeah, a kid to a teacher.
AM: Right.
SS: And Vivienne consistently challenged it [//] down the line the kid comes out to her.
AM: (laughs) That doesn’t surprise me one little bit.
SS: No. But it will surprise lots of heterosexual teachers…
AM: {yeah}
SS: …because the assumption is that you are saying racist stuff, you are a racist, if you
are saying homophobic stuff, you are homophobic. It doesn’t occur to them that what
they are doing is testing them and making sure that you are a safe pair of hands to come
out to.
AM: Yep, some kind of defence mechanism.
SS: Yes. Well this kid said what she was doing was was testing her.
AM: Right.
SS: But, and you are quite right there’s also the whole internal stuff. So for instance I was
training this was in more adult, but delivering adult women’s studies and this woman
consistently came every week but she challenged me every week I talked about lesbians
and said this is a women’s studies course why are you constantly talking about lesbians?
And every week I would explain why and then you now I’m on a lesbian strength and