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PART II - HAGUE RULES 453Article 4 (5) - Limits of liabilitya very small matter. Agreed. The freight is a small matter, but it cannot stand insurance;and if you want to have both carriage and insurance you will have to pay for it, and youcome back to the point, which we all know from our experience, that the loss and thedamage is not one per cent.; it is not a half of one per cent.; I doubt if it is a quarter ofone per cent. Is it wise to establish a Code under which, for the sake of argument, thecargo owners will pay more freight in 100 shipments in order to have a claim in thecase of the 100th shipment that goes wrong? Is that good business? We want to promoteoverseas commerce. The more it moves the better it is for the shippers. We believethat would be bad business; it would not promote and facilitate, it would notcheapen, overseas commerce.The currency question is a big one, and I quite follow Mr. Dor’s objection to elaboratecalculations; but there is no elaborate calculation if you say the limit is twentytimes the freight as it is calculated in the bill of lading. You have quite a simple calculation;you get quite a simple figure; and you get at an amount which is expressed inthe currency of the person who is held responsible and of the owner of the cargo. Ifthe cargo is shipped from France the freight is expressed in francs, and the value of thecargo is expressed in francs, and the indemnity is on that basis. If it is shipped fromEngland, and it is in £ sterling, that basis would apply.Now, Sir, I think it is very important that we should get this clause through, and thatwe should get it through unanimously. We were very much concerned, in drafting it, notonly from the British shipowners’ point of view, but from all our fellow shipowners’point of view and, I think, on this point, and I hope on all the other points, we have alwaysborne in mind that if we are to make a set of rules it is the shipowners of all countriesthat will have to work together. I think we have always been alive to that.[178]With those remarks I beg to move the substituted amendment. I would like tomake clear, Sir, that I have only touched the first clause of it. I propose to leave in thewords: “The declaration by the shipper as to the nature and value of any goods declaredshall be prima facie evidence, but shall not be binding or conclusive on the carrier”;and to leave in: “By agreement between the carrier, master or agent of the carrierand the shipper, another maximum amount than mentioned in this paragraph maybe fixed, provided that such maximum shall not be less than the figures above named”.I propose to leave those in, and my substitution is merely for what Mr. Dor has criticisedas rather an elaborate calculation.The Chairman: The question is that, in lieu of the words in the first six lines of thefirst paragraph of clause 4, the words in red shall be inserted. I call upon Mr. Dor.Mr. Dor: Sir. I am afraid we have now got to the point which may be the stumblingblock. It is very important, if these rules are adopted here, that they should also beadopted not only by shipowners but by the various cargo owners on the Continent;and that very point of a limitation of liability clause is the point of which cargo owners,Chambers of Commerce, and so on, are extremely suspicious; because they knowfrom experience that it is always by that limitation of liability clause that the shipownershave been able to evade the effect of any concessions which they had made to thecargo owners. If we go back to them with anything but a clear limitation of liabilityclause of £100 free of tax, if we present anything else, I feel absolutely certain that theysimply will not look at it, and will go on with legislation.There is one point of principle of which I want to remind the Committee. Sir NormanHill has been talking about penalising the shipowner, but that is not at all thepoint. (Hear, hear). It must be remembered that the limitation of liability clause is anexceptional favour granted to the shipowner, and which he is the only one to enjoy.The railway carrier does not enjoy it.