A Record of Meetings held by P.D. Ouspensky - HolyBooks.com

uses without paying my fare, etc. As I have to be more awake to domy swindling, it does not go against my aim. Would it be necessary oruseful to try and acquire ordinary standards of right and wrong, andfrom what point of view?MR O. It doesn't enter into the programme.MRS B Is it possible to know eventually what is objective right andwrong, if one has no ordinary feelings about subjective right andwrong?MR O It is all relative. There is right and wrong for this table, rightand wrong for the stage, right and wrong for the room. You mustunderstand the relativity of it first; then you will understand And ifyou want to understand objective right and wrong, that means rightand wrong generally, for the whole universe, then it will have nomeaning for this stage.MISS M . At what point in our progress may one expect to be able tomake our centres work more fully? Mr. O. has said that now we canonly use ten per cent of their capacity.MR. O Much less than that. Ten per cent will be almost all that youcan get, but we don't have one-millionth per cent.MISS M . What are those higher centres that we do not often contactwith?MR O. Never. It would be very good if we could contact even notvery often. They are machines in us that can work only in differentstates of consciousness. If you have some observations and material,we can describe the difference between higher emotional and highermental. Higher emotional is supposed to work with the third state ofconsciousness, and higher mental with the fourth state of consciousness.That is all we can say about it, but there are so many descriptions ofthese manifestations, and these descriptions are so similar that there isnothing wrong in accepting them, because we can compare them, andsee the inventions. There are many false descriptions, but by comparingmany of these descriptions we can easily see what is right and what iswrong, what is real and what invented. In religious experiences,philosophical writings, there are many descriptions of that. Some timeI can speak about it, and particularly about how to distinguish the realand false.MR W If, as Mr. O. says in New Model, 'We have every right toconsider that our thoughts move along the fourth dimension' . . .