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scenaCeauøescu, pe care a gîndit-o øi supravegheat-o împreunæ cu soflia øi anturajul, modificînd-oîn mai multe rînduri. Seamænæ cu Teatrul Naflional, care la început era o clædirefoarte modernæ, dar care a fost „îmbræcatæ“ cu ornamente de piatræ falsæ, decorafliitradiflionale preluate de la începutul secolului XX…M.C.: Dar familia nu a putut sæ locuiascæ în palat deloc, deoarece, de îndatæ ce afost terminat, în ’89, a intervenit revoluflia, iar ei au fost gonifli…I.G.: Dar mæ întreb cine va avea în viitor curajul sæ distrugæ øi sæ transforme astfelun oraø. Probabil cæ, dupæ un timp, va deveni important pentru români, chiar dacæ,deocamdatæ, este disprefluit øi respins. El era ridicol, se spunea cæ e mai mult saumai puflin retardat, vorbea greu, existæ colecflii întregi de poveøti pe seama lui, a nevesteiøi familiei sale etc. Dar istoria nu fline seama de asemenea mici anecdote…Deøi construcflia edificiilor care nu au fost terminate în timpul vieflii sale se refaceacum, pe mulfli bani venifli din Occident, aceastæ concepflie a oraøului, ideea de areînnoi totul, îi aparfline. Toatæ economia, toate întreprinderile de construcflii erauimplicate în acest edificiu øi în altele din oraø. Erau mii øi mii de muncitori care contribuiau,soldafli, însæøi armata. Era un øantier enorm, ce se întindea în tot oraøul.Mai e øi metroul! Toatæ lumea e recunoscætoare pentru metrou…M.C.: Acestea fac referire la manifestærile de 23 august, care era ziua naflionalæ aRomâniei. Era særbætorirea eliberærii de fascism, cînd am trecut de partea Aliaflilor.H.U.O.: Sînt deci imagini gæsite?I.G.: Sînt imagini de ziar care au fost fotografiate…H.U.O.: Iar aceasta?I.G.: E 1 noiembrie, ziua morflilor…S.P.: Acestea sînt fæcute de dumneavoastræ?I.G.: Da. Este o slujbæ religioasæ...S.P.: E foarte emoflionant.I.G.: Aici e ceva ce am expus în ’75. Era pe tema „Arta øi Istoria“. Fotografii ale transmisiuniitelevizate a særbætorii naflionale. Cu armata…M.C.: Da, era foarte multæ lume. Toatæ flara era implicatæ, cu defilærile pentru partid,pentru guvern. El alætura imaginile lui celor de la televizor…S.P.: Øi træiafli din picturæ øi restaurarea bisericilor ortodoxe?I.G.: Mai întîi am fost profesor de desen într-o øcoalæ, apoi m-am orientat cætre restaurareøi încæ øi azi mai træiesc din aceste lucræri de restaurare…H.U.O.: De unde provin casele acestea?I.G.: Cam de peste tot din România. Casele de lemn sînt destul de des întîlnite.H.U.O.: Ce uneøte toate aceste case? Faptul cæ sînt toate din lemn sau mai existæøi altceva?I.G.: E o întrebare complexæ. Mai e øi corpul uman, mæsuræ a lucrurilor øi obiectelorîn casa tradiflionalæ.H.U.O.: A existat vreun moment în care sæ nu pictafli ori afli continuat mereu sælucrafli ca pictor?I.G.: Prin anii ’82–’83 m-am oprit oarecum, începeam lucrærile într-un oraø din Oltenia,la Craiova, a fost cæsætoria, copiii…H.U.O.: Cæsætoria dumneavoastræ…I.G.: Da, a doua cæsætorie. Øi e adeværat cæ aceasta a marcat o pauzæ în activitateaexpoziflionalæ, cæci nu mai aveam contact cu Bucureøtiul…S.P.: Øi unde se aflæ esenflialul lucrærilor pe care ni le arætafli? Aici? La muzeu?I.G.: Unele sînt la Muzeul de Artæ Contemporanæ…M.C.: Mai e øi Muzeul Stedelijk din Amsterdam, care i-a cumpærat niøte lucræri…S.P.: Ce anume?M.C.: Naøterea Revolufliei. E o picturæ-instalaflie.S.P.: Cine a venit sæ cumpere? V-afli întîlnit cu ei?Šik for professor, he was a Czech economist and he used to say thata third way between capitalism and communism had to be found...What was your own system? But maybe it is too vast a question...I.G.: In any case, don’t expect to find a system! I proposed a dialog,the simple possibility to speak. People said that he had refused aninterview because he hadn’t written the questions. That was the situation...H.U.O.: Have you written stuff? Have you published any texts?For example, have you put on paper this program against Ceauøescu?I’m asking this because I read Kristine Stiles who is an expertin artists’ texts and she mentions somewhere that there are textsby you...I.G.: The dialog with Ceauøescu was translated, in English andgerman on the occasion of an exhibition at the Generali Foundationin Vienna, and later in Kassel...S.P.: What do you think of the opening today of the NationalMuseum of Contemporary Art in Bucharest?I.G.: It is a moment we’ve been long waiting for. It is almost the firstthing of some magnitude – let’s say – that is being done for theRomanians. It is a first contact point with the foreign artists who willbe known. Until now people knew only less important artists in smallgalleries or museums in Timiøoara or other towns in Romania...S.P.: And what do you think of its being “installed” in the hugepalace?I.G.: I’d never go visit this palace that has been built with so muchsuffering but I think, however, that it is a very good thing that it hasbeen altered for this purpose. There have been multiple projects tochange it, commercial, tourism, and eventually the decision stoppedat the project of a museum and it is the best thing. It is very contemporaryand European. It has been conceived in the atmosphere ofCeauøescu’s creation, he wanted it and watched over its constructionwith his wife and camarilla, he changed it several times. It’s a littlelike the National Theatre that used to be a very modern constructionand that has been adorned in false rock and traditional ornamentsfrom the beginning of the 20th century...M.C.: But the family never had the chance to live in this palacebecause as soon as it was finished, in 1989 the revolution came andthey were gone...I.G.: But I wonder who will have the guts in the future to destroy andtransform a city like that. Probably that in the long run he will becomeimportant for the Romanians, even if he is despised and rejectednow. He was ridicule, people said he was more or less retarded,he spoke with difficulty, there are collections of jokes on his account,or his wife, family, etc. But history doesn’t care for such anecdotes...Although the constructions that haven’t been finished in his lifetimeare continued today with lots of money from the western world, thisconception of the city, especially the idea to renew everything, washis. All the economy, the construction enterprises were involved withthis building and others in the city. There were thousands of workerswho made a contribution, soldiers, the army itself. It was an enormousconstruction site all over the city. And there is also the subway!Everybody is grateful for the subway...M.C.: This is related to the demonstrations for the 23rd of Augustwhich used to be the national day of Romania celebrating the liberationfrom Fascism and the joining with the Allies.H.U.O.: These are found images?I.G.: They are newspaper images that have been re-photographed...H.U.O.: And this?I.G.: The 1st of November, the day of the dead...S.P.: You made these?I.G.: Yes. It is a religious service...S.P.: It is very touching.I.G.: Here is something I’ve shown in ’75 on the theme “Art andHistory”. Photos from the TV broadcast of the national day. With thearmy...63