A Record of Meetings held by P.D. Ouspensky - HolyBooks.com

MR. M. That is not an expression you would use—'climbing the Ray ofCreation'?MR. O. Too big expression for the beginning. It may be, only manythings have to be changed here before one can change place, so tospeak.MR. M. But the Ray of Creation here is mechanical, is it not?MR. O. Yes. Not the whole ray. When it comes to us, certainly all lawsare mechanical on this plane.MR. M. But how is it possible that a mechanical ray can create amachine which is capable of achieving a permanent will?MR. O. You must remember that the Ray of Creation starts consciously,and in the starting point evidently there are plans of everything, orsome plans may develop further. But in the 48 laws that work on theearth, there are three laws from World 3, which is under the directWill of the Absolute. Take these 48 laws: three from World 3, six fromWorld 6, twelve from World 12, twenty-four from World 24, andthree of its own; so you see they are not equally mechanical. Some aremore mechanical, some are less mechanical. If we take this octave, notstarting from Absolute, but from the sun—the octave of organic life:the sun is much higher than the earth and it is evidently possible tocreate in this octave possibilities of development. Thus man, if he canbe regarded as a seed, has in himself the possibility of growth. He isnot only what he looks; there is something which cannot be seen inhim—the possibility of development.MR. M. Is all consciousness of the same essence, the same substance?MR. O. That I am afraid we have not material to answer. Consciousnesswe can speak about only belonging to ourselves. Consciousness belongingto higher levels, Ray of Creation, sun and so on is really justmetaphysical idea, nothing else. We cannot compare. Although wemust know even from our own experience that consciousness can bemeasured—in duration, in many different qualities we can find inourselves. If it can be measured in ourselves, it can be measured inother planes.MR. M. Is there any conservation of consciousness? Is it the energy No.4. ...MR. O. No, no. That classification is not according to any of thesedivisions of the system. I only said that ordinary observation showsfour kinds of energy—but not No. 2, No. 3 etc. Ordinary observation,