January 2002 - July 2006 - The Jerry Quarry Foundation

AM|Roadscholarette|Chicago||roadscholarette@hotmail.com||||10|John -I
wonder too, if there was some sort of falling out between Saddler and George. At
this point in time, it seems George just can't quite seem to get the amount of
respect this great boxing champion deserves. It's hard to accept that someone
Marciano's size could punch harder than Foreman. I realize the Rock ~did~ punch
harder than many, probably most men bigger that he was, but George was a guy
who'd have hit hard as a lighter weight (like Bob Foster, Roberto Duran, or
Danny Lopez), ~plus~ he was huge, putting his power in lunar trajectory.
In both the movie and the book, The Greatest, sparring partner, Bossman
Jones told Ali, "George is the first fighter I've been in the ring with, man,
who could ~kill~ you - he can lift you off your feet with one punch!" And did,
with several opponents, most notably, Norton and Frazier.On the subject
of GF, on his website, he doesn't include himself in history's top ten
champions, which I think is silly, and just George being humble. He also (this
being a haven of Quarry enthusiasts) mentions that JQ was the best non-champion,
and I'd certainly agree that he is indeed on a short list of "greatest non-
champions," taking all divisions into account. Since Foreman-Quarry would have
been a huge draw, I can't imagine it never being made. Is George being truthful
about ducking Jerry, or just being humble and complimentary again? He also
mentioned that if JQ had boxed Frazier and slugged with Ellis, rather than the
reverse, he'd have been champ. What do you think of that statement? Slugging
with Ellis would have been doable, but boxing with Frazier, successfully, wasn't
that easy, as Ali found out in New York and Manilla! |
|8/28/03 11:25:47 AM|Tubby Breslin|Fullerton, CA||Bearstubastanchu||||10|Well,
OK, I won't defend Big George any more -- he doesn't need it. Let's tune into
one thing, though. The Age of Marciano was a lot different from the Age of Ali
or the Age of Lennox Lewis. In Marciano's day, popular fighters had matches
every 2 or 3 months, sometimes more often. In the heavyweight class, they were
smaller by 20 or 30 pounds, on the average, compared with today. They lacked the
training equipment, nutrition, and most of the comforts of today's top fighters,
and most of all, the gigantic purses. Were most of the guys Marciano fought
better than the guys Ali or Foreman fought? I think so, but it's arguable. We've
discussed how many good fighters there were in the 60s and 70s, whether we agree
they were great or not. Marciano was relentless with sure killer's instinct
and a big punch, but how would he have done against a really smart, skilled big
man? I'm referring to Ali or Foreman or even Norton or possibly Frazier, all
much bigger than The Rock. Some of you contributors have been discounting the
the factors of size, reach, leverage, ability to wrestle in clinches and walk an
opponent to the ropes, etc. Believe it or not, these are usually more decisive
factors in how a fight goes than somebody's punch. The notion of a fight ending
with a big punch, or being dominated by 3 or 4 big flurries is misleading. For
one thing, more than often it doesn't work out that way. What happens instead is
two guys being careful for 10 or 12 rounds, pawing each other, clinching a lot,
seeing who can wear down whom, and then maybe somebody yielding to fatigue and
getting hit with some combinations, dropping to the mat, etc. We've talked about
how Ali could wear down King Kong himself by leaning on his shoulders, stinging
his face and head with "glancing blows", exasperating and exhausting an opponent
with his motion and speed, and above all, his greatest of all time psychouts.
And Foreman had his big punch. So where does this leave relatively small
Rocky Marciano, a puncher with one speed and one direction, straight ahead? Not
much. Finally, and I don't mean this to be disparaging or snotty or
disrespectful, but asking guys who have been boxers for a long time to rate
other boxers, including those they have fought and those they have worked with,
is not a very valid or reliable proposition. Unfortunately, they all have one
degree or another of brain damage. They are also sentimental and diplomatic,
some of them. So while I respect the Saddlers, I don't put much stock in them
saying Rocky had the biggest punch. This claim runs counter to the laws of