A Record of Meetings held by P.D. Ouspensky - HolyBooks.com

the same way which leads to objective consciousness leads also to theunderstanding of right and wrong. As we have not got objectiveconsciousness, we consider everything that helps us to develop consciousnessas right and good, and everything that hinders it as wrongand bad. This is a good definition, only it is too far from life. Thereare many things about which we can find no visible indications as towhether they help or hinder. So it is necessary to look for otherprinciples. And other principles we can find only when we think aboutconcrete cases of conduct. In the system one can find many sufficientindications which show how to look at one or another thing.The aim of the system is to find objective truth. We, as we are, mayhave a very strong feeling, and yet be mistaken about the contents ofright and wrong.MRS. H. Is the moral side of the system the struggle between 'yes' and'no'?MR. O. Yes, the struggle between 'yes' and 'no' may lead in thisdirection; it may lead to a better understanding of right and wrong,but it is not a fact by itself.MR. W. Do you mean we must think of how we affect other people?MR. O. No, we must think in which way we can come to a betterunderstanding of right and wrong. For instance, several questions havebeen asked about the rule of warning new people. In one of thepsychological lectures I gave an example about how to judge a politicalsituation from the point of view of the system. Civilization can bemeasured by the amount of personal freedom. A certain minimum ofpersonal freedom is necessary for the existence of a school. If personalfreedom disappears, one can, therefore, say that it is a wrong state ofcountry. This is the moral side of political situation. Fascism andbolshevism are both based on impressing their ideas on others byforce, and the result actually is domination by a small party at theexpense of the whole population of a country. For instance, in Russiapeasants and workmen, in whose name the revolution was made, arenow in a much worse position than before, and suffer much more thanthey did before the revolution. It is all words and lies, and the countryonly suffers.From this point of view all political activities destroying personalfreedom are criminal. Work needs personal freedom. From this pointof view bolshevism and fascism have equally criminal methods, aims